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Re: [prbytes] Re: Vocus?

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  • Jube
    I appreciate your candor. I know I m spending so many hours doing my own media list for each client and for each clients events that it is tiresome. I
    Message 1 of 11 , Aug 7 3:32 PM
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      I appreciate your candor. I know I'm spending so many hours doing my
      own media list for each client and for each clients events that it is
      tiresome. I actually did hire someone to come in and do this work, but
      when it took them 3 months to get half way through one database, I
      figured that experiment was over.

      So is this the boring part of PR that no one extols in school? Should I
      just consider this like stake outs for cops or guard duty for the
      military, just the routine dry part of this business? Just wondering.

      Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
      ¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
      ((¸¸.·´ .·´ -:¦:-Jube
      -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*
      http://www.NetMediaConsultants.com
      Practical Public Relations
      On and OFF the Net
      713-937-7510



      kezia_jauron wrote:

      >I would assume not. They do very little wheeling-dealing unless it's
      >December 29th and they want to post some numbers before the end of the
      >year. What they are more likely to do is throw in some trial services
      >to sweeten the deal.
      >
      >We've been using Vocus for almost two years, and if I knew you, I'd try
      >to talk you out of it. I hate the service/support, hate the interface
      >(very user un-friendly), and I don't have any faith in the accuracy the
      >data. It lacks some of the most obvious features and is slow as
      >molasses unless it's 10 PM. For what we pay them annually, I could get
      >a part-timer in here a few mornings a week to do web research and still
      >have money left over.
      >
      >What Vocus does best is project management and reports, including clip
      >management. If you have a client who needs to see a report about what
      >percentage of their press coverage comes from the Pacific Northwest
      >versus the Southwest and Eastern Seaboard, then you might need Vocus.
      >Or if you're interested in generating more analytical data about the
      >amount of coverage you get from news releases versus phone calls versus
      >in-person meetings with journalists.
      >
      >But for a small company, it's like getting a Viking commercial range
      >when all you ever cook is Top Ramen.
      >
      >My advice is stay away.
      >
      >
      >--- In prbytes@yahoogroups.com, Jube <Jube@...> wrote:
      >
      >
      >>I have been looking at Vocus, and yes, by far have the most to offer,
      >>
      >>
      >at
      >
      >
      >>the highest price. What I'm wondering is if anyone had heard if they
      >>have a sharing program the way MediaMap has for several small shops
      >>
      >>
      >to
      >
      >
      >>share a subscription.
      >>
      >>Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >Yahoo! Groups Links
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • kezia_jauron
      In a word? Yes. That said, my sense is you are wasting time creating a new media list each and every time someone sneezes, when you should be focusing on
      Message 2 of 11 , Aug 8 3:58 PM
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        In a word? Yes. That said, my sense is you are wasting time creating
        a new media list each and every time someone sneezes, when you
        should be focusing on building relationships with the key contacts
        whom you KNOW will cover your sneezes and your sniffles too.

        With all due respect, do you not have a specialty? What is it that
        your clients are doing that this should be so time consuming for
        you? Let's assume that you have a huge, accurate media list...with
        how many of those contacts can you manage to have a quality
        relationship?

        The following is essentially an encore presentation of a post from
        back in June. Perhaps it will help:

        A small/solo practitioner should check into Contacts on Tap from
        CornerBarPR.com:
        http://www.cornerbarpr.com/cot/howdy.cfm

        Otherwise, if you need a specialized press list in a hurry, try your
        friendly neighborhood BusinessWire account rep.

        Subscribing to a service such as Vocus or Bacon's may lock you into
        a longer, bigger, spendier product than you need. Also look into PR
        Newswire's MediAtlas. I did a beta test for them some time ago and I
        liked the usability, but not the quality/currency of the data. I'm
        sure that's been improved, since what I saw was in the very early
        stages.

        I have found that NONE of these media databases are even close to
        being up to the minute. In addition, many expect you to go to the
        trouble of updating their information when you find errors. (At
        least ContactsOnTap gives you some sort of credit for updating their
        data. Bacon's and Vocus certainly do not.)

        Frankly, nothing can replace the hours of legwork and research that
        goes into the contact-management process.



        --- In prbytes@yahoogroups.com, Jube <Jube@...> wrote:
        >
        > I appreciate your candor. I know I'm spending so many hours doing
        my
        > own media list for each client and for each clients events that it
        is
        > tiresome. I actually did hire someone to come in and do this work,
        but
        > when it took them 3 months to get half way through one database, I
        > figured that experiment was over.
        >
        > So is this the boring part of PR that no one extols in school?
        Should I
        > just consider this like stake outs for cops or guard duty for the
        > military, just the routine dry part of this business? Just
        wondering.
        >
        > Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
        > ¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
        > ((¸¸.·´ .·´ -:¦:-Jube
        > -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*
        > http://www.NetMediaConsultants.com
        > Practical Public Relations
        > On and OFF the Net
        > 713-937-7510
        >
        >
        >
        > kezia_jauron wrote:
        >
        > >I would assume not. They do very little wheeling-dealing unless
        it's
        > >December 29th and they want to post some numbers before the end
        of the
        > >year. What they are more likely to do is throw in some trial
        services
        > >to sweeten the deal.
        > >
        > >We've been using Vocus for almost two years, and if I knew you,
        I'd try
        > >to talk you out of it. I hate the service/support, hate the
        interface
        > >(very user un-friendly), and I don't have any faith in the
        accuracy the
        > >data. It lacks some of the most obvious features and is slow as
        > >molasses unless it's 10 PM. For what we pay them annually, I
        could get
        > >a part-timer in here a few mornings a week to do web research and
        still
        > >have money left over.
        > >
        > >What Vocus does best is project management and reports, including
        clip
        > >management. If you have a client who needs to see a report about
        what
        > >percentage of their press coverage comes from the Pacific
        Northwest
        > >versus the Southwest and Eastern Seaboard, then you might need
        Vocus.
        > >Or if you're interested in generating more analytical data about
        the
        > >amount of coverage you get from news releases versus phone calls
        versus
        > >in-person meetings with journalists.
        > >
        > >But for a small company, it's like getting a Viking commercial
        range
        > >when all you ever cook is Top Ramen.
        > >
        > >My advice is stay away.
        > >
        > >
        > >--- In prbytes@yahoogroups.com, Jube <Jube@> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > >>I have been looking at Vocus, and yes, by far have the most to
        offer,
        > >>
        > >>
        > >at
        > >
        > >
        > >>the highest price. What I'm wondering is if anyone had heard if
        they
        > >>have a sharing program the way MediaMap has for several small
        shops
        > >>
        > >>
        > >to
        > >
        > >
        > >>share a subscription.
        > >>
        > >>Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
        > >>
        > >>
        > >>
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >Yahoo! Groups Links
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Richard B Barger ABC APR
        Good advice, Kezia. Thanks, of course, for the plug. You re right: NONE of these media databases are even close to being up to the minute. Each of the
        Message 3 of 11 , Aug 9 7:26 AM
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          Good advice, Kezia.

          Thanks, of course, for the plug. You're right: "NONE of these media
          databases are even close to being up to the minute."

          Each of the on-line companies updates its data on a cycle, in roughly
          the same fashion: Highest-circulation print publications and broadcast
          media in the top DMAs are personally verified and fully updated
          quarterly or thereabouts, on a cycle; next tier, at least 2X a year;
          smallest-market media and most trades, annually. Of course, this varies
          a bit from company to company, but the approach is roughly the same, no
          matter which database product you're dealing with.

          That means that, at one time, our supplier at Contacts On Tap might be
          more up-to-date than anyone on the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, and that
          one of our competitors is more up-to-date on the Portland Oregonian.
          However, in a couple of months, someone else will be more current on
          both. For a while. Over the course of a few months, it all evens out,
          but, at any given time, one of the companies will have updated a given
          listing more recently than any of their competitors.

          For obvious reasons, you usually will have better and more current
          information on changes in your local market than the database companies
          will. For instance, I knew that KCTV-5 would be abolishing its sports
          department, to be replaced by outsourcing from
          MetroSports, a week before it happened. However, unless they're lucky
          about their update cycle, I'll bet that absolutely NONE of the media
          database companies (except the one we work with!) found this out for
          weeks. You're an expert on your local market; we're a resource for
          markets where you have less knowledge and fewer contacts.

          But Kezia is right on the money: Relationships will get you better
          results than a humongous list.

          Cheers!

          Rich Barger, ABC, APR
          Chief Curmudgeon
          http://www.CornerBarPR.com

          ---

          kezia_jauron wrote:

          > In a word? Yes. That said, my sense is you are wasting time creating a
          > new media list each and every time someone sneezes, when you should be
          > focusing on building relationships with the key contacts whom you KNOW
          > will cover your sneezes and your sniffles too.
          >
          > With all due respect, do you not have a specialty? What is it that
          > your clients are doing that this should be so time consuming for you?
          > Let's assume that you have a huge, accurate media list...with how many
          > of those contacts can you manage to have a quality
          > relationship?
          >
          > The following is essentially an encore presentation of a post from
          > back in June. Perhaps it will help:
          >
          > A small/solo practitioner should check into Contacts on Tap from
          > CornerBarPR.com:
          > http://www.cornerbarpr.com/cot/howdy.cfm
          >
          > Otherwise, if you need a specialized press list in a hurry, try your
          > friendly neighborhood BusinessWire account rep.
          >
          > Subscribing to a service such as Vocus or Bacon's may lock you into a
          > longer, bigger, spendier product than you need. Also look into PR
          > Newswire's MediAtlas. I did a beta test for them some time ago and I
          > liked the usability, but not the quality/currency of the data. I'm
          > sure that's been improved, since what I saw was in the very early
          > stages.
          >
          > I have found that NONE of these media databases are even close to
          > being up to the minute. In addition, many expect you to go to the
          > trouble of updating their information when you find errors. (At least
          > ContactsOnTap gives you some sort of credit for updating their data.
          > Bacon's and Vocus certainly do not.)
          >
          > Frankly, nothing can replace the hours of legwork and research that
          > goes into the contact-management process.
          >
          > --- In prbytes@yahoogroups.com, Jube <Jube@...> wrote:
          > >
          > > I appreciate your candor. I know I'm spending so many hours doing
          > my
          > > own media list for each client and for each clients events that it
          > is
          > > tiresome. I actually did hire someone to come in and do this work,
          > but
          > > when it took them 3 months to get half way through one database, I
          > > figured that experiment was over.
          > >
          > > So is this the boring part of PR that no one extols in school?
          > Should I
          > > just consider this like stake outs for cops or guard duty for the
          > > military, just the routine dry part of this business? Just
          > wondering.
          > >
          > > Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
          > > ¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
          > > ((¸¸.·´ .·´ -:¦:-Jube
        • Edna Kaplan
          Vocus is letting a group of us in the Boston share a subscription, as Bacon’s did for a couple of years. I’m hoping they let us continue another year –
          Message 4 of 11 , Aug 13 6:22 PM
          • 0 Attachment
            Vocus is letting a group of us in the Boston share a subscription, as
            Bacon’s did for a couple of years. I’m hoping they let us continue another
            year – I like Vocus’s capabilities (but think Bacon’s is more up-to-date).
            You may be able to negotiate. Good luck!

            Edna



            ****************
            Edna Kaplan
            KOGS Communication

            Wakefield office: 781-245-7773 x 105
            Marblehead office: 781-639-1910
            f: 781-631-3322
            <mailto:kaplan@...> kaplan@...

            _____

            From: prbytes@yahoogroups.com [mailto:prbytes@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            Jube
            Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 12:45 PM
            To: prbytes@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [prbytes] Vocus?



            I have been looking at Vocus, and yes, by far have the most to offer, at
            the highest price. What I'm wondering is if anyone had heard if they
            have a sharing program the way MediaMap has for several small shops to
            share a subscription.

            Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
            ¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
            ((¸¸.·´ .·´ -:¦:-Jube
            -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*
            http://www.NetMedia <http://www.NetMediaConsultants.com> Consultants.com
            Practical Public Relations
            On and OFF the Net
            713-937-7510

            david davis wrote:

            >Vocus is an US company which provides CRM systems to most of the leading
            American PR agencies and many company internal communications departments.
            By far the market leader. Set up in Europe about 5 years ago and has become
            a leading provider of CRM systems in the UK. Recently went public in the US.
            More information at
            >http://www.vocus <http://www.vocus.com/content/index.asp>
            com/content/index.asp
            >
            > Hope this is helpful
            >
            > David Davis
            > www.askddtraining.com
            >
            >Foley Virginia <vfoley@...
            <mailto:vfoley%40bos.blackwellpublishing.com> lpublishing.com> wrote:
            > Right now we license Bacons Media Source for our media contacts but I
            >have been approached by a company called Vocus. Any one know anything
            >about them?
            >
            >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Janine Krasicky
            Edna: How many people are sharing the subscription? There are quite a few solo PR firms in Detroit and we might be interested in a similar arrangement. I can
            Message 5 of 11 , Aug 14 1:27 PM
            • 0 Attachment
              Edna:

              How many people are sharing the subscription? There are quite a few solo PR
              firms in Detroit and we might be interested in a similar arrangement. I can
              be contacted at the email below or via phone if you have some details. Thank
              you!



              Best regards,

              Janine

              Janine Krasicky
              President
              J9 Media Solutions, LLC
              248.542.3991
              janine@...
              www.j9media.com



              Integrated public relations & marketing communications

              "We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give."
              - Winston Churchill



              _____

              From: prbytes@yahoogroups.com [mailto:prbytes@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              Edna Kaplan
              Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:23 PM
              To: prbytes@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [prbytes] Vocus?



              Vocus is letting a group of us in the Boston share a subscription, as
              Bacon’s did for a couple of years. I’m hoping they let us continue another
              year – I like Vocus’s capabilities (but think Bacon’s is more up-to-date).
              You may be able to negotiate. Good luck!

              Edna

              ****************
              Edna Kaplan
              KOGS Communication

              Wakefield office: 781-245-7773 x 105
              Marblehead office: 781-639-1910
              f: 781-631-3322
              <mailto:kaplan@kogspr. <mailto:kaplan%40kogspr.com> com> kaplan@kogspr.
              <mailto:kaplan%40kogspr.com> com

              _____

              From: prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com
              [mailto:prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com] On
              Behalf Of
              Jube
              Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 12:45 PM
              To: prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com
              Subject: Re: [prbytes] Vocus?

              I have been looking at Vocus, and yes, by far have the most to offer, at
              the highest price. What I'm wondering is if anyone had heard if they
              have a sharing program the way MediaMap has for several small shops to
              share a subscription.

              Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
              ¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
              ((¸¸.·´ .·´ -:¦:-Jube
              -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*
              http://www.NetMedia <http://www.NetMedia
              <http://www.NetMediaConsultants.com> Consultants.com> Consultants.com
              Practical Public Relations
              On and OFF the Net
              713-937-7510

              david davis wrote:

              >Vocus is an US company which provides CRM systems to most of the leading
              American PR agencies and many company internal communications departments.
              By far the market leader. Set up in Europe about 5 years ago and has become
              a leading provider of CRM systems in the UK. Recently went public in the US.
              More information at
              >http://www.vocus <http://www.vocus
              <http://www.vocus.com/content/index.asp> com/content/index.asp>
              com/content/index.asp
              >
              > Hope this is helpful
              >
              > David Davis
              > www.askddtraining.com
              >
              >Foley Virginia <vfoley@... <mailto:vfoley%40bos.blackwel>
              <mailto:vfoley%40bos.blackwellpublishing.com> lpublishing.com> wrote:
              > Right now we license Bacons Media Source for our media contacts but I
              >have been approached by a company called Vocus. Any one know anything
              >about them?
              >
              >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Richard B Barger ABC APR
              Hi, all. If you folks can t get this put together in your various cities, remember that Contacts On Tap is an inexpensive alternative to Vocus and Bacon s and
              Message 6 of 11 , Aug 14 3:12 PM
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi, all.

                If you folks can't get this put together in your various cities, remember that
                Contacts On Tap is an inexpensive alternative to Vocus and Bacon's and such,
                with some 60,000 U.S. media contacts and list-building and -exporting features.
                You can take a two-week Free Trial and decide whether it meets your needs.
                http://www.CornerBarPR.com/COT/Howdy.cfm

                Cheers!

                Rich Barger, ABC, APR
                Chief Curmudgeon
                http://www.CornerBarPR.com

                ---

                Janine Krasicky wrote:

                > Edna:
                >
                > How many people are sharing the subscription? There are quite a few solo PR
                > firms in Detroit and we might be interested in a similar arrangement. I can
                > be contacted at the email below or via phone if you have some details. Thank
                > you!
                >
                > Best regards,
                >
                > Janine
                >
                > Janine Krasicky
                > President
                > J9 Media Solutions, LLC
                > 248.542.3991
                > janine@...
                > www.j9media.com
                > _____
                >
                > From: prbytes@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Edna Kaplan
                > Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:23 PM
                > To: prbytes@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: RE: [prbytes] Vocus?
                >
                > Vocus is letting a group of us in the Boston share a subscription, as Bacon’s
                > did for a couple of years. I’m hoping they let us continue another year – I
                > like Vocus’s capabilities (but think Bacon’s is more up-to-date). You may be
                > able to negotiate. Good luck!
                >
                > Edna
                >
                > ****************
                > Edna Kaplan
                > KOGS Communication
                >
                > Wakefield office: 781-245-7773 x 105
                > Marblehead office: 781-639-1910
                > f: 781-631-3322
              • Edna Kaplan
                Hi Janine, There are six of us, with a couple of “seats.” A couple of us are heavy users; the rest are light users, a good mix. It’s rare that we all
                Message 7 of 11 , Aug 14 4:42 PM
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hi Janine,



                  There are six of us, with a couple of “seats.” A couple of us are heavy
                  users; the rest are light users, a good mix.



                  It’s rare that we all want to use Vocus at once. One caveat - the group
                  deal is not for the forgetful. Bacon’s logs off automatically after about
                  10 minutes of no activity (a good feature). Vocus does not.



                  Edna

                  ****************
                  Edna Kaplan
                  KOGS Communication

                  Wakefield office: 781-245-7773 x 105
                  Marblehead office: 781-639-1910
                  f: 781-631-3322
                  <mailto:kaplan@...> kaplan@...

                  _____

                  From: prbytes@yahoogroups.com [mailto:prbytes@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  Janine Krasicky
                  Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 4:28 PM
                  To: prbytes@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [prbytes] Vocus?



                  Edna:

                  How many people are sharing the subscription? There are quite a few solo PR
                  firms in Detroit and we might be interested in a similar arrangement. I can
                  be contacted at the email below or via phone if you have some details. Thank
                  you!

                  Best regards,

                  Janine

                  Janine Krasicky
                  President
                  J9 Media Solutions, LLC
                  248.542.3991
                  janine@j9media. <mailto:janine%40j9media.com> com
                  www.j9media.com

                  Integrated public relations & marketing communications

                  "We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give."
                  - Winston Churchill

                  _____

                  From: prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com
                  [mailto:prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com] On
                  Behalf Of
                  Edna Kaplan
                  Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2006 9:23 PM
                  To: prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com
                  Subject: RE: [prbytes] Vocus?

                  Vocus is letting a group of us in the Boston share a subscription, as
                  Bacon’s did for a couple of years. I’m hoping they let us continue another
                  year – I like Vocus’s capabilities (but think Bacon’s is more up-to-date).
                  You may be able to negotiate. Good luck!

                  Edna

                  ****************
                  Edna Kaplan
                  KOGS Communication

                  Wakefield office: 781-245-7773 x 105
                  Marblehead office: 781-639-1910
                  f: 781-631-3322
                  <mailto:kaplan@kogspr. <mailto:kaplan%40kogspr.com> com> kaplan@kogspr.
                  <mailto:kaplan%40kogspr.com> com

                  _____

                  From: prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com
                  [mailto:prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com] On
                  Behalf Of
                  Jube
                  Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 12:45 PM
                  To: prbytes@yahoogroups <mailto:prbytes%40yahoogroups.com> .com
                  Subject: Re: [prbytes] Vocus?

                  I have been looking at Vocus, and yes, by far have the most to offer, at
                  the highest price. What I'm wondering is if anyone had heard if they
                  have a sharing program the way MediaMap has for several small shops to
                  share a subscription.

                  Blessings,· ´¨¨)) -:¦:-
                  ¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
                  ((¸¸.·´ .·´ -:¦:-Jube
                  -:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*
                  http://www.NetMedia <http://www.NetMedia
                  <http://www.NetMedia <http://www.NetMediaConsultants.com> Consultants.com>
                  Consultants.com> Consultants.com
                  Practical Public Relations
                  On and OFF the Net
                  713-937-7510

                  david davis wrote:

                  >Vocus is an US company which provides CRM systems to most of the leading
                  American PR agencies and many company internal communications departments.
                  By far the market leader. Set up in Europe about 5 years ago and has become
                  a leading provider of CRM systems in the UK. Recently went public in the US.
                  More information at
                  >http://www.vocus <http://www.vocus
                  <http://www.vocus <http://www.vocus.com/content/index.asp>
                  com/content/index.asp> com/content/index.asp>
                  com/content/index.asp
                  >
                  > Hope this is helpful
                  >
                  > David Davis
                  > www.askddtraining.com
                  >
                  >Foley Virginia <vfoley@... <mailto:vfoley%40bos.blackwel>
                  <mailto:vfoley%40bos.blackwel>
                  <mailto:vfoley%40bos.blackwellpublishing.com> lpublishing.com> wrote:
                  > Right now we license Bacons Media Source for our media contacts but I
                  >have been approached by a company called Vocus. Any one know anything
                  >about them?
                  >
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                  >
                  >Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
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