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Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less

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  • John
    Dino, I m glad I m not the only person who feels that way about Daniel Craig as Bond. What was the reason not to use Brosnan anymore? Did he want more
    Message 1 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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      Dino,
      I'm glad I'm not the only person who feels that way about Daniel Craig as
      Bond. What was the reason not to use Brosnan anymore? Did he want
      more money too?

      John




      -------Original Message-------

      From: LambuLambu@...
      Date: 1/3/2012 5:58:00 PM
      To: probe_control@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less


      Geoff,

      I maybe wrong, or mis-remembering (and someone please correct me if I am),
      but Alley was offered the part of Saavik in ST:III, but demanded double what
      she was paid to ST:II, and Paramount was not negotiating with demands, so
      they dropped her and got Curtis. Rumors at the time were that Alley wanted a
      salary that was more on par with the "main" Trek cast members and Paramount
      didn't feel that was justified after one appearance in the franchise. The
      fact that she made a demand rather than a request - or asked to negotiate a
      higher salary - didn't help her.

      Some of the rumors must be true because something apparently soured the Trek
      people's attitude towards Alley; she never appeared in any further Trek
      productions. Curtis, on the other hand, appeared in several TNG, DS9, and
      Voyager episodes, albeit in several different roles each time, but they did
      bring her back. Alley - a one Trek wonder.

      And yes: Bond and Leiter are definitely Gallifreyan, as is Moneypenny. I
      always thought it would be interesting to have such a world crisis that it
      would take "The Five Bonds" having to all work together to solve. (And no, I
      m not counting Daniel Craig in that mix. He's a 'reboot' and can wait for
      his own regeneration before having to team up with himself.)

      Dino.

      -----Original Message-----
      From: Geoff Willmetts <gfwillmetts@...>
      To: chat search <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 10:35 am
      Subject: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less

      Hello Dino

      The most regular changed role is James
      Bond but we all know he�s actually Gallifreyan. But so, too, is Felix Leiter


      With Saavik, Robin Curtis had a lot smaller
      screen time so probably wouldn�t have justified Alley�s price.

      Geoff

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • LambuLambu@aol.com
      From what I ve heard, and I think it was on a Good Morning America interview with Brosnan, he was just as surprised as everyone else when he learned that
      Message 2 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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        From what I've heard, and I think it was on a 'Good Morning America' interview with Brosnan, he was just as surprised as everyone else when he learned that Bond was going to be played by Craig. Brosnan wanted to continue in the role. In fact he was offered the role originally after Sir Roger Moore. 'Remington Steele' had just been cancelled so Brosnan accepted eagerly as he REALLY wanted to play Bond. But the network (NBC, I think it was) pulled some fast trick regarding his contract that prevented him from taking the role. The network brought 'Steele' back as a mid-season replacement, and then cancelled it again, but by that time Timothy Dalton had already gotten the role. So when Dalton left after his second outing Brosnan jumped in happily to finally land his coveted role.


        So it was a huge shock to him when he found out he was basically being fired from the role. He was a great Bond (and my wife loved him as Remington Steele, too). Daniel Craig doesn't strike me as having that "Bond" look. There is a certain elegance in all of the previous actors... they were all really good-looking guys (even George Lazenby). Craig? He looks more like a Blofeld than a Bond. On the Bond handsomeness scale, Craig comes in around a 2 (and I'm being generous). My wife puts Sean Connery at a 10, Brosnan at a 9, and Moore at about an 8.5. Dalton, she considers at about a 6.5, with Lazenby at a 6. She hasn't rated Craig yet because she says she doesn't want to be that cruel, but hints that the numbers are in the negative range.


        Dino.



        -----Original Message-----
        From: John <videoking@...>
        To: probe_control <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 1:04 pm
        Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less





        Dino,
        I'm glad I'm not the only person who feels that way about Daniel Craig as
        Bond. What was the reason not to use Brosnan anymore? Did he want
        more money too?

        John






        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • John
        I tried watching both of the Craig Bond films and could barely get through most of the first one. I found them very boring and very UN-Bond. Maybe those
        Message 3 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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          I tried watching both of the Craig Bond films and could barely get through
          most of the first one. I found them very boring and very UN-Bond. Maybe
          those that prefer and more gritty Bond like him but he doesn't appeal to me
          at all.

          John




          -------Original Message-------

          From: LambuLambu@...
          Date: 1/3/2012 6:27:46 PM
          To: probe_control@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less


          From what I've heard, and I think it was on a 'Good Morning America'
          interview with Brosnan, he was just as surprised as everyone else when he
          learned that Bond was going to be played by Craig. Brosnan wanted to
          continue in the role. In fact he was offered the role originally after Sir
          Roger Moore. 'Remington Steele' had just been cancelled so Brosnan accepted
          eagerly as he REALLY wanted to play Bond. But the network (NBC, I think it
          was) pulled some fast trick regarding his contract that prevented him from
          taking the role. The network brought 'Steele' back as a mid-season
          replacement, and then cancelled it again, but by that time Timothy Dalton
          had already gotten the role. So when Dalton left after his second outing
          Brosnan jumped in happily to finally land his coveted role.

          So it was a huge shock to him when he found out he was basically being fired
          from the role. He was a great Bond (and my wife loved him as Remington
          Steele, too). Daniel Craig doesn't strike me as having that "Bond" look.
          There is a certain elegance in all of the previous actors... they were all
          really good-looking guys (even George Lazenby). Craig? He looks more like a
          Blofeld than a Bond. On the Bond handsomeness scale, Craig comes in around a
          2 (and I'm being generous). My wife puts Sean Connery at a 10, Brosnan at a
          9, and Moore at about an 8.5. Dalton, she considers at about a 6.5, with
          Lazenby at a 6. She hasn't rated Craig yet because she says she doesn't want
          to be that cruel, but hints that the numbers are in the negative range.

          Dino.

          -----Original Message-----
          From: John <videoking@...>
          To: probe_control <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 1:04 pm
          Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less

          Dino,
          I'm glad I'm not the only person who feels that way about Daniel Craig as
          Bond. What was the reason not to use Brosnan anymore? Did he want
          more money too?

          John

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • LambuLambu@aol.com
          I ve noticed they ve been trying to do Bond up a bit. Hmmm... Don t like it. Dino. ... From: John To: probe_control
          Message 4 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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            I've noticed they've been trying to do 'Bond' up a bit.


            Hmmm... Don't like it.


            Dino.



            -----Original Message-----
            From: John <videoking@...>
            To: probe_control <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 1:34 pm
            Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less





            I tried watching both of the Craig Bond films and could barely get through
            most of the first one. I found them very boring and very UN-Bond. Maybe
            those that prefer and more gritty Bond like him but he doesn't appeal to me
            at all.

            John






            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • John
            My favorite Bond films were the Roger Moore ones. I know they are the most cartoonish out of the whole series of films but I find them to be the most fun.
            Message 5 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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              My favorite Bond films were the Roger Moore ones. I know they are the
              most cartoonish out of the whole series of films but I find them to be the
              most fun.

              John




              -------Original Message-------

              From: LambuLambu@...
              Date: 1/3/2012 6:37:30 PM
              To: probe_control@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less


              I've noticed they've been trying to do 'Bond' up a bit.

              Hmmm... Don't like it.

              Dino.

              -----Original Message-----
              From: John <videoking@...>
              To: probe_control <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 1:34 pm
              Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less

              I tried watching both of the Craig Bond films and could barely get through
              most of the first one. I found them very boring and very UN-Bond. Maybe
              those that prefer and more gritty Bond like him but he doesn't appeal to me
              at all.

              John

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Marta Dawes
              I m not a Bond fan, but I loved Daniel Craig s performance in Casino Royale and I loved the film. I thought it was a killer action film and was a fitting
              Message 6 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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                I'm not a Bond fan, but I loved Daniel Craig's performance in "Casino
                Royale" and I loved the film. I thought it was a killer action film and was
                a fitting take on the original story, updated though it was. "Quantum of
                Solace" was not nearly as interesting, and didn't have near the appeal of
                the first; it just didn't seem to click.

                Marta

                http://www.steveandmarta.com - See the 2004 Twilight Zone Convention page!

                All we are saying...
                is give Peace a chance. - John Lennon

                ". . . just do a couple of lines from "Hamlet," please . . . or "The
                Sandpiper"!" Michael J. Pollard and Logan Ramsey, to Bill Murray, in
                "Scrooged."

                -----Original Message-----
                From: probe_control@yahoogroups.com [mailto:probe_control@yahoogroups.com]
                On Behalf Of John
                Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2012 5:35 PM
                To: probe_control@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less

                I tried watching both of the Craig Bond films and could barely get through
                most of the first one. I found them very boring and very UN-Bond. Maybe
                those that prefer and more gritty Bond like him but he doesn't appeal to me
                at all.

                John




                -------Original Message-------

                From: LambuLambu@...
                Date: 1/3/2012 6:27:46 PM
                To: probe_control@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less


                From what I've heard, and I think it was on a 'Good Morning America'
                interview with Brosnan, he was just as surprised as everyone else when he
                learned that Bond was going to be played by Craig. Brosnan wanted to
                continue in the role. In fact he was offered the role originally after Sir
                Roger Moore. 'Remington Steele' had just been cancelled so Brosnan accepted
                eagerly as he REALLY wanted to play Bond. But the network (NBC, I think it
                was) pulled some fast trick regarding his contract that prevented him from
                taking the role. The network brought 'Steele' back as a mid-season
                replacement, and then cancelled it again, but by that time Timothy Dalton
                had already gotten the role. So when Dalton left after his second outing
                Brosnan jumped in happily to finally land his coveted role.

                So it was a huge shock to him when he found out he was basically being fired
                from the role. He was a great Bond (and my wife loved him as Remington
                Steele, too). Daniel Craig doesn't strike me as having that "Bond" look.
                There is a certain elegance in all of the previous actors... they were all
                really good-looking guys (even George Lazenby). Craig? He looks more like a
                Blofeld than a Bond. On the Bond handsomeness scale, Craig comes in around a
                2 (and I'm being generous). My wife puts Sean Connery at a 10, Brosnan at a
                9, and Moore at about an 8.5. Dalton, she considers at about a 6.5, with
                Lazenby at a 6. She hasn't rated Craig yet because she says she doesn't want
                to be that cruel, but hints that the numbers are in the negative range.

                Dino.

                -----Original Message-----
                From: John <videoking@...>
                To: probe_control <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 1:04 pm
                Subject: Re: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less

                Dino,
                I'm glad I'm not the only person who feels that way about Daniel Craig as
                Bond. What was the reason not to use Brosnan anymore? Did he want more money
                too?

                John

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                ------------------------------------

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              • John
                Actually, Nicholas Meyer wanted her to play Saavik in Star Trek 6, and have that character be the one to betray the peace mission. When she wouldn t do it,
                Message 7 of 11 , Jan 3, 2012
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                  Actually, Nicholas Meyer wanted her to play Saavik in Star Trek 6, and have
                  that character be the one to betray the peace mission. When she wouldn't
                  do it, the character was renamed and Kim Cattrall played the part.

                  I am not sure I buy the notion of her souring the Trek people. First of
                  all, she started Cheers in 1987...the same time Next Gen started...she did
                  not need to do guest shots on a syndicated show when she was starring in a
                  highly successful network show. Second, the folks doing 24th Century Trek
                  were not the same ones doing the Original cast movies, and wanting more
                  money is not enough to sour a whole different production group. Finally,
                  she may not have wanted to do any more Trek. Some folks don't like the
                  genre...some don't like intense fandom...and some may feel typecast by it.

                  On Tue, Jan 3, 2012 at 5:57 PM, <LambuLambu@...> wrote:

                  > **
                  >
                  >
                  > Geoff,
                  >
                  > I maybe wrong, or mis-remembering (and someone please correct me if I am),
                  > but Alley was offered the part of Saavik in ST:III, but demanded double
                  > what she was paid to ST:II, and Paramount was not negotiating with demands,
                  > so they dropped her and got Curtis. Rumors at the time were that Alley
                  > wanted a salary that was more on par with the "main" Trek cast members and
                  > Paramount didn't feel that was justified after one appearance in the
                  > franchise. The fact that she made a demand rather than a request - or asked
                  > to negotiate a higher salary - didn't help her.
                  >
                  > Some of the rumors must be true because something apparently soured the
                  > Trek people's attitude towards Alley; she never appeared in any further
                  > Trek productions. Curtis, on the other hand, appeared in several TNG, DS9,
                  > and Voyager episodes, albeit in several different roles each time, but they
                  > did bring her back. Alley - a one Trek wonder.
                  >
                  > And yes: Bond and Leiter are definitely Gallifreyan, as is Moneypenny. I
                  > always thought it would be interesting to have such a world crisis that it
                  > would take "The Five Bonds" having to all work together to solve. (And no,
                  > I'm not counting Daniel Craig in that mix. He's a 'reboot' and can wait for
                  > his own regeneration before having to team up with himself.)
                  >
                  > Dino.
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: Geoff Willmetts <gfwillmetts@...>
                  > To: chat search <probe_control@yahoogroups.com>
                  > Sent: Tue, Jan 3, 2012 10:35 am
                  > Subject: [probe_control] MacMillan & wife-less
                  >
                  > Hello Dino
                  >
                  > The most regular changed role is James
                  > Bond but we all know he�s actually Gallifreyan. But so, too, is Felix
                  > Leiter.
                  >
                  > With Saavik, Robin Curtis had a lot smaller
                  > screen time so probably wouldn�t have justified Alley�s price.
                  >
                  > Geoff
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Robert Greenberger
                  Let me weigh in here since I’ve been researching the issue for my forthcoming Unofficial History of Star Trek. According to Nimoy, Alley’s agent wanted a
                  Message 8 of 11 , Jan 4, 2012
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                    Let me weigh in here since I’ve been researching the issue for my forthcoming Unofficial History of Star Trek.



                    According to Nimoy, Alley’s agent wanted a salary putting her on par with DeForest Kelley, which he thought was absurd. The agent wouldn’t budge so they recast with Robin Curtis. Alley maintained positive relations with Paramount overall, which is how she wound up on Cheers.



                    Early drafts of the script for Star Trek IV did indicate Saavik was carrying Spock’s child and that is why she was staying on Vulcan. As the script got revised, they simply left her behind without comment. Fans have been speculating ever since on the exact nature of their connection. Various novelists and comic book writers have explored these non-canonical threads.



                    Yes, Nick Meyer wanted Alley back as Saavik for Star Trek VI but Alley refused the invitation so the part was rewritten into Valeris. Valeris was stated to be half-Romulan/half-Vulcan on screen while the footage of Spock mentioning the same heritage for Saavik was shown at Sho West prior to Star Trek II's release but has never been edited back into any broadcast or video release I have seen.



                    Hope this helps.



                    Bob



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Jim Alexander
                    Your Unofficial History of Star Trek sounds like it ll be a fascinating book, Bob. When it s released, consider another copy sold. I ll be looking forward to
                    Message 9 of 11 , Jan 4, 2012
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                      Your 'Unofficial History of Star Trek' sounds like it'll be a fascinating book, Bob. When it's released, consider another copy sold. I'll be looking forward to it.

                      Jim Alexander

                      ----- Original Message -----
                      Robert Greenberger wrote:





                      Let me weigh in here since I’ve been researching the issue for my forthcoming Unofficial History of Star Trek.

                      According to Nimoy, Alley’s agent wanted a salary putting her on par with DeForest Kelley, which he thought was absurd. The agent wouldn ’t budge so they recast with Robin Curtis. Alley maintained positive relations with Paramount overall, which is how she wound up on Cheers.

                      Early drafts of the script for Star Trek IV did indicate Saavik was carrying Spock’s child and that is why she was staying on Vulcan. As the script got revised, they simply left her behind without comment. Fans have been speculating ever since on the exact nature of their connection. Various novelists and comic book writers have explored these non-canonical threads.

                      Yes, Nick Meyer wanted Alley back as Saavik for Star Trek VI but Alley refused the invitation so the part was rewritten into Valeris . Valeris was stated to be half-Romulan/half-Vulcan on screen while the footage of Spock mentioning the same heritage for Saavik was shown at Sho West prior to Star Trek II's release but has never been edited back into any broadcast or video release I have seen.

                      Hope this helps.

                      Bob

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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