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Re: [podcasters] Podspew

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  • Stephen Eley
    ... Curious, I checked it out. Was amused to see that Escape Pod is also featured on their front page. (And no, I d never heard of it either.) I did click
    Message 1 of 11 , Sep 28 7:34 PM
      On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 9:13 PM, Rick Savoia <rick@...> wrote:
      > I stumbled across this site tonight while doing a Google search on my
      > show, The Force Field. Apparently it converts downloadable mp3 files
      > into streams in .M3U.

      Curious, I checked it out. Was amused to see that Escape Pod is also
      featured on their front page. (And no, I'd never heard of it either.)

      I did click through, and determined that their service is:

      A.) Useless. They're making this sound like some sort of complex
      "conversion" process, but an M3U playlist file is really just a text
      file with all the locations of the media files you want to play.
      (URLs in this case.) So my M3U file generated by them looks like:

      http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP177_Usurpers.mp3
      http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP176_HowTheWorldBecameQuiet.mp3
      http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP175_Reparations.mp3
      http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP174_PrivateDetectiveMolly.mp3
      http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP173_RobotsDontCry.mp3
      [...]

      ...Those are just all the URLs from my podcast feed. Brilliant.
      Anybody could make one of these in thirty seconds, if they wanted one.
      But there's not much point in it, because every media player program
      out there will let you do this already with a nice graphical
      interface. Who needs this?


      B.) Broken. The file it gave me to download didn't even have an .m3u
      extension, it had a .php extension. Basic stupid coding error. But
      makes it harder to use if somebody DID want one of these files.


      C.) Misleading. There's no "streaming" involved here. This is just a
      playlist file. You could pass it to a Flash player or something if
      you wanted to, but that's not really streaming either. And they don't
      even have such a Flash player on their site. Lazy, lazy.


      As for their listing my content... *shrug* It's just another bad
      podcast directory. I release on a Creative Commons license, so
      anybody who wants to can do this sort of thing. It doesn't hurt me if
      they do it. Heck, somebody someday might even use this site to search
      for a podcast, and find mine. It doesn't seem *likely*, but why
      should I stand in their way?

      (Oh, and... D.) Horrible, horrible name.)


      --
      Have Fun,
      Steve Eley (sfeley@...)
      ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
      http://www.escapepod.org
    • the Encaffeinated ONE
      These sorts of copiers are all over the place; I ve noted my blog and several others copied and dumped unceremoniously into someone else s page. It s
      Message 2 of 11 , Sep 29 7:28 AM
        These sorts of copiers are all over the place; I've noted my blog and
        several others copied and dumped unceremoniously into someone else's page.
        It's unfortunate, but the openness of the web easily allows such a thing,
        and doesn't really give much hope to stopping it -- short of every page
        being an *image* of text and not text itself. (But then, your image is
        taken..)

        I've thought about trying to get real clever and write a Javascript/AJAX
        thingee (technical term) that would download the contents on demand, or
        scream loudly about SCAMMER!/SPAMMER! if the site was in the wrong place.
        Not technically that hard -- although integrating it with Wordpress might be
        a little tricky for me.

        Still, if a clever coder out there can make this happen, I'd be pleased. It
        irks me a bit that people might find my stuff via search and the ad revenue
        go to them rather than me, but that's the way it goes.

        encaf1/MK

        "An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made, in a
        narrow field." - Niels Bohr
        the Encaffeinated ONE <http://encaffeinated.ca>
        Host of THE WEIRD SHOW <http://theweirdshow.com>
        Crew on The 9th HeroesCAST <http://www.heroescast.com>

        Spoken Word Coordinator, Host on CHSR FM 97.9 <http://chsrfm.ca>
        Production Manager, Giant Gnome Productions
        (Junior) Member, Darker Projects, <http://darkerprojects.com>Pendant Audio
        Productions <http://pendantaudio.com>, Broken Sea Audio<http://brokensea.com>
        *the Encaffeinated ONE*: Amateur Voice Actor, Podcaster, Amateur Writer
        Wannabe, SF/F Fan, UNIX wizard, Geek.


        On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 11:34 PM, Stephen Eley <SFEley@...> wrote:

        > On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 9:13 PM, Rick Savoia <rick@...<rick%40theforcefield.net>>
        > wrote:
        > > I stumbled across this site tonight while doing a Google search on my
        > > show, The Force Field. Apparently it converts downloadable mp3 files
        > > into streams in .M3U.
        >
        > Curious, I checked it out. Was amused to see that Escape Pod is also
        > featured on their front page. (And no, I'd never heard of it either.)
        >
        > I did click through, and determined that their service is:
        >
        > A.) Useless. They're making this sound like some sort of complex
        > "conversion" process, but an M3U playlist file is really just a text
        > file with all the locations of the media files you want to play.
        > (URLs in this case.) So my M3U file generated by them looks like:
        >
        >
        > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP177_Usurpers.mp3
        >
        > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP176_HowTheWorldBecameQuiet.mp3
        >
        > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP175_Reparations.mp3
        >
        > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP174_PrivateDetectiveMolly.mp3
        >
        > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP173_RobotsDontCry.mp3
        > [...]
        >
        > ...Those are just all the URLs from my podcast feed. Brilliant.
        > Anybody could make one of these in thirty seconds, if they wanted one.
        > But there's not much point in it, because every media player program
        > out there will let you do this already with a nice graphical
        > interface. Who needs this?
        >
        > B.) Broken. The file it gave me to download didn't even have an .m3u
        > extension, it had a .php extension. Basic stupid coding error. But
        > makes it harder to use if somebody DID want one of these files.
        >
        > C.) Misleading. There's no "streaming" involved here. This is just a
        > playlist file. You could pass it to a Flash player or something if
        > you wanted to, but that's not really streaming either. And they don't
        > even have such a Flash player on their site. Lazy, lazy.
        >
        > As for their listing my content... *shrug* It's just another bad
        > podcast directory. I release on a Creative Commons license, so
        > anybody who wants to can do this sort of thing. It doesn't hurt me if
        > they do it. Heck, somebody someday might even use this site to search
        > for a podcast, and find mine. It doesn't seem *likely*, but why
        > should I stand in their way?
        >
        > (Oh, and... D.) Horrible, horrible name.)
        >
        > --
        > Have Fun,
        > Steve Eley (sfeley@... <sfeley%40gmail.com>)
        > ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
        > http://www.escapepod.org
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • andrew clarke
        ... #!/usr/bin/env python # list-enclosures.py # # A simple Python program to read an RSS 2.0 feed from standard input # and output a list of enclosure
        Message 3 of 11 , Sep 29 7:47 AM
          On Sun 2008-09-28 22:34:03 UTC-0400, Stephen Eley (SFEley@...) wrote:

          > On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 9:13 PM, Rick Savoia <rick@...> wrote:
          >
          > > I stumbled across this site tonight while doing a Google search on my
          > > show, The Force Field. Apparently it converts downloadable mp3 files
          > > into streams in .M3U.
          >
          > They're making this sound like some sort of complex "conversion"
          > process, but an M3U playlist file is really just a text file with all
          > the locations of the media files you want to play. (URLs in this
          > case.)

          #!/usr/bin/env python

          # list-enclosures.py
          #
          # A simple Python program to read an RSS 2.0 feed from standard input
          # and output a list of enclosure URLs.
          #
          # Usage: ./list-enclosures.py < input.rss > output.m3u
          #
          # Written in July 2007 by Andrew Clarke <mail@...>
          # and released to the public domain.

          import xml.parsers.expat, sys

          def start_element(name, attrs):
          if name == 'enclosure':
          print attrs['url']

          x = xml.parsers.expat.ParserCreate()
          x.StartElementHandler = start_element
          x.Parse(sys.stdin.read(), True)
        • Stephen Eley
          On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:28 AM, the Encaffeinated ONE ... You re talking about something else. Podspew.com didn t copy anyone s site or site content. They
          Message 4 of 11 , Sep 29 9:22 AM
            On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:28 AM, the Encaffeinated ONE
            <encaf1@...> wrote:
            > These sorts of copiers are all over the place; I've noted my blog and
            > several others copied and dumped unceremoniously into someone else's page.
            > It's unfortunate, but the openness of the web easily allows such a thing,
            > and doesn't really give much hope to stopping it -- short of every page
            > being an *image* of text and not text itself. (But then, your image is
            > taken..)

            You're talking about something else. Podspew.com didn't copy anyone's
            site or site content. They are redisplaying some feed info and
            creating a text file with the enclosure URLs from the feed.

            More to the point, why is it unfortunate? Unless they're stripping
            attribution from you, it all points back to you. Ineffectively, in an
            ugly manner, and for squalid reasons, they're helping to promote your
            stuff. This is bad? Do you release on Creative Commons, or do you
            prefer to keep people from redistributing the stuff you're giving away
            for free?


            > I've thought about trying to get real clever and write a Javascript/AJAX
            > thingee (technical term) that would download the contents on demand, or
            > scream loudly about SCAMMER!/SPAMMER! if the site was in the wrong place.
            > Not technically that hard -- although integrating it with Wordpress might be
            > a little tricky for me.

            Cute, but most of those Webfungus sites aren't scraping your Web site.
            They're reading your RSS feed. RSS feed agents aren't going to run
            any Javascript, they're just making straight HTTP get requests.
            Unless you're willing to destroy the utility of your RSS feed and only
            serve files to Web browsers (i.e., stop being a podcaster), you
            wouldn't fix anything this way.


            > Still, if a clever coder out there can make this happen, I'd be pleased. It
            > irks me a bit that people might find my stuff via search and the ad revenue
            > go to them rather than me, but that's the way it goes.

            How much ad revenue are you getting from your Web site right now? How
            much do you think _they'll_ get? You're not talking about real
            numbers here. The reason Webfungus grows to redistribute so much crap
            from so many places is because the business model is so bad, they
            _need_ thousands and thousands of sites to pull in any revenue at all.

            I'm not saying they're doing a fine and noble thing. I'm just
            suggesting that, as intellectual property infringement goes, Webfungus
            is more pathetic than dangerous.


            --
            Have Fun,
            Steve Eley (sfeley@...)
            ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
            http://www.escapepod.org
          • Stephen Eley
            ... Ha! I ll see your Python XML parser and raise you a Perl regex: #!/usr/bin/perl while ( ) {$_ =~ /
            Message 5 of 11 , Sep 29 9:44 AM
              On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 10:47 AM, andrew clarke <mail@...> wrote:
              >
              > #!/usr/bin/env python
              >
              > # list-enclosures.py
              > # A simple Python program to read an RSS 2.0 feed from standard input
              > # and output a list of enclosure URLs.

              Ha! I'll see your Python XML parser and raise you a Perl regex:

              #!/usr/bin/perl
              while (<>) {$_ =~ /<enclosure.*url=\"(.*?)\"/ && print "$1\n";}


              (Ordinarily these days I'd do this in Ruby, but Ruby doesn't have that
              <> shortcut for STDIN, so it would have been more characters.
              Otherwise it would have been almost the same.)

              --
              Have Fun,
              Steve Eley (sfeley@...)
              ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
              http://www.escapepod.org
            • the Encaffeinated ONE
              ... You re right, of course -- it s a different species of ugliness. Or maybe just a different sub-species under my general category of ECH . ;) ... Well, the
              Message 6 of 11 , Sep 29 11:04 AM
                On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Stephen Eley <SFEley@...> wrote:
                >
                > You're talking about something else. Podspew.com didn't copy anyone's
                > site or site content. They are redisplaying some feed info and
                > creating a text file with the enclosure URLs from the feed.

                You're right, of course -- it's a different species of ugliness. Or maybe
                just a different sub-species under my general category of "ECH". ;)

                > More to the point, why is it unfortunate? Unless they're stripping
                > attribution from you, it all points back to you. Ineffectively, in an
                > ugly manner, and for squalid reasons, they're helping to promote your
                > stuff. This is bad? Do you release on Creative Commons, or do you
                > prefer to keep people from redistributing the stuff you're giving away
                > for free?

                Well, the one's that I've seen strip all links and often even any sort of
                attribution. As for the RSS refeeders, I think it muddies the water when
                someone who is searching for things by me are redirected to a poorly-laid
                out or badly built site. The things is: they aren't really adding any value
                to what I'm doing, and any negative things about them might reflect poorly
                on them.

                I mean, if spam can have as great an effect as it does, there must be people
                gullible or misinformed enough to fall for it. The same thing applies to
                these feedleechers.

                Also, if *they* offer an RSS feed which is *not* mine, then I lose listener
                trackability, and that definitely can have an effect on my podcast. I'm not
                particularly obsessed with the numbers, but I like to have a handle on the
                general size. And for those who are looking to (arg!) "monetize" their
                stuff, they'll likely lose some evidence.

                I'm not saying that these are necessarily "evil", just "awful" and
                "detrimental".

                There are actual podcast directories that work this way, and sometimes they
                take the care to make things right. Those I don't mind, although if I choose
                to change my feed (as I am in the process of doing now) I can't update them
                and therefore lose some control over my feed. I don't really care about
                rebroadcasts, and I make sure to mention my URL in each episode, but I *do*
                want to maintain a certain level of control over the channel.

                > Cute, but most of those Webfungus sites aren't scraping your Web site.
                > They're reading your RSS feed. RSS feed agents aren't going to run
                > any Javascript, they're just making straight HTTP get requests.
                > Unless you're willing to destroy the utility of your RSS feed and only
                > serve files to Web browsers (i.e., stop being a podcaster), you
                > wouldn't fix anything this way.

                Well, if the RSS feed has full HTML text, you *can*, in fact, shove
                JavaScript into it, but I get your meaning. It feels a little like the
                futility of fighting SPAM: we can do some things to minimize the impact on
                our inbox, but we can't do much to stop the source. I admit, it's a danger
                of the "free frontier" that we also appreciate highly, the freedom comes at
                a price.

                > How much ad revenue are you getting from your Web site right now? How
                > much do you think _they'll_ get? You're not talking about real
                > numbers here. The reason Webfungus grows to redistribute so much crap
                > from so many places is because the business model is so bad, they
                > _need_ thousands and thousands of sites to pull in any revenue at all.

                It's true, I don't actually make much ad revenue. Ok, really none. ;) But it
                does disturb me a bit when I find my feed out of context, badly displayed
                and getting the page impression that was meant for me..

                And while the business model is so bad that it *requires* mass hits to work,
                that's not that hard to set up. It's a "poisoning the well" situation, where
                they are not discouraged if they have to kill the entire town just to kill
                one person, because they don't care about the town anyway..

                I just keep wondering about my mom as my typical example: reasonably
                intelligent, but not really net savvy: if she forgot my web address and did
                a search, would she know which one to choose? And if she chose the wrong one
                -- one that, say, used porn banner ads -- would she realize that it has
                nothing to do with me?

                A podcaster should have some rights to protect their image, although they
                cannot be well-enforced in the current infrastructure..

                > I'm not saying they're doing a fine and noble thing. I'm just
                > suggesting that, as intellectual property infringement goes, Webfungus
                > is more pathetic than dangerous.

                Doesn't stop me from complaining or spinning off quick thoughts about how
                they might be smashed, however.. :) I would hope that, in time, such sleazy
                business practices are defeated by a combination of intelligent tools and
                intelligent people, but likely digital bottom-feeders will always be around.

                And it always helps to bring up such things, especially here, because there
                are always those who are not aware of them and need to be educated.

                encaf1/MK

                "An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made, in a
                narrow field." - Niels Bohr
                the Encaffeinated ONE <http://encaffeinated.ca/>
                Host of THE WEIRD SHOW <http://theweirdshow.com/>
                Crew on The 9th HeroesCAST <http://www.heroescast.com/>

                Spoken Word Coordinator, Host on CHSR FM 97.9 <http://chsrfm.ca/>
                Production Manager, Giant Gnome Productions
                (Junior) Member, Darker Projects, <http://darkerprojects.com/>Pendant Audio
                Productions <http://pendantaudio.com/>, Broken Sea Audio<http://brokensea.com/>
                *the Encaffeinated ONE*: Amateur Voice Actor, Podcaster, Amateur Writer
                Wannabe, SF/F Fan, UNIX wizard, Geek.


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Pat Cook (The Left Wing Conservative)
                Hi everyone: There s a way around that you know. Take their feed and put it on FeedBurner. You use the FeedBurner URL and they can use their own feed. This
                Message 7 of 11 , Sep 29 11:29 AM
                  Hi everyone:

                  There's a way around that you know.

                  Take their feed and put it on FeedBurner. You use the FeedBurner URL and they can use their own feed. This way, if you change hosts, all you have to do is simply redirect people to the new feed URL simply by logging onto FeedBurner (Don't forget your username and password info!) and change it in there.

                  By doing that, you have more accurate information that PodShow does.

                  And speaking of "PodSpew", there's a discussion on the Videoblogging group regarding the safeness of VIDEOS on there. Are they safe (As in NO ROYALTY ISSUES)??? I'll be happy to pass along the answer to this question.

                  Cheers

                  Pat Cook
                  HOST - The Left Wing Conservative Talk Show
                  Denver, CO
                  WEBSITE - http://www.geocities.com/theleftwingconservative/


                  From: the Encaffeinated ONE
                  Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 12:04 PM
                  To: podcasters@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [podcasters] Podspew


                  On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Stephen Eley <SFEley@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > You're talking about something else. Podspew.com didn't copy anyone's
                  > site or site content. They are redisplaying some feed info and
                  > creating a text file with the enclosure URLs from the feed.

                  You're right, of course -- it's a different species of ugliness. Or maybe
                  just a different sub-species under my general category of "ECH". ;)

                  > More to the point, why is it unfortunate? Unless they're stripping
                  > attribution from you, it all points back to you. Ineffectively, in an
                  > ugly manner, and for squalid reasons, they're helping to promote your
                  > stuff. This is bad? Do you release on Creative Commons, or do you
                  > prefer to keep people from redistributing the stuff you're giving away
                  > for free?

                  Well, the one's that I've seen strip all links and often even any sort of
                  attribution. As for the RSS refeeders, I think it muddies the water when
                  someone who is searching for things by me are redirected to a poorly-laid
                  out or badly built site. The things is: they aren't really adding any value
                  to what I'm doing, and any negative things about them might reflect poorly
                  on them.

                  I mean, if spam can have as great an effect as it does, there must be people
                  gullible or misinformed enough to fall for it. The same thing applies to
                  these feedleechers.

                  Also, if *they* offer an RSS feed which is *not* mine, then I lose listener
                  trackability, and that definitely can have an effect on my podcast. I'm not
                  particularly obsessed with the numbers, but I like to have a handle on the
                  general size. And for those who are looking to (arg!) "monetize" their
                  stuff, they'll likely lose some evidence.

                  I'm not saying that these are necessarily "evil", just "awful" and
                  "detrimental".

                  There are actual podcast directories that work this way, and sometimes they
                  take the care to make things right. Those I don't mind, although if I choose
                  to change my feed (as I am in the process of doing now) I can't update them
                  and therefore lose some control over my feed. I don't really care about
                  rebroadcasts, and I make sure to mention my URL in each episode, but I *do*
                  want to maintain a certain level of control over the channel.

                  > Cute, but most of those Webfungus sites aren't scraping your Web site.
                  > They're reading your RSS feed. RSS feed agents aren't going to run
                  > any Javascript, they're just making straight HTTP get requests.
                  > Unless you're willing to destroy the utility of your RSS feed and only
                  > serve files to Web browsers (i.e., stop being a podcaster), you
                  > wouldn't fix anything this way.

                  Well, if the RSS feed has full HTML text, you *can*, in fact, shove
                  JavaScript into it, but I get your meaning. It feels a little like the
                  futility of fighting SPAM: we can do some things to minimize the impact on
                  our inbox, but we can't do much to stop the source. I admit, it's a danger
                  of the "free frontier" that we also appreciate highly, the freedom comes at
                  a price.

                  > How much ad revenue are you getting from your Web site right now? How
                  > much do you think _they'll_ get? You're not talking about real
                  > numbers here. The reason Webfungus grows to redistribute so much crap
                  > from so many places is because the business model is so bad, they
                  > _need_ thousands and thousands of sites to pull in any revenue at all.

                  It's true, I don't actually make much ad revenue. Ok, really none. ;) But it
                  does disturb me a bit when I find my feed out of context, badly displayed
                  and getting the page impression that was meant for me..

                  And while the business model is so bad that it *requires* mass hits to work,
                  that's not that hard to set up. It's a "poisoning the well" situation, where
                  they are not discouraged if they have to kill the entire town just to kill
                  one person, because they don't care about the town anyway..

                  I just keep wondering about my mom as my typical example: reasonably
                  intelligent, but not really net savvy: if she forgot my web address and did
                  a search, would she know which one to choose? And if she chose the wrong one
                  -- one that, say, used porn banner ads -- would she realize that it has
                  nothing to do with me?

                  A podcaster should have some rights to protect their image, although they
                  cannot be well-enforced in the current infrastructure..

                  > I'm not saying they're doing a fine and noble thing. I'm just
                  > suggesting that, as intellectual property infringement goes, Webfungus
                  > is more pathetic than dangerous.

                  Doesn't stop me from complaining or spinning off quick thoughts about how
                  they might be smashed, however.. :) I would hope that, in time, such sleazy
                  business practices are defeated by a combination of intelligent tools and
                  intelligent people, but likely digital bottom-feeders will always be around.

                  And it always helps to bring up such things, especially here, because there
                  are always those who are not aware of them and need to be educated.

                  encaf1/MK

                  "An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made, in a
                  narrow field." - Niels Bohr
                  the Encaffeinated ONE <http://encaffeinated.ca/>
                  Host of THE WEIRD SHOW <http://theweirdshow.com/>
                  Crew on The 9th HeroesCAST <http://www.heroescast.com/>

                  Spoken Word Coordinator, Host on CHSR FM 97.9 <http://chsrfm.ca/>
                  Production Manager, Giant Gnome Productions
                  (Junior) Member, Darker Projects, <http://darkerprojects.com/>Pendant Audio
                  Productions <http://pendantaudio.com/>, Broken Sea Audio<http://brokensea.com/>
                  *the Encaffeinated ONE*: Amateur Voice Actor, Podcaster, Amateur Writer
                  Wannabe, SF/F Fan, UNIX wizard, Geek.

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Kevin
                  So, it s not a complete scam...just a huge hemroid on the rear of the net. Kevin sisco83@hotmail.com http://www.gcast.com/u/kjsisco ... From: Stephen Eley To:
                  Message 8 of 11 , Sep 29 4:44 PM
                    So, it's not a complete scam...just a huge hemroid on the rear of the net.

                    Kevin
                    sisco83@...
                    http://www.gcast.com/u/kjsisco

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Stephen Eley
                    To: podcasters@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sunday, September 28, 2008 7:34 PM
                    Subject: Re: [podcasters] Podspew


                    On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 9:13 PM, Rick Savoia <rick@...> wrote:
                    > I stumbled across this site tonight while doing a Google search on my
                    > show, The Force Field. Apparently it converts downloadable mp3 files
                    > into streams in .M3U.

                    Curious, I checked it out. Was amused to see that Escape Pod is also
                    featured on their front page. (And no, I'd never heard of it either.)

                    I did click through, and determined that their service is:

                    A.) Useless. They're making this sound like some sort of complex
                    "conversion" process, but an M3U playlist file is really just a text
                    file with all the locations of the media files you want to play.
                    (URLs in this case.) So my M3U file generated by them looks like:

                    http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP177_Usurpers.mp3
                    http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP176_HowTheWorldBecameQuiet.mp3
                    http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP175_Reparations.mp3
                    http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP174_PrivateDetectiveMolly.mp3
                    http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP173_RobotsDontCry.mp3
                    [...]

                    ...Those are just all the URLs from my podcast feed. Brilliant.
                    Anybody could make one of these in thirty seconds, if they wanted one.
                    But there's not much point in it, because every media player program
                    out there will let you do this already with a nice graphical
                    interface. Who needs this?

                    B.) Broken. The file it gave me to download didn't even have an .m3u
                    extension, it had a .php extension. Basic stupid coding error. But
                    makes it harder to use if somebody DID want one of these files.

                    C.) Misleading. There's no "streaming" involved here. This is just a
                    playlist file. You could pass it to a Flash player or something if
                    you wanted to, but that's not really streaming either. And they don't
                    even have such a Flash player on their site. Lazy, lazy.

                    As for their listing my content... *shrug* It's just another bad
                    podcast directory. I release on a Creative Commons license, so
                    anybody who wants to can do this sort of thing. It doesn't hurt me if
                    they do it. Heck, somebody someday might even use this site to search
                    for a podcast, and find mine. It doesn't seem *likely*, but why
                    should I stand in their way?

                    (Oh, and... D.) Horrible, horrible name.)

                    --
                    Have Fun,
                    Steve Eley (sfeley@...)
                    ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
                    http://www.escapepod.org




                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Kevin
                    I could take a crack at such a script. In the meantime, at least your name is out there Kevin sisco83@hotmail.com http://www.gcast.com/u/kjsisco ... From:
                    Message 9 of 11 , Sep 29 4:47 PM
                      I could take a crack at such a script. In the meantime, at least your name is "out there"

                      Kevin
                      sisco83@...
                      http://www.gcast.com/u/kjsisco

                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: the Encaffeinated ONE
                      To: podcasters@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 7:28 AM
                      Subject: Re: [podcasters] Podspew


                      These sorts of copiers are all over the place; I've noted my blog and
                      several others copied and dumped unceremoniously into someone else's page.
                      It's unfortunate, but the openness of the web easily allows such a thing,
                      and doesn't really give much hope to stopping it -- short of every page
                      being an *image* of text and not text itself. (But then, your image is
                      taken..)

                      I've thought about trying to get real clever and write a Javascript/AJAX
                      thingee (technical term) that would download the contents on demand, or
                      scream loudly about SCAMMER!/SPAMMER! if the site was in the wrong place.
                      Not technically that hard -- although integrating it with Wordpress might be
                      a little tricky for me.

                      Still, if a clever coder out there can make this happen, I'd be pleased. It
                      irks me a bit that people might find my stuff via search and the ad revenue
                      go to them rather than me, but that's the way it goes.

                      encaf1/MK

                      "An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made, in a
                      narrow field." - Niels Bohr
                      the Encaffeinated ONE <http://encaffeinated.ca>
                      Host of THE WEIRD SHOW <http://theweirdshow.com>
                      Crew on The 9th HeroesCAST <http://www.heroescast.com>

                      Spoken Word Coordinator, Host on CHSR FM 97.9 <http://chsrfm.ca>
                      Production Manager, Giant Gnome Productions
                      (Junior) Member, Darker Projects, <http://darkerprojects.com>Pendant Audio
                      Productions <http://pendantaudio.com>, Broken Sea Audio<http://brokensea.com>
                      *the Encaffeinated ONE*: Amateur Voice Actor, Podcaster, Amateur Writer
                      Wannabe, SF/F Fan, UNIX wizard, Geek.

                      On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 11:34 PM, Stephen Eley <SFEley@...> wrote:

                      > On Sun, Sep 28, 2008 at 9:13 PM, Rick Savoia <rick@...<rick%40theforcefield.net>>
                      > wrote:
                      > > I stumbled across this site tonight while doing a Google search on my
                      > > show, The Force Field. Apparently it converts downloadable mp3 files
                      > > into streams in .M3U.
                      >
                      > Curious, I checked it out. Was amused to see that Escape Pod is also
                      > featured on their front page. (And no, I'd never heard of it either.)
                      >
                      > I did click through, and determined that their service is:
                      >
                      > A.) Useless. They're making this sound like some sort of complex
                      > "conversion" process, but an M3U playlist file is really just a text
                      > file with all the locations of the media files you want to play.
                      > (URLs in this case.) So my M3U file generated by them looks like:
                      >
                      >
                      > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP177_Usurpers.mp3
                      >
                      > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP176_HowTheWorldBecameQuiet.mp3
                      >
                      > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP175_Reparations.mp3
                      >
                      > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP174_PrivateDetectiveMolly.mp3
                      >
                      > http://media.rawvoice.com/escapepod/media.libsyn.com/media/escapepod/EP173_RobotsDontCry.mp3
                      > [...]
                      >
                      > ...Those are just all the URLs from my podcast feed. Brilliant.
                      > Anybody could make one of these in thirty seconds, if they wanted one.
                      > But there's not much point in it, because every media player program
                      > out there will let you do this already with a nice graphical
                      > interface. Who needs this?
                      >
                      > B.) Broken. The file it gave me to download didn't even have an .m3u
                      > extension, it had a .php extension. Basic stupid coding error. But
                      > makes it harder to use if somebody DID want one of these files.
                      >
                      > C.) Misleading. There's no "streaming" involved here. This is just a
                      > playlist file. You could pass it to a Flash player or something if
                      > you wanted to, but that's not really streaming either. And they don't
                      > even have such a Flash player on their site. Lazy, lazy.
                      >
                      > As for their listing my content... *shrug* It's just another bad
                      > podcast directory. I release on a Creative Commons license, so
                      > anybody who wants to can do this sort of thing. It doesn't hurt me if
                      > they do it. Heck, somebody someday might even use this site to search
                      > for a podcast, and find mine. It doesn't seem *likely*, but why
                      > should I stand in their way?
                      >
                      > (Oh, and... D.) Horrible, horrible name.)
                      >
                      > --
                      > Have Fun,
                      > Steve Eley (sfeley@... <sfeley%40gmail.com>)
                      > ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
                      > http://www.escapepod.org
                      >
                      >

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Rick Savoia
                      Hi Pat, I think you may have mistaken the title of my post as a derogatory reference to Podshow, which it wasn t. I was referring to an actual website called
                      Message 10 of 11 , Sep 29 10:31 PM
                        Hi Pat, I think you may have mistaken the title of my post as a
                        derogatory reference to Podshow, which it wasn't. I was referring to
                        an actual website called Podspew, which claimed to stream podcasts
                        after submitting the RSS feed for it.

                        I was surprised to find the site while Googling around for my show
                        and was asking if it was a legit site or a malware server. From the
                        responses it sounds like a link farm - some of which could still
                        serve malware.

                        For the record, while I am not a fan of PodShow I did not attempt to
                        denigrade their name in any way. The name Podspew refers to
                        www.podspew.com and apparently was intentionally named such by the
                        owner of the domain name and is certainly not my choice of a name.

                        Rick Savoia
                        The Force Field podcast for IT service providers
                        http://www.theforcefield.net


                        --- In podcasters@yahoogroups.com, "Pat Cook \(The Left Wing
                        Conservative\)" <theleftwingconservative@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi everyone:
                        >
                        > There's a way around that you know.
                        >
                        > Take their feed and put it on FeedBurner. You use the FeedBurner
                        URL and they can use their own feed. This way, if you change hosts,
                        all you have to do is simply redirect people to the new feed URL
                        simply by logging onto FeedBurner (Don't forget your username and
                        password info!) and change it in there.
                        >
                        > By doing that, you have more accurate information that PodShow
                        does.
                        >
                        > And speaking of "PodSpew", there's a discussion on the
                        Videoblogging group regarding the safeness of VIDEOS on there. Are
                        they safe (As in NO ROYALTY ISSUES)??? I'll be happy to pass along
                        the answer to this question.
                        >
                        > Cheers
                        >
                        > Pat Cook
                        > HOST - The Left Wing Conservative Talk Show
                        > Denver, CO
                        > WEBSITE - http://www.geocities.com/theleftwingconservative/
                        >
                        >
                        > From: the Encaffeinated ONE
                        > Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 12:04 PM
                        > To: podcasters@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: Re: [podcasters] Podspew
                        >
                        >
                        > On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Stephen Eley <SFEley@...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > You're talking about something else. Podspew.com didn't copy
                        anyone's
                        > > site or site content. They are redisplaying some feed info and
                        > > creating a text file with the enclosure URLs from the feed.
                        >
                        > You're right, of course -- it's a different species of ugliness.
                        Or maybe
                        > just a different sub-species under my general category of "ECH". ;)
                        >
                        > > More to the point, why is it unfortunate? Unless they're
                        stripping
                        > > attribution from you, it all points back to you. Ineffectively,
                        in an
                        > > ugly manner, and for squalid reasons, they're helping to promote
                        your
                        > > stuff. This is bad? Do you release on Creative Commons, or do you
                        > > prefer to keep people from redistributing the stuff you're
                        giving away
                        > > for free?
                        >
                        > Well, the one's that I've seen strip all links and often even any
                        sort of
                        > attribution. As for the RSS refeeders, I think it muddies the
                        water when
                        > someone who is searching for things by me are redirected to a
                        poorly-laid
                        > out or badly built site. The things is: they aren't really adding
                        any value
                        > to what I'm doing, and any negative things about them might
                        reflect poorly
                        > on them.
                        >
                        > I mean, if spam can have as great an effect as it does, there must
                        be people
                        > gullible or misinformed enough to fall for it. The same thing
                        applies to
                        > these feedleechers.
                        >
                        > Also, if *they* offer an RSS feed which is *not* mine, then I lose
                        listener
                        > trackability, and that definitely can have an effect on my
                        podcast. I'm not
                        > particularly obsessed with the numbers, but I like to have a
                        handle on the
                        > general size. And for those who are looking to (arg!) "monetize"
                        their
                        > stuff, they'll likely lose some evidence.
                        >
                        > I'm not saying that these are necessarily "evil", just "awful" and
                        > "detrimental".
                        >
                        > There are actual podcast directories that work this way, and
                        sometimes they
                        > take the care to make things right. Those I don't mind, although
                        if I choose
                        > to change my feed (as I am in the process of doing now) I can't
                        update them
                        > and therefore lose some control over my feed. I don't really care
                        about
                        > rebroadcasts, and I make sure to mention my URL in each episode,
                        but I *do*
                        > want to maintain a certain level of control over the channel.
                        >
                        > > Cute, but most of those Webfungus sites aren't scraping your Web
                        site.
                        > > They're reading your RSS feed. RSS feed agents aren't going to
                        run
                        > > any Javascript, they're just making straight HTTP get requests.
                        > > Unless you're willing to destroy the utility of your RSS feed
                        and only
                        > > serve files to Web browsers (i.e., stop being a podcaster), you
                        > > wouldn't fix anything this way.
                        >
                        > Well, if the RSS feed has full HTML text, you *can*, in fact, shove
                        > JavaScript into it, but I get your meaning. It feels a little like
                        the
                        > futility of fighting SPAM: we can do some things to minimize the
                        impact on
                        > our inbox, but we can't do much to stop the source. I admit, it's
                        a danger
                        > of the "free frontier" that we also appreciate highly, the freedom
                        comes at
                        > a price.
                        >
                        > > How much ad revenue are you getting from your Web site right
                        now? How
                        > > much do you think _they'll_ get? You're not talking about real
                        > > numbers here. The reason Webfungus grows to redistribute so much
                        crap
                        > > from so many places is because the business model is so bad, they
                        > > _need_ thousands and thousands of sites to pull in any revenue
                        at all.
                        >
                        > It's true, I don't actually make much ad revenue. Ok, really
                        none. ;) But it
                        > does disturb me a bit when I find my feed out of context, badly
                        displayed
                        > and getting the page impression that was meant for me..
                        >
                        > And while the business model is so bad that it *requires* mass
                        hits to work,
                        > that's not that hard to set up. It's a "poisoning the well"
                        situation, where
                        > they are not discouraged if they have to kill the entire town just
                        to kill
                        > one person, because they don't care about the town anyway..
                        >
                        > I just keep wondering about my mom as my typical example:
                        reasonably
                        > intelligent, but not really net savvy: if she forgot my web
                        address and did
                        > a search, would she know which one to choose? And if she chose the
                        wrong one
                        > -- one that, say, used porn banner ads -- would she realize that
                        it has
                        > nothing to do with me?
                        >
                        > A podcaster should have some rights to protect their image,
                        although they
                        > cannot be well-enforced in the current infrastructure..
                        >
                        > > I'm not saying they're doing a fine and noble thing. I'm just
                        > > suggesting that, as intellectual property infringement goes,
                        Webfungus
                        > > is more pathetic than dangerous.
                        >
                        > Doesn't stop me from complaining or spinning off quick thoughts
                        about how
                        > they might be smashed, however.. :) I would hope that, in time,
                        such sleazy
                        > business practices are defeated by a combination of intelligent
                        tools and
                        > intelligent people, but likely digital bottom-feeders will always
                        be around.
                        >
                        > And it always helps to bring up such things, especially here,
                        because there
                        > are always those who are not aware of them and need to be educated.
                        >
                        > encaf1/MK
                        >
                        > "An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be
                        made, in a
                        > narrow field." - Niels Bohr
                        > the Encaffeinated ONE <http://encaffeinated.ca/>
                        > Host of THE WEIRD SHOW <http://theweirdshow.com/>
                        > Crew on The 9th HeroesCAST <http://www.heroescast.com/>
                        >
                        > Spoken Word Coordinator, Host on CHSR FM 97.9 <http://chsrfm.ca/>
                        > Production Manager, Giant Gnome Productions
                        > (Junior) Member, Darker Projects,
                        <http://darkerprojects.com/>Pendant Audio
                        > Productions <http://pendantaudio.com/>, Broken Sea
                        Audio<http://brokensea.com/>
                        > *the Encaffeinated ONE*: Amateur Voice Actor, Podcaster, Amateur
                        Writer
                        > Wannabe, SF/F Fan, UNIX wizard, Geek.
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
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