Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [qiresearch] long distance healing

Expand Messages
  • chigung@mindspring.com
    ... Seeing how this is a research group, I expected to get a flood of people wanting to participate in the healings/research. Instead, I get letters like the
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 1, 2000
    • 0 Attachment
      >
      >Hi This is Judith here.
      >I have been doing longdistance healings for 7 years and never had to go
      >through the process you want us to go through. I do people in person
      >different than at a distance. At a distance I must prepare and pray and
      >medditate and then I go ahead. I tell whoever I am going to give a healing
      >what to do on their side.

      Seeing how this is a research group, I expected to get a flood of people
      wanting to participate in the healings/research. Instead, I get letters
      like the above.
      First of all, I have done long distance healing for 25 years and I also
      haven't done anything like the rigorous testing proposed...but so what?
      Isn't it about time we did? And I don't see how the proceedure proposed
      will interfere in the least with how we work. Prepare yourself, pray,
      meditate etc., whatever you want, and tell the client how to be receptive
      for you then send your long distance healing at the agreeded upon time. We
      can vary the length of the healings if you want so what's the problem? If
      we don't do something like what I proposed, we all could just be sitting
      around perpetuating the power of suggestion and not proving the validity of
      healing at a distance at all.

      What I am most worried about in all this is the fact that after several
      months and several hundred healings, the numbers will show that the client
      is quite inaccurate as to when they received the healings. Then what do we
      do? And look at the nightmare of variables we have to contend with...
      1. What if they were healed in spite of feeling nothing.
      2. What if they weren't healed even though they felt the healings accurately.
      3. What if the ones that felt something AND were instantly healed were
      healed by one person alone and the other healers were just excess baggage.
      (eventually, we must rotate healers to find out who is most effective and
      vary healing methods to see which is most effective)
      4. What if we do some controlled healings where we dont send healing at all
      and those sessions prove to be the most effective?

      Who is going to coordinate it all and keep the records and the necessary
      follow up with each client?

      Should we be specific in our goals with each client? I remember a study
      that confirmed that distant healings that were not specific were more
      effective than those that were. Did anyone else see that study?

      Many healings involve a period of exaggerated symptoms as part of the
      cleansing process. How do we distinguish those from healings that just
      didn't work?

      How many of you already do long distance healings? I want to hear from you all.
      Thanks
      Mark
    • Rebecca Buck
      We need to have the controlled tests. My main concern is that you may be asking for too much. To cure may be beyond (our) powers and truly up to the patient.
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 1, 2000
      • 0 Attachment
        We need to have the controlled tests.
        My main concern is that you may be asking for too much.
        To cure may be beyond (our) powers and truly up to the patient.
        Our intent should be general to give the patient faith and perseverance
        to help themselves.
        I didn't just sit around waiting for the "power" to heal me.
        I have worked hard on my recovery.
        As long time practitioners of this art you may forget how much
        dedication and work goes into our training to understand the Chi forces?

        I have seen people practice for years and never get the true"kung fu".
        If it were that easy, we would have all evolved as Wizards and not
        Doctors.
      • savva@aol.com
        In a message dated 9/1/00 12:46:57 AM Pacific Daylight Time, chigung@mindspring.com writes:
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 1, 2000
        • 0 Attachment
          In a message dated 9/1/00 12:46:57 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
          chigung@... writes:

          << Subj: Re: [qiresearch] long distance healing
          Date: 9/1/00 12:46:57 AM Pacific Daylight Time
          From: chigung@...
          Reply-to: qiresearch@egroups.com
          To: qiresearch@egroups.com

          ...

          What I am most worried about in all this is the fact that after several
          months and several hundred healings, the numbers will show that the client
          is quite inaccurate as to when they received the healings. Then what do we
          do? And look at the nightmare of variables we have to contend with...
          1. What if they were healed in spite of feeling nothing.
          2. What if they weren't healed even though they felt the healings accurately.
          3. What if the ones that felt something AND were instantly healed were
          healed by one person alone and the other healers were just excess baggage.
          (eventually, we must rotate healers to find out who is most effective and
          vary healing methods to see which is most effective)
          4. What if we do some controlled healings where we dont send healing at all
          and those sessions prove to be the most effective?

          Who is going to coordinate it all and keep the records and the necessary
          follow up with each client?

          Should we be specific in our goals with each client? I remember a study
          that confirmed that distant healings that were not specific were more
          effective than those that were. Did anyone else see that study?

          Many healings involve a period of exaggerated symptoms as part of the
          cleansing process. How do we distinguish those from healings that just
          didn't work?

          How many of you already do long distance healings? I want to hear from you
          all.
          Thanks
          Mark >>

          Those are very valid questions. The only way is to conduct the study (on
          distant healing) at a specialized hospital facility coordinated by a medical
          specialist. This is how Dr. Randel Byrd, cardiologist, conducted his study on
          the effect of prayers on his patients (a total around 400) in the 1980s.
          Funding provided, such study could be organized on a carefully selected
          disease, with methodology properly developed in advance. In contrast to
          Byrd's study, I would suggest to establish a strong emotional contact between
          healers and patients. Many other modifications might be discussed.

          Savely Savva
          MISAHA
        • Andrew Michael MacTao
          Hello All, First off, I want to apologize. I posted a few items in the past which were tangents to the subject at hand. That said, There has been concern
          Message 4 of 5 , Sep 1, 2000
          • 0 Attachment
            Hello All,
            First off, I want to apologize. I posted a few items in the past
            which were tangents to the subject at hand.

            That said,
            There has been concern expressed on list about how to conduct
            research, what conflicting results may indicate, what do we do IF.....

            I know someone on a different list who is a Research Scientist in
            Scotland. He has a very analytical mind. To the best of my knowledge,
            he does not do Chi Kung or Healing of any sort.
            I believe it would be beneficial to have a "Disinterested" third
            party, with Research experience help, or even sole create a regiment
            of Testing Procedures. Complete with placebo and double blind
            environments.
            If there are no objections, I would like to invite him to join
            this list, or, send me advice directly, whichever may fit his
            schedule.

            In the mean time, I believe it would be highly beneficial for us to
            begin creating a database:

            1. How many folks do we have on list.
            2. How much Training does each individual have.
            3. What styles, forms, Chi Kung sets, Teachers, Methodology, etc.
            4. What Healing experience. Relative degree of success.
            5. What Chi Projection experience. Relative degree of success.
            6. What does each individual feel his/her strong points are.
            7. What does each individual feel his/her weak points are.
            8. Unusual, specific, related types of Healing.
            9. Scientific Training, experience.
            10. Medical Training, experience.
            11. Willingness, availability for travel.
            12. Funding for travel expenses/accommodations.
            13. Current location.

            This thread could become quite lengthy. So, I hope we can all bear
            with each other. A most important part of any research project is to
            lay the groundwork. Part of that includes taking stock of inventory.
            It is important to know, before we start asking question, do we have
            the manpower available, with the necessary skills, to answer that
            question.
            If not, how important is that particular question?
            If it is important, how can we enlist or Train individuals to fill
            the manpower requirements?

            Also, if someone finds a particular Chi Kung set already listed in
            someone else's email, that they also know or practice, list it in
            your own response as well. It is important, not only to know what is
            known, but also by how many.

            I am not very good at bookkeeping. However, I will archive all
            emails to the list. If someone on list does have bookkeeping skills &
            volunteers to keep track of the database, I can forward any missed
            emails.

            That said. (I know I've missed a number of points)
            I will begin:

            1. I am alone in my household, I count as 1.

            2. I have studied external Martial Arts intermittently for 34 years.
            I have studied Internal Martial Arts styles since early 1989.
            This includes an intense period of 5 years..... 3-4 classes per day,
            7 days per week.

            3. My Internal Styles include: Yang and Chen, T'ai Chi, Hsing-I,
            Dai-I, Da-Cheng, Pa Kua, Liu Ho Pa Fa, Taoist Elixir Kung Fu (Tao Tan
            Pai)
            My Chi Kung sets include: Tao Tan Pai "31", Tao Tan Pai 5 Breaths,
            Tao Tan Pai 6 Stars, Tao Tan Pai Shen Set, T'ai Chi Set, T'ai Chi
            Sword Chi Kung, Liu Ho Pa Fa Set, Hsing-I Set, Pa-Kua Set, Da Cheng
            Set, Dai I Enhancements, 18 Hands of the Lohan, Ta Mo's Muscle
            Change, Ta Mo's Marrow Washing, T'ai Chi Chi', T'ai Chi Shen Kung,
            Silkweavers, Wu Chin Shi Animal Walks, Wu Chin Shi Single Step Chi
            Kung, Sil Lum Chi Kung Kuen, Standing Meditation Chi Kung, Shanghai
            Chi Kung.
            Teachers:
            Internal: Sifu's Carl A. Totton II, John Fey, Michael Shaman,
            Marjorie Jackson. Workshops with Sifu Share K. Lew, Peter Ralston.
            External: Sensei's Linda Gross, Gordon Doversola, Jack Arnold, Tony
            Raven, Jimmy Yamashita, Kong Yueng.

            4. My Healing experience is relatively limited. But, includes:
            Parkinson's Syndrome, Migraines, Arthritis, Sinus Ailments,
            Allergies, Immune Deficiency, Hypertension, Anxiety, Muscular pains.
            Success has been good.

            5. My Chi Projection Experience includes many of the same type of
            "Empty Force" demonstrations you can find on Sifu Mooney's website
            (video clips of Sifu Mooney). And extended hand..... Continuing to
            push a participant after my hand has physically lost contact with
            their body.
            Success has been good.

            6&7. Strong & weak points. Note in #4&5 above, I state success has
            been good, not excellent. I have quite an expansive database of
            knowledge. However, taking what's in my head & putting it in my hands
            has never been one of my stronger points. On the plus side, taking
            what's in my head & putting it in someone else's head is one of my
            greatest abilities. My ability to Learn quickly is great. My ability
            to Teach others is EXCELLENT, bordering on MIRACULOUS.

            8. One Unusual Healing technique I have had success with is "Time
            Dilation Healing." That is, healing someone in the past, before their
            condition got too serious.

            9. Science training: limited to the usual public school Science classes.

            10. Medical training: Standard First Aid, CPR.

            11-12. At present, I do not have set hours & am able to travel,
            should in-person tests or Instruction become necessary. Funding for
            transportation & accommodations is a problem.

            13. I currently live in East California. Owens Valley, Mt. Whitney,
            Death Valley area.
            I may also note: Death Valley is the lowest elevation in North
            America. Mt. Whitney is the highest peak in the contiguous 48. Should
            we wish to conduct research into the effects of temperature,
            atmospheric pressure, elevation, weather extremes, etc. on the
            effectiveness of Chi Kung, this area offers many conditions within a
            short drive of each other. Mt. Whitney, 15.5k' must be hiked.
            However, elevations of 10k' are driveable.

            Next.....
            --
            Iechyd Da,
            Sláinte,
            Andrew

            Please visit World Kwan Enlightenment Home Page
            http://www.eskimo.com/~mactao

            An Important Message for the year 2000
            http://www.eskimo.com/~mactao/thoughts/pol-rel-II.html
          • chigung@mindspring.com
            ... Thanks for that, I wondered how they did that study. Do we have enough healers in this group to try setting up something similar? Speak up or forever hold
            Message 5 of 5 , Sep 2, 2000
            • 0 Attachment
              >Those are very valid questions. The only way is to conduct the study (on
              >distant healing) at a specialized hospital facility coordinated by a medical
              >specialist. This is how Dr. Randel Byrd, cardiologist, conducted his study on
              >the effect of prayers on his patients (a total around 400) in the 1980s.
              > Funding provided, such study could be organized on a carefully selected
              >disease, with methodology properly developed in advance. In contrast to
              >Byrd's study, I would suggest to establish a strong emotional contact between
              >healers and patients. Many other modifications might be discussed.
              >
              >Savely Savva
              >MISAHA

              Thanks for that, I wondered how they did that study. Do we have enough
              healers in this group to try setting up something similar? Speak up or
              forever hold your chi.
              Mark
            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.