Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Need Advice for Laurentians (Rocky, Acidic Soil), Short Growing Season

Expand Messages
  • mogiljan
    Hello! There you have it: extremely patchy soil (rocky, mostly evergreens (spruce), a few birches that recently are dying, short growing season (way less than
    Message 1 of 7 , Jun 24, 2005
    • 0 Attachment
      Hello!

      There you have it: extremely patchy soil (rocky, mostly evergreens
      (spruce), a few birches that recently are dying, short growing season
      (way less than the mandatory 150 days for nut trees), because of the
      surrounding hills - poor sunlight, plus standing water in the
      hollows).

      The better area of my property has a southern exposure facing a
      shallow (i.e. artificial) lake but the rocks are still there. This
      allows for the rare beechwood or ironwood, I believe, and lots more
      deciduous than coniferous. But the root systems have little soil to
      grow in, and eventually the most ambitious tree will topple over.

      I'm looking for something along the lines of permaculture; in the hope
      of planting either nut trees (perhaps with artificial shelter to
      extend the growing season and protect the roots against deep freeze)
      or use raised beds for gardening (again, a hoop/green-house may be
      needed).

      Compost - very necessary, but there's not a lot of excess soil to
      start with.

      George (Canada)
    • Bob Ewing
      Greetings, i live in Thunder Bay, Ontario on the edge of the Boreal Forest, growing conditions appear to be similar to yours. We have grown, jack pine,
      Message 2 of 7 , Jun 25, 2005
      • 0 Attachment
        Greetings, i live in Thunder Bay, Ontario on the edge
        of the Boreal Forest, growing conditions appear to be
        similar to yours. We have grown, jack pine,
        blueberries and beaked hazel (C. cornuta) in close
        proximity and all do well. The jack pine provides the
        acidic soil that blueberries love.

        The beaked hazel thrives here and provides edible
        nuts.

        Bob Ewing

        Permaculture is how we take control over our own lives, meet our individual needs and build our common future. Let Nature be your mentor.
        www.restoretheearth.ca

        __________________________________________________
        Do You Yahoo!?
        Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
        http://mail.yahoo.com
      • George Mogiljansky
        Thank you, Bob. I m just discovering permaculture (incl. environmental horticulture). I planted three chestnut seedlings in April but they didn t take. I m
        Message 3 of 7 , Jun 25, 2005
        • 0 Attachment
          Thank you, Bob. I'm just discovering permaculture
          (incl. environmental horticulture).

          I planted three chestnut seedlings in April but they
          didn't take. I'm told the soil was too cold. I also
          didn't harden them enough, I suspect.

          The current property has likely very limited use as a
          growing zone for edibles. There are about four "wild"
          apple trees, raspberries, earth strawberries, a few
          blueberry bushes (the fast growing spruce is
          overtaking them), choke cherry (barely present), and
          the rhubarb has disappeared.

          I will look for a local source of seedlings for beaked
          hazel and jack pine, unless they can be started from
          seed?

          George


          --- Bob Ewing <urbanpermaculture@...> wrote:

          > Greetings, i live in Thunder Bay, Ontario on the
          > edge
          > of the Boreal Forest, growing conditions appear to
          > be
          > similar to yours. We have grown, jack pine,
          > blueberries and beaked hazel (C. cornuta) in close
          > proximity and all do well. The jack pine provides
          > the
          > acidic soil that blueberries love.
          >
          > The beaked hazel thrives here and provides edible
          > nuts.
          >
          > Bob Ewing
          >
          > Permaculture is how we take control over our own
          > lives, meet our individual needs and build our
          > common future. Let Nature be your mentor.
          > www.restoretheearth.ca





          ____________________________________________________
          Yahoo! Sports
          Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
          http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com
        • Bob Ewing
          Greetings for jack pine: http://ianrpubs.unl.edu/forestry/g380.htm and from pfaf database: beaked hazel Propagation Seed - best sown as soon as it is harvested
          Message 4 of 7 , Jun 25, 2005
          • 0 Attachment
            Greetings for jack pine:

            http://ianrpubs.unl.edu/forestry/g380.htm

            and from pfaf database:

            beaked hazel

            Propagation
            Seed - best sown as soon as it is harvested in autumn
            in a cold frame[164]. Germinates in late winter or
            spring. Stored seed should be pre-soaked in warm water
            for 48 hours and then given 2 weeks warm followed by 3
            - 4 months cold stratification[164]. Germinates in 1 -
            6 months at 20°c[164]. When large enough to handle,
            prick the seedlings out into individual pots and grow
            them on in a cold frame or sheltered place outdoors
            for their first winter. Plant them out into their
            permanent positions in late spring or early summer[K].

            --- George Mogiljansky <mogiljan@...> wrote:


            ---------------------------------

            Thank you, Bob. I'm just discovering permaculture
            (incl. environmental horticulture).

            I planted three chestnut seedlings in April but they
            didn't take. I'm told the soil was too cold. I also
            didn't harden them enough, I suspect.

            April is early , at least here, we plant usually, late
            May or early June.



            I will look for a local source of seedlings for beaked
            hazel and jack pine, unless they can be started from
            seed?

            George


            --- Bob Ewing <urbanpermaculture@...> wrote:

            > Greetings, i live in Thunder Bay, Ontario on the
            > edge
            > of the Boreal Forest, growing conditions appear to
            > be
            > similar to yours. We have grown, jack pine,
            > blueberries and beaked hazel (C. cornuta) in close
            > proximity and all do well. The jack pine provides
            > the
            > acidic soil that blueberries love.
            >
            > The beaked hazel thrives here and provides edible
            > nuts.
            >
            > Bob Ewing
            >
            > Permaculture is how we take control over our own
            > lives, meet our individual needs and build our
            > common future. Let Nature be your mentor.
            > www.restoretheearth.ca





            ____________________________________________________
            Yahoo! Sports
            Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
            http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com


            ---------------------------------
            Yahoo! Groups Links

            To visit your group on the web, go to:
            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf/

            To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            pfaf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

            Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
            Terms of Service.



            Permaculture is how we take control over our own lives, meet our individual needs and build our common future. Let Nature be your mentor.
            www.restoretheearth.ca

            __________________________________________________
            Do You Yahoo!?
            Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
            http://mail.yahoo.com
          • Geir Flatabø
            ... Obviously if ther is beech growing, at least three nut trees will make it: Pinus cembra, Pinus koraiensis, Pinus sibirica, Probably also Corylus avellana ,
            Message 5 of 7 , Jun 26, 2005
            • 0 Attachment
              mogiljan skrev:

              >I'm looking for something along the lines of permaculture; in the hope
              >of planting either nut trees (perhaps with artificial shelter to
              >extend the growing season and protect the roots against deep freeze)
              >or use raised beds for gardening (again, a hoop/green-house may be
              >needed).
              >Compost - very necessary, but there's not a lot of excess soil to
              >start with.
              >
              >George (Canada)
              >
              >
              Obviously if ther is beech growing,
              at least three nut trees will make it:
              Pinus cembra, Pinus koraiensis, Pinus sibirica,
              Probably also Corylus avellana , C. colurna, and C. maxima and hybrids,

              if you were situated in Norway (I am) -
              if beech is growing, I would also try Juglans regia, Juglans nigra,
              Castanea dentata,
              here they thrive with approx 120 - 150 days growing season.

              Geir Flatabø
            • George Mogiljansky
              Thanks, Geir. Unless I m mistaken, you are near the Gulf Stream and the warming effect? What about further inland? What is growing there? George ...
              Message 6 of 7 , Jun 28, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                Thanks, Geir.

                Unless I'm mistaken, you are near the Gulf Stream and
                the warming effect?

                What about further inland? What is growing there?

                George


                --- Geir Flatabø <geirf@...> wrote:

                >
                >
                > mogiljan skrev:
                >
                > >I'm looking for something along the lines of
                > permaculture; in the hope
                > >of planting either nut trees (perhaps with
                > artificial shelter to
                > >extend the growing season and protect the roots
                > against deep freeze)
                > >or use raised beds for gardening (again, a
                > hoop/green-house may be
                > >needed).
                > >Compost - very necessary, but there's not a lot of
                > excess soil to
                > >start with.
                > >
                > >George (Canada)
                > >
                > >
                > Obviously if ther is beech growing,
                > at least three nut trees will make it:
                > Pinus cembra, Pinus koraiensis, Pinus sibirica,
                > Probably also Corylus avellana , C. colurna, and C.
                > maxima and hybrids,
                >
                > if you were situated in Norway (I am) -
                > if beech is growing, I would also try Juglans
                > regia, Juglans nigra,
                > Castanea dentata,
                > here they thrive with approx 120 - 150 days growing
                > season.
                >
                > Geir Flatabø
                >


                http://www.geocities.com/mogiljan/SustainableFuture.html
                Check out Dr. Williams' Proposal for a Solar Tower
                http://f1.pg.briefcase.yahoo.com/mogiljan
                To obtain three pdf files (600k) -
                send your Yahoo ID only to download; or I will send via email attachment.



                ____________________________________________________
                Yahoo! Sports
                Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
                http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com
              • Geir Flatabø
                You are right, the gulf effect makes warmer / milder and more rainy winthers , and cooler summers. Summer temperatures seldom above 25 C, and nearly never
                Message 7 of 7 , Jun 28, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  You are right,
                  the gulf effect makes warmer / milder and more rainy winthers , and
                  "cooler" summers. Summer temperatures seldom above 25 C, and nearly
                  never above 30C, till now this year we have had extremely bad weathers,
                  with only two days of temperatures abowe 20C. Winter temperatures might
                  go down to -20C, and stay with -10C for a week or more....
                  Local climatic factors - as south facing slopes are necessary for the
                  more warmth demanding species as Chestnuts, grapes and nectarines, but
                  the pines and walnuts and hazelnuts do make it "anywhere" how named
                  varieties of hazelnuts would do, I cannot say. - but some old filberts
                  and cobnuts do OK.
                  The pines are hardy to nearly timberline - 1000 m above sea level and
                  beyond polar circle. Hazelnuts have no trouble inland, at least the
                  wild types, I have also tried almonds and figs, they survive a few
                  years, if protected, but I guess it would be possible to get hardier
                  varieties.
                  .
                  Geir Flatabø

                  George Mogiljansky skrev:

                  >Thanks, Geir.
                  >
                  >Unless I'm mistaken, you are near the Gulf Stream and
                  >the warming effect?
                  >
                  >What about further inland? What is growing there?
                  >
                  >George
                  >
                  >
                  >--- Geir Flatabø <geirf@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >>mogiljan skrev:
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>I'm looking for something along the lines of
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>permaculture; in the hope
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>of planting either nut trees (perhaps with
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>artificial shelter to
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>extend the growing season and protect the roots
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>against deep freeze)
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>or use raised beds for gardening (again, a
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>hoop/green-house may be
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>needed).
                  >>>Compost - very necessary, but there's not a lot of
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>excess soil to
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>>start with.
                  >>>
                  >>>George (Canada)
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>Obviously if ther is beech growing,
                  >>at least three nut trees will make it:
                  >>Pinus cembra, Pinus koraiensis, Pinus sibirica,
                  >>Probably also Corylus avellana , C. colurna, and C.
                  >>maxima and hybrids,
                  >>
                  >>if you were situated in Norway (I am) -
                  >>if beech is growing, I would also try Juglans
                  >>regia, Juglans nigra,
                  >>Castanea dentata,
                  >>here they thrive with approx 120 - 150 days growing
                  >>season.
                  >>
                  >>Geir Flatabø
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >
                  >
                  >http://www.geocities.com/mogiljan/SustainableFuture.html
                  >Check out Dr. Williams' Proposal for a Solar Tower
                  >http://f1.pg.briefcase.yahoo.com/mogiljan
                  >To obtain three pdf files (600k) -
                  >send your Yahoo ID only to download; or I will send via email attachment.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >____________________________________________________
                  >Yahoo! Sports
                  >Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
                  >http://football.fantasysports.yahoo.com
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.