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2436Re: Cabling the Delta 44

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  • ericwd9
    Apr 1, 2012
    • 0 Attachment
      I agree Bob,
      though I have found in the past some sound cards especially
      when using two of them (not recommended but necessary for those
      on a lower budget and experimenting) need isolation. Most PCs
      where more than one connection is made to them will fill the
      panoramic display with artifacts from power supplies etc.
      I have had more success with external sound cards where this
      is concerned.
      I do remember (in the beginning) when using two USB external sound-cards I wound all the USB lines (3 of them) together
      twisting them a few times and wrapping them with aluminum foil
      which was connected to the PC ground. This worked a little.
      I later found much of my (Shack Hash) came from the monitors.
      I have tried Audio isolation transformers in the past and unless
      they are of high quality sample rates over 48KHz are not possible.
      Though with sound cards on the main board with long patch leads
      they were needed.
      Concerning "sound cards" I have tried many many of them before
      I "bit the bullet" and spent money I had previously wasted on
      inferior cards and bought delta 44, FA-66 and the USB2SDR in a fit
      of impulse buying.
      The Edirol FA-66 made the experience of SDR IQ at last consistent
      and rewarding being much more free of problems. The USB2SDR is
      at least equal in efficacy to the FA-66 but somewhat harder to
      set up. It has (since it was designed to work hand in hand with
      PSDR IQ) much greater compatibility and function with PSDR IQ.
      I am however having problems with VAC and the later versions of
      PSDR IQ some sort of intermittent instability. I know not if from incompatibility or set up?

      But in conclusion: unless one wishes to go the "long path" of
      experimentation and cure. Thorougher isolation cures most all
      connection ills. While I would repeat audio isolation should only
      be used as a last resort because of phase, level shifting and bandwidth problems.

      73 best Regards Eric VK5ZAG.


      --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "g8voip" <g8voi.reeves59@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Eric,
      >
      > All of the Ensemble kits using the USB interface rely on USB 5V supply for powering the local oscillator, so needs the USB 0V connection to function, otherwise there is no other earth return as the LO is isolated from the rest of the circuit by a combination of transformers and iopto couplers.
      >
      > If it does function without the USB 0V connection, it must be by chance as there has to be another 0V return path, which certainly is not there by design.
      >
      > If anyone has to resort to putting transformers in the audio lines, that really only covers up the real problem that really needs resolving. Sticking plaster solution with side effects that potentially are worse than a little bit of hum.
      >
      > People seem to be totally paranoid about a small centre frequency spike. When using PowerSDR this becopmes purely cosmetic as with the pseudo IF used you can never actually tune to it.
      >
      > 73, Bob G8VOI
      >
      > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, "ericwd9" <ericwd9@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Ground isolation to prevent hum loops is essential.
      > > Also antenna ground can be a problem. I have now the
      > > habit of isolating everything. I run power to the softrock from
      > > a battery with an isolated (transformer type wall wart)battery charger.
      > > No ground to the softrock from the power source. Any USB or other
      > > device connected to the softrock needs to be isolated. In the case of USB connections simply removing the ground connection can suffice.
      > > Otherwise there are optical USB isolators available. (do not use with
      > > USB2SDR). Audio lines connected to a computer card can be a problem
      > > and may need isolation transformers in line. I now customarily isolate
      > > the antenna connection with a 1:1 binocular core transformer suitable
      > > for the TX power used. If SR is in a case insulated stand offs or
      > > TO220 transistor mounting kits to mount the board away from ground.
      > > Using the Edirol FA-66 and the USB2SDR the ground connection from
      > > the softrock to the "sound card" is direct and if leads are short
      > > will not give any problem. This means that: the softrock and the FA-66
      > > are ground bonded together. Nothing else is grounded to this combination. In the case of the Delta 44 since this is a PCI card
      > > within the PC then audio ground isolation transformers might be required.
      > > If these procedures are carried out there should be NO zero Hz
      > > central spike in any panoramic display and artifacts from noisy
      > > computers and monitors will be minimized.
      > > Serious ground loops will also cause degradation of transmitted
      > > signals and possible RF feedback.
      > >
      > > 73 Regards Eric VK5ZAG
      > >
      > >
      > > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Tanner <bet110@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > I found this interesting, Bob. I use the Edirol, FA-66 which is
      > > > similarly configured. I use two RCA jack out puts, which I take to both
      > > > be MONO and then have them go to a 'combiner' which I then took to be a
      > > > 'Stereo' out put which goes to the Softrock. I note, however, that
      > > > unless I ground the cabinet of the FA-66 to my AC > 12VDC power supply I
      > > > get tremendous AC hum on the signal as well as a perfect mirror image of
      > > > the signal on the panadapter. Given your comments, I am now suspecting
      > > > that the cable arrangement I am using is never conducting a proper
      > > > ground path to the Softrock. I will have to investigate that...
      > > >
      > > > Bruce
      > > >
      > > > On 3/31/2012 1:25 PM, g8voip wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > Al,
      > > > >
      > > > > The 8 connectors on the Delta 44 break out box are all stereo jack
      > > > > sockets.
      > > > >
      > > > > Each is wired as a separate mono input channel, tip to sleeve as a
      > > > > single ended input i.e. one side to ground, or tip to ring as a
      > > > > balanced (floating) input.
      > > > >
      > > > > Personally I am not sure about using mono jack plugs for making the
      > > > > connections as I do not know how the Delta 44 input is actually
      > > > > configured, certainly not a true balanced input though.
      > > > >
      > > > > Might be acceptable to earth the ring when using it as a single ended
      > > > > input.
      > > > >
      > > > > 73, Bob G8VOI
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > <mailto:powersdr-iq%40yahoogroups.com>, Albert Gerheim <alpg49@> wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > The break-out box had 8 mono 1/4" connectors: 2 stereo streams in and 2
      > > > > > stereo streams out.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I'm not sure which way stereo 1/4"-ers are wired.
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 10:35 PM, Joseph LaFerla <joe@> wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > > **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Hi Bob****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ** **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > I think I am going to make up the cables anyway. Are the jacks in the
      > > > > > > original interface box mono or stereo and would I need mono or stereo
      > > > > > > plugs? I could not figure this out from the manual. If I have to use
      > > > > > > stereo, I suppose I would wire the tip and sleeve only right?****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ** **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Thanks.****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ** **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > 73****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ** **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Joe****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > VA3JLF****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ** **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > *From:* powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > <mailto:powersdr-iq%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > [mailto:powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > <mailto:powersdr-iq%40yahoogroups.com>] *On
      > > > > > > Behalf Of *g8voip
      > > > > > > *Sent:* March-29-12 2:09 AM
      > > > > > > *To:* powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > <mailto:powersdr-iq%40yahoogroups.com>
      > > > > > > *Subject:* [powersdr-iq] Re: Cabling the Delta 44****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ** **
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Hi Joe,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > You are correct, if you use the original supplied break out box
      > > > > for the
      > > > > > > Delta 44, although it has stereo sockets on it, you need seperate
      > > > > plugs for
      > > > > > > the left and right channels. The stereo sockets on the box are
      > > > > wired as a
      > > > > > > mono input between the tip and main body, and a balanced input
      > > > > between the
      > > > > > > tip and ring.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Tony KB9YIG does produce a kit for a small Delta 44 interface
      > > > > module that
      > > > > > > plugs directly into the 15 way D type and has PCB mounted 3.5mm
      > > > > stereo jack
      > > > > > > sockets, so far more convenient to use.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > It is not listed on his website at the moment, but worth dropping
      > > > > him an
      > > > > > > email directly or asking on the SoftRock40 forum.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > 73, Bob G8VOI
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > --- In powersdr-iq@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > <mailto:powersdr-iq%40yahoogroups.com>, "Joseph LaFerla" <joe@> wrote:
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Hi
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Today I finally received my delta 44 and installed it in the
      > > > > computer. I
      > > > > > > > have a question regarding cabling to the Ensemble RXTX. The ensemble
      > > > > > > inputs
      > > > > > > > and outputs are stereo and it appears to me that each input and
      > > > > output
      > > > > > > for
      > > > > > > > the delta 44 are mono. When making up my cables does this mean
      > > > > that I
      > > > > > > have
      > > > > > > > to make a cable with a stereo jack for the ensemble end and then
      > > > > two mono
      > > > > > > > jacks on the delta 44 end? I am talking about the breakout box
      > > > > that came
      > > > > > > > with the delta or is there another breakout box that I can make
      > > > > up with
      > > > > > > > stereo plugs? If I am not mistaken, I remember reading about a
      > > > > different
      > > > > > > > breakout box. If I am misunderstanding this, maybe someone can
      > > > > put me
      > > > > > > > straight!
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Thanks and 73
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Joe
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > VA3JLF
      > > > > > > >****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > ****
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --
      > > > > > Al Gerheim
      > > > > > Adopt a Homeless Pet
      > > > > > http://www.petfinder.com
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus
      > > > > signature database 7016 (20120331) __________
      > > > >
      > > > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.
      > > > >
      > > > > http://www.eset.com
      > > >
      > >
      >
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