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Re: Are you using Win32::GuiTest?

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  • Piotr Kaluski
    Hi Gabor, This is a very good post and a good question, which may stimulate the discussion on what is going to be a future of Win32::GuiTest. I am using
    Message 1 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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      Hi Gabor,
      This is a very good post and a good question, which may stimulate the
      discussion on what is going to be a future of Win32::GuiTest.
      I am using Win32::GuiTest in real life in automation of tests of
      application written in VC++.

      I see the followin factors which will have a serious impact on
      Win32::GuiTest popularity:
      1. Win32::GuiTest usefulness - it depends on the tool itself. For my
      purposes it is sufficient and I am really happy, with features it
      gives me. Despite the fact that it misses some basic functions for
      data setting/getting for important, well known controls, there are
      workarounds. Moreover, I have observed, that it is safer to set
      controls values simulating key strokes and mouse clicks, since they
      generate all side effects, generated during human interaction.

      2. Popularity of VC++.
      Win32::GuiTest is best suited for automating programs written in VC++
      or VB. It has limited use for java and web browsers based
      applications. It also may have some problems with .net apps (I have no
      practical experience in this area). I believe population of
      applications written in VC++ will decrease. There still would be quite
      a few of them, but I expect that almost none of new projects will
      choose VC++ as their development language. VC++ will play the same
      role as cobol played 20 years ago - there will be a high demand for
      developers knowning it, but no company will decide to choose it as a
      language for developing something from scratch. At least in the area
      of business applications. In system programming C, C++ and VC++ will
      probably be indispensible for a very, very long time.
      If it occurs that there is no way of making Win32::GuiTest a viable
      option of dealing with .net applications, Win32::GuiTest future will
      be tightly bound with the future of VC++ and Win32 api programming.


      I may be wrong, as most IT related predictions are.

      It would be good to hear voices from people using it in real life test
      automation.
      In the most recent version of Win32::GuiTest documentation I have
      added some encouragement to share experience. This sharing may be
      beneficial for all of us.

      --Piotr



      --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Gabor Szabo" <szabgab@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi,
      >
      > during my classes "Perl for QA professionals" - among many other
      > things - I have been teaching how to use Win32::GuiTest for more than
      > 2 years now. I am also a "maintainer" of the module though I have
      > worked on it very little.
      > On the other habd I have never needed it in real life projects as
      most of my
      > work is done on Linux.
      >
      > I also see very low traffic on the mailing list so I wonder if you
      > people are using it.
      > I very much would like to know if there are real life uses of the
      > module out there?
      > If you are using it, what are you doing with it?
      >
      > If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
      > GUI, what other
      > tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?
      >
      > Gabor
      >
    • chrs_mcmhn
      ... I use it occasionally in conjunction with Watir to handle popup windows. I still think Perl Win32::GuiTest is the best solution for them, although the
      Message 2 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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        > If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
        > GUI, what other
        > tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?

        I use it occasionally in conjunction with Watir to handle popup
        windows. I still think Perl Win32::GuiTest is the best solution for
        them, although the Watir people are making improvements to that.

        Also, we are very slowly porting it to Ruby:
        http://rubyforge.org/projects/guitest/
      • brentje
        I ve been lurking lately due to health issues, but I am in the middle of creating a package for testing the software we develop at work. Mind you, it is a .Net
        Message 3 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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          I've been lurking lately due to health issues, but I am in the middle
          of creating a package for testing the software we develop at work.
          Mind you, it is a .Net program, and Win32::GUITest was not made for
          .Net but I'm the stubborn type. I've had to create a lot of pure Perl
          calls using SendMessage, which I'd be happy to give to the project, to
          get the information that I needed. For the most part, it works. It's
          a little memory intensive, but I think that's more because of my
          design and my lack of understand how to streamline Perl code. Some
          things I can't do yet (want to know that check status of a .Net
          checkbox? False. Always false.), but I've come up with workarounds.
          By the time I have the majority of the test scripts written, I hope
          to have the following functionally:

          Screenshots using Win32::Screenshot (dibSect just wasn't enough)

          Logging with Log4Perl

          A function that searches for a field by it label, and for a field by
          it's X/Y coordinates.

          Get and Set functions to use the info from the field search.

          A rough way of handling .Net main and popup menus.

          A revised SendKeys function that ignores the special characters (try
          using GUITest to enter (this) into a text field, brackets and all).

          Some sort of OCR or something to read values from a report that the
          .Net application generates.

          Verifying DB entries.

          Get and Set functions for the following:

          Treeview (problem I had with this has been fixed though)
          Listbox
          Combobox
          DateTimePicker
          MonthCal (WEEEEEE! That was a fun one...)
          More to come here as needed...

          As well, various functions for simplifying getting control
          coordinates, clicking controls, clearing controls, moving the mouse in
          a more human like fashion, date manulation functions, clearing fields,
          and a few DB related functions. I know some of this are really tied
          to my program and can't be included in GUITest, and some functions are
          .Net only. But yes, I am using it and it has been responsible for
          finding bugs that I've personally overlooked. As a regression testing
          suite, it's incomplete but still useful. Hope to see more progress in
          the years to come.

          Brent

          --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Gabor Szabo" <szabgab@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi,
          >
          > during my classes "Perl for QA professionals" - among many other
          > things - I have been teaching how to use Win32::GuiTest for more than
          > 2 years now. I am also a "maintainer" of the module though I have
          > worked on it very little.
          > On the other habd I have never needed it in real life projects as
          most of my
          > work is done on Linux.
          >
          > I also see very low traffic on the mailing list so I wonder if you
          > people are using it.
          > I very much would like to know if there are real life uses of the
          > module out there?
          > If you are using it, what are you doing with it?
          >
          > If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
          > GUI, what other
          > tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?
          >
          > Gabor
          >
        • y_s_geo
          ... We are using Compuware s QARun , which is not supported anymore , but still works for 90% of all GUI application in our company. I have implemented a small
          Message 4 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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            >
            > > If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
            > > GUI, what other
            > > tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?
            > >
            > > Gabor
            > >
            >
            We are using Compuware's QARun , which is not supported anymore , but
            still works for 90% of all GUI application in our company.
            I have implemented a small code snippet using SendKeys func and
            recognizing several Windows in order just to minimize them ; )

            The next move will be to start closing / killing crashed applications
            by just recognizing the crashed dialogboxes and / or windows

            Yet I assume, that the possibilities of this module are allmost
            endless if you could combine the glueness of perl + other profecional
            WinGUI test automation tool and / or java GUI automation tool ...
          • Earthlink-m_ryan
            ... I use the Win32::GuiTest module to interact with the MLS database in Northern Virginia. I have found no other way to negotiate the website and use the
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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              Gabor wrote:

              >I very much would like to know if there are real life uses of the module out there? If you are using it, what are you doing with it?

              I use the Win32::GuiTest module to interact with the MLS database in Northern Virginia. I have found no other way to negotiate the website and use the Javascript actions on the pages necessary to retrieve the data I need for my website.
              I control an instance of IExplorer in order to navigate through seven pages to export a search result from listings available on the real estate website. This program runs from task manager once every two hours and is a life saver for updating my database.

              I get occasional mistakes with SendKeys but not so bad as to make me turn my back on the module.


              Matthew Ryan
              703-642-2651
              Administrator/Realtor
              RE/MAX CitySide
              7700 Little River Tpke #305
              Annandale, VA 22003

              http://www.ListingMap.net

              *We will never share your email with anyone without your consent.
              *reply with the word 'remove' in the subject line to stop receiving emails from us.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Danny R. Faught
              I have written a monkey test for one of my clients that randomly clicks on their application until it crashes. It found several bugs, though they tend to be
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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                I have written a "monkey test" for one of my clients that randomly
                clicks on their application until it crashes. It found several bugs,
                though they tend to be difficult to reproduce. It's based on a monkey
                test script I found on a web site, and it relies on Win32::GuiTest. I
                ought to write a paper about it some day.

                I haven't had the opportunity to do reliability testing for that client
                lately, so I haven't used the GuiTest module for six months+.

                I do see a lot of interest from testers in having a free GUI test tool,
                but most them are not programmers and really want something like with
                the features and robustness of WinRunner, which we're a long way from.

                -Danny
              • Amit Dixit
                Hi, In our company we have test automation framework for UI testing we are using Wub32::GuiTest and so far its rocking:-). Thanks, Amit
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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                  Hi,

                  In our company we have test automation framework for
                  UI testing we are using Wub32::GuiTest and so far its
                  rocking:-).

                  Thanks,

                  Amit

                  --- Gabor Szabo <szabgab@...> wrote:

                  > Hi,
                  >
                  > during my classes "Perl for QA professionals" -
                  > among many other
                  > things - I have been teaching how to use
                  > Win32::GuiTest for more than
                  > 2 years now. I am also a "maintainer" of the module
                  > though I have
                  > worked on it very little.
                  > On the other habd I have never needed it in real
                  > life projects as most of my
                  > work is done on Linux.
                  >
                  > I also see very low traffic on the mailing list so I
                  > wonder if you
                  > people are using it.
                  > I very much would like to know if there are real
                  > life uses of the
                  > module out there?
                  > If you are using it, what are you doing with it?
                  >
                  > If you are using other things to automate
                  > interaction with Windows
                  > GUI, what other
                  > tools are you using? What kind of things are you
                  > doing with that?
                  >
                  > Gabor
                  >
                • Shanmuhanathan T
                  on a related note, I have also used windows script/WSH to acheive the same ends... ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 13, 2006
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                    on a related note, I have also used windows script/WSH to acheive the
                    same ends...

                    On 11/14/06, Danny R. Faught <faught@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > I have written a "monkey test" for one of my clients that randomly
                    > clicks on their application until it crashes. It found several bugs,
                    > though they tend to be difficult to reproduce. It's based on a monkey
                    > test script I found on a web site, and it relies on Win32::GuiTest. I
                    > ought to write a paper about it some day.
                    >
                    > I haven't had the opportunity to do reliability testing for that client
                    > lately, so I haven't used the GuiTest module for six months+.
                    >
                    > I do see a lot of interest from testers in having a free GUI test tool,
                    > but most them are not programmers and really want something like with
                    > the features and robustness of WinRunner, which we're a long way from.
                    >
                    > -Danny
                    >
                    >


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Danny R. Faught
                    ... You can use AppleScript for GUI automation on OS X. I was impressed with how much automation is built in to the OS. I could have used a Perl module to
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 14, 2006
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                      >Are there any similar Perl modules for Linux and Mac OSX? I would like to
                      >automate the key pressing in some
                      >programs for these operating systems.

                      You can use AppleScript for GUI automation on OS X. I was impressed with
                      how much automation is built in to the OS. I could have used a Perl
                      module to bridge to AppleScript, but I decided that because of the
                      skimpy documentation (isn't it always?) for both AppleScript and the
                      Perl module that sits on top of it, it would be best to learn the native
                      AppleScript first.

                      I managed to use AppleScript to script several repetitive tasks in my
                      client's Mac application (which has no explicit scripting support) and
                      caused numerous crashes, many of them reproducible. But when I tried to
                      implement a random monkey test, I never quite figured out how to do it.

                      Linux has something like an X11::Guitest perl module. I haven't tried
                      it. There's also a tool called Android, which isn't object-based, so
                      I don't recommend it.

                      -Danny
                    • chrs_mcmhn
                      ... like to ... with
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 14, 2006
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                        --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Danny R. Faught" <faught@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > >Are there any similar Perl modules for Linux and Mac OSX? I would
                        like to
                        > >automate the key pressing in some
                        > >programs for these operating systems.
                        >
                        > You can use AppleScript for GUI automation on OS X. I was impressed
                        with
                        > how much automation is built in to the OS. I could have used a Perl
                        > module to bridge to AppleScript, but I decided that because of the
                        > skimpy documentation (isn't it always?) for both AppleScript and the
                        > Perl module that sits on top of it, it would be best to learn the native
                        > AppleScript first.
                        >
                        > I managed to use AppleScript to script several repetitive tasks in my
                        > client's Mac application (which has no explicit scripting support) and
                        > caused numerous crashes, many of them reproducible. But when I tried to
                        > implement a random monkey test, I never quite figured out how to do it.
                        >
                        > Linux has something like an X11::Guitest perl module. I haven't tried
                        > it. There's also a tool called Android, which isn't object-based, so
                        > I don't recommend it.
                        >
                        > -Danny
                        >
                      • chrs_mcmhn
                        ... Would that be the monkey-test script that I posted on the agile-testing wiki http://www.agilistas.org/agile/MonkeyTestingWindows and perlmonks
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 14, 2006
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                          --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Danny R. Faught" <faught@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > I have written a "monkey test" for one of my clients that randomly
                          > clicks on their application until it crashes. It found several bugs,
                          > though they tend to be difficult to reproduce. It's based on a monkey
                          > test script I found on a web site, and it relies on Win32::GuiTest. I
                          > ought to write a paper about it some day.

                          Would that be the monkey-test script that I posted on the
                          agile-testing wiki http://www.agilistas.org/agile/MonkeyTestingWindows
                          and perlmonks http://perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=357341 and
                          mentioned on the list itself
                          http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/agile-testing/message/5427 a couple
                          of years ago?
                        • enrico_1969
                          Thanks for the info. Enrique ... like to ... impressed with ... Perl ... the ... native ... my ... and ... tried to ... do it. ... tried ... so
                          Message 12 of 20 , Nov 15, 2006
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                            Thanks for the info.

                            Enrique


                            --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Danny R. Faught" <faught@...>
                            wrote:
                            >
                            > >Are there any similar Perl modules for Linux and Mac OSX? I would
                            like to
                            > >automate the key pressing in some
                            > >programs for these operating systems.
                            >
                            > You can use AppleScript for GUI automation on OS X. I was
                            impressed with
                            > how much automation is built in to the OS. I could have used a
                            Perl
                            > module to bridge to AppleScript, but I decided that because of the
                            > skimpy documentation (isn't it always?) for both AppleScript and
                            the
                            > Perl module that sits on top of it, it would be best to learn the
                            native
                            > AppleScript first.
                            >
                            > I managed to use AppleScript to script several repetitive tasks in
                            my
                            > client's Mac application (which has no explicit scripting support)
                            and
                            > caused numerous crashes, many of them reproducible. But when I
                            tried to
                            > implement a random monkey test, I never quite figured out how to
                            do it.
                            >
                            > Linux has something like an X11::Guitest perl module. I haven't
                            tried
                            > it. There's also a tool called Android, which isn't object-based,
                            so
                            > I don't recommend it.
                            >
                            > -Danny
                            >
                          • Rajeev Srivastava
                            Hi, I have started perl GUI test few days ago and I am very happy with the initial API which I am using.For demo purpose I have developed script for calculator
                            Message 13 of 20 , Nov 15, 2006
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                              Hi, I have started perl GUI test few days ago and I am very happy with the initial API which I am using.For demo purpose I have developed script for calculator testing. I am Planning for presentation in my comp after doig some more projects and real work.

                              Regards
                              Rajeev


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                            • Eric
                              I m currently using it for automating our installation program tests. We have a big, and stupid, paper checklist of stuff we have to do to make sure our
                              Message 14 of 20 , Nov 15, 2006
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                                I'm currently using it for automating our installation program
                                tests. We have a big, and stupid, paper checklist of stuff we have
                                to do to make sure our dialog boxes are still working. I'm killing
                                that with Perl. It's actually growing to become a decent-sized suite
                                using the other Perl testing libraries.

                                I'd rather use Ruby - but the Ruby windows automation project isn't
                                finished yet and I really don't have the time to put into helping out
                                with that.

                                --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Gabor Szabo" <szabgab@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Hi,
                                >
                                > during my classes "Perl for QA professionals" - among many other
                                > things - I have been teaching how to use Win32::GuiTest for more
                                than
                                > 2 years now. I am also a "maintainer" of the module though I have
                                > worked on it very little.
                                > On the other habd I have never needed it in real life projects as
                                most of my
                                > work is done on Linux.
                                >
                                > I also see very low traffic on the mailing list so I wonder if you
                                > people are using it.
                                > I very much would like to know if there are real life uses of the
                                > module out there?
                                > If you are using it, what are you doing with it?
                                >
                                > If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
                                > GUI, what other
                                > tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?
                                >
                                > Gabor
                                >
                              • kpqt01
                                Hi, I am using Win32::GuiTest (the only automation tool :) ) to test our company s vsC++ application. I found this tool about 5 months ago and loving it.
                                Message 15 of 20 , Nov 15, 2006
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                                  Hi,

                                  I am using Win32::GuiTest (the only automation tool :) ) to test our
                                  company's vsC++ application. I found this tool about 5 months ago and
                                  loving it. From basic control to advance control, I able to write
                                  mall test scripts as well as building an over all regression GUI test.
                                  This tool really give me the feeling that I know what I'm coding and
                                  in control.

                                  Thanks for the great tool.

                                  --- In perlguitest@yahoogroups.com, "Gabor Szabo" <szabgab@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Hi,
                                  >
                                  > during my classes "Perl for QA professionals" - among many other
                                  > things - I have been teaching how to use Win32::GuiTest for more than
                                  > 2 years now. I am also a "maintainer" of the module though I have
                                  > worked on it very little.
                                  > On the other habd I have never needed it in real life projects as
                                  most of my
                                  > work is done on Linux.
                                  >
                                  > I also see very low traffic on the mailing list so I wonder if you
                                  > people are using it.
                                  > I very much would like to know if there are real life uses of the
                                  > module out there?
                                  > If you are using it, what are you doing with it?
                                  >
                                  > If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
                                  > GUI, what other
                                  > tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?
                                  >
                                  > Gabor
                                  >
                                • Anand, Vaitheeswaran (IE10)
                                  Hi, I used initially and made my team also to use it. Right now I moved to another role so not doing much with it. I would suggest that if possible please
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Nov 15, 2006
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                                    Hi,

                                    I used initially and made my team also to use it. Right now I moved to
                                    another role so not doing much with it.

                                    I would suggest that if possible please share the class room material
                                    for your classes so more and more QA professionals will be benefited.

                                    Thanks for your good work.

                                    V Anand

                                    -----Original Message-----
                                    From: perlguitest@yahoogroups.com [mailto:perlguitest@yahoogroups.com]
                                    On Behalf Of Gabor Szabo
                                    Sent: Monday, November 13, 2006 12:35 PM
                                    To: perlguitest@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: [perlguitest] Are you using Win32::GuiTest?

                                    Hi,

                                    during my classes "Perl for QA professionals" - among many other
                                    things - I have been teaching how to use Win32::GuiTest for more than
                                    2 years now. I am also a "maintainer" of the module though I have
                                    worked on it very little.
                                    On the other habd I have never needed it in real life projects as most
                                    of my
                                    work is done on Linux.

                                    I also see very low traffic on the mailing list so I wonder if you
                                    people are using it.
                                    I very much would like to know if there are real life uses of the
                                    module out there?
                                    If you are using it, what are you doing with it?

                                    If you are using other things to automate interaction with Windows
                                    GUI, what other
                                    tools are you using? What kind of things are you doing with that?

                                    Gabor



                                    Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  • Gabor Szabo
                                    On 11/15/06, Anand, Vaitheeswaran (IE10) ... Though this is not the latest version, you can find the slides and the examples here:
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Nov 16, 2006
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                                      On 11/15/06, Anand, Vaitheeswaran (IE10)
                                      <Anand.Vaitheeswaran@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > I would suggest that if possible please share the class room material
                                      > for your classes so more and more QA professionals will be benefited.

                                      Though this is not the latest version, you can find the slides and the examples
                                      here: http://www.szabgab.com/perl_in_test_automation.html


                                      Gabor
                                      ps.
                                      Invitations for live training classes are welcome
                                    • Danny R. Faught
                                      ... Yes, that looks like it - Google found it for me on perlmonks.org. Thanks! I did a good deal of tweaking to make it more robust and to customize it to
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Nov 19, 2006
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                                        > 1f. Re: Are you using Win32::GuiTest?
                                        > Posted by: "chrs_mcmhn" christopher.mcmahon@... chrs_mcmhn
                                        > Would that be the monkey-test script that I posted on the
                                        > agile-testing wiki http://www.agilistas.org/agile/MonkeyTestingWindows
                                        > and perlmonks http://perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=357341 and
                                        > mentioned on the list itself
                                        > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/agile-testing/message/5427 a couple
                                        > of years ago?

                                        Yes, that looks like it - Google found it for me on perlmonks.org. Thanks! I did a good deal of tweaking to make it more robust and to customize it to dismiss the various dialogs that the particular application might pop up. It's difficult to make even a simple monkey test robust.
                                        --
                                        Danny R. Faught
                                        Tejas Software Consulting
                                        http://tejasconsulting.com/
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