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Quenya: "I love you" ?!

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  • soccerphil_7
    Amin mela lle or Tye-mela ne or Melinyet or Le melon [Sindarin] wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and melme(noun)
    Message 1 of 17 , May 13, 2005
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      "Amin mela lle" or "Tye-mela'ne" or "Melinyet" or "Le melon"[Sindarin]

      wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and melme(noun) <"z
    • Captain Quack
      I would probably say_melinyel_or_tye-melin_. ... From: soccerphil_7 Date: 05/13/05 12:53:45 To: quenya@yahoogroups.com Subject: [quenya] Quenya: I love you
      Message 2 of 17 , May 13, 2005
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        I would probably say_melinyel_or_tye-melin_.
         
        -------Original Message-------
         
        Date: 05/13/05 12:53:45
        Subject: [quenya] Quenya: "I love you" ?!
         
        "Amin mela lle" or "Tye-mela'ne" or "Melinyet" or "Le melon"[Sindarin]

        wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and melme(noun) <"z


         
      • Atwe
        Yes. **amin mela lle is Grelvish, rpg-language, nothing close to Tolkien s Quenya and Sindarin. In Sindarin we have no attested example for I love you . ...
        Message 3 of 17 , May 13, 2005
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          Yes. **amin mela lle is Grelvish, rpg-language,
          nothing close to Tolkien's Quenya and Sindarin.
          In Sindarin we have no attested example for "I love
          you".

          --- Captain Quack <captainquack@...> wrote:
          > I would probably say_melinyel_or_tye-melin_.
          >
          > -------Original Message-------
          >
          > From: soccerphil_7
          > Date: 05/13/05 12:53:45
          > To: quenya@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [quenya] Quenya: "I love you" ?!
          >
          > "Amin mela lle" or "Tye-mela'ne" or "Melinyet" or
          > "Le melon"[Sindarin]
          >
          > wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and
          > melme(noun) <"z
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
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          Thomas Ferencz

          -- love is the shadow that ripens the wine --



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        • soccerphil_7
          I know I read it some where but I cnt rmmber the suffix -in and - yet wat does it mean again when you add it with a noun. And the prefix tye- it means
          Message 4 of 17 , May 13, 2005
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            I know I read it some where but I cnt rmmber the suffix "-in" and "-
            yet" wat does it mean again when you add it with a noun. And the
            prefix "tye-" it means "thee" or "you" right so "tye-melin"
            means "thee I love" ? .... I think pretty much the best way to say "I
            love you" is "melinyelye" although Im not sure with the suffixes I
            added <"z
          • Captain Quack
            As far as the suffix_in_is concerned, it is the plural dative suffix. For example: _elda_elf, _eldain_for elves _aran_king, _aranin_for kings I don t believe
            Message 5 of 17 , May 13, 2005
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              As far as the suffix_in_is concerned, it is the plural dative suffix. For example:
               
              _elda_elf, _eldain_for elves
              _aran_king, _aranin_for kings
               
              I don't believe that there is a suffix_yet_. Perhaps you are mistaking part of the ending_-inyet_, which is the aorist ending "-i"+1st person singular pronominal ending "-nye"+3rd person pronominal ending "-t". It would be used as follows:
               
              _mel_love,_melinyet_I love them.
              _cen_see,_ceninyet_I see them.
               
              It is also customary to use the short pronominal endings in the accusative, so I would probably say_melinyel_instead of_melinyelye_.
               
              Fallendil 
               
              -------Original Message-------
               
              Date: 05/13/05 15:36:26
              Subject: [quenya] Re: Quenya: "I love you" ?!
               
              I know I read it some where but I cnt rmmber the suffix "-in" and "-
              yet" wat does it mean again when you add it with a noun. And the
              prefix "tye-" it means "thee" or "you" right so "tye-melin"
              means "thee I love" ? .... I think pretty much the best way to say "I
              love you" is "melinyelye" although Im not sure with the suffixes I
              added <"z


               
            • soccerphil_7
              thanks. the addition -t is it to be plural? ... under the situation which is better to use -tyë or -lyë ;I cant make out the difference of the two
              Message 6 of 17 , May 14, 2005
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                thanks. the addition "-t" is it to be plural? ... under the situation
                which is better to use "-tyë" or "-lyë" ;I cant make out the
                difference of the two <"z
              • Atwe
                ... It seems that -tye is used in familiar address, while -lye is more reverential, formal (aside of being also 2nd person plural). Thomas Ferencz -- love is
                Message 7 of 17 , May 14, 2005
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                  --- soccerphil_7 <soccerphil_7@...> wrote:
                  > thanks. the addition "-t" is it to be plural? ...
                  > under the situation
                  > which is better to use "-ty�" or "-ly�" ;I cant make
                  > out the
                  > difference of the two <"z

                  It seems that -tye is used in familiar address, while
                  -lye is more reverential, formal (aside of being also
                  2nd person plural).

                  Thomas Ferencz

                  -- love is the shadow that ripens the wine --



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                • chris waner
                  melinyelye would be a correct way to say it in quenya. there are also approx 26 other ways to say it since the language gives you so many options mel (love)
                  Message 8 of 17 , May 15, 2005
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                    melinyelye would be a correct way to say it in quenya.  there are also approx 26 other ways to say it since the language gives you so many options

                    mel (love) in(aorist tense meaning general truth) nye (I) lye (you)

                    mel-i(nye)-lye

                    ///waner




                    ----Original Message Follows----
                    From: "soccerphil_7" <soccerphil_7@...>
                    Reply-To: quenya@yahoogroups.com
                    To: quenya@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [quenya] Re: Quenya: "I love you" ?!
                    Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 13:36:17 -0000

                    I know I read it some where but I cnt rmmber the suffix "-in" and "-
                    yet" wat does it mean again when you add it with a noun. And the
                    prefix "tye-" it means "thee" or "you" right so "tye-melin"
                    means "thee I love" ? .... I think pretty much the best way to say "I
                    love you" is "melinyelye" although Im not sure with the suffixes I
                    added <"z


                  • Atwe
                    ... melinyelye would be a correct way to say it in quenya. Sorry, but it would not. As far as we know only the short pronominal suffixes can be used as object
                    Message 9 of 17 , May 15, 2005
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                      --- chris waner <cwaner@...> wrote:
                      ---------------------------------

                      melinyelye would be a correct way to say it in quenya.


                      Sorry, but it would not. As far as we know only the
                      short pronominal suffixes can be used as object
                      endings, so the correct for would be melinyel.

                      Thomas Ferencz

                      -- love is the shadow that ripens the wine --



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                    • lsg
                      inye tye mela soccerphil_7 escreveu: Amin mela lle or Tye-mela ne or Melinyet or Le melon [Sindarin] wat I do know is that mel-
                      Message 10 of 17 , May 15, 2005
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                        inye tye mela

                        soccerphil_7 <soccerphil_7@...> escreveu:
                        "Amin mela lle" or "Tye-mela'ne" or "Melinyet" or "Le melon"[Sindarin]

                        wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and melme(noun) <"z



                        Yahoo! Mail: agora com 1GB de espaço grátis. Abra sua conta!
                      • soccerphil_7
                        ... what does it mean ? same thing?
                        Message 11 of 17 , May 27, 2005
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                          --- In quenya@yahoogroups.com, lsg <louisesgg@y...> wrote:
                          > inye tye mela


                          what does it mean ? same thing? <"z
                        • soccerphil_7
                          mellon is friend right? so how do you say I am your friend or where are friend .... friends forever?
                          Message 12 of 17 , May 27, 2005
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                            mellon is friend right? so how do you say I am your friend or where
                            are friend .... friends forever? <"z
                          • Nathan Roy
                            Please allow me to put my two cents in... According to the Quenya course from Ardalambion, there are many possible ways to construct the phrase I love you,
                            Message 13 of 17 , May 27, 2005
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                              Please allow me to put my two cents in...

                              According to the Quenya course from Ardalambion, there are many possible
                              ways to construct the phrase "I love you," based on vocabulary gleaned or
                              extrapolated from Tolkein's documents. Here's the run down for vocabulary
                              options, if memory serves:

                              I (1st person singular subject pronoun)
                              -n / -nye (suffix), ni (independent), inye (independent emphatic)

                              love (present tense verb)
                              meela (present), mele (aorist)

                              you (2nd person object pronoun)
                              -l / -lye (formal suffix), tye (informal independent)

                              "Inye tye meela" is actually an attested sentence of Tolkein's, although
                              somewhat unique, since both pronouns are found in their independently forms.
                              Elsewhere, we have evidence of the other elements listed above, so
                              formulations such as "Melinyel" may be valid. Sorry for all the English, but
                              hopefully cleared some things up for any newcomers. Please read that Quenya
                              course! Sincerely,

                              Nathan Roy

                              (P.S. "mellon" is not Quenya, but means "friend" only in the Sindarin
                              variant of Elvish. The wordlists at Ardalambion give "meldo", "nildo" and
                              "sermo", among others... Use the available resources, and you'll soon be
                              able to compose sentences of your own. I'm planning to submit my own
                              translations here in the future. If only we had more advanced linguistic
                              info from Tolkein's papers!)


                              >From: "soccerphil_7" <soccerphil_7@...>
                              >Reply-To: quenya@yahoogroups.com
                              >To: quenya@yahoogroups.com
                              >Subject: [quenya] Re: Quenya: "I love you" ?!
                              >Date: Fri, 27 May 2005 13:58:10 -0000
                              >
                              >mellon is friend right? so how do you say I am your friend or where
                              >are friend .... friends forever? <"z
                              >
                              >
                            • soccerphil_7
                              thanks for all the help! Quenya course from Ardalambion? do you think you can give me a url address I dont think I have that
                              Message 14 of 17 , May 31, 2005
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                                thanks for all the help! Quenya course from Ardalambion? do you think
                                you can give me a url address I dont think I have that <"z
                              • Atwe
                                http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/ ... Thomas Ferencz -- love is the shadow that ripens the wine -- __________________________________________________ Do You
                                Message 15 of 17 , Jun 1, 2005
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                                  http://www.uib.no/People/hnohf/

                                  --- soccerphil_7 <soccerphil_7@...> wrote:
                                  > thanks for all the help! Quenya course from
                                  > Ardalambion? do you think
                                  > you can give me a url address I dont think I have
                                  > that <"z
                                  >
                                  >


                                  Thomas Ferencz

                                  -- love is the shadow that ripens the wine --

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                                • scott
                                  ... melon [Sindarin] ... i guess im far from an expert on the language, but seeing as how im new here ill throw my spin on it. from what i know, it is common
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Jul 15, 2005
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                                    --- In quenya@yahoogroups.com, "soccerphil_7" <soccerphil_7@y...>
                                    wrote:
                                    > "Amin mela lle" or "Tye-mela'ne" or "Melinyet" or "Le
                                    melon"[Sindarin]
                                    >
                                    > wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and melme(noun) <"z

                                    i guess im far from an expert on the language, but seeing as how im
                                    new here ill throw my spin on it.

                                    from what i know, it is common for words to blend together to the
                                    point of what "sounds" most pleasing to the ears. for formal
                                    occasions they may use more litteral "sounding out" of the words.
                                    but for high elvish (quenya) in every day talk (as in amoung the
                                    elves of valinor) the way that the words blend together in the most
                                    pleasing way is correct.

                                    ie:

                                    I (1st pers. sg) inyë (independent pronoun, used for emphasis:
                                    *"even I")

                                    LOVE (vb, love as friend) mel-


                                    ~the following is so debated upon that it needs a thorough
                                    description~

                                    YOU (pl. only; for sg "you", see THOU) The ending -lyë may cover pl.
                                    as well as sg. "you"; on the other hand, Tolkien also used -llë for
                                    pl. "you" (VT43:36). The reduced form -l may be attached to an
                                    imperative: hecal! "you be gone!" [WJ:364] and probably also as
                                    object: *Utúvienyel, "I (-nye) have found you (-l)". Perhaps -l can
                                    be used for plural "you" in subject postition as well, e.g.
                                    *lendel, "you went", though this could perhaps also be *lendellë.
                                    The independent (emphatic) word for "you, even you" as subject may
                                    be *ellë, while object "you" seems to be le (perhaps also used as a
                                    polite or formal sg: "thee", though the sg. seems to be #lye in at
                                    least one late version of Quenya). YOUR – the ending would be -lya
                                    if -lyë is both sg. and pl. "you" (the ending -lya is attested with
                                    sg. meaning), but if we accept -llë as an ending for plural "you",
                                    the ending for "your" would most likely be *-lla, e.g.
                                    *aldalla "your tree"


                                    THOU elyë (independent pronoun, used for emphasis, therefore
                                    translated "even thou" in Nam and RGEO:67. Such independent pronouns
                                    may also be used in copula-less constructions, e.g. aistana
                                    elyë "blessed [art] thou", VT43:30).


                                    so, from what i gather..."i love you" translates to "i love thou"
                                    which translates to "inyë mel elyë" which to sound most pleasing to
                                    the ears would translate to "imelyë".

                                    so as far as the correct translation of "i love you" to quenya, my
                                    answer would have to be "imelyë".

                                    however, to say something more along the lines of "my love",

                                    "amelyë" [literal translation= "love of i"], would be more
                                    appropriate.
                                  • Atwe
                                    Dear scott, I do not mean to be insulting, so please do not take this that way but it is clear nonsense. Please bear with me I will write a message with an
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Jul 16, 2005
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                                      Dear scott,

                                      I do not mean to be insulting, so please do not take
                                      this that way but it is clear nonsense.

                                      Please bear with me I will write a message with an
                                      explanation soon how to express this simple phrase.

                                      Cheers,
                                      --- scott wrote: --- In quenya@yahoogroups.com,
                                      "soccerphil_7"

                                      wrote:
                                      > "Amin mela lle" or "Tye-mela'ne" or "Melinyet" or
                                      "Le
                                      melon"[Sindarin]
                                      >
                                      > wat I do know is that mel- love(verb) and
                                      melme(noun) <"z

                                      i guess im far from an expert on the language, but
                                      seeing as how im
                                      new here ill throw my spin on it.

                                      from what i know, it is common for words to blend
                                      together to the
                                      point of what "sounds" most pleasing to the ears.
                                      for formal
                                      occasions they may use more litteral "sounding out"
                                      of the words.
                                      but for high elvish (quenya) in every day talk (as
                                      in amoung the
                                      elves of valinor) the way that the words blend
                                      together in the most
                                      pleasing way is correct.

                                      ie:

                                      I (1st pers. sg) inyë (independent pronoun, used for
                                      emphasis:
                                      *"even I")

                                      LOVE (vb, love as friend) mel-


                                      ~the following is so debated upon that it needs a
                                      thorough
                                      description~

                                      YOU (pl. only; for sg "you", see THOU) The ending
                                      -lyë may cover pl.
                                      as well as sg. "you"; on the other hand, Tolkien
                                      also used -llë for
                                      pl. "you" (VT43:36). The reduced form -l may be
                                      attached to an
                                      imperative: hecal! "you be gone!" [WJ:364] and
                                      probably also as
                                      object: *Utúvienyel, "I (-nye) have found you (-l)".
                                      Perhaps -l can
                                      be used for plural "you" in subject postition as
                                      well, e.g.
                                      *lendel, "you went", though this could perhaps also
                                      be *lendellë.
                                      The independent (emphatic) word for "you, even you"
                                      as subject may
                                      be *ellë, while object "you" seems to be le (perhaps
                                      also used as a
                                      polite or formal sg: "thee", though the sg. seems to
                                      be #lye in at
                                      least one late version of Quenya). YOUR – the ending
                                      would be -lya
                                      if -lyë is both sg. and pl. "you" (the ending -lya
                                      is attested with
                                      sg. meaning), but if we accept -llë as an ending for
                                      plural "you",
                                      the ending for "your" would most likely be *-lla,
                                      e.g.
                                      *aldalla "your tree"


                                      THOU elyë (independent pronoun, used for emphasis,
                                      therefore
                                      translated "even thou" in Nam and RGEO:67. Such
                                      independent pronouns
                                      may also be used in copula-less constructions, e.g.
                                      aistana
                                      elyë "blessed [art] thou", VT43:30).


                                      so, from what i gather..."i love you" translates to
                                      "i love thou"
                                      which translates to "inyë mel elyë" which to sound
                                      most pleasing to
                                      the ears would translate to "imelyë".

                                      so as far as the correct translation of "i love you"
                                      to quenya, my
                                      answer would have to be "imelyë".

                                      however, to say something more along the lines of
                                      "my love",

                                      "amelyë" [literal translation= "love of i"], would
                                      be more
                                      appropriate.







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                                      Thomas Ferencz

                                      -- love is the shadow that ripens the wine --



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