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1839Re: a couple of questions

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  • Peter
    Feb 1 5:05 AM
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      --- In quenya@yahoogroups.com, "Isaac Penzev" <isaacp@u...> wrote:
      > 1) Is there any way to count numbers beyond 12? E.g. to
      say "thirteen"?

      In the new issue of Vinyar Tengwar there is actually an answer to
      your question. The last two issues of Vinyar Tengwar has dealt
      extensively with Quenya numerals, so you would propably be
      interested in obtaining these. From issue No. 48 we get the numerals
      13 Q. _quainel_, 14 Q. _quaican_, 15 Q. _quailepen_, 16 Q.
      _quainque_, 17 Q. _otoque_, 18 Q. _toloque_, 19 Q. _neterque_. There
      are several differemt forms of these numerals and several different
      modes of forming them. I suggest you read the issue (and the former
      one) to learn the context these forms come from, as they are not
      some finalized table but different ideas that can be read in
      Tolkien's notes.

      >
      > 2) I know there are no attested words for "where" and "there" in
      the
      > available corpus. Some people reconstruct "where" as *massë. I
      have not yet
      > found any reference to "there". We have the word "here" (="in this
      place") -
      > sinomë. Would the words coined according to this pattern, *manomë
      and
      > *tanomë, plausible, or at least understandable?

      In _Námarie_ "wherein (pl.)" is _yassen_ so maybe you can use _*ya_
      as a demonstrative pronoun meaning "where". But maybe it is the
      interrogative you want? I believe that that is what people have
      reconstructed as Q. _*masse_.

      There are a lot of different forms in the (posthumously) published
      corpus meaning "there" and "where". I cannot list them all here,
      since it would take a long study to present them in a proper manner.
      Most of the demonstrative pronouns meaning "there" circle around the
      word _en_ f. ex. in _en i úmavaisor_ "*there on the throne of hate"
      from _Sí Qente Fëanor_ in Parma Eldalamberon No. 15. This is an
      early source, but _en_ keeps popping up as the demonstrative "there"
      taking different shades of meaning.

      All the best,
      Peter
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