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Re: Advice Needed / .NET Postfix Control

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  • Serge Fonville
    Ah, ok. Well you can run OpenLDAP (for example) as a backend in the same way you could use AD. Postfix can use multiple backends depending on your needs. What
    Message 1 of 12 , May 21 11:32 AM
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      Ah, ok.

      Well you can run OpenLDAP (for example) as a backend in the same way you could use AD.

      Postfix can use multiple backends depending on your needs.

      What requirements do you have?



      Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

      Serge Fonville

      http://www.sergefonville.nl

      Convince Microsoft!
      They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


      2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
      Sorry... should have specified... cannot integrate with AD or the Microsoft environment.  This needs to remain entirely stand-alone.  This means our member base will be stored in the application's database and we will need to call out to Postfix to manually perform account provisioning and the like.

      - G. Deward



      On May 21, 2013, at 2:18 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

      Hi,

      From your mail it seems you desire a backend that can handle all that, you should be able to setup postfix to retrieve its users from AD.

      HTH

      Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

      Serge Fonville

      http://www.sergefonville.nl

      Convince Microsoft!
      They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


      2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
      NEWBIE WARNING:  I have never used Postfix and am not a Linux guru.  Please be gentile.

      Is there an existing .NET library (DLL, etc.) for controlling Postfix?  If not, is there an existing API for applications that are NOT running on the same server as Postfix?  More specifically, I have a need for creating users, deleting users, changing passwords, and the like.  I have been tasked with implementing an Ubuntu mail server and tying it into our custom ERP application (written in ASP.NET MVC and running on Windows).  The goal is to be able to dynamically create user accounts, leverage them for a period of time, and then shut them down when a project is finished.

      Thank you, in advance, for any assistance you may provide.

      - G. Deward



    • Greg Deward
      In our conversations, the overall goal was to have a stand-alone mail server running Ubuntu and whatever mail packages are installed in [as close to default as
      Message 2 of 12 , May 21 11:49 AM
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        In our conversations, the overall goal was to have a stand-alone mail server running Ubuntu and whatever mail packages are installed in [as close to default as possible] configuration.  The server should remain isolated and not be connected to any other box or resource.  We would call into it programmatically for all administrative functions.  Since we are a Microsoft shop, there is an overwhelming concern (read "fear") that we will be less qualified to maintain the platform as we add other services to the mix... in essence, we need to keep the overall mail platform as simplistic as possible to increase the chance that our folks can maintain it with ease.  Unless an LDAP server was an absolute requirement for Postfix we could not look at it.  And, more than likely, if it was a requirement, we would probably look to a different product.

        Early on in this project we were given a requirement to allow our members the ability to receive "messages" from our server via IMAP.  Someone assumed writing an IMAP server service would be simple and that we would have the cycles to do so.  Over time we have discouraged this and tried to find another IMAP service that will be able to marshal and deliver our messages to the client.  This was unsuccessful.  Postfix, and a simple server like Ubuntu, seems like the easiest method for dropping in a box that can receive messages and allow a standard email client to pull them down.  Ultimately, it would be great to find an IMAP Server Service to negotiate the client calls act as a proxy to our application.  Until then, Postfix appears to be the path we are on.

        I hope this helps.

        - G. Deward



        On May 21, 2013, at 2:32 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

        Ah, ok.

        Well you can run OpenLDAP (for example) as a backend in the same way you could use AD.

        Postfix can use multiple backends depending on your needs.

        What requirements do you have?



        Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

        Serge Fonville

        http://www.sergefonville.nl

        Convince Microsoft!
        They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


        2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
        Sorry... should have specified... cannot integrate with AD or the Microsoft environment.  This needs to remain entirely stand-alone.  This means our member base will be stored in the application's database and we will need to call out to Postfix to manually perform account provisioning and the like.

        - G. Deward



        On May 21, 2013, at 2:18 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

        Hi,

        From your mail it seems you desire a backend that can handle all that, you should be able to setup postfix to retrieve its users from AD.

        HTH

        Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

        Serge Fonville

        http://www.sergefonville.nl

        Convince Microsoft!
        They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


        2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
        NEWBIE WARNING:  I have never used Postfix and am not a Linux guru.  Please be gentile.

        Is there an existing .NET library (DLL, etc.) for controlling Postfix?  If not, is there an existing API for applications that are NOT running on the same server as Postfix?  More specifically, I have a need for creating users, deleting users, changing passwords, and the like.  I have been tasked with implementing an Ubuntu mail server and tying it into our custom ERP application (written in ASP.NET MVC and running on Windows).  The goal is to be able to dynamically create user accounts, leverage them for a period of time, and then shut them down when a project is finished.

        Thank you, in advance, for any assistance you may provide.

        - G. Deward




      • Brian Evans
        ... I think you misunderstand what Postfix is. Postfix receives mail for valid recipients then passes it on to a delivery agent. It has no administrative
        Message 3 of 12 , May 21 11:57 AM
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          On 5/21/2013 2:49 PM, Greg Deward wrote:
          In our conversations, the overall goal was to have a stand-alone mail server running Ubuntu and whatever mail packages are installed in [as close to default as possible] configuration.  The server should remain isolated and not be connected to any other box or resource.  We would call into it programmatically for all administrative functions.  Since we are a Microsoft shop, there is an overwhelming concern (read "fear") that we will be less qualified to maintain the platform as we add other services to the mix... in essence, we need to keep the overall mail platform as simplistic as possible to increase the chance that our folks can maintain it with ease.  Unless an LDAP server was an absolute requirement for Postfix we could not look at it.  And, more than likely, if it was a requirement, we would probably look to a different product.

          I think you misunderstand what Postfix is.

          Postfix receives mail for valid recipients then passes it on to a delivery agent.
          It has no administrative functions like you are seeking.
          It can look up valid recipient via SQL or ldap or static lists.
          Then it delivers as directed to an agent. There are a couple of simple agents to deliver to the local file system included, but nothing fancy.

          Installing Postfix alone will not let you read the mail.  You need an IMAP/POP3 client to read remotely which Postfix does not provide.

          Before commenting further, I think you should read the documentation http://www.postfix.org/documentation.html .

          Brian


          Early on in this project we were given a requirement to allow our members the ability to receive "messages" from our server via IMAP.  Someone assumed writing an IMAP server service would be simple and that we would have the cycles to do so.  Over time we have discouraged this and tried to find another IMAP service that will be able to marshal and deliver our messages to the client.  This was unsuccessful.  Postfix, and a simple server like Ubuntu, seems like the easiest method for dropping in a box that can receive messages and allow a standard email client to pull them down.  Ultimately, it would be great to find an IMAP Server Service to negotiate the client calls act as a proxy to our application.  Until then, Postfix appears to be the path we are on.

          I hope this helps.

          - G. Deward



          On May 21, 2013, at 2:32 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

          Ah, ok.

          Well you can run OpenLDAP (for example) as a backend in the same way you could use AD.

          Postfix can use multiple backends depending on your needs.

          What requirements do you have?



          Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

          Serge Fonville

          http://www.sergefonville.nl

          Convince Microsoft!
          They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


          2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
          Sorry... should have specified... cannot integrate with AD or the Microsoft environment.  This needs to remain entirely stand-alone.  This means our member base will be stored in the application's database and we will need to call out to Postfix to manually perform account provisioning and the like.

          - G. Deward



          On May 21, 2013, at 2:18 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

          Hi,

          From your mail it seems you desire a backend that can handle all that, you should be able to setup postfix to retrieve its users from AD.

          HTH

          Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

          Serge Fonville

          http://www.sergefonville.nl

          Convince Microsoft!
          They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


          2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
          NEWBIE WARNING:  I have never used Postfix and am not a Linux guru.  Please be gentile.

          Is there an existing .NET library (DLL, etc.) for controlling Postfix?  If not, is there an existing API for applications that are NOT running on the same server as Postfix?  More specifically, I have a need for creating users, deleting users, changing passwords, and the like.  I have been tasked with implementing an Ubuntu mail server and tying it into our custom ERP application (written in ASP.NET MVC and running on Windows).  The goal is to be able to dynamically create user accounts, leverage them for a period of time, and then shut them down when a project is finished.

          Thank you, in advance, for any assistance you may provide.

          - G. Deward





        • Viktor Dukhovni
          ... No. But people use webmin or similar to control their Unix systems with Postfix as one of the managed components. ... None of this is Postfix-specific.
          Message 4 of 12 , May 21 11:59 AM
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            On Tue, May 21, 2013 at 02:12:18PM -0400, Greg Deward wrote:

            > Is there an existing .NET library (DLL, etc.) for controlling
            > Postfix?

            No. But people use webmin or similar to control their Unix systems
            with Postfix as one of the managed components.

            > More specifically, I have a need for creating users, deleting users,
            > changing passwords, and the like.

            None of this is Postfix-specific. Postfix is just an MTA, it routes
            email messages, it is not a mailstore. Perhaps you're looking for
            Zimbra or something similar or perhaps a bit simpler like Dovecot.

            > I have been tasked with implementing an Ubuntu mail server and tying
            > it into our custom ERP application

            Postfix is a building-block not a complete mail system. It is an
            MTA that receives and forwards email. Postfix does not manage
            users or user mailboxes.

            The MTA is an important, but very simple part of a "mail server",
            by far the bulk of the complexity is the mailstore. All the
            user-centric activity happens around the IMAP or similar mail
            service, not the SMTP mail relay.

            Find a mail-server you like, and management tools for that. You
            can use Postfix on the edge of this environment to be a border MX
            host, and in as the MTA internally routing messages between servers.

            The extent of Postfix interaction with the mailstore will be lookups
            against LDAP or MySQL or ... tables managed by the mailstore
            administrator to determine how to rewrite public addresses to
            mailbox addresses or route public addresses to the right store.

            Consider the strong possibility that you're in over your head.
            Building an Ubuntu mailstore as a novice to Unix is a tall order.
            Look for an integrated product that delivers the whole stack (users,
            mailboxes, quotas, passwords, ...)

            --
            Viktor.
          • Serge Fonville
            A few challenges then I suspect. Postfix does SMTP, you need a different service for IMAP It is likely easier (to maintain) a full solution (i.e. zarafa,
            Message 5 of 12 , May 21 11:59 AM
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              A few challenges then I suspect.
              Postfix does SMTP, you need a different service for IMAP
              It is likely easier (to maintain) a full solution (i.e. zarafa, zimbra) instead of a combination of services (postfix/dovecot)

              The point you make about low maintenance complicates things especially since there are multiple components that make up a solution.

              HTH

              Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

              Serge Fonville

              http://www.sergefonville.nl

              Convince Microsoft!
              They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


              2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
              In our conversations, the overall goal was to have a stand-alone mail server running Ubuntu and whatever mail packages are installed in [as close to default as possible] configuration.  The server should remain isolated and not be connected to any other box or resource.  We would call into it programmatically for all administrative functions.  Since we are a Microsoft shop, there is an overwhelming concern (read "fear") that we will be less qualified to maintain the platform as we add other services to the mix... in essence, we need to keep the overall mail platform as simplistic as possible to increase the chance that our folks can maintain it with ease.  Unless an LDAP server was an absolute requirement for Postfix we could not look at it.  And, more than likely, if it was a requirement, we would probably look to a different product.

              Early on in this project we were given a requirement to allow our members the ability to receive "messages" from our server via IMAP.  Someone assumed writing an IMAP server service would be simple and that we would have the cycles to do so.  Over time we have discouraged this and tried to find another IMAP service that will be able to marshal and deliver our messages to the client.  This was unsuccessful.  Postfix, and a simple server like Ubuntu, seems like the easiest method for dropping in a box that can receive messages and allow a standard email client to pull them down.  Ultimately, it would be great to find an IMAP Server Service to negotiate the client calls act as a proxy to our application.  Until then, Postfix appears to be the path we are on.

              I hope this helps.

              - G. Deward



              On May 21, 2013, at 2:32 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

              Ah, ok.

              Well you can run OpenLDAP (for example) as a backend in the same way you could use AD.

              Postfix can use multiple backends depending on your needs.

              What requirements do you have?



              Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

              Serge Fonville

              http://www.sergefonville.nl

              Convince Microsoft!
              They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


              2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
              Sorry... should have specified... cannot integrate with AD or the Microsoft environment.  This needs to remain entirely stand-alone.  This means our member base will be stored in the application's database and we will need to call out to Postfix to manually perform account provisioning and the like.

              - G. Deward



              On May 21, 2013, at 2:18 PM, Serge Fonville <serge.fonville@...> wrote:

              Hi,

              From your mail it seems you desire a backend that can handle all that, you should be able to setup postfix to retrieve its users from AD.

              HTH

              Kind regards/met vriendelijke groet,

              Serge Fonville

              http://www.sergefonville.nl

              Convince Microsoft!
              They need to add TRUNCATE PARTITION in SQL Server


              2013/5/21 Greg Deward <greg.deward@...>
              NEWBIE WARNING:  I have never used Postfix and am not a Linux guru.  Please be gentile.

              Is there an existing .NET library (DLL, etc.) for controlling Postfix?  If not, is there an existing API for applications that are NOT running on the same server as Postfix?  More specifically, I have a need for creating users, deleting users, changing passwords, and the like.  I have been tasked with implementing an Ubuntu mail server and tying it into our custom ERP application (written in ASP.NET MVC and running on Windows).  The goal is to be able to dynamically create user accounts, leverage them for a period of time, and then shut them down when a project is finished.

              Thank you, in advance, for any assistance you may provide.

              - G. Deward





            • Brian Evans
              ... I mean IMAP/POP3 server such as courier, dovecot, etc.
              Message 6 of 12 , May 21 11:59 AM
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                On 5/21/2013 2:57 PM, Brian Evans wrote:

                Installing Postfix alone will not let you read the mail.  You need an IMAP/POP3 client to read remotely which Postfix does not provide.

                I mean IMAP/POP3 server such as courier, dovecot, etc.
              • Stan Hoeppner
                ... It s a bit ironic that you re summarily eliminating the one interface you already know very well, which would work perfectly for you. I d guess this is
                Message 7 of 12 , May 21 1:32 PM
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                  On 5/21/2013 1:28 PM, Greg Deward wrote:
                  > Sorry... should have specified... cannot integrate with AD or the Microsoft environment.

                  It's a bit ironic that you're summarily eliminating the one interface
                  you already know very well, which would work perfectly for you. I'd
                  guess this is due to...

                  > This needs to remain entirely stand-alone.

                  Fear. You fear the unknown system you have zero experience with, so you
                  desire to completely isolate it from anything else. This is a mistake.
                  Face your fear and let it pass through you.

                  Postfix never modifies LDAP/AD/mysql data. As others have mentioned
                  that is not its job. It simply queries for user and domain names,
                  possibly credentials if you're allowing submission, other table data,
                  etc. Given that you're an all Microsoft shop, implementing a *nix mail
                  server without using LDAP/AD queries for user info is akin to hog tiring
                  yourself.

                  > This means our member base will be stored in the application's database and we will need to call out to Postfix to manually perform account provisioning and the like.

                  Again as others noted, Postfix doesn't perform user management. It
                  doesn't create nor delete user accounts. You can perform these
                  functions blindfolded using AD can you not? Then use it.

                  And if you actually intend to have users "pull" this email as you
                  described, instead of delivering it to their existing mailboxes, then
                  you need a mailbox/IMAP/POP server, as others mentioned.

                  To make this much easier and avoid running a mailbox/IMAP/POP server,
                  simply deliver these emails to users' existing mailboxes, wherever those
                  may be: freemail, ISP, internal corporate, etc. If you do this, all
                  you need is your MS hosted AD database and Postfix.

                  Your description of the workload requirements is somewhat vague so keep
                  that in mind when reading replies.

                  --
                  Stan
                • Benny Pedersen
                  ... +1 http://www.postfix.org/addon.html (Run/Configuration/Queue/User management) -- senders that put my email into body content will deliver it to my own
                  Message 8 of 12 , May 21 4:25 PM
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                    Greg Deward skrev den 2013-05-21 20:12:
                    > NEWBIE WARNING: I have never used Postfix and am not a Linux guru.
                    > Please be gentile.

                    +1

                    http://www.postfix.org/addon.html (Run/Configuration/Queue/User
                    management)

                    --
                    senders that put my email into body content will deliver it to my own
                    trashcan, so if you like to get reply, dont do it
                  • The_Ace
                    Since this is for a completely windows based system, why not use a windows based mail server like hmailserver ? it supports several database types
                    Message 9 of 12 , May 26 9:10 AM
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                      Since this is for a completely windows based system, why not use a windows based mail server like hmailserver ? it supports several database types (mysql,mssql) so you can manage the user base through your system.


                      On Wed, May 22, 2013 at 4:55 AM, Benny Pedersen <me@...> wrote:
                      Greg Deward skrev den 2013-05-21 20:12:

                      NEWBIE WARNING:  I have never used Postfix and am not a Linux guru.
                      Please be gentile.

                      +1

                      http://www.postfix.org/addon.html (Run/Configuration/Queue/User management)

                      --
                      senders that put my email into body content will deliver it to my own trashcan, so if you like to get reply, dont do it



                      --
                      The mysteries of the Universe are revealed when you break stuff.
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