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Re: [rootsradicals] Re: Longtail standards vs totalitarian regimes

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  • Rick Pickett
    Mind you, only Xtracycle and Surly use Chromoly in their bicycle frames. This alone raises the cost in manufacturing. Added to that, we re small volume
    Message 1 of 52 , Jun 20, 2010
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      Mind you, only Xtracycle and Surly use Chromoly in their bicycle frames. This alone raises the cost in manufacturing. Added to that, we're small volume compared to Trek/Kona/et al. (who use aluminum which has it's own cost increases, but volume helps eat into that).

      I don't know what Surly has up their sleeves, but I doubt that they'll remove the sloping downtube unless they go with a mundo route and do one long tube, very low, from front to rear. But then that would betray the mountain bike heritage that I think they'd like to keep (and something I appreciate about my Big Dummy... although I do want a more upright riding position for my daily runarounds).

      PS This looks like a fun device to get someone to install in a cargo bike: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Nd13ARuvVE

      PPS Brazil is wrecking shop on Ivory Coast!


      Meet the all new Radish for 2010! http://bit.ly/radish2010

      "Life is like a ten speed bicycle. Most of us have gears we never use."  – Charles Schulz

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      On Jun 20, 2010, at 12:44 PM, David Chase wrote:

       


      On 2010-06-20, at 12:19 PM, Rich wrote:
      > The Kona & Trek are what I am inclined to call semi-longtail bikes with cargo panniers too far behind the rear axle. Do we call them "Longtail Lite" designs?

      Long-butt.

      And where does the Madsen fit into all of this?

      I am genuinely curious what goes into the pricing of a frame. There's just not enough steel in a bike to matter, and I've seen skilled welders work, they're fast. Is it a matter of pennies per pound, and ten dollars per joint, then double the price to allow for some profit?

      As far as Surly reducing the price of the BD, what I imagine, is that they would cut down on the use of non-standard curved tubing, as much as possible.

      David


    • Rich
      Just looking at the Yuba web site they now have a Mundo version with a front wheel hub electric motor available. Eight shown as in stock. I do not think that
      Message 52 of 52 , Jun 21, 2010
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        Just looking at the Yuba web site they now have a Mundo version with a front wheel hub electric motor available. Eight shown as in stock. I do not think that I have seen that option mentioned here.

        http://yubaride.com/yubashop/28-e-mundo.html

        Rich Wood

        --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com, Steve Lange <steve@...> wrote:
        >
        > Re: the Mundo:
        >
        > The cool LBS devoted to utility and commuter cycles has a couple Yuba Mundo
        > 2s in stock and I rode one around a bit... it's actually quite, quite nice.
        >
        > Felt very stiff (though I didn't test with a load) and was not appreciably
        > heavier than my Xtracycle by my "heave ho" test. It's in some ways a simpler
        > design - the wideloaders are permanently welded to the frame, etc. - but
        > it's really quite a nice bike, I thought, appointed with a nice range of
        > modest but completely useful components. And a nice range of colors, too.
        > The freeloader-esque bag was HUGE too. Definitely a worthy entry in the
        > market, I think, and at a pretty compelling price.
        >
        > Will look forward to riding a new Radish, I wasn't impressed at all with the
        > front end geometry of the original model (too slack). Hopefully the new one
        > addresses that issue.
        >
        > Steve Lange
        > Santa Barbara, CA
        >
        >
        > On Mon, Jun 21, 2010 at 12:25 AM, MH <hoagy@...> wrote:
        >
        > > A little something of interest about World Bicycle Relief. -Mark Hoagy
        > >
        > > http://kristof.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/12/a-bike-for-abel/#more-4635
        > >
        > > Katie Bolling
        > > Chicago, IL
        > > April 13th, 2010
        > > 11:13 am
        > >
        > > To Nicholas Kristof: My name is Katie Bolling and I recently had the
        > > pleasure of briefly meeting you after your speaking engagement in
        > > Chicago that was hosted by Facing History and Ourselves. I manage
        > > Grassroots Development at World Bicycle Relief and, like many others,
        > > am inspired by your work and feel honored to have this opportunity to
        > > answer some questions that you raise above concerning the influence of
        > > bicycles in humanitarian development. Here goes:
        > >
        > > Aid is definitely a tricky business. In our experience of delivering over
        > > 60,000 bicycles in Sri Lanka, Zambia, Lesotho, Mozambique, Rwanda,
        > > Tanzania,
        > > Kenya and Zimbabwe, we have seen everything from theft of bicycles to
        > > jealousy among community members who have not received them. However, we
        > > have also seen a girl kept out of an early marriage because she now has a
        > > bike and can go to school. We have seen a child-led household where 4 of
        > > the 6 children would have died from the AIDs epidemic saved because they
        > > had
        > > access to ARVs through bicycles. The way we address the issues you
        > > mentioned
        > > is to first provide a bicycle that is designed to last the lifetime of the
        > > user if properly maintained and we do this by managing the entire supply
        > > chain from design to distribution. Then we train one bike mechanic for
        > > every
        > > 50 bikes distributed and monitor use of the bicycles through a network of
        > > community volunteers, local NGOs and our staff.
        > >
        > > In terms of the issue of students having access to school, we started a
        > > program in Zambia to deliver 50,000 bicycles to students, teachers and
        > > community education volunteers in rural areas where students walk as far as
        > > 12.4 miles to school, this program is called the Bicycles for Educational
        > > Empowerment Program (BEEP). Bicycle recipients are chosen through a process
        > > that involves school leaders, community volunteers and local community
        > > based
        > > organizations. Lameck Kasanga, World Bicycle Relief's program officer, goes
        > > out to the school and talks to students about care, maintenance of the
        > > bicycles and also the contract they will sign with their parents to agree
        > > that the primary use of the bicycle is to get to school. Lameck monitors
        > > use
        > > of bicycles through the committees and local Community based organizations
        > > we partner with. Theft has been minimal in these rural communities because
        > > the bicycles we distribute are recognized as an asset of the community.
        > >
        > > Thank for your time. If you want to keep up with our work, feel free to
        > > follow us on twitter at @powerofbicycles. We post stories and photos from
        > > our recipients and distributions on a weekly basis.
        > >
        > > With respect, Katie Bolling
        > >
        > > http://twitter.com/powerofbicycles
        > > http://www.worldbicyclerelief.org
        > >
        > >
        > > Rick Pickett wrote:
        > > > In addition to Worldbike's efforts, one of the largest stakeholders in
        > > SRAM has
        > > > launched an effective and inspiring effort to bring cargo bikes to
        > > Africa:
        > > >
        > > >
        > > http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2010/0510/creative-giving-sram-zambia-charity-armstrong-bicycle-economy.html
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > /
        > > > /
        > > > /
        > > > /
        > > >
        > > > Meet the all new Radish for 2010! http://bit.ly/radish2010/
        > > > /
        > > > /
        > > > /
        > > > /"When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of
        > > the human
        > > > race." – H.G. Wells/
        > > > *
        > > > *
        > > > *graphical structuralist | rick@... <mailto:rick@...
        > > >*
        > > > *888.537-1401 | oh the things you'll haul*
        > > > *
        > > > *
        > > > *
        > > > *
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > /
        > > > / //
        > > >
        > > > On Jun 20, 2010, at 5:36 PM, Rich wrote:
        > > >
        > > >>
        > > >>
        > > >> Liam;
        > > >>
        > > >> I like your comparison. For the areas of the world that need a heavy
        > > duty
        > > >> cargo bike the worst even the Yuba Mundo is too expensive. Remember that
        > > in
        > > >> much of Africa you are talking a per capita income of about $100 per
        > > year.
        > > >>
        > > >> I was reading somewhere recently about a cargo bike initiative for local
        > > >> African build using square medium wall steel tubing for the frame,
        > > welded
        > > >> locally. The tubing is made in South Africa.
        > > >>
        > > >> The object is to come up with a true heavy duty agricultural transport
        > > bicycle
        > > >> design that is affordable in Africa and can handle very heavy cargo
        > > weights,
        > > >> like the Mundo. Design goals are minimal cost, rugged construction and
        > > easy
        > > >> local repair when required.
        > > >>
        > > >> Rich Wood
        > > >>
        > > >> --- In rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com <mailto:
        > > rootsradicals%40yahoogroups.com <rootsradicals%2540yahoogroups.com>>,
        > > >> Liam Casey <zyzzyva23@> wrote:
        > > >> >
        > > >> > I've often likened the difference between the Big Dummy and the Mundo
        > > to
        > > >> > that between pickup trucks and U-Hauls. The one will carry just about
        > > >> > anything you'd ever want to carry, but it's not something you'd want
        > > to ride
        > > >> > when you don't have to. Since I got my BD, the only time I've taken
        > > another
        > > >> > bike out is when I've had to lock up in a sketchy area. Don't think
        > > I'd
        > > >> > wanna go off-road touring with a Mundo, but to each his/her own.
        > > >> >
        > > >> > It didn't even occur to me that Surly had changes in mind for the
        > > frame. I
        > > >> > was just thinking they'd put different components on the stock build.
        > > They
        > > >> > could save a fair chunk of change just by swapping out the Mr Whirly
        > > >> > crankset for a Deore.
        > > >> >
        > > >> > Liam
        > > >>
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > ------------------------------------
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        > > radical.
        > >
        > > To Post a message, send it to: rootsradicals@yahoogroups.com
        > >
        > >
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        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
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