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Re: [pepysdiary] About that 'other diary'

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  • Phil Gyford
    Hi Eric, I ve often wondered about Evelyn s diary, and wished there was a good home for it online. (NOT that I m suggesting I want to make one :) ). Simply
    Message 1 of 11 , Jun 4, 2012
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      Hi Eric,

      I've often wondered about Evelyn's diary, and wished there was a good home for it online. (NOT that I'm suggesting I want to make one :)    ).

      Simply making a site that had one diary entry per page, with sensible URLs, would be a really good initial target. Then I could link to them from Sam's diary entries easily!

      Adding all the contextual information is, as we all know, a never-ending additional goal...

      Feel free to drop me a line any time if there's anything I can offer advice about.

      Phil



      On 4 Jun, 2012, at 10:30, Eric Mills wrote:



      This may be an inappropriate post in which case I apologise but will soldier on nonetheless ... The other 17th Century Diarist (John Evelyn) is ripe for the Gyford Treatment ... However, and here's the rub. Dear old Pepys covered a mere 10 years ... and look at the effort and time that Phi Gyford has put in over the years - John Evelyn's diary (discovered in a clothes basket 11 years after his death) covers 60 years of pretty detailed observations.
      As a 'Teaser' I include a (carefully chosen) random sample:

      6th September, 1651. I went with my wife to St. Germains, to condole with Mr. Waller's loss. I carried with me and treated at dinner that excellent and pious person the Dean of St. Paul's, Dr. Stewart, and Sir Lewis Dives (half-brother to the Earl of Bristol), who entertained us with his wonderful escape out of prison in Whitehall, the very evening before he was to have been put to death, leaping down out of a jakes two stories high into the Thames at high water, in the coldest of winter, and at night; so as by swimming he got to a boat that attended for him, though he was guarded by six musketeers. After this, he went about in women's habit, and then in a small-coal-man's, traveling 200 miles on foot, embarked for Scotland with some men he had raised, who coming on shore were all surprised and imprisoned on the Marquis of Montrose's score; he not knowing anything of their ba rbarous murder of that hero. This he told us was his fifth escape, and none less miraculous;

      I am in the process of transcribing the Diary into html 4.01 format and have got to year 24 ... and that is only putting the text into a reasonably readable format - still to come are the notes that will make sense of, for example, references to the Comet of 1618, the Emperor Matthias and his Bohemians etc, etc. 

      What I'm getting round to saying is, is there anyone 'out there' in the Pepysian Community who would be interested in getting involved in a project which will be but a pale reflection of what Phil has achived but which would be something not yet done ?
      Having 'baited' the hook I wait with bated breath for any interested responses - this would be a sort of distributed intellectual computation exercise 
      - Oh. Yes, a really good knowledge of Latin, Italian (17th century, naturally), plants, painting, politics (etc ad infinitum) would be really useful.

      Hopefully,
      Eric.
      (PS: I got 9% for Latin at School).







      -- 
      Phil Gyford





    • Eric Mills
      Hi Phil, Sorry about the typo Phi-(Beta-Kappa) in the earlier posting. Your offer of a per diem link system is good - plenty of time to sort that out though.
      Message 2 of 11 , Jun 4, 2012
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        Hi Phil,
        Sorry about the typo Phi-(Beta-Kappa) in the earlier posting.
        Your offer of a per diem link system is good - plenty of time to sort that out though.

        The 'sensible' url would be, in my humble opinion, would be something like:
        http://where-ever-it-is.com/16510906.htm
        which would point at the entry that I partially quoted in the original posting.

        I'm currently using a 'hover text' javascript that seems to work quite well for giving detail of words/items I don't think are common ... for example, it may be that the 'jakes' qukoted in the sample is: a toilet, especially an outdoor one.
        which, if true, would make the item even more hilarious !

        Enough of this banter - my sore nose to the grindstone again !

        I hope you that, later on, don't regret your unstinting offer of help. Thanks.

        In friendship,
        Eric.



        To: pepysdiary@yahoogroups.com
        From: lists@...
        Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2012 11:24:54 +0100
        Subject: Re: [pepysdiary] About that 'other diary'

         
        Hi Eric,

        I've often wondered about Evelyn's diary, and wished there was a good home for it online. (NOT that I'm suggesting I want to make one :)    ).

        Simply making a site that had one diary entry per page, with sensible URLs, would be a really good initial target. Then I could link to them from Sam's diary entries easily!

        Adding all the contextual information is, as we all know, a never-ending additional goal...

        Feel free to drop me a line any time if there's anything I can offer advice about.

        Phil



        On 4 Jun, 2012, at 10:30, Eric Mills wrote:



        This may be an inappropriate post in which case I apologise but will soldier on nonetheless ... The other 17th Century Diarist (John Evelyn) is ripe for the Gyford Treatment ... However, and here's the rub. Dear old Pepys covered a mere 10 years ... and look at the effort and time that Phi Gyford has put in over the years - John Evelyn's diary (discovered in a clothes basket 11 years after his death) covers 60 years of pretty detailed observations.
        As a 'Teaser' I include a (carefully chosen) random sample:

        6th September, 1651. I went with my wife to St. Germains, to condole with Mr. Waller's loss. I carried with me and treated at dinner that excellent and pious person the Dean of St. Paul's, Dr. Stewart, and Sir Lewis Dives (half-brother to the Earl of Bristol), who entertained us with his wonderful escape out of prison in Whitehall, the very evening before he was to have been put to death, leaping down out of a jakes two stories high into the Thames at high water, in the coldest of winter, and at night; so as by swimming he got to a boat that attended for him, though he was guarded by six musketeers. After this, he went about in women's habit, and then in a small-coal-man's, traveling 200 miles on foot, embarked for Scotland with some men he had raised, who coming on shore were all surprised and imprisoned on the Marquis of Montrose's score; he not knowing anything of their ba rbarous murder of that hero. This he told us was his fifth escape, and none less miraculous;

        I am in the process of transcribing the Diary into html 4.01 format and have got to year 24 ... and that is only putting the text into a reasonably readable format - still to come are the notes that will make sense of, for example, references to the Comet of 1618, the Emperor Matthias and his Bohemians etc, etc. 

        What I'm getting round to saying is, is there anyone 'out there' in the Pepysian Community who would be interested in getting involved in a project which will be but a pale reflection of what Phil has achived but which would be something not yet done ?
        Having 'baited' the hook I wait with bated breath for any interested responses - this would be a sort of distributed intellectual computation exercise 
        - Oh. Yes, a really good knowledge of Latin, Italian (17th century, naturally), plants, painting, politics (etc ad infinitum) would be really useful.

        Hopefully,
        Eric.
        (PS: I got 9% for Latin at School).







        -- 
        Phil Gyford






      • Susan Thomas
        I would certainly love to read this online daily! Wonderful project, Eric. And if I can help you, I will! (I got a Grade 6 for O Level Latin :( ) BTW I think
        Message 3 of 11 , Jun 4, 2012
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          I would certainly love to read this online daily! Wonderful project, Eric. And if I can help you, I will! (I got a Grade 6 for O Level Latin :( ) BTW I think jakes refers to a privy. What it would be is a jutting out piece of the castle wall which delivered the detritus directly into the river through a round aperture. The prisoner must have been trusted to enter the little chamber by himself to relieve himself (probably because of his rank) - and only high class prisoners would have had such facilities - and he then squeezed himself through the hole and dropped into the river. I remember going to Doune Castle in Scotland with my children when they were young and pointing out the jakes on the side of that castle wall. The children were fascinated to be told that that was where Mary Queen of Scots went to the toilet. I regretted that their father had informed them of this fact as that is the one item of information concerning MQOS's imprisonment in the castle they retained..........

          On 4 June 2012 19:30, Eric Mills <ericmills1936@...> wrote:
           

          This may be an inappropriate post in which case I apologise but will soldier on nonetheless ... The other 17th Century Diarist (John Evelyn) is ripe for the Gyford Treatment ... However, and here's the rub. Dear old Pepys covered a mere 10 years ... and look at the effort and time that Phi Gyford has put in over the years - John Evelyn's diary (discovered in a clothes basket 11 years after his death) covers 60 years of pretty detailed observations.
          As a 'Teaser' I include a (carefully chosen) random sample:

          6th September, 1651. I went with my wife to St. Germains, to condole with Mr. Waller's loss. I carried with me and treated at dinner that excellent and pious person the Dean of St. Paul's, Dr. Stewart, and Sir Lewis Dives (half-brother to the Earl of Bristol), who entertained us with his wonderful escape out of prison in Whitehall, the very evening before he was to have been put to death, leaping down out of a jakes two stories high into the Thames at high water, in the coldest of winter, and at night; so as by swimming he got to a boat that attended for him, though he was guarded by six musketeers. After this, he went about in women's habit, and then in a small-coal-man's, traveling 200 miles on foot, embarked for Scotland with some men he had raised, who coming on shore were all surprised and imprisoned on the Marquis of Montrose's score; he not knowing anything of their barbarous murder of that hero. This he told us was his fifth escape, and none less miraculous;

          I am in the process of transcribing the Diary into html 4.01 format and have got to year 24 ... and that is only putting the text into a reasonably readable format - still to come are the notes that will make sense of, for example, references to the Comet of 1618, the Emperor Matthias and his Bohemians etc, etc.

          What I'm getting round to saying is, is there anyone 'out there' in the Pepysian Community who would be interested in getting involved in a project which will be but a pale reflection of what Phil has achived but which would be something not yet done ?
          Having 'baited' the hook I wait with bated breath for any interested responses - this would be a sort of distributed intellectual computation exercise
          - Oh. Yes, a really good knowledge of Latin, Italian (17th century, naturally), plants, painting, politics (etc ad infinitum) would be really useful.

          Hopefully,
          Eric.
          (PS: I got 9% for Latin at School).





          --
          Kind regards,



          Susan Thomas

          Emphron Informatics
          Level 3 88 Jephson St
          TOOWONG
          QLD 4066

          Office: +61 7 3503 1765
          Mobile: 0411 094 688
          Fax: +61 7 3318 7677

          Legal Notice: This electronic mail and its attachments are intended solely for the person(s) to whom they are addressed and contain information, which is confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure, except for the purpose for which they are intended. Dissemination, distribution, or reproduction by anyone other than the intended recipients is prohibited and may be illegal. If you are not an intended recipient, please immediately inform the sender and return the electronic mail and its attachments and destroy any copies, which may be in your possession. By reading this communication, the recipient(s) have accepted that it is confidential and NOT subject to any form of public disclosure. Nothing in this communication is intended to operate as an electronic signature under applicable law. The company screens electronic mails for viruses but does not warrant that this electronic mail is free of any viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this electronic mail.


        • Eric Mills
          Hello Susan, Thank you for your kind offer of help ... the potential team is growing. ** You are right about the jakes ... I had originally thought, from my
          Message 4 of 11 , Jun 5, 2012
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            Hello Susan,
            Thank you for your kind offer of help ... the potential team is growing. **
            You are right about the 'jakes' ... I had originally thought, from my somewhat patchy memory, that it was too 'slangy' to be within the era-range ... but it is surprising how many apparently modern words/phrases are deeply rooted in the past. I must admit that that particular 'episode' sounds a bit like a "pre-write" of Sir Harry Flashman on a good day!

            As a reward to you and so that you can get in the swing of things, here are a couple of links to pdf versions of the 1901 edition I am working from:
            Volume 1:
            http://ia700304.us.archive.org/17/items/diaryofjohnevely01eveliala/diaryofjohnevely01eveliala.pdf
            Volume 2:
            http://ia600308.us.archive.org/7/items/diaryofjohnevely02eveliala/diaryofjohnevely02eveliala.pdf

            They are both about 20 MegaBytes in length and can be viewed using Adobe's Acrobat Viewer - I use the 100%-view so that I can distinguish between the various accented characters and decipher the italicised bits. (Those are the places where my OCR stuff falls down a bit and manual editing is needed to translate it into internetesque gobble-dey-gook).

            About MQOS and her jakes visit - a shame your thunder had already been stolen but it was brilliant that the anecdote was reinforced by the double telling ... Memories are made of this - lucky kids.

            ** I may have acquired a host, a botanist and now a Latinist.
            Anyone else who wishes to step up to the plate would be welcomed aboard (mixed metaphor - but you know what I mean) - However, and it is a big However, we are talking a biggish thing ... I mentioned 60 years span - that is the number of years I haven't yet processed. So, we are not talking about publishing-a-page-per-day-rate - which is why I am looking for 'farming out' editing, proof-reading and the like.

            In friendship,
            Eric.

            To: pepysdiary@yahoogroups.com
            From: susan.thomas@...
            Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2012 09:14:48 +1000
            Subject: Re: [pepysdiary] About that 'other diary'

             
            I would certainly love to read this online daily! Wonderful project, Eric. And if I can help you, I will! (I got a Grade 6 for O Level Latin :( ) BTW I think jakes refers to a privy. What it would be is a jutting out piece of the castle wall which delivered the detritus directly into the river through a round aperture. The prisoner must have been trusted to enter the little chamber by himself to relieve himself (probably because of his rank) - and only high class prisoners would have had such facilities - and he then squeezed himself through the hole and dropped into the river. I remember going to Doune Castle in Scotland with my children when they were young and pointing out the jakes on the side of that castle wall. The children were fascinated to be told that that was where Mary Queen of Scots went to the toilet. I regretted that their father had informed them of this fact as that is the one item of information concerning MQOS's imprisonment in the castle they retained..........


            On 4 June 2012 19:30, Eric Mills <ericmills1936@...> wrote:
             

            This may be an inappropriate post in which case I apologise but will soldier on nonetheless ... The other 17th Century Diarist (John Evelyn) is ripe for the Gyford Treatment ... However, and here's the rub. Dear old Pepys covered a mere 10 years ... and look at the effort and time that Phi Gyford has put in over the years - John Evelyn's diary (discovered in a clothes basket 11 years after his death) covers 60 years of pretty detailed observations.
            As a 'Teaser' I include a (carefully chosen) random sample:

            6th September, 1651. I went with my wife to St. Germains, to condole with Mr. Waller's loss. I carried with me and treated at dinner that excellent and pious person the Dean of St. Paul's, Dr. Stewart, and Sir Lewis Dives (half-brother to the Earl of Bristol), who entertained us with his wonderful escape out of prison in Whitehall, the very evening before he was to have been put to death, leaping down out of a jakes two stories high into the Thames at high water, in the coldest of winter, and at night; so as by swimming he got to a boat that attended for him, though he was guarded by six musketeers. After this, he went about in women's habit, and then in a small-coal-man's, traveling 200 miles on foot, embarked for Scotland with some men he had raised, who coming on shore were all surprised and imprisoned on the Marquis of Montrose's score; he not knowing anything of their barbarous murder of that hero. This he told us was his fifth escape, and none less miraculous;

            I am in the process of transcribing the Diary into html 4.01 format and have got to year 24 ... and that is only putting the text into a reasonably readable format - still to come are the notes that will make sense of, for example, references to the Comet of 1618, the Emperor Matthias and his Bohemians etc, etc.

            What I'm getting round to saying is, is there anyone 'out there' in the Pepysian Community who would be interested in getting involved in a project which will be but a pale reflection of what Phil has achived but which would be something not yet done ?
            Having 'baited' the hook I wait with bated breath for any interested responses - this would be a sort of distributed intellectual computation exercise
            - Oh. Yes, a really good knowledge of Latin, Italian (17th century, naturally), plants, painting, politics (etc ad infinitum) would be really useful.

            Hopefully,
            Eric.
            (PS: I got 9% for Latin at School).






            --
            Kind regards,



            Susan Thomas

            Emphron Informatics
            Level 3 88 Jephson St
            TOOWONG
            QLD 4066

            Office: +61 7 3503 1765
            Mobile: 0411 094 688
            Fax: +61 7 3318 7677

            Legal Notice: This electronic mail and its attachments are intended solely for the person(s) to whom they are addressed and contain information, which is confidential or otherwise protected from disclosure, except for the purpose for which they are intended. Dissemination, distribution, or reproduction by anyone other than the intended recipients is prohibited and may be illegal. If you are not an intended recipient, please immediately inform the sender and return the electronic mail and its attachments and destroy any copies, which may be in your possession. By reading this communication, the recipient(s) have accepted that it is confidential and NOT subject to any form of public disclosure. Nothing in this communication is intended to operate as an electronic signature under applicable law. The company screens electronic mails for viruses but does not warrant that this electronic mail is free of any viruses. The company accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this electronic mail.



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