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Re: [revelation-list] Continuity

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  • Georg S. Adamsen
    Perhaps not everyone ... Anyway, yes I have developed that hypothesis. One might argue that there is a pragmatic unity, even if this is not easily
    Message 1 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
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      Perhaps not "everyone" ... Anyway, yes I have developed that hypothesis. One
      might argue that there is a pragmatic unity, even if this is not easily
      recognisable by structural markers and contents. However, I argue that
      structure and content does indeed support the pragmatic unity, i.e. that
      Revelation 4-22 function as an argument for the exhortations in Revelation
      1-3. Parts of my thesis is "controversial", but one of its strengths is that
      I point to themes and structures recognised by others.

      Georg

      -----Oprindelig meddelelse-----
      Fra: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
      [mailto:revelation-list@yahoogroups.com] På vegne af George F Somsel
      Sendt: 14. januar 2009 11:39
      Til: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
      Emne: Re: [revelation-list] Continuity

      Of course, everyone is aware of such themes as epiphany and the divine
      warrior motif in the Apocalypse.  What interests me more is your hypothesis
      that 4-22 functioned as an argument for 1-3.  Have you developed that?
       george
      gfsomsel


      … search for truth, hear truth,
      learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
      defend the truth till death.


      - Jan Hus
      _________




      ________________________________
      From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@...>
      To: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 1:23:21 AM
      Subject: Re: [revelation-list] Continuity


      Dr. Somsel,

      I agree. Years ago when I wrote my Master's thesis, I formed the hypothesis
      that Rev 4-22 functioned as an argument for the exhortations in Rev 1-3.

      Later, I read Dr. Mark W. Wilson's thesis
      (http://www.revelati on-resources. com/2008/ 01/06/wilson- the-victor-
      sayings/).
      His studies confirmed what I was at.

      In my own thesis I found that both theme and pragmatic function unifies
      Revelation. OT themes such as epiphany and the divine warrior motif are used
      in both parts of Revelation.

      Other scholars (e.g., Kempson, Mazzaferri, Giblin, Bauckham) have shown that
      there is a unifying overall structure. This structure is indicated by
      external linguistic markers, such as EN PNEUMATI and the numbering
      sequences.

      There is much, much more to say, but I would say that you are certainly
      right!

      Dr. Georg S. Adamsen

      -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
      Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
      [mailto:revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com] På vegne af George F Somsel
      Sendt: 14. januar 2009 07:05
      Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
      Emne: [revelation- list] Continuity

      It has always seemed that caps 1-3 and 4-22 are two separate worlds (Of
      course, in one sense they are).  I have been wondering lately if there is
      not a closer relation between the two halves of the writing.  Does anyone
      have some thoughts they would care to share on this?
       george
      gfsomsel

      … search for truth, hear truth,
      learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
      defend the truth till death.

      - Jan Hus
      _________
      .





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


      ------------------------------------

      Yahoo! Groups Links
    • George F Somsel
      Are the results of your study available in written form (Perhaps your thesis which I seem to recall was submitted in English)?  I would be willing to purchase
      Message 2 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
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        Are the results of your study available in written form (Perhaps your thesis which I seem to recall was submitted in English)?� I would be willing to purchase a copy.
        �george
        gfsomsel


        � search for truth, hear truth,
        learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
        defend the truth till death.


        - Jan Hus
        _________




        ________________________________
        From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@...>
        To: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 6:15:07 AM
        Subject: Re: [revelation-list] Continuity


        Perhaps not "everyone" ... Anyway, yes I have developed that hypothesis. One
        might argue that there is a pragmatic unity, even if this is not easily
        recognisable by structural markers and contents. However, I argue that
        structure and content does indeed support the pragmatic unity, i.e. that
        Revelation 4-22 function as an argument for the exhortations in Revelation
        1-3. Parts of my thesis is "controversial" , but one of its strengths is that
        I point to themes and structures recognised by others.

        Georg

        -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
        Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
        [mailto:revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com] P� vegne af George F Somsel
        Sendt: 14. januar 2009 11:39
        Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
        Emne: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

        Of course, everyone is aware of such themes as epiphany and the divine
        warrior motif in the Apocalypse.� What interests me more is your hypothesis
        that�4-22 functioned as an argument for 1-3.� Have you developed that?
        �george
        gfsomsel

        � search for truth, hear truth,
        learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
        defend the truth till death.

        - Jan Hus
        _________

        ____________ _________ _________ __
        From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@stubkjaer- adamsen.dk>
        To: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
        Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 1:23:21 AM
        Subject: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

        Dr. Somsel,

        I agree. Years ago when I wrote my Master's thesis, I formed the hypothesis
        that Rev 4-22 functioned as an argument for the exhortations in Rev 1-3.

        Later, I read Dr. Mark W. Wilson's thesis
        (http://www.revelati on-resources. com/2008/ 01/06/wilson- the-victor-
        sayings/).
        His studies confirmed what I was at.

        In my own thesis I found that both theme and pragmatic function unifies
        Revelation. OT themes such as epiphany and the divine warrior motif are used
        in both parts of Revelation.

        Other scholars (e.g., Kempson, Mazzaferri, Giblin, Bauckham) have shown that
        there is a unifying overall structure. This structure is indicated by
        external linguistic markers, such as EN PNEUMATI and the numbering
        sequences.

        There is much, much more to say, but I would say that you are certainly
        right!

        Dr. Georg S. Adamsen

        -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
        Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
        [mailto:revelation- list@ yahoogroups. com] P� vegne af George F Somsel
        Sendt: 14. januar 2009 07:05
        Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
        Emne: [revelation- list] Continuity

        It has always seemed that caps 1-3 and 4-22 are two separate worlds (Of
        course, in one sense they are).� I have been wondering lately if there is
        not a closer relation between the two halves of the writing.� Does anyone
        have some thoughts they would care to share on this?
        �george
        gfsomsel

        � search for truth, hear truth,
        learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
        defend the truth till death.

        - Jan Hus
        _________
        .
        .





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Georg S. Adamsen
        My thesis is available from a number of European libraries. It may or may not be available from U.S. libraries as well. I do think that I still have one or two
        Message 3 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
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          My thesis is available from a number of European libraries. It may or may
          not be available from U.S. libraries as well. I do think that I still have
          one or two copies left, but, unfortunately, it is extremely expensive to
          send it to the U.S. I will take a look as to whether it is possible to make
          a PDF-version of it. PDF-technology has advanced since 2002, I guess.

          Georg

          -----Oprindelig meddelelse-----
          Fra: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
          [mailto:revelation-list@yahoogroups.com] På vegne af George F Somsel
          Sendt: 14. januar 2009 12:24
          Til: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
          Emne: Re: [revelation-list] Continuity

          Are the results of your study available in written form (Perhaps your thesis
          which I seem to recall was submitted in English)?  I would be willing to
          purchase a copy.
           george
          gfsomsel


          … search for truth, hear truth,
          learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
          defend the truth till death.


          - Jan Hus
          _________




          ________________________________
          From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@...>
          To: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 6:15:07 AM
          Subject: Re: [revelation-list] Continuity


          Perhaps not "everyone" ... Anyway, yes I have developed that hypothesis. One
          might argue that there is a pragmatic unity, even if this is not easily
          recognisable by structural markers and contents. However, I argue that
          structure and content does indeed support the pragmatic unity, i.e. that
          Revelation 4-22 function as an argument for the exhortations in Revelation
          1-3. Parts of my thesis is "controversial" , but one of its strengths is
          that
          I point to themes and structures recognised by others.

          Georg

          -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
          Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
          [mailto:revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com] På vegne af George F Somsel
          Sendt: 14. januar 2009 11:39
          Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
          Emne: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

          Of course, everyone is aware of such themes as epiphany and the divine
          warrior motif in the Apocalypse.  What interests me more is your hypothesis
          that 4-22 functioned as an argument for 1-3.  Have you developed that?
           george
          gfsomsel

          … search for truth, hear truth,
          learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
          defend the truth till death.

          - Jan Hus
          _________

          ____________ _________ _________ __
          From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@stubkjaer- adamsen.dk>
          To: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
          Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 1:23:21 AM
          Subject: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

          Dr. Somsel,

          I agree. Years ago when I wrote my Master's thesis, I formed the hypothesis
          that Rev 4-22 functioned as an argument for the exhortations in Rev 1-3.

          Later, I read Dr. Mark W. Wilson's thesis
          (http://www.revelati on-resources. com/2008/ 01/06/wilson- the-victor-
          sayings/).
          His studies confirmed what I was at.

          In my own thesis I found that both theme and pragmatic function unifies
          Revelation. OT themes such as epiphany and the divine warrior motif are used
          in both parts of Revelation.

          Other scholars (e.g., Kempson, Mazzaferri, Giblin, Bauckham) have shown that
          there is a unifying overall structure. This structure is indicated by
          external linguistic markers, such as EN PNEUMATI and the numbering
          sequences.

          There is much, much more to say, but I would say that you are certainly
          right!

          Dr. Georg S. Adamsen

          -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
          Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
          [mailto:revelation- list@ yahoogroups. com] På vegne af George F Somsel
          Sendt: 14. januar 2009 07:05
          Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
          Emne: [revelation- list] Continuity

          It has always seemed that caps 1-3 and 4-22 are two separate worlds (Of
          course, in one sense they are).  I have been wondering lately if there is
          not a closer relation between the two halves of the writing.  Does anyone
          have some thoughts they would care to share on this?
           george
          gfsomsel

          … search for truth, hear truth,
          learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
          defend the truth till death.

          - Jan Hus
          _________
          .
          .





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


          ------------------------------------

          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • George F Somsel
          Thank you, I would appreciate it very much.  george gfsomsel … search for truth, hear truth, learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
          Message 4 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
          • 0 Attachment
            Thank you, I would appreciate it very much.
            �george
            gfsomsel


            � search for truth, hear truth,
            learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
            defend the truth till death.


            - Jan Hus
            _________




            ________________________________
            From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@...>
            To: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 6:34:43 AM
            Subject: Re: [revelation-list] Continuity


            My thesis is available from a number of European libraries. It may or may
            not be available from U.S. libraries as well. I do think that I still have
            one or two copies left, but, unfortunately, it is extremely expensive to
            send it to the U.S. I will take a look as to whether it is possible to make
            a PDF-version of it. PDF-technology has advanced since 2002, I guess.

            Georg

            -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
            Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            [mailto:revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com] P� vegne af George F Somsel
            Sendt: 14. januar 2009 12:24
            Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            Emne: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

            Are the results of your study available in written form (Perhaps your thesis
            which I seem to recall was submitted in English)?� I would be willing to
            purchase a copy.
            �george
            gfsomsel

            � search for truth, hear truth,
            learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
            defend the truth till death.

            - Jan Hus
            _________

            ____________ _________ _________ __
            From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@stubkjaer- adamsen.dk>
            To: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 6:15:07 AM
            Subject: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

            Perhaps not "everyone" ... Anyway, yes I have developed that hypothesis. One
            might argue that there is a pragmatic unity, even if this is not easily
            recognisable by structural markers and contents. However, I argue that
            structure and content does indeed support the pragmatic unity, i.e. that
            Revelation 4-22 function as an argument for the exhortations in Revelation
            1-3. Parts of my thesis is "controversial" , but one of its strengths is
            that
            I point to themes and structures recognised by others.

            Georg

            -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
            Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            [mailto:revelation- list@ yahoogroups. com] P� vegne af George F Somsel
            Sendt: 14. januar 2009 11:39
            Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            Emne: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

            Of course, everyone is aware of such themes as epiphany and the divine
            warrior motif in the Apocalypse.� What interests me more is your hypothesis
            that�4-22 functioned as an argument for 1-3.� Have you developed that?
            �george
            gfsomsel

            � search for truth, hear truth,
            learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
            defend the truth till death.

            - Jan Hus
            _________

            ____________ _________ _________ __
            From: Georg S. Adamsen <georg@stubkjaer- adamsen.dk>
            To: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 1:23:21 AM
            Subject: Re: [revelation- list] Continuity

            Dr. Somsel,

            I agree. Years ago when I wrote my Master's thesis, I formed the hypothesis
            that Rev 4-22 functioned as an argument for the exhortations in Rev 1-3.

            Later, I read Dr. Mark W. Wilson's thesis
            (http://www.revelati on-resources. com/2008/ 01/06/wilson- the-victor-
            sayings/).
            His studies confirmed what I was at.

            In my own thesis I found that both theme and pragmatic function unifies
            Revelation. OT themes such as epiphany and the divine warrior motif are used
            in both parts of Revelation.

            Other scholars (e.g., Kempson, Mazzaferri, Giblin, Bauckham) have shown that
            there is a unifying overall structure. This structure is indicated by
            external linguistic markers, such as EN PNEUMATI and the numbering
            sequences.

            There is much, much more to say, but I would say that you are certainly
            right!

            Dr. Georg S. Adamsen

            -----Oprindelig meddelelse-- ---
            Fra: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            [mailto:revelation- list@ yahoogroups. com] P� vegne af George F Somsel
            Sendt: 14. januar 2009 07:05
            Til: revelation-list@ yahoogroups. com
            Emne: [revelation- list] Continuity

            It has always seemed that caps 1-3 and 4-22 are two separate worlds (Of
            course, in one sense they are).� I have been wondering lately if there is
            not a closer relation between the two halves of the writing.� Does anyone
            have some thoughts they would care to share on this?
            �george
            gfsomsel

            � search for truth, hear truth,
            learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
            defend the truth till death.

            - Jan Hus
            _________
            .





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Edmond Long
            I have wondered about the significance of 1.3 and 22.7, the hearing and heeding blessings. Between 4.1 and 22.6, little if anything needs to be heeded, in the
            Message 5 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
            • 0 Attachment
              I have wondered about the significance of 1.3 and 22.7, the hearing
              and heeding blessings. Between 4.1 and 22.6, little if anything needs
              to be heeded, in the sense of obeying. Seemingly, chaps. 4-22 have an
              entirely different purpose than 1-3, and 22.7-21. The only "commmands"
              in the Apocalypse are found in the beginning and ending of the book.
              Am I on the right track?
            • Ian R. Brown
              I would recommend looking at G. K. Beale s extensive commentary. He deals with the matter briefly in his introduction, then in the introduction to the
              Message 6 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
              • 0 Attachment
                I would recommend looking at G. K. Beale's extensive commentary. He deals
                with the matter briefly in his introduction, then in the introduction to the
                letters, and then periodically throughout the commentary. He offers several
                reasons for linking the letters to the visions.

                Ian R. Brown

                -----Original Message-----
                From: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:revelation-list@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of George F Somsel
                Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 1:05 AM
                To: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [revelation-list] Continuity

                It has always seemed that caps 1-3 and 4-22 are two separate worlds (Of
                course, in one sense they are).  I have been wondering lately if there is
                not a closer relation between the two halves of the writing.  Does anyone
                have some thoughts they would care to share on this?
                 george
                gfsomsel


                … search for truth, hear truth,
                learn truth, love truth, speak the truth, hold the truth,
                defend the truth till death.


                - Jan Hus
                _________




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


                ------------------------------------

                Yahoo! Groups Links
              • Ian R. Brown
                I would argue that what needs heeding in 4:1-22:6 is more implied than direct; for example, the implied command to avoid idolatry. Something more direct would
                Message 7 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
                • 0 Attachment
                  I would argue that what needs heeding in 4:1-22:6 is more implied than
                  direct; for example, the implied command to avoid idolatry. Something more
                  direct would be 13:10, 18; 14:12; 17:9.

                  Ian R. Brown

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
                  [mailto:revelation-list@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Edmond Long
                  Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 6:53 AM
                  To: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [revelation-list] Re: Continuity

                  I have wondered about the significance of 1.3 and 22.7, the hearing
                  and heeding blessings. Between 4.1 and 22.6, little if anything needs
                  to be heeded, in the sense of obeying. Seemingly, chaps. 4-22 have an
                  entirely different purpose than 1-3, and 22.7-21. The only "commmands"
                  in the Apocalypse are found in the beginning and ending of the book.
                  Am I on the right track?


                  ------------------------------------

                  Yahoo! Groups Links
                • Edmond Long
                  Do we take the term heed, (tereo typically means to obey) to mean pay attention to, or to obey ? I am not certain of the presence implied commands in the
                  Message 8 of 11 , Jan 14, 2009
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Do we take the term "heed," (tereo typically means to obey) to mean
                    "pay attention to," or "to obey"? I am not certain of the presence
                    implied commands in the 4-22 sections. If they are present, though,
                    they are subsidiary to the overtly stated commands in the 1-3 and
                    22.7f sections. The letters in 2-3, on the other hand, are filled with
                    commands. Again, the question is how do chaps. 4-22 relate to chaps.
                    2-3 in particular?
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