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Holygarchy

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  • Vigilius Haufniensis
    http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/ April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today: After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident,
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 4, 2007
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      April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today:

      After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident, returned to Bolivia, we maintained an email relationship and I continued to edit his book. I secured permission from the publisher of the newspaper I edit to publish his manuscript. We began editing the latest version of his excellent book, Holygarchy, after Publish America decided to terminate their contract with him on spurious grounds.

      He had recently sent me a new chapter about a high level Mossad agent who was also coincidentally an "art student."

      He never gave me the real name of this gentleman, always calling him Arik, but he told me one very important detail about the man, namely that he was the son of the man who put the bombs in the Hotel King
      David.

      He told me about the "fighting families" (Lehi, Etzel, Irgun) of Israel and the way in which they still control the intelligence services and plum business positions given as gifts to core warriors.

      Recently, Reuven was growing more and more desperate back in Bolivia and mentioned to me that he was again under heavy surveillance and that someone had recently broken into his room in search of
      "documents."

      Then, all of a sudden, this morning, I go to edit the newest version of Straw Skyscrapers, a chapter from the book, when I find that absolutely every single email to and from Reuven has been deleted from
      my gmail account. Even his entry in my Contacts file was gone.

      It has been widely reported that google has CIA connections, and quite frankly, I feel deeply violated and very concerned, both for Reuven and myself, hence this public letter.

      http://www.google-watch.org/jobad.html 
      http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/december2006/061206seedmoney.htm

      Tonight, I checked on a hunch and found that Reuven's entire website has disappeared. The domain has not expired, and was hosted at a free site on geocities.com (Yahoo). Once again, I suspect active sabotage. Google schossen.com and you can see the cached version. An old version is still up at http://progressiveconvergence.com/schossen

      Attached, please find the most recent chapter entitled Arik in the midst of the editing process as well as the complete manuscript as I have it. I also include below the chapter entitled Straw Skyscrapers,
      a touching account of the vagueness of the Israeli State's "Law of Return," underscoring the vast myth of Judaism as race and religion.

      Please pray for Reuven if you are so inclined. Although some of my friends, you know who you are, were disinclined to work with Reuven, I developed a close relationship with him. As such, my emotions are telling me that something very bad has happened and I am concerned for my friend's safety. As he used to say to me, it could happen to you too.

      Leland Lehrman

    • Sean McBride
      Is the implication here that Mossad has infiltrated and/or hacked Google? That is has access to the Gmail accounts of all users and can maliciously manipulate
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 5, 2007
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        Is the implication here that Mossad has infiltrated and/or hacked Google?  That is has access to the Gmail accounts of all users and can maliciously manipulate them?  And that it may have murdered Reuven
        Schossen?
         
        If this story is true (I don't for sure yet that it is), it should be circulated far and wide, because the implications of it are staggering and sinister.  Apparently Mossad, through a covert network of agents and sympathizers, may have access to and control of all the data in all the private accounts of all the major Internet companies -- including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, Hotmail, Comcast and many other companies.
         
        Google should issue an official and formal statement on this incident, if it is true, and explain precisely how this Gmail account was hacked.  Are any Gmail accounts safe?  Is Mossad reading the mail of all Gmail users and targeting specific Gmail users for malicious attack?  Where do Sergey Brin and Larry Page stand on this issue?
         
        This is potentially a huge issue, folks.  Pay close attention.


        Vigilius Haufniensis <thehatefulnerd@...> wrote:
         
        April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today:
        After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident, returned to Bolivia, we maintained an email relationship and I continued to edit his book. I secured permission from the publisher of the newspaper I edit to publish his manuscript. We began editing the latest version of his excellent book, Holygarchy, after Publish America decided to terminate their contract with him on spurious grounds.

        He had recently sent me a new chapter about a high level Mossad agent who was also coincidentally an "art student."

        He never gave me the real name of this gentleman, always calling him Arik, but he told me one very important detail about the man, namely that he was the son of the man who put the bombs in the Hotel King
        David.

        He told me about the "fighting families" (Lehi, Etzel, Irgun) of Israel and the way in which they still control the intelligence services and plum business positions given as gifts to core warriors.

        Recently, Reuven was growing more and more desperate back in Bolivia and mentioned to me that he was again under heavy surveillance and that someone had recently broken into his room in search of
        "documents."

        Then, all of a sudden, this morning, I go to edit the newest version of Straw Skyscrapers, a chapter from the book, when I find that absolutely every single email to and from Reuven has been deleted from
        my gmail account. Even his entry in my Contacts file was gone.

        It has been widely reported that google has CIA connections, and quite frankly, I feel deeply violated and very concerned, both for Reuven and myself, hence this public letter.

        http://www.google- watch.org/ jobad.html 
        http://www.prisonpl anet.com/ articles/ december2006/ 061206seedmoney. htm
        Tonight, I checked on a hunch and found that Reuven's entire website has disappeared. The domain has not expired, and was hosted at a free site on geocities.com (Yahoo). Once again, I suspect active sabotage. Google schossen.com and you can see the cached version. An old version is still up at http://progressivec onvergence. com/schossen

        Attached, please find the most recent chapter entitled Arik in the midst of the editing process as well as the complete manuscript as I have it. I also include below the chapter entitled Straw Skyscrapers,
        a touching account of the vagueness of the Israeli State's "Law of Return," underscoring the vast myth of Judaism as race and religion.

        Please pray for Reuven if you are so inclined. Although some of my friends, you know who you are, were disinclined to work with Reuven, I developed a close relationship with him. As such, my emotions are telling me that something very bad has happened and I am concerned for my friend's safety. As he used to say to me, it could happen to you too.

        Leland Lehrman

      • Bond
        Or alternatively one could apply Occam s Razor: Lehrman s own computer security was compromised, and his GMail password purloined. ... From: Sean McBride To:
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 5, 2007
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          Or alternatively one could apply Occam's Razor:
           
          Lehrman's own computer security was compromised, and his GMail password purloined.
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 1:24 AM
          Subject: [political-research] Mossad Hacking/Infiltration/Control of Google?

          Is the implication here that Mossad has infiltrated and/or hacked Google?  That is has access to the Gmail accounts of all users and can maliciously manipulate them?  And that it may have murdered Reuven
          Schossen?
           
          If this story is true (I don't for sure yet that it is), it should be circulated far and wide, because the implications of it are staggering and sinister.  Apparently Mossad, through a covert network of agents and sympathizers, may have access to and control of all the data in all the private accounts of all the major Internet companies -- including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, Hotmail, Comcast and many other companies.
           
          Google should issue an official and formal statement on this incident, if it is true, and explain precisely how this Gmail account was hacked.  Are any Gmail accounts safe?  Is Mossad reading the mail of all Gmail users and targeting specific Gmail users for malicious attack?  Where do Sergey Brin and Larry Page stand on this issue?
           
          This is potentially a huge issue, folks.  Pay close attention.


          Vigilius Haufniensis <thehatefulnerd@...> wrote:
           
          April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today:
          After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident, returned to Bolivia, we maintained an email relationship and I continued to edit his book. I secured permission from the publisher of the newspaper I edit to publish his manuscript. We began editing the latest version of his excellent book, Holygarchy, after Publish America decided to terminate their contract with him on spurious grounds.

          He had recently sent me a new chapter about a high level Mossad agent who was also coincidentally an "art student."

          He never gave me the real name of this gentleman, always calling him Arik, but he told me one very important detail about the man, namely that he was the son of the man who put the bombs in the Hotel King
          David.

          He told me about the "fighting families" (Lehi, Etzel, Irgun) of Israel and the way in which they still control the intelligence services and plum business positions given as gifts to core warriors.

          Recently, Reuven was growing more and more desperate back in Bolivia and mentioned to me that he was again under heavy surveillance and that someone had recently broken into his room in search of
          "documents."

          Then, all of a sudden, this morning, I go to edit the newest version of Straw Skyscrapers, a chapter from the book, when I find that absolutely every single email to and from Reuven has been deleted from
          my gmail account. Even his entry in my Contacts file was gone.

          It has been widely reported that google has CIA connections, and quite frankly, I feel deeply violated and very concerned, both for Reuven and myself, hence this public letter.

        • Sean McBride
          Maybe, maybe... But all any major intel agency around the world requires to access private account information at an Internet company (or any company or
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
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            Maybe, maybe...
             
            But all any major intel agency around the world requires to access private account information at an Internet company (or any company or government agency) is *one* employee, even a relatively low-level technical worker.  Stop and think how many employees at Google would jump at the chance to help Mossad as a matter of patriotic duty.  I know of one incident from a decade ago in which the owner of a major American ISP, who fit the profile of a David Horowitz or Daniel Pipes, put the resources of his company at the service of the Israeli government.
             
            This particular story is quite disturbing, and should be followed very closely.
             
            There is some context here, also: Google reportedly attempted to censor on Google Video and Youtube material which proved that the BBC announced the collapse of WTC7 a half hour before the fact.  Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
             
            Google is rapidly evolving into one of the most powerful companies on the planet, perhaps the most powerful.  We need to know a great deal about the politics, agenda and ethics of the people who control the company.


            Bond <Bondj4007@...> wrote:
            Or alternatively one could apply Occam's Razor:
             
            Lehrman's own computer security was compromised, and his GMail password purloined.
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 1:24 AM
            Subject: [political-research ] Mossad Hacking/Infiltratio n/Control of Google?

            Is the implication here that Mossad has infiltrated and/or hacked Google?  That is has access to the Gmail accounts of all users and can maliciously manipulate them?  And that it may have murdered Reuven
            Schossen?
             
            If this story is true (I don't for sure yet that it is), it should be circulated far and wide, because the implications of it are staggering and sinister.  Apparently Mossad, through a covert network of agents and sympathizers, may have access to and control of all the data in all the private accounts of all the major Internet companies -- including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, Hotmail, Comcast and many other companies.
             
            Google should issue an official and formal statement on this incident, if it is true, and explain precisely how this Gmail account was hacked.  Are any Gmail accounts safe?  Is Mossad reading the mail of all Gmail users and targeting specific Gmail users for malicious attack?  Where do Sergey Brin and Larry Page stand on this issue?
             
            This is potentially a huge issue, folks.  Pay close attention.


            Vigilius Haufniensis <thehatefulnerd@ comcast.net> wrote:
             
            April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today:
            After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident, returned to Bolivia, we maintained an email relationship and I continued to edit his book. I secured permission from the publisher of the newspaper I edit to publish his manuscript. We began editing the latest version of his excellent book, Holygarchy, after Publish America decided to terminate their contract with him on spurious grounds.

            He had recently sent me a new chapter about a high level Mossad agent who was also coincidentally an "art student."

            He never gave me the real name of this gentleman, always calling him Arik, but he told me one very important detail about the man, namely that he was the son of the man who put the bombs in the Hotel King
            David.

            He told me about the "fighting families" (Lehi, Etzel, Irgun) of Israel and the way in which they still control the intelligence services and plum business positions given as gifts to core warriors.

            Recently, Reuven was growing more and more desperate back in Bolivia and mentioned to me that he was again under heavy surveillance and that someone had recently broken into his room in search of
            "documents."

            Then, all of a sudden, this morning, I go to edit the newest version of Straw Skyscrapers, a chapter from the book, when I find that absolutely every single email to and from Reuven has been deleted from
            my gmail account. Even his entry in my Contacts file was gone.

            It has been widely reported that google has CIA connections, and quite frankly, I feel deeply violated and very concerned, both for Reuven and myself, hence this public letter.


          • Bond
            I hear you, although there s such elegance involved in simple and surgical operations. Consider this portion of Lehrman s email: Tonight, I checked on a
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
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              I hear you, although there's such elegance involved in simple and surgical operations.  Consider this portion of Lehrman's email:
               
              "Tonight, I checked on a hunch and found that Reuven's entire website has disappeared. The domain has not expired, and was hosted at a free site on geocities.com (Yahoo). Once again, I suspect active sabotage. Google schossen.com and you can see the cached version."
               
              Google spooks involved, yet they leave a cached version in their system?
               
              Consider also that Reuven had indicated a recent home intrusion event ("looking for documents").  Again, the Occam's Razor suggests an elegant explanation:  Reuven's computer had been compromised with keyloggers, and/or trojan software.. then at an appropriate time, the intruders simply return to his premises, power-up his PC and take down the Geocities-hosted website!
               
              The elegance is in the Originating IP being Reuven's.  And, it may well be Lehrman's GMail 'modifications' were also done from his own PC.  Zero blowback.
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 7:16 PM
              Subject: Re: [political-research] Mossad Hacking/Infiltration/Control of Google?

              Maybe, maybe...
               
              But all any major intel agency around the world requires to access private account information at an Internet company (or any company or government agency) is *one* employee, even a relatively low-level technical worker.  Stop and think how many employees at Google would jump at the chance to help Mossad as a matter of patriotic duty.  I know of one incident from a decade ago in which the owner of a major American ISP, who fit the profile of a David Horowitz or Daniel Pipes, put the resources of his company at the service of the Israeli government.
               
              This particular story is quite disturbing, and should be followed very closely.
               
              There is some context here, also: Google reportedly attempted to censor on Google Video and Youtube material which proved that the BBC announced the collapse of WTC7 a half hour before the fact.  Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
               
              Google is rapidly evolving into one of the most powerful companies on the planet, perhaps the most powerful.  We need to know a great deal about the politics, agenda and ethics of the people who control the company.


              Bond <Bondj4007@...> wrote:
              Or alternatively one could apply Occam's Razor:
               
              Lehrman's own computer security was compromised, and his GMail password purloined.
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 1:24 AM
              Subject: [political-research ] Mossad Hacking/Infiltratio n/Control of Google?

              Is the implication here that Mossad has infiltrated and/or hacked Google?  That is has access to the Gmail accounts of all users and can maliciously manipulate them?  And that it may have murdered Reuven
              Schossen?
               
              If this story is true (I don't for sure yet that it is), it should be circulated far and wide, because the implications of it are staggering and sinister.  Apparently Mossad, through a covert network of agents and sympathizers, may have access to and control of all the data in all the private accounts of all the major Internet companies -- including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, Hotmail, Comcast and many other companies.
               
              Google should issue an official and formal statement on this incident, if it is true, and explain precisely how this Gmail account was hacked.  Are any Gmail accounts safe?  Is Mossad reading the mail of all Gmail users and targeting specific Gmail users for malicious attack?  Where do Sergey Brin and Larry Page stand on this issue?
               
              This is potentially a huge issue, folks.  Pay close attention.


              Vigilius Haufniensis <thehatefulnerd@ comcast.net> wrote:
               
              April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today:
              After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident, returned to Bolivia, we maintained an email relationship and I continued to edit his book. I secured permission from the publisher of the newspaper I edit to publish his manuscript. We began editing the latest version of his excellent book, Holygarchy, after Publish America decided to terminate their contract with him on spurious grounds.

              He had recently sent me a new chapter about a high level Mossad agent who was also coincidentally an "art student."

              He never gave me the real name of this gentleman, always calling him Arik, but he told me one very important detail about the man, namely that he was the son of the man who put the bombs in the Hotel King
              David.

              He told me about the "fighting families" (Lehi, Etzel, Irgun) of Israel and the way in which they still control the intelligence services and plum business positions given as gifts to core warriors.

              Recently, Reuven was growing more and more desperate back in Bolivia and mentioned to me that he was again under heavy surveillance and that someone had recently broken into his room in search of
              "documents."

              Then, all of a sudden, this morning, I go to edit the newest version of Straw Skyscrapers, a chapter from the book, when I find that absolutely every single email to and from Reuven has been deleted from
              my gmail account. Even his entry in my Contacts file was gone.

              It has been widely reported that google has CIA connections, and quite frankly, I feel deeply violated and very concerned, both for Reuven and myself, hence this public letter.


            • LeaNder
              - Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby. ... I don t quite understand what
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
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                -
                  Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
                >   

                I don't quite understand what this means? Could you give an example?

                Personally I simply ignore it when another mail suddenly disappears,thinking I must have clicked the wrong online or desktop button. My longer experience is that working under stress produces these things almost automatically. And my biggest problem is that I usually try to do several things at once. This means I do not always pay the close atttentions  every single would deserve. Not that I would not like to have a program that would let me check what exactly happened in hindsight. ...

                That said; I do not know the the people and how they function, so maybe they deserve the benefit of doubt. BUT this is admittedly a story were I wonder if certain basical "pre judgements" are necessary to lean to the other side. ...

                There is a certain air of spectaculum about the whole thing that makes me wonder if it closer to reality or fiction. Although to complicate things: sometimes fiction turns into reality and reality into fiction.

                Tthus I write this with all due respect to your  hesitant: "Maybe, maybe..."
              • Sean McBride
                What you envision is very plausible. We need to follow this story to see if any new facts emerge to clarify it. With regard to intel interest in general in
                Message 7 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
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                  What you envision is very plausible.  We need to follow this story to see if any new facts emerge to clarify it. 
                   
                  With regard to intel interest in general in compromising, infiltrating and controlling major Internet companies: can you appreciate what a prize outfits like Google, Yahoo, Amazon, AOL and Comcast are?  I'm sure you can.  Google, and its treasure trove of clickstreams, may be the ultimate aquarium for the human race.
                   
                  For more background check out Carl Cameron's CNN report on Israeli involvement in telecommunications espionage in America (a story which was subsequently censored and scrubbed from CNN under the instigation of the ADL thought police, but which is still widely available on the Internet.)  Try searching on "carl cameron amdocs" without the quotes.


                  Bond <Bondj4007@...> wrote:
                  I hear you, although there's such elegance involved in simple and surgical operations.  Consider this portion of Lehrman's email:
                   
                  "Tonight, I checked on a hunch and found that Reuven's entire website has disappeared. The domain has not expired, and was hosted at a free site on geocities.com (Yahoo). Once again, I suspect active sabotage. Google schossen.com and you can see the cached version."
                   
                  Google spooks involved, yet they leave a cached version in their system?
                   
                  Consider also that Reuven had indicated a recent home intrusion event ("looking for documents").  Again, the Occam's Razor suggests an elegant explanation:  Reuven's computer had been compromised with keyloggers, and/or trojan software.. then at an appropriate time, the intruders simply return to his premises, power-up his PC and take down the Geocities-hosted website!
                   
                  The elegance is in the Originating IP being Reuven's.  And, it may well be Lehrman's GMail 'modifications' were also done from his own PC.  Zero blowback.
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 7:16 PM
                  Subject: Re: [political-research ] Mossad Hacking/Infiltratio n/Control of Google?

                  Maybe, maybe...
                   
                  But all any major intel agency around the world requires to access private account information at an Internet company (or any company or government agency) is *one* employee, even a relatively low-level technical worker.  Stop and think how many employees at Google would jump at the chance to help Mossad as a matter of patriotic duty.  I know of one incident from a decade ago in which the owner of a major American ISP, who fit the profile of a David Horowitz or Daniel Pipes, put the resources of his company at the service of the Israeli government.
                   
                  This particular story is quite disturbing, and should be followed very closely.
                   
                  There is some context here, also: Google reportedly attempted to censor on Google Video and Youtube material which proved that the BBC announced the collapse of WTC7 a half hour before the fact.  Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
                   
                  Google is rapidly evolving into one of the most powerful companies on the planet, perhaps the most powerful.  We need to know a great deal about the politics, agenda and ethics of the people who control the company.


                  Bond <Bondj4007@yahoo. com.au> wrote:
                  Or alternatively one could apply Occam's Razor:
                   
                  Lehrman's own computer security was compromised, and his GMail password purloined.
                   
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 1:24 AM
                  Subject: [political-research ] Mossad Hacking/Infiltratio n/Control of Google?

                  Is the implication here that Mossad has infiltrated and/or hacked Google?  That is has access to the Gmail accounts of all users and can maliciously manipulate them?  And that it may have murdered Reuven
                  Schossen?
                   
                  If this story is true (I don't for sure yet that it is), it should be circulated far and wide, because the implications of it are staggering and sinister.  Apparently Mossad, through a covert network of agents and sympathizers, may have access to and control of all the data in all the private accounts of all the major Internet companies -- including Google, Yahoo, Amazon, Hotmail, Comcast and many other companies.
                   
                  Google should issue an official and formal statement on this incident, if it is true, and explain precisely how this Gmail account was hacked.  Are any Gmail accounts safe?  Is Mossad reading the mail of all Gmail users and targeting specific Gmail users for malicious attack?  Where do Sergey Brin and Larry Page stand on this issue?
                   
                  This is potentially a huge issue, folks.  Pay close attention.


                  Vigilius Haufniensis <thehatefulnerd@ comcast.net> wrote:
                   
                  April 4, 2007 -- E-mailed yesterday and received from Leland Lehrman today:
                  After Reuven Schossen, the Israeli dissident, returned to Bolivia, we maintained an email relationship and I continued to edit his book. I secured permission from the publisher of the newspaper I edit to publish his manuscript. We began editing the latest version of his excellent book, Holygarchy, after Publish America decided to terminate their contract with him on spurious grounds.

                  He had recently sent me a new chapter about a high level Mossad agent who was also coincidentally an "art student."

                  He never gave me the real name of this gentleman, always calling him Arik, but he told me one very important detail about the man, namely that he was the son of the man who put the bombs in the Hotel King
                  David.

                  He told me about the "fighting families" (Lehi, Etzel, Irgun) of Israel and the way in which they still control the intelligence services and plum business positions given as gifts to core warriors.

                  Recently, Reuven was growing more and more desperate back in Bolivia and mentioned to me that he was again under heavy surveillance and that someone had recently broken into his room in search of
                  "documents."

                  Then, all of a sudden, this morning, I go to edit the newest version of Straw Skyscrapers, a chapter from the book, when I find that absolutely every single email to and from Reuven has been deleted from
                  my gmail account. Even his entry in my Contacts file was gone.

                  It has been widely reported that google has CIA connections, and quite frankly, I feel deeply violated and very concerned, both for Reuven and myself, hence this public letter.



                • Sean McBride
                  With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google: http://www.google.com/search?q=Jew You will see the following explanation at the top of
                  Message 8 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
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                    With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                     
                     
                    You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                     
                    "We're disturbed about these results as well.  Please read our note here."
                     
                    Then read the explanation here:
                     
                     
                    Question: is Google a universal search engine or is it an ethnocentric search engine?  Why does no other ethnic or religious group receive this kind of special treatment from Google?  Do Sergey Brin and Larry Page have a special interest in this issue?  Is this why Google weirdly tried to censor material on Google Video proving that the BBC announced the collapse of WTC7 a half hour before it actually fell?
                     
                    Notice the URL for the "explanation": clearly it's the only "breaking of the frame" of its type on Google search.  It's THE explanation, the only one.
                     
                    Also note that the explanation cites the ADL as an authority.  That's interesting, dear Google: the ADL has a proven track record of engaging in large-scale illegal spying on Americans, and is widely (and reasonably) suspected of coordinating its activities with Mossad.  You can look it up on Google.
                     
                    Google needs to be as pure as the driven snow on these matters because of the enormous power it wields, and because of the potential for the abuse of that power.  It needs to create the impression of absolute impartiality with regard to controversial political issues.  It has already failed in this regard and displayed an evident bias.  That is the kind of mistake one never really recovers from -- the seeds of suspicion have been planted by Google itself.


                    LeaNder <l.l.hahn@...> wrote:

                    -
                      Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
                    >   

                    I don't quite understand what this means? Could you give an example?

                    Personally I simply ignore it when another mail suddenly disappears,thinking I must have clicked the wrong online or desktop button. My longer experience is that working under stress produces these things almost automatically. And my biggest problem is that I usually try to do several things at once. This means I do not always pay the close atttentions  every single would deserve. Not that I would not like to have a program that would let me check what exactly happened in hindsight. ...

                    That said; I do not know the the people and how they function, so maybe they deserve the benefit of doubt. BUT this is admittedly a story were I wonder if certain basical "pre judgements" are necessary to lean to the other side. ...

                    There is a certain air of spectaculum about the whole thing that makes me wonder if it closer to reality or fiction. Although to complicate things: sometimes fiction turns into reality and reality into fiction.

                    Tthus I write this with all due respect to your  hesitant: "Maybe, maybe..."

                  • LeaNder
                    Sean: With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on ... ... here. LeaNder: I don t get a note/explanation
                    Message 9 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
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                      Sean: 
                      With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                      >
                      > http://www.google.com/search?q=Jew 
                      >
                      > You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                      >
                      > "We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here."

                      LeaNder: I don't get a note/explanation on top of the search if I follow your link. I do not get explanations on top  if I google "Jew" on Google Germany. The only difference is that  over here  two (2 see note on the bottom of the page) links are censored maybe its Jew Watch

                      http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=jew&btnG=Suche&meta=

                      Instead we have a link analyzing the Jew Watch issue: Jew Watch, Google and Search Engine optimization  (see link below) high up on the Google.de Search. The explanation came up link no. 4 and the the investigation of the issue on link  no 9.  Is it still there??

                      http://sethf.com/anticensorware/google/jew-watch.p
                      >
                      Sean:  Then read the explanation here:
                      >
                      > http://www.google.com/explanation.html 
                      >
                      > Question: is Google a universal search engine or is it an ethnocentric search engine? Why does no other ethnic or religious group receive this kind of special treatment from Google? Do Sergey Brin and Larry Page have a special interest in this issue? Is this why Google weirdly tried to censor material on Google Video proving that the BBC announced the collapse of WTC7 a half hour before it actually fell?
                       
                      LeaNder: On first sight  it seems the reasons were neither our German/European laws, nor Larry Page's sensitivity but it was triggered by a Steven Weinstock [Weinstock = grapevine]  I can see the problem with an exception to the rule that opens the road for larger censorship ...  As a German I would prefer a different subject at the core of the whole censorship debate . Can you understand???
                      >
                      Sean:  Notice the URL for the "explanation": clearly it's the only "breaking of the frame" of its type on Google search. It's THE explanation, the only one.

                      LeaNder: Its a very special part of Western history.  But yes, I agree that it is somehow irritating that demands for censorship mainly seem to lead back to this core lately.  But I haven't paid enough attention to the subject. And attention it would deserve. So this may be a superficial impression, too.

                      Can censorship ever be the solution? Will it lead to an ever expanding framework of censorships from this core? ...  I don't know.
                      >
                      Sean: 
                      Also note that the explanation cites the ADL as an authority. That's interesting, dear Google: the ADL has a proven track record of engaging in large-scale illegal spying on Americans, and is widely (and reasonably) suspected of coordinating its activities with Mossad. You can look it up on Google.

                      LeaNder: OK: when you mentioned the story about ADL first, I couldn't imagine for a second that anybody  but an antisemite would ever write something like this.  I admittedly was surprised, when I discovered some of the things you mentioned were correct. But I wouldn't know how to evaluate them. Spying on Americans, yes but I simply do not know enough about the case, or the Mark Rich story, or anything else? ...

                      You did forward to your Google Reader a strong criticism of Foxman by a  ADL Chicago chapter member not long ago?  You see I pay attention to the issue ...

                      And I have to admit that a survey by ADL on European antisemitism once made me slightly angry. It had a very peculiar design considering the state of art in this field. It were only about 10 questions, basically the most common antisemitic prejudices were tested.  But then, there seem to be people that honestly believe these things. Who would know better than a German?.
                       
                      Sean: Google needs to be as pure as the driven snow on these matters because of the enormous power it wields, and because of the potential for the abuse of that power. It needs to create the impression of absolute impartiality with regard to controversial political issues. It has already failed in this regard and displayed an evident bias. That is the kind of mistake one never really recovers from -- the seeds of suspicion have been planted by Google itself.

                      LeaNder:
                      Ideally, yes. Ideally google should apply a set of algorithms and than leave the search alone. But ideally there shouldn't be antisemitism either. Unfortunately it exists.


                      >
                      >
                      > LeaNder l.l.hahn@... wrote:
                      >
                      > -
                      > Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
                      > >
                      >
                      > I don't quite understand what this means? Could you give an example?
                      >
                      > Personally I simply ignore it when another mail suddenly disappears,thinking I must have clicked the wrong online or desktop button. My longer experience is that working under stress produces these things almost automatically. And my biggest problem is that I usually try to do several things at once. This means I do not always pay the close atttentions every single would deserve. Not that I would not like to have a program that would let me check what exactly happened in hindsight. ...
                      >
                      > That said; I do not know the the people and how they function, so maybe they deserve the benefit of doubt. BUT this is admittedly a story were I wonder if certain basical "pre judgements" are necessary to lean to the other side. ...
                      >
                      > There is a certain air of spectaculum about the whole thing that makes me wonder if it closer to reality or fiction. Although to complicate things: sometimes fiction turns into reality and reality into fiction.
                      >
                      > Tthus I write this with all due respect to your hesitant: "Maybe, maybe..."
                      >
                    • Sean McBride
                      I would of course make no assertion about the ADL or any other subject that wasn t true. :) I research and double fact check before I assert anything, as a
                      Message 10 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I would of course make no assertion about the ADL or any other subject that wasn't true. :)  I research and double fact check before I assert anything, as a matter of pride and ego.  That the ADL engaged in large-scale illegal spying on Americans is a matter of the mainstream public record -- Google it.
                         
                        There is evidence to suggest that the ADL is working to build a large-scale surveillance network in tandem with local police departments, JINSA, SPLC, DHS, Mossad, free-lance sayanim and other parties to be targeted at "anti-Semites" -- that is, anyone who disagrees with the ADL, the Israel lobby or the Israeli government.  Would some members of Google cooperate with this project?  Well, that's the question on the table.  I think probably.  Actually, I think definitely, without a doubt, based on encounters with the kind of personality type that feels impelled to get involved in such things from motives of ethno-religious patriotism and zealotry.  There is a distinct cult dynamic at work here which leads to extreme forms of behavior, sometimes crossing the line into criminal behavior conducted with the utmost self-righteousness and conviction of divine mission.  This is the kind of fanaticism which propelled the Bush 43 administration into the Iraq War and produced the atrocities at Abu Ghraib.


                        LeaNder <l.l.hahn@...> wrote:

                        Sean: 
                        With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                        >
                        > http://www.google. com/search? q=Jew 
                        >
                        > You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                        >
                        > "We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here."

                        LeaNder: I don't get a note/explanation on top of the search if I follow your link. I do not get explanations on top  if I google "Jew" on Google Germany. The only difference is that  over here  two (2 see note on the bottom of the page) links are censored maybe its Jew Watch

                        http://www.google. de/search? hl=de&q=jew&btnG=Suche&meta=

                        Instead we have a link analyzing the Jew Watch issue: Jew Watch, Google and Search Engine optimization  (see link below) high up on the Google.de Search. The explanation came up link no. 4 and the the investigation of the issue on link  no 9.  Is it still there??

                        http://sethf. com/anticensorwa re/google/ jew-watch. p
                        >
                        Sean:  Then read the explanation here:
                        >
                        > http://www.google. com/explanation. html 
                        >
                        > Question: is Google a universal search engine or is it an ethnocentric search engine? Why does no other ethnic or religious group receive this kind of special treatment from Google? Do Sergey Brin and Larry Page have a special interest in this issue? Is this why Google weirdly tried to censor material on Google Video proving that the BBC announced the collapse of WTC7 a half hour before it actually fell?
                         
                        LeaNder: On first sight  it seems the reasons were neither our German/European laws, nor Larry Page's sensitivity but it was triggered by a Steven Weinstock [Weinstock = grapevine]  I can see the problem with an exception to the rule that opens the road for larger censorship ...  As a German I would prefer a different subject at the core of the whole censorship debate . Can you understand?? ?
                        >
                        Sean:  Notice the URL for the "explanation" : clearly it's the only "breaking of the frame" of its type on Google search. It's THE explanation, the only one.

                        LeaNder: Its a very special part of Western history.  But yes, I agree that it is somehow irritating that demands for censorship mainly seem to lead back to this core lately.  But I haven't paid enough attention to the subject. And attention it would deserve. So this may be a superficial impression, too.

                        Can censorship ever be the solution? Will it lead to an ever expanding framework of censorships from this core? ...  I don't know.
                        >
                        Sean: 
                        Also note that the explanation cites the ADL as an authority. That's interesting, dear Google: the ADL has a proven track record of engaging in large-scale illegal spying on Americans, and is widely (and reasonably) suspected of coordinating its activities with Mossad. You can look it up on Google.

                        LeaNder: OK: when you mentioned the story about ADL first, I couldn't imagine for a second that anybody  but an antisemite would ever write something like this.  I admittedly was surprised, when I discovered some of the things you mentioned were correct. But I wouldn't know how to evaluate them. Spying on Americans, yes but I simply do not know enough about the case, or the Mark Rich story, or anything else? ...

                        You did forward to your Google Reader a strong criticism of Foxman by a  ADL Chicago chapter member not long ago?  You see I pay attention to the issue ...

                        And I have to admit that a survey by ADL on European antisemitism once made me slightly angry. It had a very peculiar design considering the state of art in this field. It were only about 10 questions, basically the most common antisemitic prejudices were tested.  But then, there seem to be people that honestly believe these things. Who would know better than a German?.
                         
                        Sean: Google needs to be as pure as the driven snow on these matters because of the enormous power it wields, and because of the potential for the abuse of that power. It needs to create the impression of absolute impartiality with regard to controversial political issues. It has already failed in this regard and displayed an evident bias. That is the kind of mistake one never really recovers from -- the seeds of suspicion have been planted by Google itself.

                        LeaNder:
                        Ideally, yes. Ideally google should apply a set of algorithms and than leave the search alone. But ideally there shouldn't be antisemitism either. Unfortunately it exists.


                        >
                        >
                        > LeaNder l.l.hahn@... wrote:
                        >
                        > -
                        > Google also (and weirdly) provides intrusive editorial commentary on searches which ruffle the feathers of a certain lobby.
                        > >
                        >
                        > I don't quite understand what this means? Could you give an example?
                        >
                        > Personally I simply ignore it when another mail suddenly disappears,thinking I must have clicked the wrong online or desktop button. My longer experience is that working under stress produces these things almost automatically. And my biggest problem is that I usually try to do several things at once. This means I do not always pay the close atttentions every single would deserve. Not that I would not like to have a program that would let me check what exactly happened in hindsight. ...
                        >
                        > That said; I do not know the the people and how they function, so maybe they deserve the benefit of doubt. BUT this is admittedly a story were I wonder if certain basical "pre judgements" are necessary to lean to the other side. ...
                        >
                        > There is a certain air of spectaculum about the whole thing that makes me wonder if it closer to reality or fiction. Although to complicate things: sometimes fiction turns into reality and reality into fiction.
                        >
                        > Tthus I write this with all due respect to your hesitant: "Maybe, maybe..."
                        >

                      • Bond
                        On Australian Google, that search query [ http://www.google.com.au/search?q=Jew ] returns this at top of results: Offensive Search Results
                        Message 11 of 19 , Apr 6, 2007
                        • 0 Attachment
                          On Australian Google, that search query [ http://www.google.com.au/search?q=Jew ] returns this at top of results:
                           
                          Offensive Search Results
                          www.google.com/explanation      We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here.
                           
                          ..and this at bottom:
                           
                          In response to a legal request submitted to Google, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may read more about the request at ChillingEffects.org.
                           
                          ----- Original Message -----
                          From: LeaNder
                          Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 7:55 AM
                          Subject: [political-research] Re: Mossad Hacking/Infiltration/Control of Google?


                          Sean: 
                          With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                          >
                          > http://www.google.com/search?q=Jew 
                          >
                          > You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                          >
                          > "We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here."

                          LeaNder: I don't get a note/explanation on top of the search if I follow your link. I do not get explanations on top  if I google "Jew" on Google Germany. The only difference is that  over here  two (2 see note on the bottom of the page) links are censored maybe its Jew Watch

                          http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=jew&btnG=Suche&meta=

                          Instead we have a link analyzing the Jew Watch issue: Jew Watch, Google and Search Engine optimization  (see link below) high up on the Google.de Search. The explanation came up link no. 4 and the the investigation of the issue on link  no 9.  Is it still there??

                          http://sethf.com/anticensorware/google/jew-watch.p
                        • LeaNder
                          Again, I do not get the message if I follow your link to the Australian Google portal. Anyway this is the first site that helped me see your Offensive Search
                          Message 12 of 19 , Apr 7, 2007
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Again, I do not get the message if I follow your link to the Australian Google portal.

                            Anyway this is the  first site that helped me see your "Offensive Search Results" link on top  - on google:
                            http://www.gahooyoogle.com/search.php?st=Web&q=Jew

                            But when I tried to check the link via the preview button here on yahoo again, it was moved from top of the search results to the top sponsored links on the right hand.

                            What somehow puzzles me much more is that Ford's International Jew is among the first ten links here in Germany via Australia. Shouldn't this be censored according to our laws?:

                            www.biblebelievers.org.au/intern_jew.htm 

                            Can't find a link off the main site:
                            http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/ 


                            I don't know how it works technically, but Jew Watch is easily accessible for me via google.com, So on one hand Jew Watch censored on Google if you search Jew, but if you search Jew Watch you can access it really easy via Wikipedia's external  link,  access a special "censor free"  [= zensurfrei) version for us here, or simply type www.jewwatch.com into your browser and it opens up immediately without the slightest problems. So no doubt Germany's handling of the law is rather confusing,

                            Which may well mirror the problems with the larger topic. I guess nobody over here would really want to hinder research in the topic ...  and if you realize this things get rather difficult.

                            To make things even more confusing if you follow the links in the article:  Jew Watch, Google, and Search Engine Optimization among the first links over here you are also presented with a  cached version of Jew Watch, and not even the special censor-free" (=zensurfrei) German version under http://www.zensurfrei.com/jew-watch/ 

                            Hmmm???? I'll take a closer look at that: http://sethf.com/anticensorware/ 





                            >
                            > On Australian Google, that search query [ http://www.google.com.au/search?q=Jew ] returns this at top of results:
                            >
                            > Offensive Search Results
                            > www.google.com/explanation We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here.
                            >
                            > ..and this at bottom:
                            >
                            > In response to a legal request submitted to Google, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may read more about the request at ChillingEffects.org.
                            >
                            > ----- Original Message -----
                            > From: LeaNder
                            > To: political-research@yahoogroups.com
                            > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 7:55 AM
                            > Subject: [political-research] Re: Mossad Hacking/Infiltration/Control of Google?
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Sean: With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                            > >
                            > > http://www.google.com/search?q=Jew  
                            > >
                            > > You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                            > >
                            > > "We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here."
                            >
                            > LeaNder: I don't get a note/explanation on top of the search if I follow your link. I do not get explanations on top if I google "Jew" on Google Germany. The only difference is that over here two (2 see note on the bottom of the page) links are censored maybe its Jew Watch
                            http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=jew&btnG=Suche&meta=  
                            >
                            > Instead we have a link analyzing the Jew Watch issue: Jew Watch, Google and Search Engine optimization (see link below) high up on the Google.de Search. The explanation came up link no. 4 and the the investigation of the issue on link no 9. Is it still there??
                            >
                            > http://sethf.com/anticensorware/google/jew-watch.php
                            >
                          • Sean McBride
                            Does Google plan to edit, rig, manipulate and censor its search results for every group on the planet that demands special treatment? Not bloody likely. As
                            Message 13 of 19 , Apr 7, 2007
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Does Google plan to edit, rig, manipulate and censor its search results for every group on the planet that demands special treatment?  Not bloody likely.  As far as I know, this is the only time that Google has intervened to frame the search results for its American audience for a particular group.  It sets a terrible precedent and raises questions about Google's agenda and operations all across the board.
                               
                              It would be interesting to see the complete list of Google employees who have access to Gmail accounts and other private Google data.  Ditto for Yahoo, Amazon, AOL, T-Mobile, Verizon, AT&T, etc. and all their private data.  Buried in those lists are quite likely the names of agents for special interests and governments.  The possibilities and opportunities for misusing and abusing this sensitive information for data mining and black ops are endless.  It's amazing that there isn't more public discussion about this elephant in the living room.


                              LeaNder <l.l.hahn@...> wrote:
                              Again, I do not get the message if I follow your link to the Australian Google portal.

                              Anyway this is the  first site that helped me see your "Offensive Search Results" link on top  - on google:
                              http://www.gahooyoo gle.com/search. php?st=Web&q=Jew

                              But when I tried to check the link via the preview button here on yahoo again, it was moved from top of the search results to the top sponsored links on the right hand.

                              What somehow puzzles me much more is that Ford's International Jew is among the first ten links here in Germany via Australia. Shouldn't this be censored according to our laws?:

                              www.biblebelievers. org.au/intern_ jew.htm 

                              Can't find a link off the main site:
                              http://www.biblebel ievers.org. au/ 


                              I don't know how it works technically, but Jew Watch is easily accessible for me via google.com, So on one hand Jew Watch censored on Google if you search Jew, but if you search Jew Watch you can access it really easy via Wikipedia's external  link,  access a special "censor free"  [= zensurfrei) version for us here, or simply type www.jewwatch. com into your browser and it opens up immediately without the slightest problems. So no doubt Germany's handling of the law is rather confusing,

                              Which may well mirror the problems with the larger topic. I guess nobody over here would really want to hinder research in the topic ...  and if you realize this things get rather difficult.

                              To make things even more confusing if you follow the links in the article:  Jew Watch, Google, and Search Engine Optimization among the first links over here you are also presented with a  cached version of Jew Watch, and not even the special censor-free" (=zensurfrei) German version under http://www.zensurfr ei.com/jew- watch/ 

                              Hmmm???? I'll take a closer look at that: http://sethf. com/anticensorwa re/ 





                              >
                              > On Australian Google, that search query [ http://www.google. com.au/search? q=Jew ] returns this at top of results:
                              >
                              > Offensive Search Results
                              > www.google.com/ explanation We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here.
                              >
                              > ..and this at bottom:
                              >
                              > In response to a legal request submitted to Google, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may read more about the request at ChillingEffects. org.
                              >
                              > ----- Original Message -----
                              > From: LeaNder
                              > To: political-research@ yahoogroups. com
                              > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 7:55 AM
                              > Subject: [political-research ] Re: Mossad Hacking/Infiltratio n/Control of Google?
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Sean: With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                              > >
                              > > http://www.google. com/search? q=Jew  
                              > >
                              > > You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                              > >
                              > > "We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here."
                              >
                              > LeaNder: I don't get a note/explanation on top of the search if I follow your link. I do not get explanations on top if I google "Jew" on Google Germany. The only difference is that over here two (2 see note on the bottom of the page) links are censored maybe its Jew Watch
                              http://www.google. de/search? hl=de&q=jew&btnG=Suche&meta=  
                              >
                              > Instead we have a link analyzing the Jew Watch issue: Jew Watch, Google and Search Engine optimization (see link below) high up on the Google.de Search. The explanation came up link no. 4 and the the investigation of the issue on link no 9. Is it still there??
                              >
                              > http://sethf. com/anticensorwa re/google/ jew-watch. php
                              >

                            • LeaNder
                              To borrow Bond s expression: I hear you. Maybe I miss the necessary sensibility or paranoia for this topic. But I am simply not convinced if Google did not
                              Message 14 of 19 , Apr 7, 2007
                              • 0 Attachment
                                To   borrow Bond's expression: I hear you. Maybe I miss the necessary sensibility or paranoia for this topic. But I am simply not convinced  if Google did not get caught between the fronts on this issue. A ccording to a report from 2004 on Telepolis Online over here Google at  first did not want to change things and interfere when accused of antisemitism and Weinstock who initiated a series of google bombing to get different sides up meanwhile realized this is not a way to deal with the subject.

                                Can you imagine the attack crowd spamming Google for supposed antisemitism? I can.




                                >
                                > Does Google plan to edit, rig, manipulate and censor its search results for every group on the planet that demands special treatment? Not bloody likely. As far as I know, this is the only time that Google has intervened to frame the search results for its American audience for a particular group. It sets a terrible precedent and raises questions about Google's agenda and operations all across the board.
                                >
                                > It would be interesting to see the complete list of Google employees who have access to Gmail accounts and other private Google data. Ditto for Yahoo, Amazon, AOL, T-Mobile, Verizon, AT&T, etc. and all their private data. Buried in those lists are quite likely the names of agents for special interests and governments. The possibilities and opportunities for misusing and abusing this sensitive information for data mining and black ops are endless. It's amazing that there isn't more public discussion about this elephant in the living room.
                                >
                                >
                                > LeaNder l.l.hahn@... wrote:
                                > Again, I do not get the message if I follow your link to the Australian Google portal.
                                >
                                > Anyway this is the first site that helped me see your "Offensive Search Results" link on top - on google:
                                > http://www.gahooyoogle.com/search.php?st=Web&q=Jew
                                >
                                > But when I tried to check the link via the preview button here on yahoo again, it was moved from top of the search results to the top sponsored links on the right hand.
                                >
                                > What somehow puzzles me much more is that Ford's International Jew is among the first ten links here in Germany via Australia. Shouldn't this be censored according to our laws?:
                                >
                                > www.biblebelievers.org.au/intern_jew.htm
                                >
                                > Can't find a link off the main site:
                                > http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/
                                >
                                > I don't know how it works technically, but Jew Watch is easily accessible for me via google.com, So on one hand Jew Watch censored on Google if you search Jew, but if you search Jew Watch you can access it really easy via Wikipedia's external link, access a special "censor free" [= zensurfrei) version for us here, or simply type www.jewwatch.com into your browser and it opens up immediately without the slightest problems. So no doubt Germany's handling of the law is rather confusing,
                                >
                                > Which may well mirror the problems with the larger topic. I guess nobody over here would really want to hinder research in the topic ... and if you realize this things get rather difficult.
                                >
                                > To make things even more confusing if you follow the links in the article: Jew Watch, Google, and Search Engine Optimization among the first links over here you are also presented with a cached version of Jew Watch, and not even the special censor-free" (=zensurfrei) German version under http://www.zensurfrei.com/jew-watch/
                                >
                                > Hmmm???? I'll take a closer look at that: http://sethf.com/anticensorware/
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > >
                                > > On Australian Google, that search query [ http://www.google.com.au/search?q=Jew ] returns this at top of results:
                                > >
                                > > Offensive Search Results
                                > > www.google.com/explanation We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here.
                                > >
                                > > ..and this at bottom:
                                > >
                                > > In response to a legal request submitted to Google, we have removed 1 result(s) from this page. If you wish, you may read more about the request at ChillingEffects.org.
                                > >
                                > > ----- Original Message -----
                                > > From: LeaNder
                                > > To: political-research@yahoogroups.com
                                > > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 7:55 AM
                                > > Subject: [political-research] Re: Mossad Hacking/Infiltration/Control of Google?
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > Sean: With regard to the intrusive explanation, try this search on Google:
                                > > >
                                > > > http://www.google.com/search?q=Jew
                                > > >
                                > > > You will see the following explanation at the top of the search:
                                > > >
                                > > > "We're disturbed about these results as well. Please read our note here."
                                > >
                                > > LeaNder: I don't get a note/explanation on top of the search if I follow your link. I do not get explanations on top if I google "Jew" on Google Germany. The only difference is that over here two (2 see note on the bottom of the page) links are censored maybe its Jew Watch
                                > > http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=jew&btnG=Suche&meta=
                                > >
                                > > Instead we have a link analyzing the Jew Watch issue: Jew Watch, Google and Search Engine optimization (see link below) high up on the Google.de Search. The explanation came up link no. 4 and the the investigation of the issue on link no 9. Is it still there??
                                > >
                                > > http://sethf.com/anticensorware/google/jew-watch.php
                                > >
                                >
                              • LeaNder
                                Yes I can imagine all these things, its all a matter of what price is paid. gone for today ... results for every group on the planet that demands special
                                Message 15 of 19 , Apr 7, 2007
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Yes I can imagine all these things, its all a matter of what price is
                                  paid.

                                  gone for today

                                  > Does Google plan to edit, rig, manipulate and censor its search
                                  results for every group on the planet that demands special treatment?
                                  Not bloody likely. As far as I know, this is the only time that
                                  Google has intervened to frame the search results for its American
                                  audience for a particular group. It sets a terrible precedent and
                                  raises questions about Google's agenda and operations all across the
                                  board.
                                  >
                                  > It would be interesting to see the complete list of Google
                                  employees who have access to Gmail accounts and other private Google
                                  data. Ditto for Yahoo, Amazon, AOL, T-Mobile, Verizon, AT&T, etc. and
                                  all their private data. Buried in those lists are quite likely the
                                  names of agents for special interests and governments. The
                                  possibilities and opportunities for misusing and abusing this
                                  sensitive information for data mining and black ops are endless. It's
                                  amazing that there isn't more public discussion about this elephant in
                                  the living room.
                                  >
                                • LeaNder
                                  ... paid. gone for today May I add today, Sean. The problem I have with the larger imagery of the Mossad-Controls-all : its much to close to the infamous
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Apr 8, 2007
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                                    >
                                    > Yes I can imagine all these things, its all a matter of what price is paid. gone for today

                                    May I add today, Sean. The problem I have with the larger imagery of the "Mossad-Controls-all": its much to close to the infamous Protocol fiction for my taste. How could they? Much of the critique of the neocons seems to blur  into a mental space that I have problems with.

                                    slightly off on a link on your Reader I found this:
                                    http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/archives/cat_dictatorship.html#062346 

                                    <quote> Germany prosecuted more than 17,000 thought crimes last year

                                    MORE seriously, the German Government has quietly admitted that over the last twelve months it prosecuted over 18,000 Germans for offences of "right-wing extremism," of which only a few hundred involved actual violence: i.e. they prosecuted over seventeen thousand thought-crimes -- people unwitting displaying the old swastika emblem, or even worse, National Socialist ideas, and perhaps even "denying the H." <quote end>

                                    It admittedly frightens me to watch people get into the trap of these propagandists. Don't ever believe Fraeulein  Sylvia Stolz - as David Irving - wants you to believe, is a martyr. I have not much sympathy for a lawyer who signs a letter to the court with  Heil Hitler and with the letterhead beneath the empires flag saying:  "Geschaeftsf├╝hrer ohne Auftrag fuer das deutsche Reich" = Executive Secretary without Appointment for the German Empire"

                                    We can debate if this is a sign of madness or simple stupidity. You simply have to accept that the majority of us Germans can't tolerate anybody that basically tries to tell people: The Nazis were right. Let's start the horror over again. Zuendel is a stupid sick old antisemite. Nothing else.

                                    The only context in which I can tolerate these things is in comedy, satire or in a political cabaret but not really from someone you might work with people that want to bring back the whole horror, or train young killers that set emigrant homes or synagogues on fire.



                                    --- In political-research@yahoogroups.com, "LeaNder" <l.l.hahn@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Yes I can imagine all these things, its all a matter of what price is
                                    > paid.
                                    >
                                    > gone for today
                                    >
                                    > > Does Google plan to edit, rig, manipulate and censor its search
                                    > results for every group on the planet that demands special treatment?
                                    > Not bloody likely. As far as I know, this is the only time that
                                    > Google has intervened to frame the search results for its American
                                    > audience for a particular group. It sets a terrible precedent and
                                    > raises questions about Google's agenda and operations all across the
                                    > board.
                                    > >
                                    > > It would be interesting to see the complete list of Google
                                    > employees who have access to Gmail accounts and other private Google
                                    > data. Ditto for Yahoo, Amazon, AOL, T-Mobile, Verizon, AT&T, etc. and
                                    > all their private data. Buried in those lists are quite likely the
                                    > names of agents for special interests and governments. The
                                    > possibilities and opportunities for misusing and abusing this
                                    > sensitive information for data mining and black ops are endless. It's
                                    > amazing that there isn't more public discussion about this elephant in
                                    > the living room.
                                    > >
                                    >
                                  • Sean McBride
                                    Two quick points: 1. Mossad itself, and many pro-Israel activists and militants, often brag that Mossad is the best intelligence service in the world. Do
                                    Message 17 of 19 , Apr 8, 2007
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                                      Two quick points:
                                       
                                      1. Mossad itself, and many pro-Israel activists and militants, often brag that Mossad is the "best" intelligence service in the world.  Do you understand what "best" means?  Among other things, "best" means that Mossad is highly aggressive and effective in violating the privacy rights of human beings all around the world and in using private information to run black ops against political opponents.  Many pro-Israel activists and militants, with access to sensitive information in government agencies and private corporations in many nations, are always happy to help out Mossad for free.
                                       
                                      2. Nothing is more Nazilike than the suppression of free speech and opposing points of view.  The best way to counter hate speech is with reasoned speech, with truth speech.  Self-appointed censors invariably turn into Nazis, Stalinists and Maoists -- it's an ironclad law of human nature and human history.  I am not afraid of hate speech.  Dealing with practitioners of hate speech is like shooting fish in a barrel -- just calmly answer their misinformation with the well-documented truth.  Have the anti-free speech anti-Nazis completely forgotten that the Nazis were enemies of free speech?  It is a slippery slope from depriving people of their free speech rights to depriving them of their lives.  All totalitarian despots throughout world history have begun their careers with an assault on free speech.


                                      LeaNder <l.l.hahn@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Yes I can imagine all these things, its all a matter of what price is paid. gone for today

                                      May I add today, Sean. The problem I have with the larger imagery of the "Mossad-Controls- all": its much to close to the infamous Protocol fiction for my taste. How could they? Much of the critique of the neocons seems to blur  into a mental space that I have problems with.

                                      slightly off on a link on your Reader I found this:
                                      http://www.whatreal lyhappened. com/archives/ cat_dictatorship .html#062346 

                                      <quote> Germany prosecuted more than 17,000 thought crimes last year

                                      MORE seriously, the German Government has quietly admitted that over the last twelve months it prosecuted over 18,000 Germans for offences of "right-wing extremism," of which only a few hundred involved actual violence: i.e. they prosecuted over seventeen thousand thought-crimes -- people unwitting displaying the old swastika emblem, or even worse, National Socialist ideas, and perhaps even "denying the H." <quote end>

                                      It admittedly frightens me to watch people get into the trap of these propagandists. Don't ever believe Fraeulein  Sylvia Stolz - as David Irving - wants you to believe, is a martyr. I have not much sympathy for a lawyer who signs a letter to the court with  Heil Hitler and with the letterhead beneath the empires flag saying:  "Geschaeftsf├╝ hrer ohne Auftrag fuer das deutsche Reich" = Executive Secretary without Appointment for the German Empire"

                                      We can debate if this is a sign of madness or simple stupidity. You simply have to accept that the majority of us Germans can't tolerate anybody that basically tries to tell people: The Nazis were right. Let's start the horror over again. Zuendel is a stupid sick old antisemite. Nothing else.

                                      The only context in which I can tolerate these things is in comedy, satire or in a political cabaret but not really from someone you might work with people that want to bring back the whole horror, or train young killers that set emigrant homes or synagogues on fire.



                                      --- In political-research@ yahoogroups. com, "LeaNder" <l.l.hahn@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Yes I can imagine all these things, its all a matter of what price is
                                      > paid.
                                      >
                                      > gone for today
                                      >
                                      > > Does Google plan to edit, rig, manipulate and censor its search
                                      > results for every group on the planet that demands special treatment?
                                      > Not bloody likely. As far as I know, this is the only time that
                                      > Google has intervened to frame the search results for its American
                                      > audience for a particular group. It sets a terrible precedent and
                                      > raises questions about Google's agenda and operations all across the
                                      > board.
                                      > >
                                      > > It would be interesting to see the complete list of Google
                                      > employees who have access to Gmail accounts and other private Google
                                      > data. Ditto for Yahoo, Amazon, AOL, T-Mobile, Verizon, AT&T, etc. and
                                      > all their private data. Buried in those lists are quite likely the
                                      > names of agents for special interests and governments. The
                                      > possibilities and opportunities for misusing and abusing this
                                      > sensitive information for data mining and black ops are endless. It's
                                      > amazing that there isn't more public discussion about this elephant in
                                      > the living room.
                                      > >
                                      >

                                    • Rosalee Grable
                                      Brave words from a guy who banned No Planers just like the censorous Loose Change Hangout did. http://killtown.blogspot.com http://811movement.com There s
                                      Message 18 of 19 , Apr 8, 2007
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                                        Brave words from a guy who banned No Planers just like the censorous
                                        Loose Change Hangout did.
                                        http://killtown.blogspot.com
                                        http://811movement.com

                                        There's still no plane in the first hit footage, and the second hit is
                                        still cartoons.
                                        Watch Mr. McBride play coverup man just like the censorous despots he
                                        decries.

                                        Sean McBride wrote:

                                        > 2. Nothing is more Nazilike than the suppression of free speech and
                                        > opposing points of view. The best way to counter hate speech is with
                                        > reasoned speech, with truth speech. Self-appointed censors invariably
                                        > turn into Nazis, Stalinists and Maoists -- it's an ironclad law of
                                        > human nature and human history. I am not afraid of hate speech.
                                        > Dealing with practitioners of hate speech is like shooting fish in a
                                        > barrel -- just calmly answer their misinformation with the
                                        > well-documented truth. Have the anti-free speech anti-Nazis
                                        > completely forgotten that the Nazis were enemies of free speech? It
                                        > is a slippery slope from depriving people of their free speech rights
                                        > to depriving them of their lives. All totalitarian despots throughout
                                        > world history have begun their careers with an assault on free speech.
                                      • Sean McBride
                                        1. Private publications are under no obligation to publish everything that is sent their way. Freedom of speech means that private publishers can choose
                                        Message 19 of 19 , Apr 8, 2007
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                                          1. Private publications are under no obligation to publish everything that is sent their way.  Freedom of speech means that private publishers can choose whatever they choose to publish, without coercion from the state or any other interests.  The New York Times, for instance, is under no obligation to publish every essay that David Duke submits to them.  Declining to publish such essays is not an act of censorship.  It is an act of editorial judgement freely exercised by a publisher.  Google is an entirely different matter: it is a (supposedly) universal information service.  Free speech means that any private publisher can publish whatever it chooses.  Universal information services in the public space should be required to provide access to all these publications.  Otherwise Google has the potential to evolve into the most evil dictatorial entity ever to afflict the human race.
                                           
                                          2. I provided more tolerance and leeway for the expression of theories by the no-planers than almost anyone else I can think of.  My patience ran out when the no-planers started to engage in vicious attacks on everyone who disagreed with them and gave the appearance of being on a mission to destroy the 9/11 Truth Movement.  Either the no-planers are agents provocateurs or they are clinically deranged.  *Even if they are right* (highly unlikely), they have chosen the wrong methods to try to make their case.  David Ray Griffin and Robert Bowman have been far more effective in reaching the public and creating momentum for a new investigation of 9/11 than the no-planers.


                                          Rosalee Grable <webfairy@...> wrote:
                                          Brave words from a guy who banned No Planers just like the censorous
                                          Loose Change Hangout did.
                                          http://killtown. blogspot. com
                                          http://811movement. com

                                          There's still no plane in the first hit footage, and the second hit is
                                          still cartoons.
                                          Watch Mr. McBride play coverup man just like the censorous despots he
                                          decries.

                                          Sean McBride wrote:

                                          > 2. Nothing is more Nazilike than the suppression of free speech and
                                          > opposing points of view. The best way to counter hate speech is with
                                          > reasoned speech, with truth speech. Self-appointed censors invariably
                                          > turn into Nazis, Stalinists and Maoists -- it's an ironclad law of
                                          > human nature and human history. I am not afraid of hate speech.
                                          > Dealing with practitioners of hate speech is like shooting fish in a
                                          > barrel -- just calmly answer their misinformation with the
                                          > well-documented truth. Have the anti-free speech anti-Nazis
                                          > completely forgotten that the Nazis were enemies of free speech? It
                                          > is a slippery slope from depriving people of their free speech rights
                                          > to depriving them of their lives. All totalitarian despots throughout
                                          > world history have begun their careers with an assault on free speech.


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