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Re: [prezveepsenator] Did Nixon speak out against Goldwater's racial stance in 1964?

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  • THOMAS JOHNSON
    That s a lot to think about. According to Joan Hoff writing in Nixon Reconsidered, Nixon told her that his roots were in the progressive wing of the
    Message 1 of 6 , Aug 24, 2005
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      That's a lot to think about.
      According to Joan Hoff writing in Nixon Reconsidered,
      Nixon told her that his roots were in the progressive
      wing of the Republican Party, and by initiating the
      EPA, the Social Security Income program, and the
      Office for Minority Business Enterprise, there seems
      to be some credence to that. And though he started
      with a higher approval rating than JFK or LBJ in
      their first 6 months in office, he felt that the press
      was out to get him, despite being supported by the
      vast majority of periodicals and daily newspapers in
      all three runs for president. His paranoia probably
      stopped him from attempting to do more.
      In secretly bombing Cambodia, 100,000 Cambodian
      peasants were killed and set the stage for the Khmer
      Rouge to take over, resulting in another 1.7 million
      deaths. He seems to have admitted that he prolonged
      the Viet Nam war for several years to help him get
      re-elected.
      He was an asshole, alright, and an insecure one, at
      that.... he probably knew it but I don't think he
      cared. The man must have been a sociopath.
      It looks to me like we have the same situation
      happening today, and I'm beginning to wonder whether
      Wilson was one, as well.

      Tom


      --- Ram Lau <ramlau@...> wrote:


      ---------------------------------
      I had a conversation with an emeritus professor on
      race and the
      Presidents yesterday. It began with his son at Yale
      working on his
      history dissertation on Woodrow Wilson's Southern
      roots and my "Nixon
      96" shirt.

      Knowing how racist Wilson was, I had no intention to
      defend him. Then
      I pointed out that the New Deal coalition was very
      solid until the
      late 40's when Eleanor Roosevelt and Harry Truman and
      Hubert Humphrey
      and the ADA and other Civil Rights pioneers
      substantially shaked up
      the civil rights stances of both parties for the first
      time.

      Nixon was the last GOP leader who could do something
      about preserving
      the moderate wing of the Party. But he wanted to win
      so badly that he
      came to the South and sought for the Klan votes
      instead. His
      anti-busing stance in 1972 was yet another blow that
      drove away the
      "good elements" of the GOP. I wonder if he realized
      how much of an
      asshole he was. I'm quite sure he did.

      He could have been the good guy and would have done
      great. But that
      role was taken by LBJ. Now that his infamous name will
      long live...
      perhaps that's what he wanted?

      Ram





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      ---------------------------------
    • Ram Lau
      Wilson was a Dixiecrat, and, as a matter of fact, quite proud of being one. The way I see Nixon is that he was willing to be either the good or bad guy. I fail
      Message 2 of 6 , Aug 24, 2005
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        Wilson was a Dixiecrat, and, as a matter of fact, quite proud of being
        one.

        The way I see Nixon is that he was willing to be either the good or
        bad guy. I fail to see what kind of legacy he wanted to shape, and
        maybe he just didn't care. He would've been a strong Civil Rights
        supporter had the Democrats not gone all out for the Black votes. As
        Machiavellian as he was, every vote was within his calculation. And by
        1968, it was a "wise move" to let go any support from Blacks (since
        Goldwater totally ruined it for him anyway) and go for the KKK votes
        instead. The plan worked out quite well for him, didn't it?

        Ram


        --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, THOMAS JOHNSON <AVRCRDNG@F...>
        wrote:
        > That's a lot to think about.
        > According to Joan Hoff writing in Nixon Reconsidered,
        > Nixon told her that his roots were in the progressive
        > wing of the Republican Party, and by initiating the
        > EPA, the Social Security Income program, and the
        > Office for Minority Business Enterprise, there seems
        > to be some credence to that. And though he started
        > with a higher approval rating than JFK or LBJ in
        > their first 6 months in office, he felt that the press
        > was out to get him, despite being supported by the
        > vast majority of periodicals and daily newspapers in
        > all three runs for president. His paranoia probably
        > stopped him from attempting to do more.
        > In secretly bombing Cambodia, 100,000 Cambodian
        > peasants were killed and set the stage for the Khmer
        > Rouge to take over, resulting in another 1.7 million
        > deaths. He seems to have admitted that he prolonged
        > the Viet Nam war for several years to help him get
        > re-elected.
        > He was an asshole, alright, and an insecure one, at
        > that.... he probably knew it but I don't think he
        > cared. The man must have been a sociopath.
        > It looks to me like we have the same situation
        > happening today, and I'm beginning to wonder whether
        > Wilson was one, as well.
        >
        > Tom
        >
        >
        > --- Ram Lau <ramlau@y...> wrote:
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > I had a conversation with an emeritus professor on
        > race and the
        > Presidents yesterday. It began with his son at Yale
        > working on his
        > history dissertation on Woodrow Wilson's Southern
        > roots and my "Nixon
        > 96" shirt.
        >
        > Knowing how racist Wilson was, I had no intention to
        > defend him. Then
        > I pointed out that the New Deal coalition was very
        > solid until the
        > late 40's when Eleanor Roosevelt and Harry Truman and
        > Hubert Humphrey
        > and the ADA and other Civil Rights pioneers
        > substantially shaked up
        > the civil rights stances of both parties for the first
        > time.
        >
        > Nixon was the last GOP leader who could do something
        > about preserving
        > the moderate wing of the Party. But he wanted to win
        > so badly that he
        > came to the South and sought for the Klan votes
        > instead. His
        > anti-busing stance in 1972 was yet another blow that
        > drove away the
        > "good elements" of the GOP. I wonder if he realized
        > how much of an
        > asshole he was. I'm quite sure he did.
        >
        > He could have been the good guy and would have done
        > great. But that
        > role was taken by LBJ. Now that his infamous name will
        > long live...
        > perhaps that's what he wanted?
        >
        > Ram
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
        >
        >
        > Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.
        >
        > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
        > Terms of Service.
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
      • THOMAS JOHNSON
        Good point. Nixon was a brilliant strategist but didn t really stand for anything. Or maybe he looked at Harry Truman s 24% approval rating in 1951 and decided
        Message 3 of 6 , Aug 25, 2005
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          Good point. Nixon was a brilliant strategist but
          didn't really stand for anything. Or maybe he looked
          at Harry Truman's 24% approval rating in 1951 and
          decided that integrity was a liability.
          Does anybody have any insight or thoughts on whether
          Wilson entered WW1 more with the US interests in mind
          or for political gain?

          Tom




          --- Ram Lau <ramlau@...> wrote:


          ---------------------------------
          Wilson was a Dixiecrat, and, as a matter of fact,
          quite proud of being
          one.

          The way I see Nixon is that he was willing to be
          either the good or
          bad guy. I fail to see what kind of legacy he wanted
          to shape, and
          maybe he just didn't care. He would've been a strong
          Civil Rights
          supporter had the Democrats not gone all out for the
          Black votes. As
          Machiavellian as he was, every vote was within his
          calculation. And by
          1968, it was a "wise move" to let go any support from
          Blacks (since
          Goldwater totally ruined it for him anyway) and go for
          the KKK votes
          instead. The plan worked out quite well for him,
          didn't it?

          Ram


          --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, THOMAS JOHNSON
          <AVRCRDNG@F...>
          wrote:
          > That's a lot to think about.
          > According to Joan Hoff writing in Nixon
          Reconsidered,
          > Nixon told her that his roots were in the
          progressive
          > wing of the Republican Party, and by initiating the
          > EPA, the Social Security Income program, and the
          > Office for Minority Business Enterprise, there seems
          > to be some credence to that. And though he started
          > with a higher approval rating than JFK or LBJ in
          > their first 6 months in office, he felt that the
          press
          > was out to get him, despite being supported by the
          > vast majority of periodicals and daily newspapers in
          > all three runs for president. His paranoia probably
          > stopped him from attempting to do more.
          > In secretly bombing Cambodia, 100,000 Cambodian
          > peasants were killed and set the stage for the Khmer
          > Rouge to take over, resulting in another 1.7
          million
          > deaths. He seems to have admitted that he prolonged
          > the Viet Nam war for several years to help him get
          > re-elected.
          > He was an asshole, alright, and an insecure one, at
          > that.... he probably knew it but I don't think he
          > cared. The man must have been a sociopath.
          > It looks to me like we have the same situation
          > happening today, and I'm beginning to wonder whether
          > Wilson was one, as well.
          >
          > Tom
          >
          >
          > --- Ram Lau <ramlau@y...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------
          > I had a conversation with an emeritus professor on
          > race and the
          > Presidents yesterday. It began with his son at Yale
          > working on his
          > history dissertation on Woodrow Wilson's Southern
          > roots and my "Nixon
          > 96" shirt.
          >
          > Knowing how racist Wilson was, I had no intention to
          > defend him. Then
          > I pointed out that the New Deal coalition was very
          > solid until the
          > late 40's when Eleanor Roosevelt and Harry Truman
          and
          > Hubert Humphrey
          > and the ADA and other Civil Rights pioneers
          > substantially shaked up
          > the civil rights stances of both parties for the
          first
          > time.
          >
          > Nixon was the last GOP leader who could do something
          > about preserving
          > the moderate wing of the Party. But he wanted to win
          > so badly that he
          > came to the South and sought for the Klan votes
          > instead. His
          > anti-busing stance in 1972 was yet another blow that
          > drove away the
          > "good elements" of the GOP. I wonder if he realized
          > how much of an
          > asshole he was. I'm quite sure he did.
          >
          > He could have been the good guy and would have done
          > great. But that
          > role was taken by LBJ. Now that his infamous name
          will
          > long live...
          > perhaps that's what he wanted?
          >
          > Ram
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------
          > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
          >
          >
          > Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.
          >
          > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
          to:
          > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
          Yahoo!
          > Terms of Service.
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------




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          ---------------------------------
        • Ram Lau
          Try this group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Our_American_Presidents Our group members aren t that responsive. And I just I don t think people in general care
          Message 4 of 6 , Aug 25, 2005
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            Try this group:

            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Our_American_Presidents

            Our group members aren't that responsive. And I just I don't think
            people in general care much about history.

            Ram


            --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, THOMAS JOHNSON <AVRCRDNG@F...>
            wrote:
            > Good point. Nixon was a brilliant strategist but
            > didn't really stand for anything. Or maybe he looked
            > at Harry Truman's 24% approval rating in 1951 and
            > decided that integrity was a liability.
            > Does anybody have any insight or thoughts on whether
            > Wilson entered WW1 more with the US interests in mind
            > or for political gain?
            >
            > Tom
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- Ram Lau <ramlau@y...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Wilson was a Dixiecrat, and, as a matter of fact,
            > quite proud of being
            > one.
            >
            > The way I see Nixon is that he was willing to be
            > either the good or
            > bad guy. I fail to see what kind of legacy he wanted
            > to shape, and
            > maybe he just didn't care. He would've been a strong
            > Civil Rights
            > supporter had the Democrats not gone all out for the
            > Black votes. As
            > Machiavellian as he was, every vote was within his
            > calculation. And by
            > 1968, it was a "wise move" to let go any support from
            > Blacks (since
            > Goldwater totally ruined it for him anyway) and go for
            > the KKK votes
            > instead. The plan worked out quite well for him,
            > didn't it?
            >
            > Ram
            >
            >
            > --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, THOMAS JOHNSON
            > <AVRCRDNG@F...>
            > wrote:
            > > That's a lot to think about.
            > > According to Joan Hoff writing in Nixon
            > Reconsidered,
            > > Nixon told her that his roots were in the
            > progressive
            > > wing of the Republican Party, and by initiating the
            > > EPA, the Social Security Income program, and the
            > > Office for Minority Business Enterprise, there seems
            > > to be some credence to that. And though he started
            > > with a higher approval rating than JFK or LBJ in
            > > their first 6 months in office, he felt that the
            > press
            > > was out to get him, despite being supported by the
            > > vast majority of periodicals and daily newspapers in
            > > all three runs for president. His paranoia probably
            > > stopped him from attempting to do more.
            > > In secretly bombing Cambodia, 100,000 Cambodian
            > > peasants were killed and set the stage for the Khmer
            > > Rouge to take over, resulting in another 1.7
            > million
            > > deaths. He seems to have admitted that he prolonged
            > > the Viet Nam war for several years to help him get
            > > re-elected.
            > > He was an asshole, alright, and an insecure one, at
            > > that.... he probably knew it but I don't think he
            > > cared. The man must have been a sociopath.
            > > It looks to me like we have the same situation
            > > happening today, and I'm beginning to wonder whether
            > > Wilson was one, as well.
            > >
            > > Tom
            > >
            > >
            > > --- Ram Lau <ramlau@y...> wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > > ---------------------------------
            > > I had a conversation with an emeritus professor on
            > > race and the
            > > Presidents yesterday. It began with his son at Yale
            > > working on his
            > > history dissertation on Woodrow Wilson's Southern
            > > roots and my "Nixon
            > > 96" shirt.
            > >
            > > Knowing how racist Wilson was, I had no intention to
            > > defend him. Then
            > > I pointed out that the New Deal coalition was very
            > > solid until the
            > > late 40's when Eleanor Roosevelt and Harry Truman
            > and
            > > Hubert Humphrey
            > > and the ADA and other Civil Rights pioneers
            > > substantially shaked up
            > > the civil rights stances of both parties for the
            > first
            > > time.
            > >
            > > Nixon was the last GOP leader who could do something
            > > about preserving
            > > the moderate wing of the Party. But he wanted to win
            > > so badly that he
            > > came to the South and sought for the Klan votes
            > > instead. His
            > > anti-busing stance in 1972 was yet another blow that
            > > drove away the
            > > "good elements" of the GOP. I wonder if he realized
            > > how much of an
            > > asshole he was. I'm quite sure he did.
            > >
            > > He could have been the good guy and would have done
            > > great. But that
            > > role was taken by LBJ. Now that his infamous name
            > will
            > > long live...
            > > perhaps that's what he wanted?
            > >
            > > Ram
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > ---------------------------------
            > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
            > >
            > >
            > > Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.
            > >
            > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
            > to:
            > > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > >
            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
            > Yahoo!
            > > Terms of Service.
            > >
            > >
            > > ---------------------------------
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > SPONSORED LINKS
            >
            > President bush
            > Supreme court justices
            > President
            > Supreme court
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
            >
            >
            > Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
            > Terms of Service.
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
          • THOMAS JOHNSON
            Thanks, Ram...It looks very interesting. Tom ... Try this group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Our_American_Presidents Our group members aren t that
            Message 5 of 6 , Aug 25, 2005
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              Thanks, Ram...It looks very interesting.

              Tom



              --- Ram Lau <ramlau@...> wrote:


              ---------------------------------
              Try this group:

              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Our_American_Presidents

              Our group members aren't that responsive. And I just I
              don't think
              people in general care much about history.

              Ram


              --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, THOMAS JOHNSON
              <AVRCRDNG@F...>
              wrote:
              > Good point. Nixon was a brilliant strategist but
              > didn't really stand for anything. Or maybe he looked
              > at Harry Truman's 24% approval rating in 1951 and
              > decided that integrity was a liability.
              > Does anybody have any insight or thoughts on whether
              > Wilson entered WW1 more with the US interests in
              mind
              > or for political gain?
              >
              > Tom
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > --- Ram Lau <ramlau@y...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > ---------------------------------
              > Wilson was a Dixiecrat, and, as a matter of fact,
              > quite proud of being
              > one.
              >
              > The way I see Nixon is that he was willing to be
              > either the good or
              > bad guy. I fail to see what kind of legacy he wanted
              > to shape, and
              > maybe he just didn't care. He would've been a strong
              > Civil Rights
              > supporter had the Democrats not gone all out for the
              > Black votes. As
              > Machiavellian as he was, every vote was within his
              > calculation. And by
              > 1968, it was a "wise move" to let go any support
              from
              > Blacks (since
              > Goldwater totally ruined it for him anyway) and go
              for
              > the KKK votes
              > instead. The plan worked out quite well for him,
              > didn't it?
              >
              > Ram
              >
              >
              > --- In prezveepsenator@yahoogroups.com, THOMAS
              JOHNSON
              > <AVRCRDNG@F...>
              > wrote:
              > > That's a lot to think about.
              > > According to Joan Hoff writing in Nixon
              > Reconsidered,
              > > Nixon told her that his roots were in the
              > progressive
              > > wing of the Republican Party, and by initiating
              the
              > > EPA, the Social Security Income program, and the
              > > Office for Minority Business Enterprise, there
              seems
              > > to be some credence to that. And though he started
              > > with a higher approval rating than JFK or LBJ in
              > > their first 6 months in office, he felt that the
              > press
              > > was out to get him, despite being supported by the
              > > vast majority of periodicals and daily newspapers
              in
              > > all three runs for president. His paranoia
              probably
              > > stopped him from attempting to do more.
              > > In secretly bombing Cambodia, 100,000 Cambodian
              > > peasants were killed and set the stage for the
              Khmer
              > > Rouge to take over, resulting in another 1.7
              > million
              > > deaths. He seems to have admitted that he
              prolonged
              > > the Viet Nam war for several years to help him get
              > > re-elected.
              > > He was an asshole, alright, and an insecure one,
              at
              > > that.... he probably knew it but I don't think he
              > > cared. The man must have been a sociopath.
              > > It looks to me like we have the same situation
              > > happening today, and I'm beginning to wonder
              whether
              > > Wilson was one, as well.
              > >
              > > Tom
              > >
              > >
              > > --- Ram Lau <ramlau@y...> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > ---------------------------------
              > > I had a conversation with an emeritus professor on
              > > race and the
              > > Presidents yesterday. It began with his son at
              Yale
              > > working on his
              > > history dissertation on Woodrow Wilson's Southern
              > > roots and my "Nixon
              > > 96" shirt.
              > >
              > > Knowing how racist Wilson was, I had no intention
              to
              > > defend him. Then
              > > I pointed out that the New Deal coalition was very
              > > solid until the
              > > late 40's when Eleanor Roosevelt and Harry Truman
              > and
              > > Hubert Humphrey
              > > and the ADA and other Civil Rights pioneers
              > > substantially shaked up
              > > the civil rights stances of both parties for the
              > first
              > > time.
              > >
              > > Nixon was the last GOP leader who could do
              something
              > > about preserving
              > > the moderate wing of the Party. But he wanted to
              win
              > > so badly that he
              > > came to the South and sought for the Klan votes
              > > instead. His
              > > anti-busing stance in 1972 was yet another blow
              that
              > > drove away the
              > > "good elements" of the GOP. I wonder if he
              realized
              > > how much of an
              > > asshole he was. I'm quite sure he did.
              > >
              > > He could have been the good guy and would have
              done
              > > great. But that
              > > role was taken by LBJ. Now that his infamous name
              > will
              > > long live...
              > > perhaps that's what he wanted?
              > >
              > > Ram
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ---------------------------------
              > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              > >
              > >
              > > Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.
              > >
              > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
              > to:
              > > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
              > Yahoo!
              > > Terms of Service.
              > >
              > >
              > > ---------------------------------
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > SPONSORED LINKS
              >
              > President bush
              > Supreme court justices

              > President

              > Supreme court

              >
              >
              > ---------------------------------
              > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
              >
              >
              > Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.
              >
              > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
              to:
              > prezveepsenator-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
              Yahoo!
              > Terms of Service.
              >
              >
              > ---------------------------------





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              Supreme court


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              Visit your group "prezveepsenator" on the web.

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