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Re: [prezveepsenator] Vt. City Electing Mayor Via Instant Runoff

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  • THOMAS JOHNSON
    Sounds like a great idea to me... ...
    Message 1 of 6 , Mar 4 10:58 AM
      Sounds like a great idea to me...

      --- Greg Cannon <gregcannon1@...> wrote:

      >
      http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060304/ap_on_el_st_lo/instant_runoff_election;_ylt=AmMlHDQqoGvX0SjKerBXeGas0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3OXIzMDMzBHNlYwM3MDM-
      >
      > Vt. City Electing Mayor Via Instant Runoff
      >
      > By ROSS SNEYD, Associated Press Writer 25 minutes
      > ago
      >
      > BURLINGTON, Vt. - Runoff elections are typically
      > cumbersome processes, taking weeks and sometimes
      > months to determine a winner. Burlington is going to
      > do it all instantly.
      >
      > In an innovation known as instant runoff voting, the
      > results of Tuesday's five-candidate election for
      > mayor
      > and whatever runoffs are needed to settle it will
      > all
      > be known soon after polls close.
      >
      > For the first time in a mayoral election in the
      > United
      > States, voters will mark their ballots for their
      > favorite candidate, along with their second, third,
      > fourth and fifth choices.
      >
      > If none of the five gets 50 percent of the vote on
      > the
      > first round, the candidate with the lowest vote
      > total
      > would be eliminated. Then the second choice of the
      > voters who made that candidate their initial pick
      > would be counted, and so on.
      >
      > "As soon as somebody gets to 50 percent, it stops,"
      > said Jo LaMarche, the city's election director.
      >
      > The winner will succeed incumbent Mayor Peter
      > Clavelle, who announced last year he would not seek
      > an
      > eighth two-year term in the city of nearly 40,000
      > people.
      >
      > Advocates promote instant runoff voting, also known
      > as
      > ranked-choice voting, as a way of boosting voter
      > turnout and encouraging more people to run for
      > public
      > office by eliminating concerns that a third-party
      > candidate might be a spoiler.
      >
      > "Nationally, people are catching on to how IRV can
      > open up our politics," said Ryan O'Donnell,
      > communications director of FairVote, the Center for
      > Voting and Democracy. "It's a reform that produces
      > majority winners, encourages candidates to reach out
      > to more voters, and eliminates the 'spoiler'
      > problem."
      >
      > If Florida had used instant runoff voting, the
      > outcome
      > of the 2000 presidential election likely would have
      > been different, said Doug Amy, professor of politics
      > at Mount Holyoke College and author of "Behind the
      > Ballot Box: A Citizen's Guide to Voting Systems."
      > Votes that went to Ralph Nader might ultimately have
      > gone to Vice President Al Gore.
      >
      > "I think that really brought that problem to
      > national
      > attention," Amy said.
      >
      > San Francisco has elected members of its board of
      > supervisors using instant runoff, but Burlington
      > will
      > be the first community in the nation to elect its
      > chief executive officer with the system.
      >
      > A number of other counties, cities, and towns have
      > shown interest, according to FairVote, including San
      > Diego, Oakland, Davis and Berkeley in California.
      > LaMarche said she has gotten calls about the system
      > from cities in South Carolina and Alaska.
      >
      > "A lot of people are just waiting to see how this
      > works with Burlington," LaMarche said.
      >
      > Bills are pending in at least 15 states to implement
      > instant runoffs at local levels or statewide. The
      > state of Washington last year gave a number of
      > mid-sized cities authority to conduct instant runoff
      > voting, although none has so far used it.
      >
      > Not everyone is enthusiastic about the idea. Some
      > election administrators worry that fewer people will
      > show up at the polls because of the system's
      > complexity. There is also concern about incomplete
      > counting in later runoff rounds.
      >
      > Doug Lewis, director of the Election Center, which
      > represents elections administrators nationally, said
      > those all are concerns he and his colleagues have
      > heard about instant runoffs. But he can't say
      > whether
      > they're valid.
      >
      > "Until you work with it enough and find out it would
      > be difficult to find out," he said
      >
      > LaMarche believes Burlington voters will not see
      > much
      > that's unusual Tuesday. The only difference is the
      > extra places after each mayoral candidate's name on
      > the optically scanned ballots for second, third,
      > fourth and fifth choices.
      >
      > The Burlington city clerk's office conducted voter
      > training in January to try to get voters interested
      > and educated. There also have been mailings
      > explaining
      > how the system works.
      >
      > Candidates even have tried to take advantage of the
      > new system. Progressive Party candidate Bob Kiss'
      > signs promote him as the "first choice for mayor."
      > Republican Kevin Curley has told his supporters that
      > he endorses Kiss as a second choice. Democrat Hinda
      > Miller has declined to endorse a second choice,
      > arguing she's confident she'll win in the first
      > round.
      >
      > ___
      >
      > On the Net:
      >
      > Burlington: http://www.ci.burlington.vt.us/
      >
      > FairVote: http://www.fairvote.org/
      >
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
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      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
    • Ram Lau
      ... Gore should just run again in 2008. Ram
      Message 2 of 6 , Mar 4 5:11 PM
        > > Votes that went to Ralph Nader might ultimately have
        > > gone to Vice President Al Gore.

        Gore should just run again in 2008.

        Ram
      • THOMAS JOHNSON
        Just when I thought that this administration couldn t get any more reactionary..... White House Trains Efforts on Media Leaks Sources, Reporters Could Be
        Message 3 of 6 , Mar 5 10:57 AM
          Just when I thought that this administration couldn't
          get any more reactionary.....


          White House Trains Efforts on Media Leaks
          Sources, Reporters Could Be Prosecuted

          By Dan Eggen
          Washington Post Staff Writer
          Sunday, March 5, 2006; Page A01

          The Bush administration, seeking to limit leaks of
          classified information, has launched initiatives
          targeting journalists and their possible government
          sources. The efforts include several FBI probes, a
          polygraph investigation inside the CIA and a warning
          from the Justice Department that reporters could be
          prosecuted under espionage laws.

          In recent weeks, dozens of employees at the CIA, the
          National Security Agency and other intelligence
          agencies have been interviewed by agents from the
          FBI's Washington field office, who are investigating
          possible leaks that led to reports about secret CIA
          prisons and the NSA's warrantless domestic
          surveillance program, according to law enforcement and
          intelligence officials familiar with the two cases.


          Numerous employees at the CIA, FBI, Justice Department
          and other agencies also have received letters from
          Justice prohibiting them from discussing even
          unclassified issues related to the NSA program,
          according to sources familiar with the notices. Some
          GOP lawmakers are also considering whether to approve
          tougher penalties for leaking.

          In a little-noticed case in California, FBI agents
          from Los Angeles have already contacted reporters at
          the Sacramento Bee about stories published in July
          that were based on sealed court documents related to a
          terrorism case in Lodi, according to the newspaper.

          Some media watchers, lawyers and editors say that,
          taken together, the incidents represent perhaps the
          most extensive and overt campaign against leaks in a
          generation, and that they have worsened the
          already-tense relationship between mainstream news
          organizations and the White House.

          "There's a tone of gleeful relish in the way they talk
          about dragging reporters before grand juries, their
          appetite for withholding information, and the hints
          that reporters who look too hard into the public's
          business risk being branded traitors," said New York
          Times Executive Editor Bill Keller, in a statement
          responding to questions from The Washington Post. "I
          don't know how far action will follow rhetoric, but
          some days it sounds like the administration is
          declaring war at home on the values it professes to be
          promoting abroad."

          President Bush has called the NSA leak "a shameful
          act" that was "helping the enemy," and said in
          December that he was hopeful the Justice Department
          would conduct a full investigation into the
          disclosure.

          "We need to protect the right to free speech and the
          First Amendment, and the president is doing that,"
          said White House spokesman Trent Duffy. "But, at the
          same time, we do need to protect classified
          information which helps fight the war on terror."

          Disclosing classified information without
          authorization has long been against the law, yet such
          leaks are one of the realities of life in Washington
          -- accounting for much of the back-channel
          conversation that goes on daily among journalists,
          policy intellectuals, and current and former
          government officials.

          Presidents have also long complained about leaks:
          Richard Nixon's infamous "plumbers" were originally
          set up to plug them, and he tried, but failed, to
          prevent publication of a classified history of the
          Vietnam War called the Pentagon Papers. Ronald Reagan
          exclaimed at one point that he was "up to my keister"
          in leaks.

          Bush administration officials -- who complain that
          reports about detainee abuse, clandestine surveillance
          and other topics have endangered the nation during a
          time of war -- have arguably taken a more aggressive
          approach than other recent administrations, including
          a clear willingness to take on journalists more
          directly if necessary.

          "Almost every administration has kind of come in
          saying they want an open administration, and then
          getting bad press and fuming about leaks," said David
          Greenberg, a Rutgers University journalism professor
          and author of "Nixon's Shadow." "But it's a pretty
          fair statement to say you haven't seen this kind of
          crackdown on leaks since the Nixon administration."


          Tom






          --- Ram Lau <ramlau@...> wrote:

          > > > Votes that went to Ralph Nader might ultimately
          > have
          > > > gone to Vice President Al Gore.
          >
          > Gore should just run again in 2008.
          >
          > Ram
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
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          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • greg
          The Nader-Gore situation reminds me of something I read the order day that you all might be interested in. This is from Robert S. McElvaine s The Great
          Message 4 of 6 , Mar 5 1:06 PM
            The Nader-Gore situation reminds me of something I read the order day
            that you all might be interested in. This is from Robert S.
            McElvaine's The Great Depression (246-247):

            In the summer of 1935, the Democratic National Committee conducted a
            secret poll on [Huey] Long as a possible third-party presidential
            candidate. The Democrats were shocked to learn that between 3 million
            and 4 million Americans might vote for Long and wealth-sharing. Even
            more disturbing to New Dealers were indications that Long had strong
            support in the midwestern Farm Belt and in the industrial regions
            along the Great Lakes (12.5 percent) and even the Pacific coast (12.1
            percent). The 1935 poll showed that Long could command a minimum
            100,000 votes in New York. It was reported separately that he might
            have obtained 250,000 votes in Ohio. Such a Long candidacy could throw
            the election to the Republicans. This was a fate Franklin Roosevelt
            did not want to see befall his countrymen. The President was already
            engaged in a secret war against Long. The White House offered
            encouragement to the senator's opponents in Louisiana, denied
            patronage to Long's supporters, secured the help of other southern
            senators in attacking Long, and even had the Justice Department and
            the FBI investigate the possibiity of sending troops into Louisiana to
            "restore republican government."

            ...

            By 1935, Long was making it plain that he was likely to support an
            independent presidential candidate the following year. His apparent
            plan was to siphon enough votes from Roosevelt to elect a Republican
            in 1936. Long believed that things would get so bad under a Republican
            administration that the people would turn to him in 1940. The Kingfish
            would be only forty-six when the new decade began, so there would be
            plenty of time.
            There was not. Before Long's last book, My First Days in the White
            House, could reach his public, an assassin's attack ended any
            possibility that fiction might become fact. As Long stood talking to
            aides in a corridor of the Louisiana Capitol in Baton Rouge on the
            night of September 8, 1935, Carl Weiss, a young physician who saw Huey
            as a tyrant and whose father-in-law had been wronged by the Long
            political machine, walked up to the senator and shot him with a
            pistol. Long's bodyguards responded by emptying their guins into Dr.
            Weiss.

            --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, "Ram Lau" <ramlau@...> wrote:
            >
            > > > Votes that went to Ralph Nader might ultimately have
            > > > gone to Vice President Al Gore.
            >
            > Gore should just run again in 2008.
            >
            > Ram
            >
          • THOMAS JOHNSON
            Great post, Greg.. I have taken the liberty of passing this along to the American Presidents group, as we are covering FDR this week, giving you proper credit,
            Message 5 of 6 , Mar 6 12:21 AM
              Great post, Greg.. I have taken the liberty of passing
              this along to the American Presidents group, as we are
              covering FDR this week, giving you proper credit, of
              course.

              Tom



              --- greg <gregcannon1@...> wrote:

              > The Nader-Gore situation reminds me of something I
              > read the order day
              > that you all might be interested in. This is from
              > Robert S.
              > McElvaine's The Great Depression (246-247):
              >
              > In the summer of 1935, the Democratic National
              > Committee conducted a
              > secret poll on [Huey] Long as a possible third-party
              > presidential
              > candidate. The Democrats were shocked to learn that
              > between 3 million
              > and 4 million Americans might vote for Long and
              > wealth-sharing. Even
              > more disturbing to New Dealers were indications that
              > Long had strong
              > support in the midwestern Farm Belt and in the
              > industrial regions
              > along the Great Lakes (12.5 percent) and even the
              > Pacific coast (12.1
              > percent). The 1935 poll showed that Long could
              > command a minimum
              > 100,000 votes in New York. It was reported
              > separately that he might
              > have obtained 250,000 votes in Ohio. Such a Long
              > candidacy could throw
              > the election to the Republicans. This was a fate
              > Franklin Roosevelt
              > did not want to see befall his countrymen. The
              > President was already
              > engaged in a secret war against Long. The White
              > House offered
              > encouragement to the senator's opponents in
              > Louisiana, denied
              > patronage to Long's supporters, secured the help of
              > other southern
              > senators in attacking Long, and even had the Justice
              > Department and
              > the FBI investigate the possibiity of sending troops
              > into Louisiana to
              > "restore republican government."
              >
              > ...
              >
              > By 1935, Long was making it plain that he was likely
              > to support an
              > independent presidential candidate the following
              > year. His apparent
              > plan was to siphon enough votes from Roosevelt to
              > elect a Republican
              > in 1936. Long believed that things would get so bad
              > under a Republican
              > administration that the people would turn to him in
              > 1940. The Kingfish
              > would be only forty-six when the new decade began,
              > so there would be
              > plenty of time.
              > There was not. Before Long's last book, My First
              > Days in the White
              > House, could reach his public, an assassin's attack
              > ended any
              > possibility that fiction might become fact. As Long
              > stood talking to
              > aides in a corridor of the Louisiana Capitol in
              > Baton Rouge on the
              > night of September 8, 1935, Carl Weiss, a young
              > physician who saw Huey
              > as a tyrant and whose father-in-law had been wronged
              > by the Long
              > political machine, walked up to the senator and shot
              > him with a
              > pistol. Long's bodyguards responded by emptying
              > their guins into Dr.
              > Weiss.
              >
              > --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, "Ram Lau"
              > <ramlau@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > > > Votes that went to Ralph Nader might
              > ultimately have
              > > > > gone to Vice President Al Gore.
              > >
              > > Gore should just run again in 2008.
              > >
              > > Ram
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
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