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Re: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX

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  • Richard Mogford
    Hi Thanks for the information. The second link below does not seem to work. How does one buy the USB2SDR? I have emailed the creator of the card with no
    Message 1 of 17 , Sep 30, 2013
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi

      Thanks for the information.  The second link below does not seem to work.

      How does one buy the USB2SDR?  I have emailed the creator of the card with no results so far.

      Richard
      On Sep 29, 2013, at 5:57 PM, ericwd9 wrote:

       

      The USB2SDR will sample at 192 KHz as supplied: See
      http://www.wb5rvz.com/usb2sdr/index.htm
      An upgrade will give still better dynamic range: See
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/powersdr-iq/files/USB2SDR%20HPADC%20/USB2SDR_AK5394A.pdf

      At this time a neat high performance "sound card" designed for
      SDR with a supporting version of PSDR-IQ that gives far more
      usability options (ie separate TX levels for each band.
      I found using the MoBo 3.4 160-10m in a transceiver a trouble free
      setup with all functions available via the GUI. Only the FA-66
      worked as well but was bigger and needed a firewire interface.
      I spent more than $2,000 on "sound cards" and have had most of them.
      specifically for PSDR-IQ the USB2SDR was the best of all. Apart
      from very good performance the support in PSDR-IQ for USB2SDR is
      an order of magnitude better in the version designed for the USB2SDR.
      On top of all that; the I2c control capability for the SoftRock series
      using the Sis570 is a great advantage. It has been my experience that
      the use of more than one connection between the SDR and the PC will
      almost always result in increased noise artifacts induced by loops
      in the connection infrastructure picking up QRM from the PC and
      attached peripherals. Some of this QRM can be wide band noise which
      looks for all the world like band noise but is simply An induced rise in the noise floor. The use of a single connection to the PC will
      almost always help or eliminate this problem

      Without Prejudice. 73 Eric VK5ZAG.

      --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Marciniak, Ed" <elmarciniak@...> wrote:
      >
      > Most of the problems with using two sound cards come from a failure to plan on having all channels running from a common clock or the software problems that result. Firewire '400' doesn't run exactly at 400 mbits a second but it does run at a multiple of 48000 Hz...specifically it runs at 8192x48KHz(393.216 MHz). It is possible to derive a common clock for all ports on firewire card, although I couldn't tell you which cards do implement that when they're "master" timing sources. USB devices running at 12 or 480 MHz have the disadvantage of not being able to share a common clock source unless you are using using an spdif clock source. For various reasons that is almost never a feasible topology. USB has the added disadvantage that the 12MHz clock tends to leak into the (usually inferior) ADC as either a DC offset or an alias at some other frequency depending on sample rate (notable exception are the TI chips that uses 250x instead of 250x division).
      >
      >
      > There are Intel HD audio codecs that also decimate by 250 instead of 256 from a base clock of 24MHz. They tend to suffer from a lack of high end ADC chips and/or high noise pickup from being on a motherboard next to very high speed clocks.
      >
      >
      > There is a reason the delta 44, FA-66 and firebox are also popular solution. They provide enough channels and just work. The creative emu-1212m would need additional channels via spdif plus mic preamp and headphone amp for a transceiver but makes has excellent ADCs. The creative emu-1820m is excellent but pricey (mine delivers something like 20.5 bits at 192KHz and 21.5 bits at 192 KHz at 48KHz). It has built in mic and headphone amps. The ADCS in the creative emu-1xxxm series are some of the best available and are even better than those in the above mentioned. For me the 1820m just worked with no special configuration required. I chose it for the 192KHz ADCs.
      >
      >
      > The USB2SDR does look like a great solution but I haven't personally used one (at the time the lack of onboard 192KHz ADCs was a deal killer for me even though there was a planned add on).
      >
      >
      > While it is theoretically possible to use two different sound cards as sources in ASIO4ALL, I wouldn't recommend it because you probably wouldn't end up there if your clock sources were well planned out. You'll also find that you can't open ASIO sources from two vendors at the same time (I tried that with my 1212m card and the built in pc sound...didn't work).
      >
      >
      > In summary, take a hard look at what you're thinking about using before you deviate from something supported or purpose built like the USB2SDR. You'll probably be money ahead in the long run and save weeks/months worth of messing around.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > 73,
      > Ed
      > NB0M
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > ________________________________
      > From: "ericwd9" <ericwd9@...>
      > To: "powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com" <powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: September 28, 2013 5:44 AM
      > Subject: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > I reply to your query on sound cards.
      > If you wish to transmit you will need 4 audio inputs and four
      > audio outputs. One can use two "sound Cards" but my experience with this has always been problematic. Windoze often encounters conflicts
      > with two sound cards. Also the way in which windoze handles sound
      > introduces latencies that can be VERY annoying. Cards using ASIO drivers to some extent side step this problem. It is highly recommended to use a "supported" card when using any version of PSDR.
      > The cheapest option is to look on ebay for a second hand "supported" card. There are a lot of Maudio Delta 44 cards around and you might get one for less than US$100. These supported cards have 4in and 4 out. PSDR is able to communicate DIRECT with the driver/card and
      > then gives full volumetric control of the card via the PSDR GUI.
      > The best of the commercial cards I have used is the Roland FA-66
      > this card uses a firewire interface the Delta 44 is a PCI card.
      > The best option is Christos's USB2SDR which has VERY low latency
      > by bypassing the windoze sound management entirely. Also the USB2SDR
      > has ptt/keying and facilities to control the Sis570 through an I2c
      > interface meaning one only USB connection to the PC. This cuts out
      > a lot of looped PC noise from the receiver.
      > Overall audio performance wise, The best is the FA-66 followed by
      > the USB2SDR then the Delta 44. Realizing that the delta 44 itself
      > is an order of magnitude better than the better industry standard
      > cards.
      > Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG
      >
      >
      > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <alan4alan@> wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > Subject: [powersdr-iq] PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > > I have some questions about configuring and using PowerSDR-IQ and the Ensemble II receiver. The installation and setup notes by
      > > > WB5RVZ were very helpful. I am trying to get some additional details on this.
      > > >
      >
      > > > 1. To install Micosoft .Net Framework 3.5 SP1, do you need to install the .Net Framework 3.5 and then the SP1? Or is the .Net
      > > > Framework 3.5 included in the SP1?
      > > >
      > > > 2, Is it important to set the device type in "Hardware Config" to "Soft Rock 40"?
      > > >
      > > > 3. How does the Freq Cal work? (I looked at the manual, but was not clear to me.)
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > > I guess you are not going to use the latest PSDR-IQ? <https://code.google.com/p/powersdr-iq/downloads/list>
      > >
      > >
      > > Information included.
      > >
      > >
      > > 73 Alan G4ZFQ
      > >
      >


    • Bill Blomgren (kk4qdz)
      The ExpressCard interface is the equivalent of a PCI bus device. It s fast.  The prosonus Firebox on that with the appropriate firewire adapter should be a
      Message 2 of 17 , Sep 30, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        The ExpressCard interface is the equivalent of a PCI bus device. It's fast.  The prosonus Firebox on that with the appropriate firewire adapter should be a good answer. (Or get a laptop with a firewire adapter)
         
        Note: if the Presonus needs power from firewire, it probably won't get enough from the laptop..   (I've been doing video and audio work with laptops for remote collection and editing for about 15 years now.. including full high def, and as fast as the express bus is, it still can't handle uncompressed video. -- but ANYTHING else just screams on it.)
         
        KK4QDZ - Now with Extra Class Priv's, and a tiny KX3 to enjoy them!

        From: Richard Mogford <rchrdm@...>
        To: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sunday, September 29, 2013 9:33 PM
        Subject: RE: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX

        Dear NB0M


        Thanks for the information on sound cards.


        A couple of questions:


        1. Is it OK to use the Presonus Firbox device with a slide-in type (e.g.,
        ExpressCard) Firewire adapter card in a laptop?


        2. I am interested in the USB2SDR card, but don't know how to get one.  I
        have tried emailing SV1EIA.


        Richard




        -----Original Message-----
        From: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com [mailto:powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of Marciniak, Ed
        Sent: Saturday, September 28, 2013 5:51 AM
        To: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX


        Most of the problems with using two sound cards come from a failure to plan
        on having all channels running from a common clock or the software problems
        that result. Firewire '400' doesn't run exactly at 400 mbits a second but it
        does run at a multiple of 48000 Hz...specifically it runs at
        8192x48KHz(393.216 MHz). It is possible to derive a common clock for all
        ports on firewire card, although I couldn't tell you which cards do
        implement that when they're "master" timing sources. USB devices running at
        12 or 480 MHz have the disadvantage of not being able to share a common
        clock source unless you are using using an spdif clock source. For various
        reasons that is almost never a feasible topology. USB has the added
        disadvantage that the 12MHz clock tends to leak into the (usually inferior)
        ADC as either a DC offset or an alias at some other frequency depending on
        sample rate (notable exception are the TI chips that uses 250x instead of
        250x division).




        There are Intel HD audio codecs that also decimate by 250 instead of 256
        from a base clock of 24MHz. They tend to suffer from a lack of high end ADC
        chips and/or high noise pickup from being on a motherboard next to very high
        speed clocks.




        There is a reason the delta 44, FA-66 and firebox are also popular solution.
        They provide enough channels and just work. The creative emu-1212m would
        need additional channels via spdif plus mic preamp and headphone amp for a
        transceiver but makes has excellent ADCs. The creative emu-1820m is
        excellent but pricey (mine delivers something like 20.5 bits at 192KHz and
        21.5 bits at 192 KHz at 48KHz). It has built in mic and headphone amps. The
        ADCS in the creative emu-1xxxm series are some of the best available and are
        even better than those in the above mentioned. For me the 1820m just worked
        with no special configuration required. I chose it for the 192KHz ADCs.




        The USB2SDR does look like a great solution but I haven't personally used
        one (at the time the lack of onboard 192KHz ADCs was a deal killer for me
        even though there was a planned add on).




        While it is theoretically possible to use two different sound cards as
        sources in ASIO4ALL, I wouldn't recommend it because you probably wouldn't
        end up there if your clock sources were well planned out. You'll also find
        that you can't open ASIO sources from two vendors at the same time (I tried
        that with my 1212m card and the built in pc sound...didn't work).




        In summary, take a hard look at what you're thinking about using before you
        deviate from something supported or purpose built like the USB2SDR. You'll
        probably be money ahead in the long run and save weeks/months worth of
        messing around.








        73,
        Ed
        NB0M








        ________________________________
        From: "ericwd9" <ericwd9@...>
        To: "powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com" <powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: September 28, 2013 5:44 AM
        Subject: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX












        I reply to your query on sound cards.
        If you wish to transmit you will need 4 audio inputs and four audio outputs.
        One can use two "sound Cards" but my experience with this has always been
        problematic. Windoze often encounters conflicts with two sound cards. Also
        the way in which windoze handles sound introduces latencies that can be VERY
        annoying. Cards using ASIO drivers to some extent side step this problem. It
        is highly recommended to use a "supported" card when using any version of
        PSDR.
        The cheapest option is to look on ebay for a second hand "supported" card.
        There are a lot of Maudio Delta 44 cards around and you might get one for
        less than US$100. These supported cards have 4in and 4 out. PSDR is able to
        communicate DIRECT with the driver/card and then gives full volumetric
        control of the card via the PSDR GUI.
        The best of the commercial cards I have used is the Roland FA-66 this card
        uses a firewire interface the Delta 44 is a PCI card.
        The best option is Christos's USB2SDR which has VERY low latency by
        bypassing the windoze sound management entirely. Also the USB2SDR has
        ptt/keying and facilities to control the Sis570 through an I2c interface
        meaning one only USB connection to the PC. This cuts out a lot of looped PC
        noise from the receiver.
        Overall audio performance wise, The best is the FA-66 followed by the
        USB2SDR then the Delta 44. Realizing that the delta 44 itself is an order of
        magnitude better than the better industry standard cards.
        Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG




        --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <alan4alan@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > Subject: [powersdr-iq] PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > > I have some questions about configuring and using PowerSDR-IQ and
        > > the Ensemble II receiver. The installation and setup notes by WB5RVZ
        were very helpful. I am trying to get some additional details on this.
        > >


        > > 1. To install Micosoft .Net Framework 3.5 SP1, do you need to
        > > install the .Net Framework 3.5 and then the SP1? Or is the .Net
        Framework 3.5 included in the SP1?
        > >
        > > 2, Is it important to set the device type in "Hardware Config" to "Soft
        Rock 40"?
        > >
        > > 3. How does the Freq Cal work? (I looked at the manual, but was not
        > > clear to me.)
        > >
        >
        >
        > I guess you are not going to use the latest PSDR-IQ?
        > <https://code.google.com/p/powersdr-iq/downloads/list>
        >
        >
        > Information included.
        >
        >
        > 73 Alan G4ZFQ
        >
















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      • ericwd9
        To obtain UBS2SDR See link. Christos is a very busy man be patient. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/powersdr-iq/message/2038 Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG
        Message 3 of 17 , Sep 30, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          To obtain UBS2SDR See link.
          Christos is a very busy man be patient.


          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/powersdr-iq/message/2038


          Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG


          --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Mogford" <rchrdm@...> wrote:
          >

          > Dear NB0M
          >
          >
          > Thanks for the information on sound cards.
          >
          >
          > A couple of questions:
          >
          >
          > 1. Is it OK to use the Presonus Firbox device with a slide-in type (e.g.,
          > ExpressCard) Firewire adapter card in a laptop?
          >
          >
          > 2. I am interested in the USB2SDR card, but don't know how to get one. I
          > have tried emailing SV1EIA.
          >
          >
          > Richard
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com [mailto:powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com] On
          > Behalf Of Marciniak, Ed
          > Sent: Saturday, September 28, 2013 5:51 AM
          > To: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
          >
          >
          > Most of the problems with using two sound cards come from a failure to plan
          > on having all channels running from a common clock or the software problems
          > that result. Firewire '400' doesn't run exactly at 400 mbits a second but it
          > does run at a multiple of 48000 Hz...specifically it runs at
          > 8192x48KHz(393.216 MHz). It is possible to derive a common clock for all
          > ports on firewire card, although I couldn't tell you which cards do
          > implement that when they're "master" timing sources. USB devices running at
          > 12 or 480 MHz have the disadvantage of not being able to share a common
          > clock source unless you are using using an spdif clock source. For various
          > reasons that is almost never a feasible topology. USB has the added
          > disadvantage that the 12MHz clock tends to leak into the (usually inferior)
          > ADC as either a DC offset or an alias at some other frequency depending on
          > sample rate (notable exception are the TI chips that uses 250x instead of
          > 250x division).
          >
          >
          >
          >

          > There are Intel HD audio codecs that also decimate by 250 instead of 256

          > from a base clock of 24MHz. They tend to suffer from a lack of high end ADC
          > chips and/or high noise pickup from being on a motherboard next to very high
          > speed clocks.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > There is a reason the delta 44, FA-66 and firebox are also popular solution.
          > They provide enough channels and just work. The creative emu-1212m would
          > need additional channels via spdif plus mic preamp and headphone amp for a
          > transceiver but makes has excellent ADCs. The creative emu-1820m is
          > excellent but pricey (mine delivers something like 20.5 bits at 192KHz and
          > 21.5 bits at 192 KHz at 48KHz). It has built in mic and headphone amps. The
          > ADCS in the creative emu-1xxxm series are some of the best available and are
          > even better than those in the above mentioned. For me the 1820m just worked
          > with no special configuration required. I chose it for the 192KHz ADCs.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > The USB2SDR does look like a great solution but I haven't personally used
          > one (at the time the lack of onboard 192KHz ADCs was a deal killer for me
          > even though there was a planned add on).
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > While it is theoretically possible to use two different sound cards as
          > sources in ASIO4ALL, I wouldn't recommend it because you probably wouldn't
          > end up there if your clock sources were well planned out. You'll also find
          > that you can't open ASIO sources from two vendors at the same time (I tried
          > that with my 1212m card and the built in pc sound...didn't work).
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > In summary, take a hard look at what you're thinking about using before you
          > deviate from something supported or purpose built like the USB2SDR. You'll
          > probably be money ahead in the long run and save weeks/months worth of
          > messing around.
          >

          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > 73,
          > Ed
          > NB0M
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ________________________________
          > From: "ericwd9" <ericwd9@...>
          > To: "powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com" <powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com>
          > Sent: September 28, 2013 5:44 AM
          > Subject: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
          >
          >
          >

          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > I reply to your query on sound cards.
          > If you wish to transmit you will need 4 audio inputs and four audio outputs.
          > One can use two "sound Cards" but my experience with this has always been
          > problematic. Windoze often encounters conflicts with two sound cards. Also
          > the way in which windoze handles sound introduces latencies that can be VERY
          > annoying. Cards using ASIO drivers to some extent side step this problem. It
          > is highly recommended to use a "supported" card when using any version of
          > PSDR.
          > The cheapest option is to look on ebay for a second hand "supported" card.
          > There are a lot of Maudio Delta 44 cards around and you might get one for
          > less than US$100. These supported cards have 4in and 4 out. PSDR is able to
          > communicate DIRECT with the driver/card and then gives full volumetric
          > control of the card via the PSDR GUI.
          > The best of the commercial cards I have used is the Roland FA-66 this card
          > uses a firewire interface the Delta 44 is a PCI card.
          > The best option is Christos's USB2SDR which has VERY low latency by
          > bypassing the windoze sound management entirely. Also the USB2SDR has
          > ptt/keying and facilities to control the Sis570 through an I2c interface
          > meaning one only USB connection to the PC. This cuts out a lot of looped PC
          > noise from the receiver.
          > Overall audio performance wise, The best is the FA-66 followed by the
          > USB2SDR then the Delta 44. Realizing that the delta 44 itself is an order of
          > magnitude better than the better industry standard cards.
          > Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <alan4alan@> wrote:
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ----- Original Message -----
          > > Subject: [powersdr-iq] PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > > I have some questions about configuring and using PowerSDR-IQ and
          > > > the Ensemble II receiver. The installation and setup notes by WB5RVZ
          > were very helpful. I am trying to get some additional details on this.
          > > >
          >
          >
          > > > 1. To install Micosoft .Net Framework 3.5 SP1, do you need to
          > > > install the .Net Framework 3.5 and then the SP1? Or is the .Net
          > Framework 3.5 included in the SP1?
          > > >
          > > > 2, Is it important to set the device type in "Hardware Config" to "Soft
          > Rock 40"?
          > > >
          > > > 3. How does the Freq Cal work? (I looked at the manual, but was not
          > > > clear to me.)
          > > >
          > >
          > >

          > > I guess you are not going to use the latest PSDR-IQ?
          > > <https://code.google.com/p/powersdr-iq/downloads/list>
          > >
          > >
          > > Information included.
          > >
          > >
          > > 73 Alan G4ZFQ
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
        • sv1eia
          Hi guys, I have to jump in here, please accept my apologies for delaying ansering direct emails. I want to tell you why it takes so long to produce more of the
          Message 4 of 17 , Oct 1, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi guys,

            I have to jump in here, please accept my apologies for delaying ansering direct emails.

            I want to tell you why it takes so long to produce more of the USB2SDR boards or anything that has been additionally designed like the HPADC or the RxTx modules.

            Nowadays, as you probably know, the local situation here in SV-land is terrible and in financial issues its simply put, a show stopper.
            I guess you do understand that to produce/fabricate a DSP board does involve a good deal of funds.
            The previous batches of USB2SDR boards have been funded initially from my own funds and with a loan, now my own funds have been drastically limited and loans are simply non existent any more.

            Beleive me when I say that I do try to solve this and I hope that I have soon news for you.


            73,

            Christos SV1EIA



             



            ---In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, wrote:

            Hi

            Thanks for the information.  The second link below does not seem to work.

            How does one buy the USB2SDR?  I have emailed the creator of the card with no results so far.

            Richard
            On Sep 29, 2013, at 5:57 PM, ericwd9 wrote:

             

            The USB2SDR will sample at 192 KHz as supplied: See
            http://www.wb5rvz.com/usb2sdr/index.htm
            An upgrade will give still better dynamic range: See
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/powersdr-iq/files/USB2SDR%20HPADC%20/USB2SDR_AK5394A.pdf

            At this time a neat high performance "sound card" designed for
            SDR with a supporting version of PSDR-IQ that gives far more
            usability options (ie separate TX levels for each band.
            I found using the MoBo 3.4 160-10m in a transceiver a trouble free
            setup with all functions available via the GUI. Only the FA-66
            worked as well but was bigger and needed a firewire interface.
            I spent more than $2,000 on "sound cards" and have had most of them.
            specifically for PSDR-IQ the USB2SDR was the best of all. Apart
            from very good performance the support in PSDR-IQ for USB2SDR is
            an order of magnitude better in the version designed for the USB2SDR.
            On top of all that; the I2c control capability for the SoftRock series
            using the Sis570 is a great advantage. It has been my experience that
            the use of more than one connection between the SDR and the PC will
            almost always result in increased noise artifacts induced by loops
            in the connection infrastructure picking up QRM from the PC and
            attached peripherals. Some of this QRM can be wide band noise which
            looks for all the world like band noise but is simply An induced rise in the noise floor. The use of a single connection to the PC will
            almost always help or eliminate this problem

            Without Prejudice. 73 Eric VK5ZAG.

            --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Marciniak, Ed" wrote:
            >
            > Most of the problems with using two sound cards come from a failure to plan on having all channels running from a common clock or the software problems that result. Firewire '400' doesn't run exactly at 400 mbits a second but it does run at a multiple of 48000 Hz...specifically it runs at 8192x48KHz(393.216 MHz). It is possible to derive a common clock for all ports on firewire card, although I couldn't tell you which cards do implement that when they're "master" timing sources. USB devices running at 12 or 480 MHz have the disadvantage of not being able to share a common clock source unless you are using using an spdif clock source. For various reasons that is almost never a feasible topology. USB has the added disadvantage that the 12MHz clock tends to leak into the (usually inferior) ADC as either a DC offset or an alias at some other frequency depending on sample rate (notable exception are the TI chips that uses 250x instead of 250x division).
            >
            >
            > There are Intel HD audio codecs that also decimate by 250 instead of 256 from a base clock of 24MHz. They tend to suffer from a lack of high end ADC chips and/or high noise pickup from being on a motherboard next to very high speed clocks.
            >
            >
            > There is a reason the delta 44, FA-66 and firebox are also popular solution. They provide enough channels and just work. The creative emu-1212m would need additional channels via spdif plus mic preamp and headphone amp for a transceiver but makes has excellent ADCs. The creative emu-1820m is excellent but pricey (mine delivers something like 20.5 bits at 192KHz and 21.5 bits at 192 KHz at 48KHz). It has built in mic and headphone amps. The ADCS in the creative emu-1xxxm series are some of the best available and are even better than those in the above mentioned. For me the 1820m just worked with no special configuration required. I chose it for the 192KHz ADCs.
            >
            >
            > The USB2SDR does look like a great solution but I haven't personally used one (at the time the lack of onboard 192KHz ADCs was a deal killer for me even though there was a planned add on).
            >
            >
            > While it is theoretically possible to use two different sound cards as sources in ASIO4ALL, I wouldn't recommend it because you probably wouldn't end up there if your clock sources were well planned out. You'll also find that you can't open ASIO sources from two vendors at the same time (I tried that with my 1212m card and the built in pc sound...didn't work).
            >
            >
            > In summary, take a hard look at what you're thinking about using before you deviate from something supported or purpose built like the USB2SDR. You'll probably be money ahead in the long run and save weeks/months worth of messing around.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > 73,
            > Ed
            > NB0M
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ________________________________
            > From: "ericwd9"
            > To: "powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com" <powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: September 28, 2013 5:44 AM
            > Subject: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > I reply to your query on sound cards.
            > If you wish to transmit you will need 4 audio inputs and four
            > audio outputs. One can use two "sound Cards" but my experience with this has always been problematic. Windoze often encounters conflicts
            > with two sound cards. Also the way in which windoze handles sound
            > introduces latencies that can be VERY annoying. Cards using ASIO drivers to some extent side step this problem. It is highly recommended to use a "supported" card when using any version of PSDR.
            > The cheapest option is to look on ebay for a second hand "supported" card. There are a lot of Maudio Delta 44 cards around and you might get one for less than US$100. These supported cards have 4in and 4 out. PSDR is able to communicate DIRECT with the driver/card and
            > then gives full volumetric control of the card via the PSDR GUI.
            > The best of the commercial cards I have used is the Roland FA-66
            > this card uses a firewire interface the Delta 44 is a PCI card.
            > The best option is Christos's USB2SDR which has VERY low latency
            > by bypassing the windoze sound management entirely. Also the USB2SDR
            > has ptt/keying and facilities to control the Sis570 through an I2c
            > interface meaning one only USB connection to the PC. This cuts out
            > a lot of looped PC noise from the receiver.
            > Overall audio performance wise, The best is the FA-66 followed by
            > the USB2SDR then the Delta 44. Realizing that the delta 44 itself
            > is an order of magnitude better than the better industry standard
            > cards.
            > Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG
            >
            >
            > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" wrote:
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > ----- Original Message -----
            > > Subject: [powersdr-iq] PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > > I have some questions about configuring and using PowerSDR-IQ and the Ensemble II receiver. The installation and setup notes by
            > > > WB5RVZ were very helpful. I am trying to get some additional details on this.
            > > >
            >
            > > > 1. To install Micosoft .Net Framework 3.5 SP1, do you need to install the .Net Framework 3.5 and then the SP1? Or is the .Net
            > > > Framework 3.5 included in the SP1?
            > > >
            > > > 2, Is it important to set the device type in "Hardware Config" to "Soft Rock 40"?
            > > >
            > > > 3. How does the Freq Cal work? (I looked at the manual, but was not clear to me.)
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            > > I guess you are not going to use the latest PSDR-IQ? <https://code.google.com/p/powersdr-iq/downloads/list>
            > >
            > >
            > > Information included.
            > >
            > >
            > > 73 Alan G4ZFQ
            > >
            >


          • Richard Mogford
            Thank-you, Christos. Is there any way we can help? Richard From: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com [mailto:powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sv1eia@yahoo.com
            Message 5 of 17 , Oct 1, 2013
            • 0 Attachment

              Thank-you, Christos.

               

              Is there any way we can help?

               

              Richard

               

              From: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com [mailto:powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of sv1eia@...
              Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2013 6:12 AM
              To: powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: Re: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX

               

               

              Hi guys,

              I have to jump in here, please accept my apologies for delaying ansering direct emails.

              I want to tell you why it takes so long to produce more of the USB2SDR boards or anything that has been additionally designed like the HPADC or the RxTx modules.

              Nowadays, as you probably know, the local situation here in SV-land is terrible and in financial issues its simply put, a show stopper.
              I guess you do understand that to produce/fabricate a DSP board does involve a good deal of funds.
              The previous batches of USB2SDR boards have been funded initially from my own funds and with a loan, now my own funds have been drastically limited and loans are simply non existent any more.

              Beleive me when I say that I do try to solve this and I hope that I have soon news for you.

               

              73,

              Christos SV1EIA

               

               



              ---In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, wrote:

              Hi

               

              Thanks for the information.  The second link below does not seem to work.

               

              How does one buy the USB2SDR?  I have emailed the creator of the card with no results so far.

               

              Richard

              On Sep 29, 2013, at 5:57 PM, ericwd9 wrote:



               

              The USB2SDR will sample at 192 KHz as supplied: See
              http://www.wb5rvz.com/usb2sdr/index.htm
              An upgrade will give still better dynamic range: See
              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/powersdr-iq/files/USB2SDR%20HPADC%20/USB2SDR_AK5394A.pdf

              At this time a neat high performance "sound card" designed for
              SDR with a supporting version of PSDR-IQ that gives far more
              usability options (ie separate TX levels for each band.
              I found using the MoBo 3.4 160-10m in a transceiver a trouble free
              setup with all functions available via the GUI. Only the FA-66
              worked as well but was bigger and needed a firewire interface.
              I spent more than $2,000 on "sound cards" and have had most of them.
              specifically for PSDR-IQ the USB2SDR was the best of all. Apart
              from very good performance the support in PSDR-IQ for USB2SDR is
              an order of magnitude better in the version designed for the USB2SDR.
              On top of all that; the I2c control capability for the SoftRock series
              using the Sis570 is a great advantage. It has been my experience that
              the use of more than one connection between the SDR and the PC will
              almost always result in increased noise artifacts induced by loops
              in the connection infrastructure picking up QRM from the PC and
              attached peripherals. Some of this QRM can be wide band noise which
              looks for all the world like band noise but is simply An induced rise in the noise floor. The use of a single connection to the PC will
              almost always help or eliminate this problem

              Without Prejudice. 73 Eric VK5ZAG.

              --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Marciniak, Ed" wrote:
              >
              > Most of the problems with using two sound cards come from a failure to plan on having all channels running from a common clock or the software problems that result. Firewire '400' doesn't run exactly at 400 mbits a second but it does run at a multiple of 48000 Hz...specifically it runs at 8192x48KHz(393.216 MHz). It is possible to derive a common clock for all ports on firewire card, although I couldn't tell you which cards do implement that when they're "master" timing sources. USB devices running at 12 or 480 MHz have the disadvantage of not being able to share a common clock source unless you are using using an spdif clock source. For various reasons that is almost never a feasible topology. USB has the added disadvantage that the 12MHz clock tends to leak into the (usually inferior) ADC as either a DC offset or an alias at some other frequency depending on sample rate (notable exception are the TI chips that uses 250x instead of 250x division).
              >
              >
              > There are Intel HD audio codecs that also decimate by 250 instead of 256 from a base clock of 24MHz. They tend to suffer from a lack of high end ADC chips and/or high noise pickup from being on a motherboard next to very high speed clocks.
              >
              >
              > There is a reason the delta 44, FA-66 and firebox are also popular solution. They provide enough channels and just work. The creative emu-1212m would need additional channels via spdif plus mic preamp and headphone amp for a transceiver but makes has excellent ADCs. The creative emu-1820m is excellent but pricey (mine delivers something like 20.5 bits at 192KHz and 21.5 bits at 192 KHz at 48KHz). It has built in mic and headphone amps. The ADCS in the creative emu-1xxxm series are some of the best available and are even better than those in the above mentioned. For me the 1820m just worked with no special configuration required. I chose it for the 192KHz ADCs.
              >
              >
              > The USB2SDR does look like a great solution but I haven't personally used one (at the time the lack of onboard 192KHz ADCs was a deal killer for me even though there was a planned add on).
              >
              >
              > While it is theoretically possible to use two different sound cards as sources in ASIO4ALL, I wouldn't recommend it because you probably wouldn't end up there if your clock sources were well planned out. You'll also find that you can't open ASIO sources from two vendors at the same time (I tried that with my 1212m card and the built in pc sound...didn't work).
              >
              >
              > In summary, take a hard look at what you're thinking about using before you deviate from something supported or purpose built like the USB2SDR. You'll probably be money ahead in the long run and save weeks/months worth of messing around.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > 73,
              > Ed
              > NB0M
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ________________________________
              > From: "ericwd9"
              > To: "powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com" <powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: September 28, 2013 5:44 AM
              > Subject: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > I reply to your query on sound cards.
              > If you wish to transmit you will need 4 audio inputs and four
              > audio outputs. One can use two "sound Cards" but my experience with this has always been problematic. Windoze often encounters conflicts
              > with two sound cards. Also the way in which windoze handles sound
              > introduces latencies that can be VERY annoying. Cards using ASIO drivers to some extent side step this problem. It is highly recommended to use a "supported" card when using any version of PSDR.
              > The cheapest option is to look on ebay for a second hand "supported" card. There are a lot of Maudio Delta 44 cards around and you might get one for less than US$100. These supported cards have 4in and 4 out. PSDR is able to communicate DIRECT with the driver/card and
              > then gives full volumetric control of the card via the PSDR GUI.
              > The best of the commercial cards I have used is the Roland FA-66
              > this card uses a firewire interface the Delta 44 is a PCI card.
              > The best option is Christos's USB2SDR which has VERY low latency
              > by bypassing the windoze sound management entirely. Also the USB2SDR
              > has ptt/keying and facilities to control the Sis570 through an I2c
              > interface meaning one only USB connection to the PC. This cuts out
              > a lot of looped PC noise from the receiver.
              > Overall audio performance wise, The best is the FA-66 followed by
              > the USB2SDR then the Delta 44. Realizing that the delta 44 itself
              > is an order of magnitude better than the better industry standard
              > cards.
              > Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG
              >
              >
              > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ----- Original Message -----
              > > Subject: [powersdr-iq] PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > > I have some questions about configuring and using PowerSDR-IQ and the Ensemble II receiver. The installation and setup notes by
              > > > WB5RVZ were very helpful. I am trying to get some additional details on this.
              > > >
              >
              > > > 1. To install Micosoft .Net Framework 3.5 SP1, do you need to install the .Net Framework 3.5 and then the SP1? Or is the .Net
              > > > Framework 3.5 included in the SP1?
              > > >
              > > > 2, Is it important to set the device type in "Hardware Config" to "Soft Rock 40"?
              > > >
              > > > 3. How does the Freq Cal work? (I looked at the manual, but was not clear to me.)
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > > I guess you are not going to use the latest PSDR-IQ? <https://code.google.com/p/powersdr-iq/downloads/list>
              > >
              > >
              > > Information included.
              > >
              > >
              > > 73 Alan G4ZFQ
              > >
              >

               

            • James Malone
              Is there a chance we can move the assembly and manufacturing here? I do it for a living on small production run custom electronics. Jim Malone Wa3lbi Sent from
              Message 6 of 17 , Oct 1, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                Is there a chance we can move the assembly and manufacturing here?

                I do it for a living on small production run custom electronics.

                Jim Malone
                Wa3lbi

                Sent from my iPhone

                On Oct 1, 2013, at 9:11 PM, sv1eia@... wrote:

                 

                Hi guys,

                I have to jump in here, please accept my apologies for delaying ansering direct emails.

                I want to tell you why it takes so long to produce more of the USB2SDR boards or anything that has been additionally designed like the HPADC or the RxTx modules.

                Nowadays, as you probably know, the local situation here in SV-land is terrible and in financial issues its simply put, a show stopper.
                I guess you do understand that to produce/fabricate a DSP board does involve a good deal of funds.
                The previous batches of USB2SDR boards have been funded initially from my own funds and with a loan, now my own funds have been drastically limited and loans are simply non existent any more.

                Beleive me when I say that I do try to solve this and I hope that I have soon news for you.


                73,

                Christos SV1EIA



                 



                ---In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, wrote:

                Hi

                Thanks for the information.  The second link below does not seem to work.

                How does one buy the USB2SDR?  I have emailed the creator of the card with no results so far.

                Richard
                On Sep 29, 2013, at 5:57 PM, ericwd9 wrote:

                 

                The USB2SDR will sample at 192 KHz as supplied: See
                http://www.wb5rvz.com/usb2sdr/index.htm
                An upgrade will give still better dynamic range: See
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/powersdr-iq/files/USB2SDR%20HPADC%20/USB2SDR_AK5394A.pdf

                At this time a neat high performance "sound card" designed for
                SDR with a supporting version of PSDR-IQ that gives far more
                usability options (ie separate TX levels for each band.
                I found using the MoBo 3.4 160-10m in a transceiver a trouble free
                setup with all functions available via the GUI. Only the FA-66
                worked as well but was bigger and needed a firewire interface.
                I spent more than $2,000 on "sound cards" and have had most of them.
                specifically for PSDR-IQ the USB2SDR was the best of all. Apart
                from very good performance the support in PSDR-IQ for USB2SDR is
                an order of magnitude better in the version designed for the USB2SDR.
                On top of all that; the I2c control capability for the SoftRock series
                using the Sis570 is a great advantage. It has been my experience that
                the use of more than one connection between the SDR and the PC will
                almost always result in increased noise artifacts induced by loops
                in the connection infrastructure picking up QRM from the PC and
                attached peripherals. Some of this QRM can be wide band noise which
                looks for all the world like band noise but is simply An induced rise in the noise floor. The use of a single connection to the PC will
                almost always help or eliminate this problem

                Without Prejudice. 73 Eric VK5ZAG.

                --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Marciniak, Ed" wrote:
                >
                > Most of the problems with using two sound cards come from a failure to plan on having all channels running from a common clock or the software problems that result. Firewire '400' doesn't run exactly at 400 mbits a second but it does run at a multiple of 48000 Hz...specifically it runs at 8192x48KHz(393.216 MHz). It is possible to derive a common clock for all ports on firewire card, although I couldn't tell you which cards do implement that when they're "master" timing sources. USB devices running at 12 or 480 MHz have the disadvantage of not being able to share a common clock source unless you are using using an spdif clock source. For various reasons that is almost never a feasible topology. USB has the added disadvantage that the 12MHz clock tends to leak into the (usually inferior) ADC as either a DC offset or an alias at some other frequency depending on sample rate (notable exception are the TI chips that uses 250x instead of 250x division).
                >
                >
                > There are Intel HD audio codecs that also decimate by 250 instead of 256 from a base clock of 24MHz. They tend to suffer from a lack of high end ADC chips and/or high noise pickup from being on a motherboard next to very high speed clocks.
                >
                >
                > There is a reason the delta 44, FA-66 and firebox are also popular solution. They provide enough channels and just work. The creative emu-1212m would need additional channels via spdif plus mic preamp and headphone amp for a transceiver but makes has excellent ADCs. The creative emu-1820m is excellent but pricey (mine delivers something like 20.5 bits at 192KHz and 21.5 bits at 192 KHz at 48KHz). It has built in mic and headphone amps. The ADCS in the creative emu-1xxxm series are some of the best available and are even better than those in the above mentioned. For me the 1820m just worked with no special configuration required. I chose it for the 192KHz ADCs.
                >
                >
                > The USB2SDR does look like a great solution but I haven't personally used one (at the time the lack of onboard 192KHz ADCs was a deal killer for me even though there was a planned add on).
                >
                >
                > While it is theoretically possible to use two different sound cards as sources in ASIO4ALL, I wouldn't recommend it because you probably wouldn't end up there if your clock sources were well planned out. You'll also find that you can't open ASIO sources from two vendors at the same time (I tried that with my 1212m card and the built in pc sound...didn't work).
                >
                >
                > In summary, take a hard look at what you're thinking about using before you deviate from something supported or purpose built like the USB2SDR. You'll probably be money ahead in the long run and save weeks/months worth of messing around.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > 73,
                > Ed
                > NB0M
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ________________________________
                > From: "ericwd9"
                > To: "powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com" <powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com>
                > Sent: September 28, 2013 5:44 AM
                > Subject: [powersdr-iq] Re: PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > I reply to your query on sound cards.
                > If you wish to transmit you will need 4 audio inputs and four
                > audio outputs. One can use two "sound Cards" but my experience with this has always been problematic. Windoze often encounters conflicts
                > with two sound cards. Also the way in which windoze handles sound
                > introduces latencies that can be VERY annoying. Cards using ASIO drivers to some extent side step this problem. It is highly recommended to use a "supported" card when using any version of PSDR.
                > The cheapest option is to look on ebay for a second hand "supported" card. There are a lot of Maudio Delta 44 cards around and you might get one for less than US$100. These supported cards have 4in and 4 out. PSDR is able to communicate DIRECT with the driver/card and
                > then gives full volumetric control of the card via the PSDR GUI.
                > The best of the commercial cards I have used is the Roland FA-66
                > this card uses a firewire interface the Delta 44 is a PCI card.
                > The best option is Christos's USB2SDR which has VERY low latency
                > by bypassing the windoze sound management entirely. Also the USB2SDR
                > has ptt/keying and facilities to control the Sis570 through an I2c
                > interface meaning one only USB connection to the PC. This cuts out
                > a lot of looped PC noise from the receiver.
                > Overall audio performance wise, The best is the FA-66 followed by
                > the USB2SDR then the Delta 44. Realizing that the delta 44 itself
                > is an order of magnitude better than the better industry standard
                > cards.
                > Regards 73 Eric VK5ZAG
                >
                >
                > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > Subject: [powersdr-iq] PowerSDR-IQ and Ensemble II RX
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > > I have some questions about configuring and using PowerSDR-IQ and the Ensemble II receiver. The installation and setup notes by
                > > > WB5RVZ were very helpful. I am trying to get some additional details on this.
                > > >
                >
                > > > 1. To install Micosoft .Net Framework 3.5 SP1, do you need to install the .Net Framework 3.5 and then the SP1? Or is the .Net
                > > > Framework 3.5 included in the SP1?
                > > >
                > > > 2, Is it important to set the device type in "Hardware Config" to "Soft Rock 40"?
                > > >
                > > > 3. How does the Freq Cal work? (I looked at the manual, but was not clear to me.)
                > > >
                > >
                > >
                > > I guess you are not going to use the latest PSDR-IQ? <https://code.google.com/p/powersdr-iq/downloads/list>
                > >
                > >
                > > Information included.
                > >
                > >
                > > 73 Alan G4ZFQ
                > >
                >


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