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Adeste Fideles in Uchunata

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  • habarakhe4
    Adoch, huiderex, adoch chymhuantex, benit, benit y betreen, benite [y]t naux adaurax fsau pich tsrat do fsaux anjoraux. benite [y]t naux adaurax benite [y]t
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 4, 2004
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      Adoch, huiderex, adoch chymhuantex, benit, benit y betreen,
      benite'[y]t naux adaurax fsau pich tsrat do fsaux anjoraux.
      benite'[y]t naux adaurax
      benite'[y]t naux adaurax
      benite'[y]t naux adaurax
      au betreen!

      Adeste, fideles, adeste triumphantes, venite, venite ad Bethlehem.
      Venite adoremus, regem angelorum.
      Venite adoremus
      Venite adoremus
      Venite adoremus
      O Bethlehem!
    • Greg Bontrager
      The Uchunata translation of Adeste Fidelis brought up a question I ran into when I translated the same into Italian. Spanish has its own form of the town name
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 4, 2004
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        The Uchunata translation of Adeste Fidelis brought up a question I ran into
        when I translated the same into Italian. Spanish has its own form of the
        town name “Bethlehem,” which is “Belén”. Do French and Italian have their
        own forms as well, and if so, can anyone tell me what they are? For now, I
        used my knowledge of Spanish-Italian morphology to come up with a good guess
        as to the Italian “Bethlehem” to come up with “Belene.” But I want to be
        correct, so if anyone knows the proper word in French and Italian, please
        drop me a line.



        Providing that I don’t find out that the Italian form of “Bethlehem” doesn’t
        fit the music in my Italian translation (titled “Venite Fideli), I also have
        the complete first verse and refrain translated in Italian for anyone who’s
        interested. I may even translate it into Brujeric, my conlang, which will
        make it the first song I’ve ever translated into a fictional language.



        Bocupas graças,



        Greg Bontrager



        --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by EWOL using Declude Virus]


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Benct Philip Jonsson
        It is _Betlemme_. I googled for bibbia testo in Italian, found the thing I looked for and looked up the beginning of Luke 2. ... -- /BP 8^) -- Benct Philip
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 4, 2004
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          It is _Betlemme_. I googled for "bibbia testo" in Italian,
          found the thing I looked for and looked up the beginning of Luke 2.

          Greg Bontrager wrote:
          > The Uchunata translation of Adeste Fidelis brought up a question I ran into
          > when I translated the same into Italian. Spanish has its own form of the
          > town name “Bethlehem,” which is “Belén”. Do French and Italian have their
          > own forms as well, and if so, can anyone tell me what they are? For now, I
          > used my knowledge of Spanish-Italian morphology to come up with a good guess
          > as to the Italian “Bethlehem” to come up with “Belene.” But I want to be
          > correct, so if anyone knows the proper word in French and Italian, please
          > drop me a line.
          >
          >
          >
          > Providing that I don’t find out that the Italian form of “Bethlehem” doesn’t
          > fit the music in my Italian translation (titled “Venite Fideli), I also have
          > the complete first verse and refrain translated in Italian for anyone who’s
          > interested. I may even translate it into Brujeric, my conlang, which will
          > make it the first song I’ve ever translated into a fictional language.
          >
          >
          >
          > Bocupas graças,
          >
          >
          >
          > Greg Bontrager


          --

          /BP 8^)>
          --
          Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch at melroch dot se

          Solitudinem faciunt pacem appellant!
          (Tacitus)
        • habarakhe4
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 4, 2004
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            --- In romconlang@yahoogroups.com, Benct Philip Jonsson <melroch@m...> wrote:
            > It is _Betlemme_. I googled for "bibbia testo" in Italian,
            > found the thing I looked for and looked up the beginning of Luke 2.
            >
            > Greg Bontrager wrote:
            > > The Uchunata translation of Adeste Fidelis brought up a question I ran into
            > > when I translated the same into Italian. Spanish has its own form of the
            > > town name "Bethlehem," which is "Belén". Do French and Italian have their
            > > own forms as well, and if so, can anyone tell me what they are? For now, I
            > > used my knowledge of Spanish-Italian morphology to come up with a good guess
            > > as to the Italian "Bethlehem" to come up with "Belene." But I want to be
            > > correct, so if anyone knows the proper word in French and Italian, please
            > > drop me a line.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Providing that I don't find out that the Italian form of "Bethlehem" doesn't
            > > fit the music in my Italian translation (titled "Venite Fideli), I also have
            > > the complete first verse and refrain translated in Italian for anyone who's
            > > interested. I may even translate it into Brujeric, my conlang, which will
            > > make it the first song I've ever translated into a fictional language.
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Bocupas graças,
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Greg Bontrager
            >
            >
            > --
            >
            > /BP 8^)>
            > --
            > Benct Philip Jonsson -- melroch at melroch dot se
            >
            > Solitudinem faciunt pacem appellant!
            > (Tacitus)
          • Muke Tever
            ... French appears to be Bethléem or Bethléhem, depending on your Bible version (though the fr.Wikipedia article on the town is at Bethléem). ... A useful
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 4, 2004
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              On Sat, 4 Dec 2004 16:18:13 -0500, Greg Bontrager <GregBont@...> wrote:
              > The Uchunata translation of Adeste Fidelis brought up a question I ran into
              > when I translated the same into Italian. Spanish has its own form of the
              > town name “Bethlehem,” which is “Belén”. Do French and Italian have their
              > own forms as well, and if so, can anyone tell me what they are?

              French appears to be Bethléem or Bethléhem, depending on your Bible version
              (though the fr.Wikipedia article on the town is at Bethléem).

              > For now, I used my knowledge of Spanish-Italian morphology to come up with
              > a good guess as to the Italian “Bethlehem” to come up with “Belene.” ButI want to be correct, so if anyone knows the proper word in French andItalian, please drop me a line.

              A useful site for this kind of thing is http://www.unboundbible.org/ --
              you can search several Bible versions and translations, and with the "power
              search" display up to three side by side.


              *Muke!
              --
              website: http://frath.net/
              LiveJournal: http://kohath.livejournal.com/
              deviantArt: http://kohath.deviantart.com/

              FrathWiki, a conlang and conculture wiki:
              http://wiki.frath.net/
            • Christian Thalmann
              Sau ih oenes! Unfortunately, my vacations in Kiwiland are already over, and I return into the middle of the traditional premature Xmas craze. ;oP What would
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 5, 2004
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                Sau ih oenes!


                Unfortunately, my vacations in Kiwiland are already over,
                and I return into the middle of the traditional premature
                Xmas craze. ;oP What would be more fitting, then, than
                to translate a Christmas carol?


                --- In romconlang@yahoogroups.com, "habarakhe4" <theophilus88@h...> wrote:
                >
                > Adoch, huiderex, adoch chymhuantex, benit, benit y betreen,
                > benite'[y]t naux adaurax fsau pich tsrat do fsaux anjoraux.
                > benite'[y]t naux adaurax
                > benite'[y]t naux adaurax
                > benite'[y]t naux adaurax
                > au betreen!

                Cool. How do envisage the distribution of syllables
                onto the notes? An audio file would be nice. =D

                Is it for religious or lyrical reasons that the
                Fortunatians adore Bethlehem rather than the lord?


                As for a (tortured, archaic-tasting, but singable)
                Jovian version:

                Oud dseise, oene o fizi, toze ei voc xuodandes,
                Venide, oud venide oenes ad Beplen;
                Ic cuefta u puobul, ricte ih rec jon aengli
                ||: Venide, oud pregame ei :||
                Venide, oud pregame ei Cristu, nor ei doemu.

                [od dejz Ajn A vi: zi to:z ej vAx Su dan d@z]
                [ve ni:d o ve ni:-i:d Ajnz ab be-e-e-pl@]
                [iC kyft @ pu@ b@l riCt i reC jAn E-EN gli]
                [ve ni:-i:d op pre ga:m ej]
                [ve ni:-i:d op pre ga:m e-e griSt nA e zAjm]


                Note how I had to expand |xuodandes| [Su'dandz]
                into an unnatural [Su'dand@z]. I can feel the
                confused wails of countless Jervan school children
                when they have to learn that line whenever I close
                my eyes.

                Vae,


                -- Christian Thalmann
              • Christian Thalmann
                Speaking of carols, I just realized my old translation of Puer Nobis Nascitur is now woefully antiquated, Modern Jovian having dropped its noun declination
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 5, 2004
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                  Speaking of carols, I just realized my old translation
                  of "Puer Nobis Nascitur" is now woefully antiquated,
                  Modern Jovian having dropped its noun declination and
                  final schwas and all. So here's the new version:


                  Auze ed gauze, fournade o naedsone:
                  [auz eg gauz fur na:d A nE dzo:n]

                  Noe ix nade u puobul.
                  [nAj iS na:d @ pu@ b@l]

                  I ere nor ja salbaedsone
                  [i e:r nAr j@ zal bE dzo:n]

                  ed yh mundu id diluogul.
                  [ed y mund id di lu@ g@l]


                  "Listen and rejoice, o fortunate nation:
                  A little boy is born unto us.
                  He shall be our salvation
                  And the dawn of the world."


                  (The old version was:

                  > Auze ed gauze, o beoda naedsone
                  > Iosu Crist' fi nadu.
                  > I ere notter salbaedsone:
                  > Audi Doemi lehadu.)
                • John Cowan
                  ... No big deal, really. In English carols it s traditional to sing the word heaven as a monosyllable, and this persists even when it is spread over two
                  Message 8 of 10 , Dec 5, 2004
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                    Christian Thalmann scripsit:

                    > Note how I had to expand |xuodandes| [Su'dandz]
                    > into an unnatural [Su'dand@z]. I can feel the
                    > confused wails of countless Jervan school children
                    > when they have to learn that line whenever I close
                    > my eyes.

                    No big deal, really. In English carols it's traditional to sing the word
                    "heaven" as a monosyllable, and this persists even when it is spread
                    over two notes! Thus the carol beginning "Joy to the world" has the line

                    And heaven and nature sing (3x)
                    And heaven, and heaven, and nature sing

                    The first three lines are sung on seven notes, and-heavn-and-na-tu-ure-sing,
                    in conformity to the convention; but the final line is actually sung on
                    eleven notes, and-he-eavn-and-he-e-eavn-and-na-ture-sing. So even when
                    "heaven" is stretched to two notes or three, it is still sung as a
                    monosyllable with an extended main vowel, rather than regaining its normal
                    prose pronunciation [hEv=n].

                    --
                    Dream projects long deferred John Cowan <jcowan@...>
                    usually bite the wax tadpole. http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
                    --James Lileks http://www.reutershealth.com
                  • Christian Thalmann
                    It occurred to me that I forgot to add a gloss, seeing as the text is not a 100% translation, and some of the words aren t trivial. ... Oh that you be
                    Message 9 of 10 , Dec 6, 2004
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                      It occurred to me that I forgot to add a gloss, seeing as
                      the text is not a 100% translation, and some of the words
                      aren't trivial.

                      --- In romconlang@yahoogroups.com, "Christian Thalmann" <cinga@g...>
                      wrote:

                      > Oud dseise, oene o fizi, toze ei voc xuodandes,
                      > Venide, oud venide oenes ad Beplen;
                      > Ic cuefta u puobul, ricte ih rec jon aengli.
                      > ||: Venide, oud pregame ei :||
                      > Venide, oud pregame ei Cristu, nor ei doemu.

                      "Oh that you be present, o all faithfuls, rejoicing at full voice,
                      Come ye, oh that ye come all to Bethlehem;
                      Here lies a boy, the rightful king of the angels.
                      Come ye, oh that we pray to him
                      Come ye, oh that we pray to the Christ, our lord."

                      The overabundance of the optative particle |oud| < O UT
                      clearly marks the text as non-colloquial register, but
                      then, how many carols are written in street talk?

                      The vocative particle |o| is distinct from the optative
                      |oud| in meaning, spelling and pronunciation, though I'm
                      afraid they end up as confoundible "o" vs "oh" in the
                      English gloss. =P


                      -- Christian Thalmann
                    • Adam Walker
                      ... I hope this doesn t mean that you ve taken the older one off line now. :( ... Coolness. I ll have a new one to post in a day or two. I m working on a
                      Message 10 of 10 , Dec 6, 2004
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                        --- Christian Thalmann <cinga@...> wrote:

                        >
                        > Speaking of carols, I just realized my old
                        > translation
                        > of "Puer Nobis Nascitur" is now woefully antiquated,
                        >

                        I hope this doesn't mean that you've taken the older
                        one off line now. :(


                        > Modern Jovian having dropped its noun declination
                        > and
                        > final schwas and all. So here's the new version:
                        >
                        >
                        > Auze ed gauze, fournade o naedsone:
                        > [auz eg gauz fur na:d A nE dzo:n]
                        >
                        > Noe ix nade u puobul.
                        > [nAj iS na:d @ pu@ b@l]
                        >
                        > I ere nor ja salbaedsone
                        > [i e:r nAr j@ zal bE dzo:n]
                        >
                        > ed yh mundu id diluogul.
                        > [ed y mund id di lu@ g@l]
                        >
                        >
                        > "Listen and rejoice, o fortunate nation:
                        > A little boy is born unto us.
                        > He shall be our salvation
                        > And the dawn of the world."
                        >
                        >

                        Coolness. I'll have a new one to post in a day or
                        two. I'm working on a setting of verses 28, 30-33, 35
                        & 42 of Sampu Lugu. I've got five of the 7 verses
                        translated from the Greek (more or less) and hope to
                        finish today. Then I'll edit them together to make a
                        smooth text and see how it fits with the music.

                        Adam

                        > (The old version was:
                        >
                        > > Auze ed gauze, o beoda naedsone
                        > > Iosu Crist' fi nadu.
                        > > I ere notter salbaedsone:
                        > > Audi Doemi lehadu.)
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >


                        =====
                        Apali fuid il nadali djul Cristu: nidespunzed il su marri, al Maja simu ul Jozevu, peru andi cunvineruns nidiscuvrid fi aved jan in gastri ul fin djul Spiritu Sampu.

                        Machu 1:18
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