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Re: [rootsradicals] Bungees vs Cam Straps and Rope

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  • Liam Casey
    Another vote against bungees and for tubes here, both for the aforementioned pirate-eye problem and simple price/performance. Here s a tip: 99% of the time you
    Message 1 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
      Another vote against bungees and for tubes here, both for the aforementioned pirate-eye problem and simple price/performance. Here's a tip: 99% of the time you don't need to tie a knot in a tube. You can just wrap it a few times and the friction will hold it in place. I've never had a tube come off this way, and you never have to worry about untying them.

      I do agree with Devian that ropes are the most versatile, and the least likely to crush a delicate load. That said, if I don't have to worry about crushing, I'm more likely to be lazy and just stretch and wrap a tube instead of tie a knot that I may or may not have remembered correctly. I know I should take the time to learn them properly!

      Liam

      On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Devian Gilbert <asanacycles@...> wrote:
       

      also bungees don't provide really much control over the amount of tension you can apply to securing your load.


      the most versatile way is to learn knots and use rope or strap.


      to get an idea of using straps, holes in snap decks, etc...

      d-

      On Aug 5, 2010, at 10:39 AM, Dave Lloyd wrote:

      I like old innertubes.  Work about as well as bungees, just tie knots in 'em at either end.  Plus the don't come with the bonus of turning you into an eye patch wearing pirate when something goes awry.

      --dlloyd



      On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:36, jenstheblackdane <public@...> wrote:
       

      Is there a bias in the the Roots Rads community against Bungees?
      And if so, why?

      No judgement either way!

      Securing a load on any vehicle is an art form - even more so on a bike.

      I'd love to hear some of our Roots Rads "Artists" discuss their preferred "mediums" (bungee, rope, straps, dental floss, etc.) and how/why they came settle on them.





    • Andrew Kreps
      On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 10:36 AM, jenstheblackdane
      Message 2 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
        On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 10:36 AM, jenstheblackdane <public@...> wrote:
        Is there a bias in the the Roots Rads community against Bungees?
        And if so, why?


        Bungees aren't secure.  With the additional force that is applied while moving, they have too much give for my liking.  I'm a strap it and forget it kind of guy.  I always use cam straps, and for the bigger stuff, ratchet straps.  


      • jj
        I use camstraps. I have 2 12footers installed underneath the snapdeck. I have used rope in the past as well, and it works fine. I carry cording and some velcro
        Message 3 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
          I use camstraps. I have 2 12footers installed underneath the snapdeck. I have used rope in the past as well, and it works fine. I carry cording and some velcro to secure LONG things to the bike. the cording is in one of these: http://prostores2.carrierzone.com/servlet/viewtainercom/Detail?no=1 and is in the pocket. the velcro is the double sided stuff that is used in telecom to secure cords: http://www.harborfreight.com/3-4-quarter-inch-x-35-ft-roll-hook-and-loop-cable-strap-96215.html I keep long chunks of that rolled up on the freeloader frames in a few spots. This is also how I secure blinkies to the back of the x frame.

          Bungies have a very specific use and that is to hold things IN: in baskets, in truck beds, in bins. Bungies do ahorrible job of securing one item to another, due to their elasticity.  so that garbage bag of clothing that we took to goodwill on monday? It was put into a box, then camstrapped to the snapdeck and the bungie net over the top of the box to keep things from hopping out.

          JJ



          On 10-08-05 10:36 AM, jenstheblackdane wrote:
           

          Is there a bias in the the Roots Rads community against Bungees?
          And if so, why?

          No judgement either way!

          Securing a load on any vehicle is an art form - even more so on a bike.

          I'd love to hear some of our Roots Rads "Artists" discuss their preferred "mediums" (bungee, rope, straps, dental floss, etc.) and how/why they came settle on them.

        • Steve Lange
          Another vote for camstraps. I have 2-3 that I carry in one of the inside black hole pockets at all times, along with my reusable grocery bags and a bungee or
          Message 4 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
            Another vote for camstraps. I have 2-3 that I carry in one of the inside "black hole" pockets at all times, along with my reusable grocery bags and a bungee or two.  Bungees have their place, but the camstraps are the go-to solution for almost everything.

            Steve Lange
            Santa Barbara, CA


            On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 12:17 PM, jj <jj@...> wrote:


            I use camstraps. I have 2 12footers installed underneath the snapdeck. I have used rope in the past as well, and it works fine. I carry cording and some velcro to secure LONG things to the bike. the cording is in one of these: http://prostores2.carrierzone.com/servlet/viewtainercom/Detail?no=1 and is in the pocket. the velcro is the double sided stuff that is used in telecom to secure cords: http://www.harborfreight.com/3-4-quarter-inch-x-35-ft-roll-hook-and-loop-cable-strap-96215.html I keep long chunks of that rolled up on the freeloader frames in a few spots. This is also how I secure blinkies to the back of the x frame.

            Bungies have a very specific use and that is to hold things IN: in baskets, in truck beds, in bins. Bungies do ahorrible job of securing one item to another, due to their elasticity.  so that garbage bag of clothing that we took to goodwill on monday? It was put into a box, then camstrapped to the snapdeck and the bungie net over the top of the box to keep things from hopping out.

            JJ




            On 10-08-05 10:36 AM, jenstheblackdane wrote:
             

            Is there a bias in the the Roots Rads community against Bungees?
            And if so, why?

            No judgement either way!

            Securing a load on any vehicle is an art form - even more so on a bike.

            I'd love to hear some of our Roots Rads "Artists" discuss their preferred "mediums" (bungee, rope, straps, dental floss, etc.) and how/why they came settle on them.




          • ama3655@aol.com
            I also use cam straps. I keep 6 on the bike at all times. I have a few more available for unusual loads if needed. 550 cord takes care of other stuff, it has
            Message 5 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
              I also use cam straps. I keep 6 on the bike at all times. I have a few more available for unusual loads if needed. 550 cord takes care of other stuff, it has to be pretty weird to need the 550 cord. Never lost a load yet, knock wood.
              I have used bungees to strap light loads to the front rack, but avoid them whenever possible. The springy hook thing scares me.
              FatRob
            • Rick Pickett
              cam straps only, did the bungees when I was afflicted with short bikeitis. I keep two on my Big Dummy. They are always attached, front and aft of the v-racks.
              Message 6 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
                cam straps only, did the bungees when I was afflicted with short bikeitis.

                I keep two on my Big Dummy. They are always attached, front and aft of the v-racks. The cam sides are on my drive side and hang down inside my freeloaders, the strap ends are on the non drive side and tied together in the not that unravels when you pull on the loose end. Allows me to form an X on top of whatever cargo I have.


                "Melancholy is incompatible with bicycling."  – James E. Starrs

                artistic shenaniganizer | rick@...
                888.537-1401 | every day adventure






                On Aug 5, 2010, at 4:34 PM, ama3655@... wrote:

                 

                I also use cam straps. I keep 6 on the bike at all times. I have a few more available for unusual loads if needed. 550 cord takes care of other stuff, it has to be pretty weird to need the 550 cord. Never lost a load yet, knock wood.
                I have used bungees to strap light loads to the front rack, but avoid them whenever possible. The springy hook thing scares me.
                FatRob


              • Pete B
                Definitely a bias against bungee cords by me. Hooks and rotating masses have a gravitational attractiveness that doubles with speed ;-) My preference is for
                Message 7 of 14 , Aug 5, 2010
                  Definitely a bias against bungee cords by me.

                  Hooks and rotating masses have a gravitational attractiveness that doubles with speed ;-)

                  My preference is for cam straps and the occasional ratchet tie-down.

                  I have seen Joel (from Human Powered Cycles) do amazing load tiedowns (and temp construction) with old inner tubes.
                  but I do like the neatness of straps.
                   
                  Pete.B
                  'Newspapers are unable, seemingly, to discriminate between a bicycle accident and the collapse of civilization' : George Bernard Shaw


                  On 6 August 2010 03:36, jenstheblackdane <public@...> wrote:
                   

                  Is there a bias in the the Roots Rads community against Bungees?
                  And if so, why?

                  No judgement either way!

                  Securing a load on any vehicle is an art form - even more so on a bike.

                  I'd love to hear some of our Roots Rads "Artists" discuss their preferred "mediums" (bungee, rope, straps, dental floss, etc.) and how/why they came settle on them.


                • phaedrus at yahoo
                  I really like Rok Straps - the ones using loops rather than hooks. They saved my backside on a motorcycle trip when I rolled in the middle of nowhere ripping a
                  Message 8 of 14 , Aug 6, 2010
                    I really like Rok Straps - the ones using loops rather than hooks.

                    They saved my backside on a motorcycle trip when I rolled in the
                    middle of nowhere ripping a bunch of stuff off my bike.  My buddy had
                    a bunch of them and was more or less able to temporarily strap my
                    motorcycle together with them long enough to get us the 50 miles or so
                    to civilization.

                    I got a bunch of varying sizes and use them regularly on the cargo
                    bike and trailer.
                    Basically, they're a webbing strap with a loop at each end to connect
                    to your vehicle like xtracycle's cam straps do.   They connect
                    together with a standard nylon buckle.  What makes them different is
                    while the one side has the standard nylon buckle/webbing strap length
                    adjustment, the other side is a flat bungee like material.  The idea
                    is you don't stretch them ridiculously like people do with bungee
                    cords - you adjust the strap length so that you're putting a 25% or so
                    stretch on the bungee portion and then that bit of stretch adds
                    tension to keep your load secure. They also don't have the pirate eye
                    making hooks. We did learn the hard way if your straps aren't long
                    enough and you DO over stretch the bungee, be very very careful when
                    releasing the tension as the long end can come around with quite some
                    speed. A nylon buckle to the nads at high velocity may not cause
                    serious injury, but its not pleasant. I've since solved that problem
                    by not over stretching them.

                    They're a bit pricey for a job that can pretty much be replicated with
                    inner tubes and rope, but if you've got them, they're great.

                    I've been trying to convince my LBS to carry them.  I'd bet xtracycle
                    branded ones would sell as well ;)

                    http://www.rokstraps.com/products/products.html

                    If you scroll down a bit, I use the cruiser, the motorcycle, and the pack adj.

                    - phaedrus


                    On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 7:40 PM, Pete B <nackterman@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Definitely a bias against bungee cords by me.
                    >
                    > Hooks and rotating masses have a gravitational attractiveness that doubles with speed ;-)
                    > My preference is for cam straps and the occasional ratchet tie-down.
                    > I have seen Joel (from Human Powered Cycles) do amazing load tiedowns (and temp construction) with old inner tubes.
                    > but I do like the neatness of straps.
                    >
                    > Pete.B
                    > 'Newspapers are unable, seemingly, to discriminate between a bicycle accident and the collapse of civilization' : George Bernard Shaw
                    >
                    >
                    > On 6 August 2010 03:36, jenstheblackdane <public@...> wrote:
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> Is there a bias in the the Roots Rads community against Bungees?
                    >> And if so, why?
                    >>
                    >> No judgement either way!
                    >>
                    >> Securing a load on any vehicle is an art form - even more so on a bike.
                    >>
                    >> I'd love to hear some of our Roots Rads "Artists" discuss their preferred "mediums" (bungee, rope, straps, dental floss, etc.) and how/why they came settle on them.
                    >>
                    >
                    >
                  • Tone
                    I never use Bungee cords. They are dangerous. An X-girlfriend of mine was a messenger in San Francisco. She had a rear rack for touring and had an incident
                    Message 9 of 14 , Aug 6, 2010
                      I never use Bungee cords. They are dangerous. An X-girlfriend of mine was
                      a messenger in San Francisco. She had a rear rack for touring and had an
                      incident with a bungee cord breaking. The hook caught her face within an
                      inch of her eye and fortunately only left her a permanent scar. After
                      that she only used inner tubes.

                      When I was messengering in NY with my Xtracycle I decided not to use
                      inner tubes though. Instead, I obviously used the triple-snapping system
                      of the Freeloaders as much as possible. Never forget they can all clip
                      across the top of the snap deck and interconnect with each other to form
                      an X, etc. If you only need to load something on one side, which was
                      usually the case for me, connecting the straps across the decks give you
                      lots of length due to the straps from the other side.
                      Of course strapping larger loads of cargo to both sides generally
                      involves something beyond the Freeloader straps. That is when I pull out
                      double-sided Velcro straps. Sometimes it is referred to as on-wrap
                      hook-n-loop strapping. JJ mentioned the ¾” one-wrap and included a link
                      for it. $8 for 35’ of the stuff sounds like a decent deal. However, I did
                      not use ¾” one-wrap Velcro. I would think the connection for that stuff
                      might not be strong enough in certain circumstances. Instead I opted for
                      2” wide industrial-strength Velcro. The industrial-strength style of
                      Velcro has flatter more dense hooks, which do not feel so scratchy. The
                      flat hooks are less likely to be crushed and loose grip over time, and of
                      course having an extra 1.25” of gripping surface helps even more.
                      I started using 2” double-sided Velcro because I bought a 25’ roll of 2”
                      wide sticky-backed Velcro from Costco or Home Depot so I could use the
                      stuff for various projects. When I had some excess lengths I decided to
                      simply stick the hook and loop sides back-to-back to make one-wrap style
                      strapping. That is when I realized the potential for tying down loads on
                      my Xtracycle. I made and cut about eight 30” lengths and keep them in my
                      Freeloaders. They make excellent and versatile strapping. On rare
                      occasions when loading especially bulky double-sided loads, I would
                      include 550 parachute cords as a complement to the Velcro.

                      By the way, if you are the type of cyclist, who uses ankle cuffs to keep
                      your pants from snagging in your chain, that one-wrap Velcro is great
                      too. I keep three lengths of ¾” or 1” one-wrap Velcro with me whenever I
                      am cycling. The one-wrap is convenient enough to stash almost anywhere,
                      but because I almost never go anywhere on my bike without my messenger
                      bag I always simply stick the one-wrap to the bag’s existing Velcro
                      closures and the one-wrap still allows it to function normally. In fact I
                      actually cut the thinner one-wrap straps to the exact length of the
                      Velcro closures on my messenger bag so everything fits and looks good.
                      ¾ or 1” one-wrap is also great in a pinch if you have a minor accident
                      and need to bandage something like a bloody knee/elbow scrape. I would
                      just detach the one-wrap from my mess-bag and use two straps to secure a
                      bandana above and below my knee. For your information, I also keep at
                      least two bandanas in my mess bag too, at least one for bandaging
                      emergencies, which is stored in a “clean pocket”, and another in a
                      separate pocket for freshening up or wiping grease/dirt after road
                      repairs. Bandanas also come in handy for other needs while
                      camping/touring on your bike.

                      Usually around Xmas my wife or sister gets me something from Xtracycle.
                      Last year my sister got me the Eco-deck and three Utility Belts. The
                      utility belts really make it easier to strap down most cargo I might have
                      since they can conveniently attach and extend the FreeLoader straps or be
                      used independently. I still carry the 2” one-wrap Velcro straps, but
                      rarely need to use them. I have been using the Velcro for several years
                      now and it has definitely shown wear. Even though it has that industrial
                      flat hook surface, it still works and I continue to use it when
                      necessary. Apart from a little functionality degradation due to the
                      flattening hooks, the Velcro does look a little worn after so many years.
                      The flatter industrial hooks are much less likely to snag hair and lint,
                      etc. than standard Velcro, but several years is a long time to use a
                      strapping system outdoors. Also, they look even rattier because I did not
                      buy one-wrap specific strapping, but instead made my own by adhering two
                      sides of sticky-backed Velcro together. Now my self-made “one-wrap” kind
                      of peels up on the ends/edges a little, so the adhesive does not really
                      work in the expose spots.
                      If I had to do it all over again I would instead buy a big roll of 2”
                      wide industrial-hook style one-wrap, then cut a dozen lengths to about
                      30”. That way the ends and edges would not peel up. While working on some
                      other projects involving colored Velcro my research discovered a few
                      Velcro suppliers, which sold one-wrap strapping:

                      http://www.hookandloop.com
                      (Has the most information)

                      http://feinersupply.com

                      http://www.levittextiles.com

                      http://www.textol.com

                      Keep in mind one-wrap is usually not sold with the industrial hook style
                      on one-side via the automated web site system because the industrial
                      Velcro generally comes in sew-on or sticky-back forms. You may have to
                      e-mail to inquire specifically about industrial one-wrap, but I think you
                      can still get it. Some of these suppliers also have hook-n-loop strapping
                      in different materials. I think it normally comes in nylon, but you can
                      get polyester-based hook-n-loop straps, which resist chemicals and UV
                      light and supposedly maintain strength a little better in the rain. Also,
                      if you intend to get adhesive-backed Velcro for a project/use other than
                      tie-down straps, then pay attention to what kind of adhesive is on the
                      back of the strap. You can get sticky-backed hook-n-loop straps/rolls
                      with either an acrylic or rubber based adhesive, so you should determine
                      what surfaces you intend to stick the sticky-backed Velcro on before
                      purchasing.

                      By the way, when I stash my “one-wrap” straps I usually fold one into a
                      U-shape with the loop side out, then attach each of the straps one by one
                      until the “U” becomes fairly rigid. At this point I can store it in my
                      FreeLoader pocket. Of course you can lay one strap out flat and attach
                      your other straps on top until it becomes a multi-layered semi-rigid
                      brick/bar, but then it is not as easy to fold over to stash in to a
                      pocket. This method will also cause the inner folded layers to ripple
                      when folding over because they do not have to stretch as far as the outer
                      folded Velcro layers. Over time the rippling effect will cause the Velcro
                      to have creases, which resist a more uniform flat hooking surface when
                      trying to strap cargo down.
                      Alternatively, you can actually wrap your bike frame with the one-wrap
                      straps almost like cork handle-bar grip tape. This allows out-of-the-way
                      storage of your straps as well as protection to your paint job.
                      Additionally, you can even apply sticky-backed Velcro to patch kits and
                      other small items so you can slap them on directly to almost anywhere on
                      your frame without any hardware mounts. If you do this I recommend
                      keeping the hook side against the bike frame. This way the loop side is
                      not only softer to the touch when handling/touching your bike, but dust
                      and lint is not as likely to stick to your bike. Of course you can also
                      wrap your handlebars for added padding in your grip, but I do not
                      recommend this because the pressure your palms put on the Velcro causes
                      the hooks to get especially crushed, so they will not work as well when
                      strapping things down.
                      One disadvantage to wrapping your frame in Velcro develops when it rains.
                      The loop or fuzzy material on the Velcro soaks up water to a degree, so
                      you end up adding extra weight instead of allowing rain to run off. Rain
                      on the ground can also help kick up dirt, which then becomes mud clumps
                      stuck to your fuzzy Velcro, like dingle-berries on an unclean person’s
                      hairy butt crack.

                      I hope this helps.
                      Ride safe,
                      _TONE_
                    • Dave Lloyd
                      This stuff, from Lee Valley (a very fun catalog to browse through) also looks interesting: http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=65470&cat=1,43326,59481
                      Message 10 of 14 , Aug 6, 2010
                        This stuff, from Lee Valley (a very fun catalog to browse through) also looks interesting:
                        http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=65470&cat=1,43326,59481


                        --dlloyd



                        On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 10:45, Tone <tone@...> wrote:
                         

                        I never use Bungee cords. They are dangerous. An X-girlfriend of mine was
                        a messenger in San Francisco. She had a rear rack for touring and had an
                        incident with a bungee cord breaking. The hook caught her face within an
                        inch of her eye and fortunately only left her a permanent scar. After
                        that she only used inner tubes.

                        When I was messengering in NY with my Xtracycle I decided not to use
                        inner tubes though. Instead, I obviously used the triple-snapping system
                        of the Freeloaders as much as possible. Never forget they can all clip
                        across the top of the snap deck and interconnect with each other to form
                        an X, etc. If you only need to load something on one side, which was
                        usually the case for me, connecting the straps across the decks give you
                        lots of length due to the straps from the other side.
                        Of course strapping larger loads of cargo to both sides generally
                        involves something beyond the Freeloader straps. That is when I pull out
                        double-sided Velcro straps. Sometimes it is referred to as on-wrap
                        hook-n-loop strapping. JJ mentioned the ¾” one-wrap and included a link
                        for it. $8 for 35’ of the stuff sounds like a decent deal. However, I did
                        not use ¾” one-wrap Velcro. I would think the connection for that stuff
                        might not be strong enough in certain circumstances. Instead I opted for
                        2” wide industrial-strength Velcro. The industrial-strength style of
                        Velcro has flatter more dense hooks, which do not feel so scratchy. The
                        flat hooks are less likely to be crushed and loose grip over time, and of
                        course having an extra 1.25” of gripping surface helps even more.
                        I started using 2” double-sided Velcro because I bought a 25’ roll of 2”
                        wide sticky-backed Velcro from Costco or Home Depot so I could use the
                        stuff for various projects. When I had some excess lengths I decided to
                        simply stick the hook and loop sides back-to-back to make one-wrap style
                        strapping. That is when I realized the potential for tying down loads on
                        my Xtracycle. I made and cut about eight 30” lengths and keep them in my
                        Freeloaders. They make excellent and versatile strapping. On rare
                        occasions when loading especially bulky double-sided loads, I would
                        include 550 parachute cords as a complement to the Velcro.

                        By the way, if you are the type of cyclist, who uses ankle cuffs to keep
                        your pants from snagging in your chain, that one-wrap Velcro is great
                        too. I keep three lengths of ¾” or 1” one-wrap Velcro with me whenever I
                        am cycling. The one-wrap is convenient enough to stash almost anywhere,
                        but because I almost never go anywhere on my bike without my messenger
                        bag I always simply stick the one-wrap to the bag’s existing Velcro
                        closures and the one-wrap still allows it to function normally. In fact I
                        actually cut the thinner one-wrap straps to the exact length of the
                        Velcro closures on my messenger bag so everything fits and looks good.
                        ¾ or 1” one-wrap is also great in a pinch if you have a minor accident
                        and need to bandage something like a bloody knee/elbow scrape. I would
                        just detach the one-wrap from my mess-bag and use two straps to secure a
                        bandana above and below my knee. For your information, I also keep at
                        least two bandanas in my mess bag too, at least one for bandaging
                        emergencies, which is stored in a “clean pocket”, and another in a
                        separate pocket for freshening up or wiping grease/dirt after road
                        repairs. Bandanas also come in handy for other needs while
                        camping/touring on your bike.

                        Usually around Xmas my wife or sister gets me something from Xtracycle.
                        Last year my sister got me the Eco-deck and three Utility Belts. The
                        utility belts really make it easier to strap down most cargo I might have
                        since they can conveniently attach and extend the FreeLoader straps or be
                        used independently. I still carry the 2” one-wrap Velcro straps, but
                        rarely need to use them. I have been using the Velcro for several years
                        now and it has definitely shown wear. Even though it has that industrial
                        flat hook surface, it still works and I continue to use it when
                        necessary. Apart from a little functionality degradation due to the
                        flattening hooks, the Velcro does look a little worn after so many years.
                        The flatter industrial hooks are much less likely to snag hair and lint,
                        etc. than standard Velcro, but several years is a long time to use a
                        strapping system outdoors. Also, they look even rattier because I did not
                        buy one-wrap specific strapping, but instead made my own by adhering two
                        sides of sticky-backed Velcro together. Now my self-made “one-wrap” kind
                        of peels up on the ends/edges a little, so the adhesive does not really
                        work in the expose spots.
                        If I had to do it all over again I would instead buy a big roll of 2”
                        wide industrial-hook style one-wrap, then cut a dozen lengths to about
                        30”. That way the ends and edges would not peel up. While working on some
                        other projects involving colored Velcro my research discovered a few
                        Velcro suppliers, which sold one-wrap strapping:

                        http://www.hookandloop.com
                        (Has the most information)

                        http://feinersupply.com

                        http://www.levittextiles.com

                        http://www.textol.com

                        Keep in mind one-wrap is usually not sold with the industrial hook style
                        on one-side via the automated web site system because the industrial
                        Velcro generally comes in sew-on or sticky-back forms. You may have to
                        e-mail to inquire specifically about industrial one-wrap, but I think you
                        can still get it. Some of these suppliers also have hook-n-loop strapping
                        in different materials. I think it normally comes in nylon, but you can
                        get polyester-based hook-n-loop straps, which resist chemicals and UV
                        light and supposedly maintain strength a little better in the rain. Also,
                        if you intend to get adhesive-backed Velcro for a project/use other than
                        tie-down straps, then pay attention to what kind of adhesive is on the
                        back of the strap. You can get sticky-backed hook-n-loop straps/rolls
                        with either an acrylic or rubber based adhesive, so you should determine
                        what surfaces you intend to stick the sticky-backed Velcro on before
                        purchasing.

                        By the way, when I stash my “one-wrap” straps I usually fold one into a
                        U-shape with the loop side out, then attach each of the straps one by one
                        until the “U” becomes fairly rigid. At this point I can store it in my
                        FreeLoader pocket. Of course you can lay one strap out flat and attach
                        your other straps on top until it becomes a multi-layered semi-rigid
                        brick/bar, but then it is not as easy to fold over to stash in to a
                        pocket. This method will also cause the inner folded layers to ripple
                        when folding over because they do not have to stretch as far as the outer
                        folded Velcro layers. Over time the rippling effect will cause the Velcro
                        to have creases, which resist a more uniform flat hooking surface when
                        trying to strap cargo down.
                        Alternatively, you can actually wrap your bike frame with the one-wrap
                        straps almost like cork handle-bar grip tape. This allows out-of-the-way
                        storage of your straps as well as protection to your paint job.
                        Additionally, you can even apply sticky-backed Velcro to patch kits and
                        other small items so you can slap them on directly to almost anywhere on
                        your frame without any hardware mounts. If you do this I recommend
                        keeping the hook side against the bike frame. This way the loop side is
                        not only softer to the touch when handling/touching your bike, but dust
                        and lint is not as likely to stick to your bike. Of course you can also
                        wrap your handlebars for added padding in your grip, but I do not
                        recommend this because the pressure your palms put on the Velcro causes
                        the hooks to get especially crushed, so they will not work as well when
                        strapping things down.
                        One disadvantage to wrapping your frame in Velcro develops when it rains.
                        The loop or fuzzy material on the Velcro soaks up water to a degree, so
                        you end up adding extra weight instead of allowing rain to run off. Rain
                        on the ground can also help kick up dirt, which then becomes mud clumps
                        stuck to your fuzzy Velcro, like dingle-berries on an unclean person’s
                        hairy butt crack.

                        I hope this helps.
                        Ride safe,
                        _TONE_


                      • Elaine Nelson
                        Am I the lone bungee r here? Well, most of the time I m using them to secure my rain tarp, and I ve found that to be the simplest solution when I m parked all
                        Message 11 of 14 , Aug 6, 2010
                          Am I the lone bungee'r here? Well, most of the time I'm using them to
                          secure my rain tarp, and I've found that to be the simplest solution
                          when I'm parked all day. (Bright green bungees + purple poncho = color
                          scheme from a 90s Batman movie!)

                          I'm just now working out how to use the camstraps effectively. :) My
                          significant other got into them in a big way the last time we had some
                          warm weather...he worked out that he could attach a folding lounge
                          chair atop the snapdeck: one strap to hold it to the bike, the other
                          to hold it shut. At some point I should probably add the photo to my
                          Flickr stream.

                          Elaine Nelson
                          http://elainenelson.org/
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