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Re: [pfaf] Perennial cabbages and Kales

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  • Griselda
    Just as a matter of interest, sea kale grows in deep shingle or sand banks by the south coast here in England, in what look like the most inhospitable
    Message 1 of 6 , Jan 9, 2006
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      Re: [pfaf] Perennial cabbages and Kales Just as a matter of interest, sea kale grows in deep shingle or sand banks by the south coast here in England, in what look like the most inhospitable conditions – salt air, shifting soil, storms, summer drought.....they root very very deeply to hold their place and to reach fresh water, just a few yards from the sea.   We pick very young leaves from the centre of the plants as they emerge in spring, keeping a wary lookout for how large the plant’s spread is.....dogs are unlikely to have peed in the middle of very large plants....   Also the leaves are so thick and tough they are inedible once they get much bigger than a hand’s span.  Still - it is ‘free’ food.    Cooks like old-fashioned cabbage and tastes very rich, as if it had a lot of iron in it, or minerals.




      Happy New Year everyone. Like me you are probably busy planning the
      planting and ordering seed.

      Is anyone familiar with any perennial brassicas?

      I have a couple of Crambe maritima, or seakale, in their first
      winter.

      I have come across discussions in French forums (or is that fora or
      foros) of Chou Daubenton, a perennial that only rarely flowers and
      is generally propagated by root cuttings. I have never seen it
      mentioned in British or US literature or groups. While I await seed
      from Francoise, in Ste Genevieve des Bois, near Paris, does anybody
      have any experience of it? I think it is Brassica oleracea v.
      ramosa.

      Ragged Jack kale is sometimes called perennial, also sometimes
      classified as B. o. v. ramosa. It is rare under that name, but some
      catalogues have it as a synonym for red russian kale. Can that be
      right, or are there two varieties masquerading as red russian? Any
      thoughts or experience?

      And how about Nine Star Broccoli? This most closely fits the
      description of Daubenton, except that it is a shortlived perennial
      and commonly flowers if the cauliflower like shoots are not picked.
      Anyone grown that?

      I am in USDA zone 5-6, rhubarb and perennial onions make it through,
      and I think the perennial brassicas will be toucha nd go, but I
      would like to try.

      Look forward to hearing your experience with these crops.

      Adam.









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    • papaloquelites
      ... Hi, Chris: Are those a particular variety of collard, a local heirloom, or regualr varieties that performa as perennials in your hands? Adam.
      Message 2 of 6 , Jan 10, 2006
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        --- In pfaf@yahoogroups.com, Christopher Shanks <ch_shanks@h...> wrote:
        >
        > We grow perennnial collards in P-N-west.
        > Cold hardy to at least zone 7 USDA.
        >
        >

        >
        Hi, Chris:

        Are those a particular variety of collard, a local heirloom, or
        regualr varieties that performa as perennials in your hands?

        Adam.
      • Geir Flatabø
        I have no experience with the ones you mention, but I have a few others to mention that survives very well here in cold Norway , they are Crambe cordifolia, -
        Message 3 of 6 , Jan 10, 2006
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          I have no experience with the ones you mention,
          but I have a few others to mention that survives very well here in "cold
          Norway",
          they are
          Crambe cordifolia, - - Tartar sea kale,(Tatarkål) absolutely hardy and
          Bunias orientalis - Turkish Rocket (Russekål) also absolutely hardy and
          both easy to grow.

          Among the Brassicas s str, I guess varieties of Brusselsprouts and
          kales - curly leaved are the most winter hardy here, but only seldom
          enduring the whole, winter.

          Geir Flatabø


          > Happy New Year everyone. Like me you are probably busy planning the
          >
          > planting and ordering seed.
          >
          > Is anyone familiar with any perennial brassicas?
          >
          > I have a couple of Crambe maritima, or seakale, in their first
          > winter.
          >
          > I have come across discussions in French forums (or is that fora or
          > foros) of Chou Daubenton, a perennial that only rarely flowers and
          > is generally propagated by root cuttings. I have never seen it
          > mentioned in British or US literature or groups. While I await seed
          > X-Hotmail-From: from Francoise, in Ste Genevieve des Bois, near
          > Paris, does anybody
          > have any experience of it? I think it is Brassica oleracea v.
          > ramosa.
          >
          > Ragged Jack kale is sometimes called perennial, also sometimes
          > classified as B. o. v. ramosa. It is rare under that name, but some
          > catalogues have it as a synonym for red russian kale. Can that be
          > right, or are there two varieties masquerading as red russian? Any
          > thoughts or experience?
          >
          > And how about Nine Star Broccoli? This most closely fits the
          > description of Daubenton, except that it is a shortlived perennial
          > and commonly flowers if the cauliflower like shoots are not picked.
          > Anyone grown that?
          >
          > I am in USDA zone 5-6, rhubarb and perennial onions make it through,
          > and I think the perennial brassicas will be toucha nd go, but I
          > would like to try.
          >
          > Look forward to hearing your experience with these crops.
          >
          > Adam.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
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        • papaloquelites
          Hi, Geir, and Steven.... I have Crambe maritima, just going into its first winter, so we shall see. I only got a few seeds from a seed saver,they may have
          Message 4 of 6 , Jan 10, 2006
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            Hi, Geir, and Steven....


            I have Crambe maritima, just going into its first winter, so we
            shall see. I only got a few seeds from a seed saver,they may have
            been old and were not very lively. They were aloso hard to
            germinate (I did scarify the hard seed coat) which of course may
            reflect their undomesticated nature.

            I have wanted to try Bunias orientalis, but one seed saver who
            offered it had run out, and another sent me seed that grew out as
            Rumex acetosus, garden sorrel. If anyone has seed please let me
            know (I have several interesting things to offer in exchange).

            The other Crambe species I have not come across; I will be trying
            nine star this year.

            The Brassicas have wide range of behaviors, many of the Asian types
            flower if you just cough near them, the old English sprouting
            broccolies (OK how do u pluralise broccoli, broccolollies, I feel a
            thread coming on, and do not say it is already plural)that
            overwinter, effectively bi-ennials, and clearly some perennials
            under at least some conditions.

            Your comments are all very interesting, thank you. Adam.
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