4747Re: [rest-discuss] REST and the design of HTTP methods
- Jan 2, 2005Roy T. Fielding wrote:
> ...OK, another interesting read is in Jim Whitehead's and Yaron Goland's
> Yeah, Yaron's twisted little view of history. It would be more
> accurate to say
> that some people insisted HTTP could not carry internationalized data in
> header fields (which is blatantly false -- it is only inconveniently
> and thus spawned an incredibly convoluted XML format for properties,
> later got boiled down to name-value pairs (like all metadata systems).
> got invented because an XML search interface was needed to deal with
> the complex
> properties, but was later dropped due to lack of interest in a
> variation of what the real database people were working on with XQuery.
"The WebDAV Property Design"
I came to WebDAV only in early 2001 (when all design decisions were
already made and DeltaV was nearing completion). However, I do agree
with some of the points made about using HTTP headers for properties, in
HTTP header values can use non-ASCII characters (RFC2231), but the
header names itself can't (or am I missing something)? So if it is a
requirement that property *names* can use arbitrary characters, they
can't be mapped to header names.
It would be an interesting exercise to define a new request header for
GET/HEAD that would basically transport PROPFIND (depth=0) information
in headers. Anybody interested?
> The issue of identification started because of a really bad paper tigerI'd really like to see that proposal, however I haven't been able to
> for munging URIs that was proposed by someone else, rejected, and then
> by me during a meeting at Xerox PARC with the imagemap-style URI
> by the server. Larry did not object to that style of munging. The
> design was
> not used by WebDAV because the editors chose not to for some unknown
> not because there was any objection from the working group (on the
> both Henrik and I objected to the extra methods). All of that nonsense
find it in the mailing list archives so far. Unfortunately, the other
archive that's supposed to have it
(<http://ftp.ics.uci.edu/pub/ietf/webdav/>) seems to be
misconfigured/down right down.
> about extra round-trips is just bullshit invented by Yaron --Although I'm not happy with many parts of the WebDAV design, there
> Microsoft's own
> implementations had no such concern for round-trips and actually made
> unnecessary requests prior to each WebDAV resource action just to check
> if it
> was actually WebDAV-enabled.
> WebDAV is stuck with that design because we let Microsoft dominate the
> working group as the only significant implementation. Apache's mod_dav
> didn't come along until much later. Henrik's implementation in libwww,
> completed during the HTTP/1.1 design, was ignored because it didn't use
doesn't seem to be a lot of competition, probably because it's "good
enough". However, that doesn't mean that it wouldn't be a good thing to
actually document an alternate design -- maybe it could get traction
outside the Microsoft world (such as Apache/mod_dav and Apache Slide).
Best regards, Julian
<green/>bytes GmbH -- http://www.greenbytes.de -- tel:+492512807760
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