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Make Magazine Vol 28

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  • andor_99833
    this quarter s make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i ve uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat. the make people tend to use
    Message 1 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
      this quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.

      the make people tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.

      joe
      petersburg, ak
    • William Abernathy
      Joe: I don t mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make s copyright on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands? I wrote the
      Message 2 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
        Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make's copyright
        on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands? I wrote the article,
        I haven't even seen a print version of it yet, and you've already put it up
        online. I have no financial interest either way (been paid already) but the
        folks at Make ought be able to make their living too.

        As for Altoid tins... The magazine doesn't have any cross-promotion deal with
        them or anything like that. It's just that those little tins are so darned handy...

        --William

        andor_99833 wrote:
        > this quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
        >
        > the make people tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
        >
        > joe
        > petersburg, ak


        --
        William Abernathy
        Berkeley, CA
        http://yourwritereditor.com
      • Slater Harrison
        William, Congrats on the Make article! I do subscribe and I read your piece: nice work. I think we re all cheering you on. When someone makes more accessible
        Message 3 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011

          William,

           

          Congrats on the Make article! I do  subscribe and I read your piece: nice work. I think we’re all cheering you on. When someone makes more accessible these devices we all love, and creates some ripples, all boats will rise!

           

          As for the PDF Joe put up, there is no question that it is a clear violation of copyright—albeit well intentioned. That said, you have benefitted from being part of this cozy, informal forum. For example, the general idea to use an aluminum soda can, and then use epoxy instead of solder, was gotten from a member of this forum, freely shared.  

           

          So perhaps you could treat us to a video of your boat running, or some behind the scenes commentary about developing it, in lieu of the copyrighted article. I know that I tried making traditional pop pop engines with my students—quite shallow, not deep like yours--but the flame still overheated the epoxy and made leaks. I am wondering if, by using that tall altoid can, the heat is farther away and the vertical wall radiates out enough heat to not cause leaks. If so, that’s brilliant and my hat is off to you. Also, bending the edges in rather than out was a smart move.

           

          By the way, my e-mail filter is capricious. Despite approving the Yahoo forum, I usually find the posts weeks later—if at all—in my filter. So if I don’t respond to something specific it’s not intentional.

           

          Slater

           

          From: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy
          Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 11:47 AM
          To: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28

           

           

          Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make's copyright
          on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands? I wrote the article,
          I haven't even seen a print version of it yet, and you've already put it up
          online. I have no financial interest either way (been paid already) but the
          folks at Make ought be able to make their living too.

          As for Altoid tins... The magazine doesn't have any cross-promotion deal with
          them or anything like that. It's just that those little tins are so darned handy...

          --William

          andor_99833 wrote:

          > this quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
          >
          > the make people tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
          >
          > joe
          > petersburg, ak

          --
          William Abernathy
          Berkeley, CA
          http://yourwritereditor.com



          This message, together with any attachments, may contain information which is privileged and confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message, along with any attachments.


        • Peak45
          Hi Guys,what is an Altoid can ?? Wayne (England) From: Slater Harrison Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 8:54 PM To: mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
          Message 4 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
            Hi Guys,what is an Altoid can ??
             
            Wayne (England)
             
            Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 8:54 PM
            Subject: RE: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
             
             

            William,

            Congrats on the Make article! I do  subscribe and I read your piece: nice work. I think we’re all cheering you on. When someone makes more accessible these devices we all love, and creates some ripples, all boats will rise!

            As for the PDF Joe put up, there is no question that it is a clear violation of copyright—albeit well intentioned. That said, you have benefitted from being part of this cozy, informal forum. For example, the general idea to use an aluminum soda can, and then use epoxy instead of solder, was gotten from a member of this forum, freely shared. 

            So perhaps you could treat us to a video of your boat running, or some behind the scenes commentary about developing it, in lieu of the copyrighted article. I know that I tried making traditional pop pop engines with my students—quite shallow, not deep like yours--but the flame still overheated the epoxy and made leaks. I am wondering if, by using that tall altoid can, the heat is farther away and the vertical wall radiates out enough heat to not cause leaks. If so, that’s brilliant and my hat is off to you. Also, bending the edges in rather than out was a smart move.

            By the way, my e-mail filter is capricious. Despite approving the Yahoo forum, I usually find the posts weeks later—if at all—in my filter. So if I don’t respond to something specific it’s not intentional.

            Slater

            From: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy
            Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 11:47 AM
            To: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28

             

            Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make's copyright
            on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands? I wrote the article,
            I haven't even seen a print version of it yet, and you've already put it up
            online. I have no financial interest either way (been paid already) but the
            folks at Make ought be able to make their living too.

            As for Altoid tins... The magazine doesn't have any cross-promotion deal with
            them or anything like that. It's just that those little tins are so darned handy...

            --William

            andor_99833 wrote:

            > this
            quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
            >
            > the make people
            tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
            >
            > joe
            >
            petersburg, ak

            --
            William Abernathy
            Berkeley, CA
            http://yourwritereditor.com



            This message, together with any attachments, may contain information which is privileged and confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message, along with any attachments.


          • arno_brosi
            Hi, Altoids is a kind of candy which comes in a can/tin.The tin has a very handy size so is used in all kinds of craft projects. Buy them here,if you re
            Message 5 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
              Hi,
              Altoids is a kind of candy which comes in a can/tin.The tin has a very handy size so is used in all kinds of craft projects.
              Buy them here,if you're interested :
              http://www.mrsomalleys.co.uk/altoids-mints-p-83.html

              But I think there are other candy cans around that might work too.

              regards,Arno


              --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, "Peak45" <wayne.9003@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi Guys,what is an Altoid can ??
              >
              > Wayne (England)
              >
              > From: Slater Harrison
              > Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 8:54 PM
              > To: mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: RE: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
              >
              >
              >
              > William,
              >
              >
              > Congrats on the Make article! I do subscribe and I read your piece: nice work. I think we’re all cheering you on. When someone makes more accessible these devices we all love, and creates some ripples, all boats will rise!
              >
              >
              > As for the PDF Joe put up, there is no question that it is a clear violation of copyrightâ€"albeit well intentioned. That said, you have benefitted from being part of this cozy, informal forum. For example, the general idea to use an aluminum soda can, and then use epoxy instead of solder, was gotten from a member of this forum, freely shared.
              >
              >
              > So perhaps you could treat us to a video of your boat running, or some behind the scenes commentary about developing it, in lieu of the copyrighted article. I know that I tried making traditional pop pop engines with my studentsâ€"quite shallow, not deep like yours--but the flame still overheated the epoxy and made leaks. I am wondering if, by using that tall altoid can, the heat is farther away and the vertical wall radiates out enough heat to not cause leaks. If so, that’s brilliant and my hat is off to you. Also, bending the edges in rather than out was a smart move.
              >
              >
              > By the way, my e-mail filter is capricious. Despite approving the Yahoo forum, I usually find the posts weeks laterâ€"if at allâ€"in my filter. So if I don’t respond to something specific it’s not intentional.
              >
              >
              > Slater
              >
              >
              > From: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy
              > Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 11:47 AM
              > To: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make's copyright
              > on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands? I wrote the article,
              > I haven't even seen a print version of it yet, and you've already put it up
              > online. I have no financial interest either way (been paid already) but the
              > folks at Make ought be able to make their living too.
              >
              > As for Altoid tins... The magazine doesn't have any cross-promotion deal with
              > them or anything like that. It's just that those little tins are so darned handy...
              >
              > --William
              >
              > andor_99833 wrote:
              > > this quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
              > >
              > > the make people tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
              > >
              > > joe
              > > petersburg, ak
              >
              > --
              > William Abernathy
              > Berkeley, CA
              > http://yourwritereditor.com
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
              > This message, together with any attachments, may contain information which is privileged and confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message, along with any attachments.
              >
            • Peak45
              Thank you. Wayne. From: arno_brosi Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 9:16 PM To: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com Subject: [pop-pop-steamboats] Re: Make
              Message 6 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
                Thank you.
                 
                Wayne.
                 
                Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 9:16 PM
                Subject: [pop-pop-steamboats] Re: Make Magazine Vol 28
                 
                 

                Hi,
                Altoids is a kind of candy which comes in a can/tin.The tin has a very handy size so is used in all kinds of craft projects.
                Buy them here,if you're interested :
                http://www.mrsomalleys.co.uk/altoids-mints-p-83.html

                But I think there are other candy cans around that might work too.

                regards,Arno

                --- In mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com, "Peak45" <wayne.9003@...> wrote:

                >
                > Hi Guys,what is an Altoid
                can ??
                >
                > Wayne (England)
                >
                > From: Slater Harrison
                > Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 8:54 PM
                > To: mailto:
                href="mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com">mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: RE: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
                >
                >
                >
                > William,
                >
                >
                > Congrats on the Make
                article! I do subscribe and I read your piece: nice work. I think we’re all cheering you on. When someone makes more accessible these devices we all love, and creates some ripples, all boats will rise!
                >
                >
                > As for
                the PDF Joe put up, there is no question that it is a clear violation of copyrightâ€"albeit well intentioned. That said, you have benefitted from being part of this cozy, informal forum. For example, the general idea to use an aluminum soda can, and then use epoxy instead of solder, was gotten from a member of this forum, freely shared.
                >
                >
                > So perhaps you
                could treat us to a video of your boat running, or some behind the scenes commentary about developing it, in lieu of the copyrighted article. I know that I tried making traditional pop pop engines with my studentsâ€"quite shallow, not deep like yours--but the flame still overheated the epoxy and made leaks. I am wondering if, by using that tall altoid can, the heat is farther away and the vertical wall radiates out enough heat to not cause leaks. If so, that’s brilliant and my hat is off to you. Also, bending the edges in rather than out was a smart move.
                >
                >
                > By the way, my e-mail filter is
                capricious. Despite approving the Yahoo forum, I usually find the posts weeks laterâ€"if at allâ€"in my filter. So if I don’t respond to something specific it’s not intentional.
                >
                >
                > Slater
                >
                >
                > From:
                href="mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com">mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy
                > Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 11:47
                AM
                > To:
                href="mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com">mailto:pop-pop-steamboats%40yahoogroups.com
                >
                Subject: Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect
                Make's copyright
                > on this one, at least until the next issue hits the
                stands? I wrote the article,
                > I haven't even seen a print version of it
                yet, and you've already put it up
                > online. I have no financial interest
                either way (been paid already) but the
                > folks at Make ought be able to
                make their living too.
                >
                > As for Altoid tins... The magazine
                doesn't have any cross-promotion deal with
                > them or anything like that.
                It's just that those little tins are so darned handy...
                >
                >
                --William
                >
                > andor_99833 wrote:
                > > this quarter's make
                magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games. i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
                > >
                > > the make people
                tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
                > >
                > >
                joe
                > > petersburg, ak
                >
                > --
                > William
                Abernathy
                > Berkeley, CA
                >
                href="http://yourwritereditor.com">http://yourwritereditor.com
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                ----------------------------------------------------------
                > This message,
                together with any attachments, may contain information which is privileged and confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the message, along with any attachments.
                >

              • William Abernathy
                Slater: I have no question that Joe s posting was due to enthusiasm, not malice, and I ascribe and offer no ill intention to him for posting it. When Issue 29
                Message 7 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
                  Slater:

                  I have no question that Joe's posting was due to enthusiasm, not malice, and I
                  ascribe and offer no ill intention to him for posting it. When Issue 29 is on
                  the stands, I will turn a blind eye to any reposts, but I am a freelancer and
                  not an employee or agent of the magazine, so you're on your own if they find out.

                  I've just wrapped up an interview with the editors (them intervieing me), and
                  that interview should be up this week. With that interview should be a link to
                  the boat in action at:

                  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Xb3cz5C08Y

                  At the time I gave this interview, my recollection of the course of events with
                  this article was different from yours. As I remembered things, I was warned off
                  of aluminum diaphragms because they could not be easily or cheaply soldered. I
                  honestly thought using JB Weld and aluminum can stock in this configuration was
                  my own idea, and this is the recollection that's going to be reflected in the
                  interview.

                  Reviewing the group files, I do now note your June 7 suggestion to use epoxy,
                  albeit for a different application (the sciencetoymaker "folded soda can" plan,
                  which recommends hi-temp silicone glue), so I apologize if I stepped on any
                  priority there or failed to recognize your contribution. The rest of the design
                  I consider novel (as far as any of our "footnotes" on the original invention can
                  be so considered) insofar as I'm using an aluminum soda can diaphragm in a way
                  that I have not seen anyone else do.

                  The issue with boiler depth may just have been one of dumb luck. (Bear in mind
                  also that this is the Altoid Smalls tin, not the full-sized tins you may be more
                  used to seeing.) I wanted to work with "found"/low-cost/easy-to-source
                  materials. Though I have a roll of .003" brass stock, I could not source this
                  material at either the local hardware store or the local hobby shop, and I could
                  not recommend casual Make readers run out to order a $15 roll of brass sheet to
                  make one toy boat. Folding the Altoid tin more or less in half (vertically)
                  obviously reduces the volume substantially, and I folded it inward to give good
                  mechanical support to the diaphragm, top and bottom, irrespective of the JB
                  Weld's bond. The JB Weld holds the whole thing together, but the basic structure
                  helps it along. I went through about a dozen failed "rough draft" engines, and
                  ate a lot of Altoid Smalls that month. This one came together on deadline around
                  July, and I was starting to pull out hair trying to document it, test it, and
                  get it ready for prime time.

                  How long this engine will last is a question of time and care. JB Weld, as I
                  note in the article, breaks down around the same temperature as solder, if not a
                  little higher. Eventually, if the JB Weld does not fail, the boiler will rust
                  out (another advantage of non-ferrous boiler designs). It's by no means an
                  heirloom, but it is a great place to give people an introduction to this
                  fascinating type of steam engine, and hopefully bring a few moments of
                  low-budget mirth to some families this holiday season.

                  I hope to see a few new faces around here as a result of the article.

                  I'll be happy to answer any more questions as they come.

                  --William



                  Slater Harrison wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > William,
                  >
                  > Congrats on the Make article! I do subscribe and I read your piece: nice
                  > work. I think we’re all cheering you on. When someone makes more
                  > accessible these devices we all love, and creates some ripples, all
                  > boats will rise!
                  >
                  > As for the PDF Joe put up, there is no question that it is a clear
                  > violation of copyright—albeit well intentioned. That said, you have
                  > benefitted from being part of this cozy, informal forum. For example,
                  > the general idea to use an aluminum soda can, and then use epoxy instead
                  > of solder, was gotten from a member of this forum, freely shared.
                  >
                  > So perhaps you could treat us to a video of your boat running, or some
                  > behind the scenes commentary about developing it, in lieu of the
                  > copyrighted article. I know that I tried making traditional pop pop
                  > engines with my students—quite shallow, not deep like yours--but the
                  > flame still overheated the epoxy and made leaks. I am wondering if, by
                  > using that tall altoid can, the heat is farther away and the vertical
                  > wall radiates out enough heat to not cause leaks. If so, that’s
                  > brilliant and my hat is off to you. Also, bending the edges in rather
                  > than out was a smart move.
                  >
                  > By the way, my e-mail filter is capricious. Despite approving the Yahoo
                  > forum, I usually find the posts weeks later—if at all—in my filter. So
                  > if I don’t respond to something specific it’s not intentional.
                  >
                  > Slater
                  >
                  > *From:* pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
                  > [mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *William Abernathy
                  > *Sent:* Saturday, October 22, 2011 11:47 AM
                  > *To:* pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
                  > *Subject:* Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
                  >
                  > Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make's
                  > copyright
                  > on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands? I wrote the
                  > article,
                  > I haven't even seen a print version of it yet, and you've already put it up
                  > online. I have no financial interest either way (been paid already) but the
                  > folks at Make ought be able to make their living too.
                  >
                  > As for Altoid tins... The magazine doesn't have any cross-promotion deal
                  > with
                  > them or anything like that. It's just that those little tins are so
                  > darned handy...
                  >
                  > --William
                  >
                  > andor_99833 wrote:
                  > > this quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games.
                  > i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
                  > >
                  > > the make people tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
                  > >
                  > > joe
                  > > petersburg, ak
                  >
                  > --
                  > William Abernathy
                  > Berkeley, CA
                  > http://yourwritereditor.com
                  >


                  --
                  William Abernathy
                  Berkeley, CA
                  http://yourwritereditor.com
                • Slater Harrison
                  William, I had to laugh at the, ... and ate a lot of Altoid Smalls that month part! It s not unusual for discoveries to me made independently, even
                  Message 8 of 15 , Oct 22, 2011
                    William,

                    I had to laugh at the, "... and ate a lot of Altoid Smalls that month" part!

                    It's not unusual for discoveries to me made independently, even simultaneously. Scientific history is full of examples. I will say that it is a matter of record that I was using aluminum for putt putt engines, recorded in this instructional video and elsewhere in the series, sealed with epoxy without silicone, a very different design than yours.

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8dEyNAcOYU

                    It's wonderful how no single person has all the ideas. The variations are what keep things moving and interesting.

                    I liked your explanation about momentum making the water piston overshoot its equilibrium. Very well put.

                    Cheers,
                    Slater

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of William Abernathy
                    Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 5:49 PM
                    To: pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28

                    Slater:

                    I have no question that Joe's posting was due to enthusiasm, not malice, and I ascribe and offer no ill intention to him for posting it. When Issue 29 is on the stands, I will turn a blind eye to any reposts, but I am a freelancer and not an employee or agent of the magazine, so you're on your own if they find out.

                    I've just wrapped up an interview with the editors (them intervieing me), and that interview should be up this week. With that interview should be a link to the boat in action at:

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Xb3cz5C08Y

                    At the time I gave this interview, my recollection of the course of events with this article was different from yours. As I remembered things, I was warned off of aluminum diaphragms because they could not be easily or cheaply soldered. I honestly thought using JB Weld and aluminum can stock in this configuration was my own idea, and this is the recollection that's going to be reflected in the interview.

                    Reviewing the group files, I do now note your June 7 suggestion to use epoxy, albeit for a different application (the sciencetoymaker "folded soda can" plan, which recommends hi-temp silicone glue), so I apologize if I stepped on any priority there or failed to recognize your contribution. The rest of the design I consider novel (as far as any of our "footnotes" on the original invention can be so considered) insofar as I'm using an aluminum soda can diaphragm in a way that I have not seen anyone else do.

                    The issue with boiler depth may just have been one of dumb luck. (Bear in mind also that this is the Altoid Smalls tin, not the full-sized tins you may be more used to seeing.) I wanted to work with "found"/low-cost/easy-to-source materials. Though I have a roll of .003" brass stock, I could not source this material at either the local hardware store or the local hobby shop, and I could not recommend casual Make readers run out to order a $15 roll of brass sheet to make one toy boat. Folding the Altoid tin more or less in half (vertically) obviously reduces the volume substantially, and I folded it inward to give good mechanical support to the diaphragm, top and bottom, irrespective of the JB Weld's bond. The JB Weld holds the whole thing together, but the basic structure helps it along. I went through about a dozen failed "rough draft" engines, and ate a lot of Altoid Smalls that month. This one came together on deadline around July, and I was starting to pull out hair trying to document it, test it, and get it ready for prime time.

                    How long this engine will last is a question of time and care. JB Weld, as I note in the article, breaks down around the same temperature as solder, if not a little higher. Eventually, if the JB Weld does not fail, the boiler will rust out (another advantage of non-ferrous boiler designs). It's by no means an heirloom, but it is a great place to give people an introduction to this fascinating type of steam engine, and hopefully bring a few moments of low-budget mirth to some families this holiday season.

                    I hope to see a few new faces around here as a result of the article.

                    I'll be happy to answer any more questions as they come.

                    --William



                    Slater Harrison wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > William,
                    >
                    > Congrats on the Make article! I do subscribe and I read your piece:
                    > nice work. I think we're all cheering you on. When someone makes more
                    > accessible these devices we all love, and creates some ripples, all
                    > boats will rise!
                    >
                    > As for the PDF Joe put up, there is no question that it is a clear
                    > violation of copyright-albeit well intentioned. That said, you have
                    > benefitted from being part of this cozy, informal forum. For example,
                    > the general idea to use an aluminum soda can, and then use epoxy
                    > instead of solder, was gotten from a member of this forum, freely shared.
                    >
                    > So perhaps you could treat us to a video of your boat running, or some
                    > behind the scenes commentary about developing it, in lieu of the
                    > copyrighted article. I know that I tried making traditional pop pop
                    > engines with my students-quite shallow, not deep like yours--but the
                    > flame still overheated the epoxy and made leaks. I am wondering if, by
                    > using that tall altoid can, the heat is farther away and the vertical
                    > wall radiates out enough heat to not cause leaks. If so, that's
                    > brilliant and my hat is off to you. Also, bending the edges in rather
                    > than out was a smart move.
                    >
                    > By the way, my e-mail filter is capricious. Despite approving the
                    > Yahoo forum, I usually find the posts weeks later-if at all-in my
                    > filter. So if I don't respond to something specific it's not intentional.
                    >
                    > Slater
                    >
                    > *From:* pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *William
                    > Abernathy
                    > *Sent:* Saturday, October 22, 2011 11:47 AM
                    > *To:* pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com
                    > *Subject:* Re: [pop-pop-steamboats] Make Magazine Vol 28
                    >
                    > Joe: I don't mean to be a meanie, but could you please respect Make's
                    > copyright on this one, at least until the next issue hits the stands?
                    > I wrote the article, I haven't even seen a print version of it yet,
                    > and you've already put it up online. I have no financial interest
                    > either way (been paid already) but the folks at Make ought be able to
                    > make their living too.
                    >
                    > As for Altoid tins... The magazine doesn't have any cross-promotion
                    > deal with them or anything like that. It's just that those little tins
                    > are so darned handy...
                    >
                    > --William
                    >
                    > andor_99833 wrote:
                    > > this quarter's make magazine (makezine.com) is on toys and games.
                    > i've uploaded a pdf article (poppop.pdf)on making a poppop boat.
                    > >
                    > > the make people tend to use alot of altoid cans as raw materials.
                    > >
                    > > joe
                    > > petersburg, ak
                    >
                    > --
                    > William Abernathy
                    > Berkeley, CA
                    > http://yourwritereditor.com
                    >


                    --
                    William Abernathy
                    Berkeley, CA
                    http://yourwritereditor.com


                    ------------------------------------

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                  • zoomkat
                    ... I get ~3 altoid cans a week from a co-worker. My intention is to make a multi wick burner for a larger engine.
                    Message 9 of 15 , Oct 23, 2011
                      --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, "Peak45" <wayne.9003@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi Guys,what is an Altoid can ??
                      >

                      I get ~3 altoid cans a week from a co-worker. My intention is to make a multi wick burner for a larger engine.
                    • David Halfpenny (y)
                      ... Has anyone tried using aluminium solder? David 1/2d
                      Message 10 of 15 , Oct 24, 2011
                        --------------------------------------------------

                        > I was warned off
                        > of aluminum diaphragms because they could not be easily or cheaply
                        > soldered.

                        Has anyone tried using aluminium solder?

                        David 1/2d
                      • Ivan Foster
                        Yes, Still to hard for me. Someone on here modified fuel pumps and bolted in the diaphragm, I like the idea but have jet to try it. On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at
                        Message 11 of 15 , Oct 24, 2011
                          Yes, Still to hard for me. Someone on here modified fuel pumps and bolted in the diaphragm, I like the idea but have jet to try it.


                          On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 3:57 PM, David Halfpenny (y) <david.halfpenny@...> wrote:

                          --------------------------------------------------

                          >  I was warned off
                          > of aluminum diaphragms because they could not be easily or cheaply
                          > soldered.

                          Has anyone tried using aluminium solder?

                          David 1/2d



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                          --
                          Foster
                          Tru Cut Landscapes
                          830 708-3160
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                        • mike.recycle
                          ... I have ordered some Techno-Weld, here are 3 videos about it. I found the supplier here in UK via Google. Mike
                          Message 12 of 15 , Oct 25, 2011
                            --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, "David Halfpenny \(y\)" <david.halfpenny@...> wrote:
                            > > I was warned off
                            > > of aluminum diaphragms because they could not be easily or cheaply
                            > > soldered.
                            >
                            > Has anyone tried using aluminium solder?

                            I have ordered some Techno-Weld, here are 3 videos about it. I found the supplier here in UK via Google.

                            Mike
                          • zoomkat
                            ... JB Weld engine from a long time back.
                            Message 13 of 15 , Oct 25, 2011
                              --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, William Abernathy <william@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >. I
                              > honestly thought using JB Weld and aluminum can stock in this configuration was
                              > my own idea, and this is the recollection that's going to be reflected in the interview.

                              JB Weld engine from a long time back.

                              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pop-pop-steamboats/photos/album/1755869487/pic/832500701/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc
                            • William Abernathy
                              Well, there goes my patent application! --W ... -- William Abernathy Berkeley, CA http://yourwritereditor.com
                              Message 14 of 15 , Oct 25, 2011
                                Well, there goes my patent application!

                                --W

                                zoomkat wrote:
                                >
                                > --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, William Abernathy<william@...> wrote:
                                >>
                                >> . I
                                >> honestly thought using JB Weld and aluminum can stock in this configuration was
                                >> my own idea, and this is the recollection that's going to be reflected in the interview.
                                >
                                > JB Weld engine from a long time back.
                                >
                                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pop-pop-steamboats/photos/album/1755869487/pic/832500701/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc


                                --
                                William Abernathy
                                Berkeley, CA
                                http://yourwritereditor.com
                              • mike.recycle
                                Didn t know about JB Weld, just checked and claimed temperature resistance is: JB Weld: 500 F (260 C) Techno Weld: 716 F (380 C) So JB Weld looks not
                                Message 15 of 15 , Oct 26, 2011
                                  Didn't know about JB Weld, just checked and claimed temperature resistance is:
                                  JB Weld: 500 F (260 C)
                                  Techno Weld: 716 F (380 C)
                                  So JB Weld looks not bad, for an epoxy,
                                  JB Weld Kwik has allegedly about half that heat resistance.
                                  Mike

                                  --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, William Abernathy <william@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Well, there goes my patent application!
                                  >
                                  > --W
                                  >
                                  > zoomkat wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In pop-pop-steamboats@yahoogroups.com, William Abernathy<william@> wrote:
                                  > >>
                                  > >> . I
                                  > >> honestly thought using JB Weld and aluminum can stock in this configuration was
                                  > >> my own idea, and this is the recollection that's going to be reflected in the interview.
                                  > >
                                  > > JB Weld engine from a long time back.
                                  > >
                                  > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pop-pop-steamboats/photos/album/1755869487/pic/832500701/view?picmode=&mode=tn&order=ordinal&start=1&count=20&dir=asc
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > --
                                  > William Abernathy
                                  > Berkeley, CA
                                  > http://yourwritereditor.com
                                  >
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