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Re: [pfaf] new member (Yerba Mate)

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  • Anna Fraser
    I wonder if the plant Veronica mentioned and which was further identified by the wonderful Geir (Lagenaria vulgaris or L. siceraria, bottle gourd, Calebash
    Message 1 of 9 , Aug 14, 2006
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      I wonder if the plant Veronica mentioned and which was further identified by the wonderful Geir (Lagenaria vulgaris or L. siceraria, bottle gourd, Calebash gourd) is involved in the preparation of Yerba mate tea, because this tea is traditionally prepared in a gourd. I seem to remember having heard that the word 'mate' may mean ' gourd', but am not sure of that as I don't speak Spanish or Portugese. I'm just guessing but I wonder if Yerba Mate actually means "Gourd Herb"? Maybe our South American friends can tell us?
      First the leaves are dried, toasted (to release the natural enzymes) and crushed. They are then put in a gourd (L. vulgaris?) and a little cold water is added to wet the leaves. This protects the nutrients and flavour somewhat, rather then pouring hot water on it straight away. Next hot water is added to cover the leaves completely. You don't drink straight from the gourd, but through a straw, called a 'bombadilla', which has some some sort of strainer-type thing at the bottom. There are many traditional rules for the drinking of Yerba Mate. The one who makes the tea drinks the gourd empty first. This is supposed to be doing the others a favour as the taste can be quite strong, since the gourd may be filled for about 50-75% with leaves. Hot water is added again and the gourd is passed on to the next person. Again, all the liquid is drunk until the straw makes a gurgling sound, as many consider it rude to leave liquid in the bottom. More hot water is added and the next person drinks, and so on until there is no taste left and also all the medicinal qualities of the leaves will have been extracted.
      There seem to be several other rules as well, for example, you must never stir the tea and leaves in the gourd with the bombadilla.
      The whole traditional Yerba Mate procedure has been compared with other social rituals in other parts of the world, such as smoking the peace pipe or the Japanese tea ceremony.

      Our European Holly (Ilex aquifolium) is a close relative of Yerba Mate (Ilex paraguayensis) and has also been widely used to make a medicinal tea. The people of the Black Forest in Germany used Holly formerly as their most common beverage, just like we drink Indian tea these days.

      Anna Fraser (Hummingtree)
      www.the-tree.org.uk


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Javier Cosp
      To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 9:13 PM
      Subject: Re: [pfaf] new member (Yerba Mate)



      Veronica:

      I am from Paraguay. We drink a lot of Yerba Mate around here. I think the
      scientific name is "ilex paraguayensis". I have a small tree in our farm.
      Are we talking about the same tree?

      Maybe you can get info in www.herbotecnia.com.ar or www.sagpya.mecon.gov.ar

      Javier Cosp
      Asuncion
      Paraguay


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: veronica giselle lescano
      To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 3:46 PM
      Subject: [pfaf] new member



      Hello,
      my name is Veronica and I have just became a member of this list,
      I have been trying to find information about a plant, which scientific name is lagenaria vulgaris, this is famous in South america because it is used in the process to obtain yerba mate ( a well known drink ), do you konw something about this plant or have any idea where can I get information????
      thanks a lot
      kind regards
      Veronica


      ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Preguntá. Respondé. Descubrí.
      Todo lo que querías saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
      está en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
      Probalo ya!





      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------


      Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
      Checked by AVG Free Edition.
      Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/411 - Release Date: 07/08/2006


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Javier Cosp
      Anna: I understand now.....Lagenaria vulgaris o siceraria is the plant that produces the gourd and ilex paraguayensis is the tea. OK You explained very well
      Message 2 of 9 , Aug 14, 2006
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        Anna:

        I understand now.....Lagenaria vulgaris o siceraria is the plant that produces the
        gourd and ilex paraguayensis is the tea. OK

        You explained very well the social culture that goes around the way to drink Yerba Mate.

        Here in Paraguay is a little diferent. Our country is so hot that we drink it with water very
        cold. (except in winter when we drink it hot - But we are having a very hot winter this year,
        36 C today). We call it "terere" when the water is cold, and "mate" when the water is hot.
        And we dont drink it in a gourd, but in a cow horn. We mix the water with
        a lot of different herbs; the water is actually green. All the people here have a lot of knowledge
        about medicinal herbs. Another cultural rule is that the least important person in the group
        serves the terere o mate. The social piramid begins in top with the bosses (male and female), then
        any other man, then women, and finally children. I know this is not "politically correct" but
        that is our guarani culture.

        I think "mate" means "gourd" but I am not 100% sure.

        Javier Cosp
        Paraguay




        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Anna Fraser
        To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 6:02 PM
        Subject: Re: [pfaf] new member (Yerba Mate)


        I wonder if the plant Veronica mentioned and which was further identified by the wonderful Geir (Lagenaria vulgaris or L. siceraria, bottle gourd, Calebash gourd) is involved in the preparation of Yerba mate tea, because this tea is traditionally prepared in a gourd. I seem to remember having heard that the word 'mate' may mean ' gourd', but am not sure of that as I don't speak Spanish or Portugese. I'm just guessing but I wonder if Yerba Mate actually means "Gourd Herb"? Maybe our South American friends can tell us?
        First the leaves are dried, toasted (to release the natural enzymes) and crushed. They are then put in a gourd (L. vulgaris?) and a little cold water is added to wet the leaves. This protects the nutrients and flavour somewhat, rather then pouring hot water on it straight away. Next hot water is added to cover the leaves completely. You don't drink straight from the gourd, but through a straw, called a 'bombadilla', which has some some sort of strainer-type thing at the bottom. There are many traditional rules for the drinking of Yerba Mate. The one who makes the tea drinks the gourd empty first. This is supposed to be doing the others a favour as the taste can be quite strong, since the gourd may be filled for about 50-75% with leaves. Hot water is added again and the gourd is passed on to the next person. Again, all the liquid is drunk until the straw makes a gurgling sound, as many consider it rude to leave liquid in the bottom. More hot water is added and the next person drinks, and so on until there is no taste left and also all the medicinal qualities of the leaves will have been extracted.
        There seem to be several other rules as well, for example, you must never stir the tea and leaves in the gourd with the bombadilla.
        The whole traditional Yerba Mate procedure has been compared with other social rituals in other parts of the world, such as smoking the peace pipe or the Japanese tea ceremony.

        Our European Holly (Ilex aquifolium) is a close relative of Yerba Mate (Ilex paraguayensis) and has also been widely used to make a medicinal tea. The people of the Black Forest in Germany used Holly formerly as their most common beverage, just like we drink Indian tea these days.

        Anna Fraser (Hummingtree)
        www.the-tree.org.uk

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Javier Cosp
        To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 9:13 PM
        Subject: Re: [pfaf] new member (Yerba Mate)

        Veronica:

        I am from Paraguay. We drink a lot of Yerba Mate around here. I think the
        scientific name is "ilex paraguayensis". I have a small tree in our farm.
        Are we talking about the same tree?

        Maybe you can get info in www.herbotecnia.com.ar or www.sagpya.mecon.gov.ar

        Javier Cosp
        Asuncion
        Paraguay

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: veronica giselle lescano
        To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 3:46 PM
        Subject: [pfaf] new member

        Hello,
        my name is Veronica and I have just became a member of this list,
        I have been trying to find information about a plant, which scientific name is lagenaria vulgaris, this is famous in South america because it is used in the process to obtain yerba mate ( a well known drink ), do you konw something about this plant or have any idea where can I get information????
        thanks a lot
        kind regards
        Veronica

        ----------------------------------------------------------
        Preguntá. Respondé. Descubrí.
        Todo lo que querías saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
        está en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
        Probalo ya!

        ----------------------------------------------------------

        Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
        Checked by AVG Free Edition.
        Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/411 - Release Date: 07/08/2006

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • veronica giselle lescano
        Anna , About lagenaria vulgaris, this is neither the seed nor the gourd, this is a plant in which the seed is stored to develope for a period of time until
        Message 3 of 9 , Aug 15, 2006
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          Anna ,
          About lagenaria vulgaris, this is neither the seed nor the gourd, this is a plant in which the seed is stored to develope for a period of time until the plant gets matuare enough to be swon on land to complete its growing process ,
          I´m looking for information about where to obtain lagenaria vulgaris seeds, conditions of growing , or any work made with it.
          Once, the plant has grown , its leaves are used to prepare the drink or "mate ",
          through a process in which leaves a dried, etc untill to get a mixture made of a podwer , that is mixed with water inside a glass or recipient called gourd or "mate", this one can be made of wood mainly and other materials , but this is not a calabash although it look like one, I hope to have given a good description ,
          Regards
          Veronica

          Anna Fraser <anna.heh@...> escribió:
          I wonder if the plant Veronica mentioned and which was further identified by the wonderful Geir (Lagenaria vulgaris or L. siceraria, bottle gourd, Calebash gourd) is involved in the preparation of Yerba mate tea, because this tea is traditionally prepared in a gourd. I seem to remember having heard that the word 'mate' may mean ' gourd', but am not sure of that as I don't speak Spanish or Portugese. I'm just guessing but I wonder if Yerba Mate actually means "Gourd Herb"? Maybe our South American friends can tell us?
          First the leaves are dried, toasted (to release the natural enzymes) and crushed. They are then put in a gourd (L. vulgaris?) and a little cold water is added to wet the leaves. This protects the nutrients and flavour somewhat, rather then pouring hot water on it straight away. Next hot water is added to cover the leaves completely. You don't drink straight from the gourd, but through a straw, called a 'bombadilla', which has some some sort of strainer-type thing at the bottom. There are many traditional rules for the drinking of Yerba Mate. The one who makes the tea drinks the gourd empty first. This is supposed to be doing the others a favour as the taste can be quite strong, since the gourd may be filled for about 50-75% with leaves. Hot water is added again and the gourd is passed on to the next person. Again, all the liquid is drunk until the straw makes a gurgling sound, as many consider it rude to leave liquid in the bottom. More hot water is added and the next
          person drinks, and so on until there is no taste left and also all the medicinal qualities of the leaves will have been extracted.
          There seem to be several other rules as well, for example, you must never stir the tea and leaves in the gourd with the bombadilla.
          The whole traditional Yerba Mate procedure has been compared with other social rituals in other parts of the world, such as smoking the peace pipe or the Japanese tea ceremony.

          Our European Holly (Ilex aquifolium) is a close relative of Yerba Mate (Ilex paraguayensis) and has also been widely used to make a medicinal tea. The people of the Black Forest in Germany used Holly formerly as their most common beverage, just like we drink Indian tea these days.

          Anna Fraser (Hummingtree)
          www.the-tree.org.uk

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Javier Cosp
          To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 9:13 PM
          Subject: Re: [pfaf] new member (Yerba Mate)

          Veronica:

          I am from Paraguay. We drink a lot of Yerba Mate around here. I think the
          scientific name is "ilex paraguayensis". I have a small tree in our farm.
          Are we talking about the same tree?

          Maybe you can get info in www.herbotecnia.com.ar or www.sagpya.mecon.gov.ar

          Javier Cosp
          Asuncion
          Paraguay

          ----- Original Message -----
          From: veronica giselle lescano
          To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 3:46 PM
          Subject: [pfaf] new member

          Hello,
          my name is Veronica and I have just became a member of this list,
          I have been trying to find information about a plant, which scientific name is lagenaria vulgaris, this is famous in South america because it is used in the process to obtain yerba mate ( a well known drink ), do you konw something about this plant or have any idea where can I get information????
          thanks a lot
          kind regards
          Veronica

          ----------------------------------------------------------
          Preguntá. Respondé. Descubrí.
          Todo lo que querías saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
          está en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
          Probalo ya!

          ----------------------------------------------------------

          Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
          Checked by AVG Free Edition.
          Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/411 - Release Date: 07/08/2006

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






          ---------------------------------
          Preguntá. Respondé. Descubrí.
          Todo lo que querías saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
          está en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
          Probalo ya!

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Anna Fraser
          Hi Javier, Thank you for your very interesting message! Guess that with a name like Ilex paraguayensis the drink and the traditional ceremony is likely to
          Message 4 of 9 , Aug 15, 2006
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            Hi Javier, Thank you for your very interesting message!
            Guess that with a name like Ilex paraguayensis the drink and the traditional ceremony is likely to have originated in your country! Sounds wonderful that so many people there are still are aware of the healing properties of plants and presumably also their spirits. Here so many of our human brothers and sisters have lost that important connection, although I think we will have to relearn it before long.
            I wonder if your present hot winter is an unusual phenomenon in Paraguay? It makes me dread to think how hot your summers might be! May your terere keep you cool and healthy!
            Greetings to you from the green hills of Wales, where today it is around 21 C, rainy and cloudy - a few weeks away from the end of our summer, Anna



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • sally neville
            Veronica, I m not certain l. vulgaris is the same as l.siceraria, but seeds of l. siceraria are available from Baker Creek Heirloom Seed Co, Blossom Farm
            Message 5 of 9 , Aug 16, 2006
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              Veronica, I'm not certain l. vulgaris is the same as l.siceraria, but seeds of l. siceraria are available from Baker Creek Heirloom Seed Co, Blossom Farm Perennials & Herbs, J.L. Hudson Seedsman, Onalee's Home-Grown Seeds & Plants. Seeds purchaseable from these companies' websites. I found this information on Daves Garden Website (http://davesgarden.com/ps/go/73599/). I hope this is useful to you. Sally (Neville)

              veronica giselle lescano <vg_lescano@...> wrote: Anna ,
              About lagenaria vulgaris, this is neither the seed nor the gourd, this is a plant in which the seed is stored to develope for a period of time until the plant gets matuare enough to be swon on land to complete its growing process ,
              I´m looking for information about where to obtain lagenaria vulgaris seeds, conditions of growing , or any work made with it.
              Once, the plant has grown , its leaves are used to prepare the drink or "mate ",
              through a process in which leaves a dried, etc untill to get a mixture made of a podwer , that is mixed with water inside a glass or recipient called gourd or "mate", this one can be made of wood mainly and other materials , but this is not a calabash although it look like one, I hope to have given a good description ,
              Regards
              Veronica

              Anna Fraser <anna.heh@...> escribió:
              I wonder if the plant Veronica mentioned and which was further identified by the wonderful Geir (Lagenaria vulgaris or L. siceraria, bottle gourd, Calebash gourd) is involved in the preparation of Yerba mate tea, because this tea is traditionally prepared in a gourd. I seem to remember having heard that the word 'mate' may mean ' gourd', but am not sure of that as I don't speak Spanish or Portugese. I'm just guessing but I wonder if Yerba Mate actually means "Gourd Herb"? Maybe our South American friends can tell us?
              First the leaves are dried, toasted (to release the natural enzymes) and crushed. They are then put in a gourd (L. vulgaris?) and a little cold water is added to wet the leaves. This protects the nutrients and flavour somewhat, rather then pouring hot water on it straight away. Next hot water is added to cover the leaves completely. You don't drink straight from the gourd, but through a straw, called a 'bombadilla', which has some some sort of strainer-type thing at the bottom. There are many traditional rules for the drinking of Yerba Mate. The one who makes the tea drinks the gourd empty first. This is supposed to be doing the others a favour as the taste can be quite strong, since the gourd may be filled for about 50-75% with leaves. Hot water is added again and the gourd is passed on to the next person. Again, all the liquid is drunk until the straw makes a gurgling sound, as many consider it rude to leave liquid in the bottom. More hot water is added and the next
              person drinks, and so on until there is no taste left and also all the medicinal qualities of the leaves will have been extracted.
              There seem to be several other rules as well, for example, you must never stir the tea and leaves in the gourd with the bombadilla.
              The whole traditional Yerba Mate procedure has been compared with other social rituals in other parts of the world, such as smoking the peace pipe or the Japanese tea ceremony.

              Our European Holly (Ilex aquifolium) is a close relative of Yerba Mate (Ilex paraguayensis) and has also been widely used to make a medicinal tea. The people of the Black Forest in Germany used Holly formerly as their most common beverage, just like we drink Indian tea these days.

              Anna Fraser (Hummingtree)
              www.the-tree.org.uk

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Javier Cosp
              To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 9:13 PM
              Subject: Re: [pfaf] new member (Yerba Mate)

              Veronica:

              I am from Paraguay. We drink a lot of Yerba Mate around here. I think the
              scientific name is "ilex paraguayensis". I have a small tree in our farm.
              Are we talking about the same tree?

              Maybe you can get info in www.herbotecnia.com.ar or www.sagpya.mecon.gov.ar

              Javier Cosp
              Asuncion
              Paraguay

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: veronica giselle lescano
              To: pfaf@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 3:46 PM
              Subject: [pfaf] new member

              Hello,
              my name is Veronica and I have just became a member of this list,
              I have been trying to find information about a plant, which scientific name is lagenaria vulgaris, this is famous in South america because it is used in the process to obtain yerba mate ( a well known drink ), do you konw something about this plant or have any idea where can I get information????
              thanks a lot
              kind regards
              Veronica

              ----------------------------------------------------------
              Preguntá. Respondé. Descubrí.
              Todo lo que querías saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
              está en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
              Probalo ya!

              ----------------------------------------------------------

              Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
              Checked by AVG Free Edition.
              Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/411 - Release Date: 07/08/2006

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


              ---------------------------------
              Preguntá. Respondé. Descubrí.
              Todo lo que querías saber, y lo que ni imaginabas,
              está en Yahoo! Respuestas (Beta).
              Probalo ya!

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Anna Fraser
              Hi Veronica, I don t really know that much about Yerba Mate, being a British medical herbalist. Just came accross it when I studied Holly and found out some of
              Message 6 of 9 , Aug 16, 2006
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                Hi Veronica,

                I don't really know that much about Yerba Mate, being a British medical herbalist. Just came accross it when I studied Holly and found out some of the basics of its sister plant from the same family that is so extensively used in South America and has been called "The Green Gold", because of its beneficial properties and the many social ceremonies connected with it.
                Nevertheless, I wonder if you may not have the right information Veronica and confuse the Lagenaria leaves with those of Yerba Mate?
                I looked around on the Internet and found that it is actually the seed of Yerba Mate (Ilex paraguensis), which is protected by a special process, until the young trees can begin to be harvested for their leaves:
                "The seeds of the Yerba sit in cotton until the plant is about 7 cm, then it is transferred to the breeding ground. There, protected, it must mature from nine months to a year before going to its definitive destiny. But still it will take another section of four years - during which they will still protect it with a canopy or "poncho" from the inclemencies of the time, so that it begins to render or yield."
                (From a website that has a nice overview of the Yerba Mate tradition. Click on the link to see for yourself:
                http://www.thebestyerbamate.com/history.html)
                The Lagenaria Gourd were used in the old days by the Guarani People to brew the leaves in, but these leaves were not Yerba Mate leaves!
                You can explore the cultivation of Lagenaria on various websites by using this Google Search Link:
                http://www.google.com/search?svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&rls=GEUA,GEUA:2005-42,GEUA:en&q=lagenaria%20%2B%20cultivation&btnG=Search&sa=N&tab=iw

                Some examples of websites that sell Lagenaria seeds. There are many more, which you can find by doing a search on www.google.com
                http://www.nickys-nursery.co.uk/seeds/pages/page6-gourds.htm
                http://www.wuvie.net/seedslist.htm
                http://www.banana-tree.com/Product_Detail~category~6~Product_ID~164.cfm
                http://www.horizonherbs.com/group.asp?grp=45&pgNUM=7

                Hope you can find all the information you need. Good luck!

                Anna Fraser


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Anna Fraser
                Forget to add the link that gives information on how to prepare the gourd: http://www.thebestyerbamate.com/prep.html Anna Fraser [Non-text portions of this
                Message 7 of 9 , Aug 16, 2006
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                  Forget to add the link that gives information on how to prepare the gourd:
                  http://www.thebestyerbamate.com/prep.html

                  Anna Fraser

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • caribe704
                  theres a Brazillian store on 441 and Atlantic next to the Harbor Frieght store you can get CHEAP bulk Yerba Mate,infusers gourd, the whole mess CHEAP I go the
                  Message 8 of 9 , Aug 16, 2006
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                    theres a Brazillian store on 441 and Atlantic next to the Harbor
                    Frieght store you can get CHEAP bulk Yerba Mate,infusers gourd, the
                    whole mess CHEAP I go the all the time!!!
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