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Re: [pfaf] Re: Green manure/mulch

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  • Ludwig
    /Thank you everyone for your splendid suggestions. /Comfrey is indeed my favorite mulching and companion plant. It grows so well with trees. I use /Symphytum x
    Message 1 of 15 , Jan 28, 2011
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      Thank you everyone for your splendid suggestions.

      Comfrey is indeed my favorite mulching and companion plant. It grows so well with trees. I use Symphytum x uplandicum, Russian Comfrey, bocking 14. Like Frank pointed out, it is an infertile hybrid. It is easily divided and propagated. But it won't turn up where you don't want it.

      I am looking for something else than comfrey, cause were I want to sow these green manures this year, I want to grow vegetables next year.
       

      Seems white clover, yarrow, borage, oats and alfalfa are recommended by Matthew Lynch. I might add Bird's foot trefoil (lotus corniculatus) or white mustard (sinapsis alba) or meadow fescue  (festuca pratensis) to the mix. I like diversity :-)

      Steve, you said:
      For pasture or other broadacre design, a winter wheat/vetch/rye mixture may be appropriate.

      Is that a recommended mixture to sow next autumn, or can I still sow that this spring? What would you recommend to sow this spring?

      I'd love a recipe for comfrey salves Bekki!

      Thank you everyone!

      Ludwig


    • david.keltie@gmail.com
      I d also suggest aliske clover and field beans - both nitrogen fixing and provide a lot of biomas. Both should do well up north! Cheers, David ... it.
      Message 2 of 15 , Jan 28, 2011
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        I'd also suggest aliske clover and field beans - both nitrogen fixing and provide a lot of biomas. Both should do well up north!
        Cheers, David

        On 28 Jan 2011 20:20, "Ludwig" <the_pooh_way@...> wrote:
        > /Thank you everyone for your splendid suggestions.
        >
        > /Comfrey is indeed my favorite mulching and companion plant. It grows so
        > well with trees. I use /Symphytum x uplandicum/, Russian Comfrey,
        > bocking 14. Like Frank pointed out, it is an infertile hybrid. It is
        > easily divided and propagated. But it won't turn up where you don't want it.
        >
        > I am looking for something else than comfrey, cause were I want to sow
        > these green manures this year, I want to grow vegetables next year.
        >
        >
        > Seems white clover, yarrow, borage, oats and alfalfa are recommended by
        > Matthew Lynch. I might add Bird's foot trefoil (lotus corniculatus) or
        > white mustard (sinapsis alba) or meadow fescue (festuca pratensis) to
        > the mix. I like diversity :-)
        >
        > Steve, you said:
        > For pasture or other broadacre design, a winter wheat/vetch/rye mixture
        > may be appropriate.
        >
        > Is that a recommended mixture to sow next autumn, or can I still sow
        > that this spring? What would you recommend to sow this spring?
        >
        > I'd love a recipe for comfrey salves Bekki!
        >
        > Thank you everyone!
        >
        > Ludwig
        >
        >
      • robinjw13
        Hi Ludwig, White clover is low to establish and will not grow enough in one season for your needs. Vetch is good but has to be sown in autumn. I suggest
        Message 3 of 15 , Jan 28, 2011
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          Hi Ludwig,

          White clover is low to establish and will not grow enough in one season for your needs. Vetch is good but has to be sown in autumn. I suggest crimson clover and/or phacelia. Both will grow rapidly during the summer and phacelia in particular even after flowering will give a lot of biomass that will lie on the soil (suppressing weeds) right through autumn and in to winter. Sow from April to the end of May.

          Robin

          --- In pfaf@yahoogroups.com, Ludwig <the_pooh_way@...> wrote:
          >
          > /Thank you everyone for your splendid suggestions.
          >
          > /Comfrey is indeed my favorite mulching and companion plant. It grows so
          > well with trees. I use /Symphytum x uplandicum/, Russian Comfrey,
          > bocking 14. Like Frank pointed out, it is an infertile hybrid. It is
          > easily divided and propagated. But it won't turn up where you don't want it.
          >
          > I am looking for something else than comfrey, cause were I want to sow
          > these green manures this year, I want to grow vegetables next year.
          >
          >
          > Seems white clover, yarrow, borage, oats and alfalfa are recommended by
          > Matthew Lynch. I might add Bird's foot trefoil (lotus corniculatus) or
          > white mustard (sinapsis alba) or meadow fescue (festuca pratensis) to
          > the mix. I like diversity :-)
          >
          > Steve, you said:
          > For pasture or other broadacre design, a winter wheat/vetch/rye mixture
          > may be appropriate.
          >
          > Is that a recommended mixture to sow next autumn, or can I still sow
          > that this spring? What would you recommend to sow this spring?
          >
          > I'd love a recipe for comfrey salves Bekki!
          >
          > Thank you everyone!
          >
          > Ludwig
          >
        • david.keltie@gmail.com
          I d be surprised if phaelecia would do well in north Scotland.... ... for your needs. Vetch is good but has to be sown in autumn. I suggest crimson clover
          Message 4 of 15 , Jan 29, 2011
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            I'd be surprised if phaelecia would do well in north Scotland....

            On 29 Jan 2011 10:23, "robinjw13" <robinkjw@...> wrote:
            > Hi Ludwig,
            >
            > White clover is low to establish and will not grow enough in one season for your needs. Vetch is good but has to be sown in autumn. I suggest crimson clover and/or phacelia. Both will grow rapidly during the summer and phacelia in particular even after flowering will give a lot of biomass that will lie on the soil (suppressing weeds) right through autumn and in to winter. Sow from April to the end of May.
            >
            > Robin
            >
            > --- In pfaf@yahoogroups.com, Ludwig <the_pooh_way@...> wrote:
            >>
            >> /Thank you everyone for your splendid suggestions.
            >>
            >> /Comfrey is indeed my favorite mulching and companion plant. It grows so
            >> well with trees. I use /Symphytum x uplandicum/, Russian Comfrey,
            >> bocking 14. Like Frank pointed out, it is an infertile hybrid. It is
            >> easily divided and propagated. But it won't turn up where you don't want it.
            >>
            >> I am looking for something else than comfrey, cause were I want to sow
            >> these green manures this year, I want to grow vegetables next year.
            >>
            >>
            >> Seems white clover, yarrow, borage, oats and alfalfa are recommended by
            >> Matthew Lynch. I might add Bird's foot trefoil (lotus corniculatus) or
            >> white mustard (sinapsis alba) or meadow fescue (festuca pratensis) to
            >> the mix. I like diversity :-)
            >>
            >> Steve, you said:
            >> For pasture or other broadacre design, a winter wheat/vetch/rye mixture
            >> may be appropriate.
            >>
            >> Is that a recommended mixture to sow next autumn, or can I still sow
            >> that this spring? What would you recommend to sow this spring?
            >>
            >> I'd love a recipe for comfrey salves Bekki!
            >>
            >> Thank you everyone!
            >>
            >> Ludwig
            >>
            >
            >
            >
            >
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          • vapid ness
            I d also be careful with the red clover as some varieties can be perennial and difficult to get rid of after- these may be issues with crimson clover so I d
            Message 5 of 15 , Jan 29, 2011
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              I'd also be careful with the red clover as some varieties can be perennial and difficult to get rid of after- these may be issues with crimson clover so I'd check.  There's an ok article in Farmer's Weekly interactiveon issues relating to more industrial use, based on info from Garden Organic. 
              The RHS have a page on green manures which is quite handy.  I've had ok results with tares, Phacelia, and buckwheat 25 miles south of Aberdeen, but we tend to leave it til later in the year to plant.  Phacelia was a bit thin but did  kind of valiantly struggle on.
              It'd be interesting to hear how you do if you try field lupins up your way- I think they're more suitable for industrial purposes though as they do get woody.  But they're so pretty!

              Good luck,

              Carol.


              On Sat, Jan 29, 2011 at 11:28 AM, <david.keltie@...> wrote:
               

              I'd be surprised if phaelecia would do well in north Scotland....

              On 29 Jan 2011 10:23, "robinjw13" <robinkjw@...> wrote:
              > Hi Ludwig,
              >
              > White clover is low to establish and will not grow enough in one season for your needs. Vetch is good but has to be sown in autumn. I suggest crimson clover and/or phacelia. Both will grow rapidly during the summer and phacelia in particular even after flowering will give a lot of biomass that will lie on the soil (suppressing weeds) right through autumn and in to winter. Sow from April to the end of May.
              >
              > Robin
              >
              > --- In pfaf@yahoogroups.com, Ludwig <the_pooh_way@...> wrote:
              >>
              >> /Thank you everyone for your splendid suggestions.
              >>
              >> /Comfrey is indeed my favorite mulching and companion plant. It grows so
              >> well with trees. I use /Symphytum x uplandicum/, Russian Comfrey,
              >> bocking 14. Like Frank pointed out, it is an infertile hybrid. It is
              >> easily divided and propagated. But it won't turn up where you don't want it.
              >>
              >> I am looking for something else than comfrey, cause were I want to sow
              >> these green manures this year, I want to grow vegetables next year.
              >>
              >>
              >> Seems white clover, yarrow, borage, oats and alfalfa are recommended by
              >> Matthew Lynch. I might add Bird's foot trefoil (lotus corniculatus) or
              >> white mustard (sinapsis alba) or meadow fescue (festuca pratensis) to
              >> the mix. I like diversity :-)
              >>
              >> Steve, you said:
              >> For pasture or other broadacre design, a winter wheat/vetch/rye mixture
              >> may be appropriate.
              >>
              >> Is that a recommended mixture to sow next autumn, or can I still sow
              >> that this spring? What would you recommend to sow this spring?
              >>
              >> I'd love a recipe for comfrey salves Bekki!
              >>
              >> Thank you everyone!
              >>
              >> Ludwig
              >>
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              > <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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              >
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              >

            • travelerinthyme
              Here in Texas, where it s too hot for clover or comfrey, we grow buckwheat for summer ground cover. It s an annual, but reseeds freely, and adds lots of
              Message 6 of 15 , Jan 30, 2011
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                Here in Texas, where it's too hot for clover or comfrey, we grow buckwheat for summer ground cover. It's an annual, but reseeds freely, and adds lots of phosphorous to our black gumbo/limestone alkaline soils.

                In the winter, there is a low groundcover that I think is dead nettle, very soft and cushy to walk on, I call it "mulch weed", that dies out in late spring leaving nice, brown, springy mulch on the ground, and it looks so pretty growing all over the garden and back yard, spilling over the rock walls and covering the pathways.

                ~Traveler in Thyme, zone 8-9
              • Jonathan Teller-Elsberg
                If you want something for a single year only, I recommend buckwheat. It is famed for growing fast and producing great volumes of biomass. Its fast growth also
                Message 7 of 15 , Jan 30, 2011
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                  If you want something for a single year only, I recommend buckwheat. It is famed for growing fast and producing great volumes of biomass. Its fast growth also helps to suppress weeds. It grows fast enough that, often, you can grow more than one successive crops in a single season, which would give you double or triple the biomass to till into the soil. It doesn't fix nitrogen, so you might want to add an N-fixer to the mix; but neither (to my knowledge) is it a heavy feeder, so even without an N-fixer alongside it, it shouldn't deplete the soil's fertility, certainly not from a single season's use. And if you like, you could potentially harvest a crop of the buckwheat groats in the process.

                  Cheers!
                  Jonathan

                  --
                  "We have changed the world, and we wonder why things won't stay the same." -Les Lanyon
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