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Re: Benevolent Dictator

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  • travelerinthyme
    Wind, water, and solar power all cost more to produce than they put out, alas, which is why we use petroleum and nuclear power in the first place. The
    Message 1 of 9 , May 2 7:42 AM
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      Wind, water, and solar power all cost more to produce than they put out, alas, which is why we use petroleum and nuclear power in the first place.

      The solution, of course, is to forego the need for technology, and reduce the population, but that ain't gonna happen without megadisaster.

      I watch too much sci-fi.
      ~Traveler in Thyme


      --- In pfaf@yahoogroups.com, Griselda Mussett <mussetts@...> wrote:
      >
      > The BBC website said today that in Scotland the electricity authorities are paying colossal sums to several windfarm arrays for NOT supplying electricty, as it comes in surges which are proving too costly for the system to cope with. This is in the region of hundreds of thousands of pounds of public money, so that they immobilise the turbines. I cannot think of a more stupid, corrupt, wasteful outcome.
      > Griselda
      >
      > Sent from my iPhone
      >
      > On 30 Apr 2011, at 01:23, Matthew Sleigh <matthew@...> wrote:
      >
      > > you have my vote :)
      > >
      > > It seems that at the moment we have no leaders, only heads of state
      > > (of various kinds). Our rulers are perhaps stifled by our political
      > > systems, and seem to be lacking any kind of vision. Previously, when
      > > faced with this dilemma, war has been the easy answer, but war is no
      > > longer socially or politically acceptable.
      > >
      > > Jacque Fresco's Venus Project has some nice ideas, but leaves no space
      > > for creativity (his beyond utopia quickly becomes a dystopia by being
      > > over designed)
      > >
      > > Matt
      > >
      > > On Sat, Apr 30, 2011 at 6:40 AM, travelerinthyme
      > > <traveler.in.thyme@...> wrote:
      > > > If all parking was covered parking, that would reduce the heat rising from all those metal cars and asphalt exposed to hot sun, a major cause of the warming caused by big cities. Austin is 5-10 degrees hotter than the countryside on any given day, you can feel it when you come over the hill on the highway.
      > > >
      > > > All covered parking could have trees and gardens planted on top, generating oxygen to counteract the carbon greenhouse gasses.
      > > >
      > > > All buildings could run off their own solar and wind generators, or do without electricity.
      > > >
      > > > Everyone going a mile or less could WALK, thereby saving fuel and curing obesity.
      > > >
      > > > We could all live in high rise buildings, with windows and balconies all around, leaving millions of acres for green parklands and gardens, which we could see from our balconies.
      > > >
      > > > Bosses would receive no more than 3 times what worker are paid, and school teachers, janitors, and dishwashers would be more highly prized than accountants and administrators. All without raising prices.
      > > >
      > > > All food would be grown organically, with respect for the natural order.
      > > >
      > > > Everyone's spiritual beliefs would be respected, and since every day is someone's religious holiday, we could feast and be merry every day, taking our turn to supply the feast 8 or 10 times a year.
      > > >
      > > > Vote for me for Benevolent Dictator!
      > > >
      > > > ~Traveler in Thyme
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ------------------------------------
      > > >
      > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      > > --
      > > All the best,
      > > Matthew
      > >
      > > Matthew Sleigh
      > > P-2, North Poblacion
      > > Don Carlos, Bukidnon
      > > 8712
      > > Philippines
      > >
      > > Matthew Sleigh
      > > B and T World Seeds
      > > Paguignan
      > > 34210 Aigues-Vives
      > > France
      > > matthew@...
      > > http://b-and-t-world-seeds.com/
      > > fax ++ 33 (0) 4 68 91 30 39
      > >
      >
    • Peter Ellis
      ... Yes. Whereas conventional power stations produce power continually, with options to raise and lower production according to demand, windfarms only produce
      Message 2 of 9 , May 2 9:14 AM
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        Matthew Sleigh wrote:
        >
        >
        > so windfarms need a way to store energy ?
        >
        Yes. Whereas conventional power stations produce power continually, with
        options to raise and lower production according to demand, windfarms
        only produce when there is wind. Statistically, they often don't produce
        power when it is needed and do produce when it isn't, hence the need for
        storage and later release.

        Some of this may be changing. Traditionally, most power was needed
        during winter, but with increased use of air conditioning in summer,
        usage is starting to even out. There are still peaks during the day. In
        the UK, there would be regular peaks when TV advertisements came on and
        viewers rushed out to all put the electric kettle on at exactly the same
        time!

        The changes have interesting side effects. A friend wrote the official
        report on the Auckland brown out, some years ago and later did another
        for IIRC, Singapore. His findings, summed up, were that when
        transmission systems are heavily used, as in winter, they heat up.
        However, winter environmental conditions normally cool them down and
        keep them within preset parameters. Now that there is increasingly heavy
        summer use, with A/C, the transmission cables still heat up, but instead
        of cold winter weather to cool them down, warm summer weather makes
        things worse and the overheating blows the protection systems. As we are
        talking of the transmission cables from the power stations, the effect
        is to cut off the whole town.

        Cheers

        Peter
      • Infowolf1@aol.com
        flywheels, battery banks, etc. Christine In a message dated 5/2/2011 6:03:26 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, matthew@b-and-t-world-seeds.com writes: so windfarms
        Message 3 of 9 , May 2 6:35 PM
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          flywheels, battery banks, etc.
           
          Christine
           
          In a message dated 5/2/2011 6:03:26 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, matthew@... writes:
           

          so windfarms need a way to store energy ?

          On Mon, May 2, 2011 at 8:52 AM, Griselda Mussett <mussetts@...> wrote:


          The BBC website said today that in Scotland the electricity authorities are paying colossal sums to several windfarm arrays for NOT supplying electricty, as it comes in surges which are proving too costly for the system to cope with. This is in the region of hundreds of thousands of pounds of public money, so that they immobilise the turbines. I cannot think of a more stupid, corrupt, wasteful outcome. 
          Griselda

          Sent from my iPhone

          On 30 Apr 2011, at 01:23, Matthew Sleigh <matthew@...> wrote:

           

          you have my vote :)

          It seems that at the moment we have no leaders, only heads of state
          (of various kinds). Our rulers are perhaps stifled by our political
          systems, and seem to be lacking any kind of vision. Previously, when
          faced with this dilemma, war has been the easy answer, but war is no
          longer socially or politically acceptable.

          Jacque Fresco's Venus Project has some nice ideas, but leaves no space
          for creativity (his beyond utopia quickly becomes a dystopia by being
          over designed)

          Matt

          On Sat, Apr 30, 2011 at 6:40 AM, travelerinthyme
          <traveler.in.thyme@...> wrote:
          > If all parking was covered parking, that would reduce the heat rising from all those metal cars and asphalt exposed to hot sun, a major cause of the warming caused by big cities.  Austin is 5-10 degrees hotter than the countryside on any given day, you can feel it when you come over the hill on the highway.
          >
          > All covered parking could have trees and gardens planted on top, generating oxygen to counteract the carbon greenhouse gasses.
          >
          > All buildings could run off their own solar and wind generators, or do without electricity.
          >
          > Everyone going a mile or less could WALK, thereby saving fuel and curing obesity.
          >
          > We could all live in high rise buildings, with windows and balconies all around, leaving millions of acres for green parklands and gardens, which we could see from our balconies.
          >
          > Bosses would receive no more than 3 times what worker are paid, and school teachers, janitors, and dishwashers would be more highly prized than accountants and administrators.  All without raising prices.
          >
          > All food would be grown organically, with respect for the natural order.
          >
          > Everyone's spiritual beliefs would be respected, and since every day is someone's religious holiday, we could feast and be merry every day, taking our turn to supply the feast 8 or 10 times a year.
          >
          > Vote for me for Benevolent Dictator!
          >
          > ~Traveler in Thyme
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >

          --
          All the best,
          Matthew

          Matthew Sleigh
          P-2, North Poblacion
          Don Carlos, Bukidnon
          8712
          Philippines

          Matthew Sleigh
          B and T World Seeds
          Paguignan
          34210 Aigues-Vives
          France
          matthew@...
          http://b-and-t-world-seeds.com/
          fax ++ 33 (0) 4 68 91 30 39






          --
          All the best,
          Matthew

          Matthew Sleigh
          P-2, North Poblacion
          Don Carlos, Bukidnon
          8712
          Philippines

          Matthew Sleigh
          B and T World Seeds
          Paguignan
          34210 Aigues-Vives
          France
          matthew@...
          http://b-and-t-world-seeds.com/
          fax ++ 33 (0) 4 68 91 30 39

        • Matthew Sleigh
          Hi Marcia, On Mon, May 2, 2011 at 10:42 PM, travelerinthyme ... Where do you get this information ? I remember that back in the 1970 s a study was done that
          Message 4 of 9 , May 2 6:38 PM
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            Hi Marcia,

            On Mon, May 2, 2011 at 10:42 PM, travelerinthyme
            <traveler.in.thyme@...> wrote:
            > Wind, water, and solar power all cost more to produce than they put out, alas, which is why we use petroleum and nuclear power in the first place.

            Where do you get this information ?

            I remember that back in the 1970's a study was done that showed
            alternative energy in a bad light - the study was (fairly) recently
            found to have been flawed; a decimal place had been misplaced and
            alternative energy production had been reported as having 1/10th of
            it's actual efficiency - the direct effect of this report was that
            alternative energy projects in the UK were dropped and nuclear energy
            promoted - indirectly the study has effected energy policy worldwide.

            On another tack:
            Plants are Wind, water, and solar power collectors, this energy can be
            harnessed in millions of different ways - in organic gardening and
            permaculture a considerable amount of the energy is reinvested in the
            soil, to arrive at a sustainable soil community where (for example)
            more biomass may be deposited than soil lost through run-off.

            All the best,
            Matthew
          • Bekki Shining Bearheart LMT
            Thanks Matthew for setting the record straight. There are a lot of myths out there reagrding alternative energy. It really comes down to the profits that
            Message 5 of 9 , May 2 10:57 PM
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              Thanks Matthew for setting the record straight. There are a lot of myths
              out there reagrding alternative energy. It really comes down to the
              profits that for-profit companies want to make, and often this is only
              possible because governments-- especially the US government-- subsidize
              them. These subsidies are found in all kinds of areas, not just energy.
              For instance the loggiing companies in many states are allowed to log in
              state forests and pay a pittance of what the trees are actually worth.
              Robbing the public of lots of revenues and never planting a tree to
              replace what they take. If the solar and wind companies were subsidized
              like the nuclear and coal and so on were, they would be more than
              competitive.

              Matthew Sleigh wrote:
              >
              > Hi Marcia,
              >
              > On Mon, May 2, 2011 at 10:42 PM, travelerinthyme
              > <traveler.in.thyme@... <mailto:traveler.in.thyme%40gmail.com>>
              > wrote:
              > > Wind, water, and solar power all cost more to produce than they put
              > out, alas, which is why we use petroleum and nuclear power in the
              > first place.
              >
              > Where do you get this information ?
              >
              > I remember that back in the 1970's a study was done that showed
              > alternative energy in a bad light - the study was (fairly) recently
              > found to have been flawed; a decimal place had been misplaced and
              > alternative energy production had been reported as having 1/10th of
              > it's actual efficiency - the direct effect of this report was that
              > alternative energy projects in the UK were dropped and nuclear energy
              > promoted - indirectly the study has effected energy policy worldwide.
              >
              > On another tack:
              > Plants are Wind, water, and solar power collectors, this energy can be
              > harnessed in millions of different ways - in organic gardening and
              > permaculture a considerable amount of the energy is reinvested in the
              > soil, to arrive at a sustainable soil community where (for example)
              > more biomass may be deposited than soil lost through run-off.
              >
              > All the best,
              > Matthew
              >
              >
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