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RE: [pcgen] [BUG]5.9.4 Weird WEAPONPROF behavior

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  • Frank Kliewe
    ... Ah, finally someone else sees it. I was already thinking there would be gremlins in my PC. I haven t fiddled with the PCC rank yet, I will make some tests
    Message 1 of 19 , Dec 27, 2005
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      > >
      > I've tried it out with the latest source and data from CVS
      > and I see the
      > problem. It is almost as if the proficiency is being
      > calculated before
      > the arcana file is loaded. Have you tried playing with the
      > priorities of
      > the PCC files?
      >

      Ah, finally someone else sees it. I was already thinking there would be
      gremlins in my PC. I haven't fiddled with the PCC rank yet, I will make some
      tests in that direction tonight. Good Idea.

      > Out of curiosity though, why is there a data source under the msrd
      > partial tree that is not loaded when you load the msrd complete set?
      > This is confusing to me, and goes against how we name the
      > data sets in
      > the srd/srd35 modes. Maybe a different directory name such as extras
      > would be appropriate?
      >
      > Cheers,
      > James Dempsey
      > PCGen Code Gibbon
      >

      The PCC setup still needs work. When I asked to get some info on the design
      philosophy of the MSRD source tree, that sparked a discussion that has not
      been finished yet (partially because of lack of replies). Basically Modern
      encompasses a variety of genres, that normally do not call for being mixed.

      I was thinking to have 3 "Complete" sets, 1 Core, 1 Arcana and 1 Future. One
      problem that I have is renaming the momentary Complete/Modern to Modern
      Core, because renaming the source would break existing characters, so I may
      well end up still doing a Full Complete set, just because I can't get rid of
      that name.

      I like your suggestion about an extras directory. We could treat the Core
      MSRD as a standard and handle Future and Arcana as extras. But whatever may
      come, I want this discussed first and will not act on a personal whim, which
      means the reorganization will still take a while. It is just getting too
      complicated to get rid of something after it has been established in that
      area.

      Cheerio,

      Frank Kliewe
      PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur

      --
      That's it. Out you two pixies go - through the door, or out the window.
      (Nick the Barkeeper in "It's A Wonderful Life", 1946)
    • Frank Kliewe
      ... Testing this revealed that I can avoid this bug if I set RANK:0 in the PCC. Any other RANK (I actually only tested 1,2,3 and 9) does not work. As a Core
      Message 2 of 19 , Dec 27, 2005
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        > > >
        > > I've tried it out with the latest source and data from CVS
        > > and I see the
        > > problem. It is almost as if the proficiency is being
        > > calculated before
        > > the arcana file is loaded. Have you tried playing with the
        > > priorities of
        > > the PCC files?
        > >
        >
        > Ah, finally someone else sees it. I was already thinking
        > there would be
        > gremlins in my PC. I haven't fiddled with the PCC rank yet, I
        > will make some
        > tests in that direction tonight. Good Idea.
        >

        Testing this revealed that I can avoid this bug if I set RANK:0 in the PCC.
        Any other RANK (I actually only tested 1,2,3 and 9) does not work. As a Core
        campaign setting Arcana should have RANK:2

        Cheerio,

        Frank Kliewe
        PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur

        --
        That's it. Out you two pixies go - through the door, or out the window.
        (Nick the Barkeeper in "It's A Wonderful Life", 1946)
      • Frank Kliewe
        REPOST. I ve collected all the messages of this thread that have been sent so far (between Dec. 19th and 28th) into this digest . The problem still appears in
        Message 3 of 19 , Jan 12, 2006
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          REPOST. I've collected all the messages of this thread that have been sent
          so far (between Dec. 19th and 28th) into this "digest". The problem still
          appears in the latest autobuild.

          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: pcgen@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups.com] On
          > Behalf Of Frank Kliewe
          > Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 3:02 AM
          > To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [pcgen] [BUG]5.9.4 Weird WEAPONPROF behavior
          >
          >
          > Using 5.9.4 with Java 1.5.0_04 on WinXP.
          >
          > Now set gamemode to MSRD Modern.
          > Select the Sources "MSRD > Complete > Modern" and "MSRD >
          > Partial > Arcana > Modern - Arcana". Create a new Character,
          > Stats all 10, Race Human, 1 level of Charismatic Hero. On the
          > FEATS tab select Archaic Weapons Proficiency. Switch to the
          > INVENTORY tab and use TYPE \ SUBTYPE \ NAME view. Open the
          > Weapon > Archaic tree. Sort the view by Source.
          >
          > You will now see that of all the Archaic weapons from
          > ArcanaEquipment.rft and ArcanaFXItems.rtf only the Greatsword
          > is shown as PROFICIENT:Y. All the other ones are red. I can't
          > find anything in the Data that might cause this. In fact, if
          > I copy the MSRD Arcana directory into the 5.9.3 Data (where
          > it hadn't been committed yet) and try the same procedure,
          > everything works. Trying with the latest Autobuild, the bug
          > is still around. I've found that WEAPONCATEGORY:Archaic was
          > missing in the MSRD miscinfo.lst and already committed that,
          > but that didn't cure the problem.
          >

          ##########2005.12.26 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          Could really no one recreate this problem?

          -- Frank

          ##########2005.12.26 --- Eddy Anthony##########

          I just gave it a shot and could not recreate the problem :/
          --
          ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)

          ##########2005.12.26 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          I just tried with a clean install of the latest autobuild and I still get
          that problem. When I load Complete/Modern and Partial/Arcana/Modern-Arcana,
          start a new character, click the kits button and add the Default Dwarf
          (Shadowkind) kit and look at the Inventory tab, the Pickaxe appears as
          non-proficient.

          When I look into the Weapon/Archaic tree, I see all arcana weapons but the
          greatsword as non-proficient. The archaic weapons from other sources and the
          greatsword are shown as proficient. :-(

          -- Frank

          ##########2005.12.26 --- Eddy Anthony##########

          I don't know what to tell you, thinking it may be something in my own build
          I got the latest autobuild and followed your directions, I'm still not
          seeing the problem.
          --
          ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)
          ~ PCGen Content Silverback

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          I have updated to the latest Java version, but that didn't help either.
          What's worse, I found out that it is not limited to archaic weapons, but
          also happens with simple weapons. None of them from Arcana are shown as
          proficient when I load the Halfling default monster kit.

          Eddy, could you please check the attack values for the Dwarf's Pickaxe, the
          Halfling's Slingshot and the Orc's Greataxe against the MSRD for me, so I
          can finish the MSRD Default Monster validation process? I know I could just
          add 4 for being proficient, but for a validation someone should actually
          have seen the correct numbers, which I can't right now. :(

          Cheerio,

          Frank Kliewe

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Barak##########

          Are the two of you checking this the same way? In the same game mode? With
          the same datasets loaded and nothing else?

          Is the non-proficiency penalty being applied if you give the character the
          weapon in question and do an output? (IOW, is it a simple display issue in
          the equipment lister?)

          And from your description Frank the first thing I would check would be the
          proficiency names in the Urban Arcana dataset in both the equipment file and
          the weaponprof filwe and make sure they match.

          Barak

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          > Are the two of you checking this the same way? In the same
          > game mode? With the same datasets loaded and nothing else?
          >

          I gave a step by step description of what I was doing in the first post of
          the thread, so Eddy should have taken the same steps. It seems to work for
          him.

          > Is the non-proficiency penalty being applied if you give the
          > character the weapon in question and do an output? (IOW, is
          > it a simple display issue in the equipment lister?)
          >

          Yes. The output sheet shows it as well.


          > And from your description Frank the first thing I would check
          > would be the proficiency names in the Urban Arcana dataset in
          > both the equipment file and the weaponprof filwe and make
          > sure they match.
          >
          > Barak

          That was my first thought, too. After checking twice I copied the Arcana
          files into 5.9.3 (without the kits as they weren't implemented in that form
          there) and everything works fine there, so it can't be a data issue. I also
          checked with the kits lst files removed in 5.9.4 (as that was the only
          difference to what I tested with 5.9.3) and still when I select a Dwarf the
          only Archaic weapon from Arcana that is shown as proficient is the
          Greatsword, so that makes no difference.

          Cheerio,

          Frank Kliewe
          PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Barak##########

          Well, bummer.

          I'm out of suggestions then. :/

          Barak

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Tir Gwaith##########

          Well, I'm happy. After all the time I spent on the MSRD and Arcana, I sure
          as well hope we fixed all the Weapon / Weaponprof dependencies...

          Tir Gwaith
          LST Chimp

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          Err, what? You're happy that PCGen throws a bug when run on my PC?

          Please meet me behind the barn, I'd like to introduce you to Mr. Hickory
          Stick! :p

          Cheerio,

          Frank Kliewe
          PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur

          ##########2005.12.27 --- James Dempsey##########

          I've tried it out with the latest source and data from CVS and I see the
          problem. It is almost as if the proficiency is being calculated before
          the arcana file is loaded. Have you tried playing with the priorities of
          the PCC files?

          Out of curiosity though, why is there a data source under the msrd
          partial tree that is not loaded when you load the msrd complete set?
          This is confusing to me, and goes against how we name the data sets in
          the srd/srd35 modes. Maybe a different directory name such as extras
          would be appropriate?

          Cheers,
          James Dempsey
          PCGen Code Gibbon

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          > >
          > I've tried it out with the latest source and data from CVS
          > and I see the
          > problem. It is almost as if the proficiency is being
          > calculated before
          > the arcana file is loaded. Have you tried playing with the
          > priorities of
          > the PCC files?
          >

          Ah, finally someone else sees it. I was already thinking there would be
          gremlins in my PC. I haven't fiddled with the PCC rank yet, I will make some
          tests in that direction tonight. Good Idea.

          > Out of curiosity though, why is there a data source under the msrd
          > partial tree that is not loaded when you load the msrd complete set?
          > This is confusing to me, and goes against how we name the
          > data sets in
          > the srd/srd35 modes. Maybe a different directory name such as extras
          > would be appropriate?
          >
          > Cheers,
          > James Dempsey
          > PCGen Code Gibbon
          >

          The PCC setup still needs work. When I asked to get some info on the design
          philosophy of the MSRD source tree, that sparked a discussion that has not
          been finished yet (partially because of lack of replies). Basically Modern
          encompasses a variety of genres, that normally do not call for being mixed.

          I was thinking to have 3 "Complete" sets, 1 Core, 1 Arcana and 1 Future. One
          problem that I have is renaming the momentary Complete/Modern to Modern
          Core, because renaming the source would break existing characters, so I may
          well end up still doing a Full Complete set, just because I can't get rid of
          that name.

          I like your suggestion about an extras directory. We could treat the Core
          MSRD as a standard and handle Future and Arcana as extras. But whatever may
          come, I want this discussed first and will not act on a personal whim, which
          means the reorganization will still take a while. It is just getting too
          complicated to get rid of something after it has been established in that
          area.

          Cheerio,

          Frank Kliewe
          PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur

          ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########

          Testing this revealed that I can avoid this bug if I set RANK:0 in the PCC.
          Any other RANK (I actually only tested 1,2,3 and 9) does not work. As a Core
          campaign setting Arcana should have RANK:2

          Cheerio,

          Frank Kliewe
          PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur
        • Frank Kliewe
          I still get this problem with 5.9.5 -- Frank ... [snip] ... [snip] ... [snip]
          Message 4 of 19 , Feb 28, 2006
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            I still get this problem with 5.9.5

            -- Frank

            > >
            > > Using 5.9.4 with Java 1.5.0_04 on WinXP.
            > >
            > > Now set gamemode to MSRD Modern.
            > > Select the Sources "MSRD > Complete > Modern" and "MSRD >
            > > Partial > Arcana > Modern - Arcana". Create a new Character,
            > > Stats all 10, Race Human, 1 level of Charismatic Hero. On the
            > > FEATS tab select Archaic Weapons Proficiency. Switch to the
            > > INVENTORY tab and use TYPE \ SUBTYPE \ NAME view. Open the
            > > Weapon > Archaic tree. Sort the view by Source.
            > >
            > > You will now see that of all the Archaic weapons from
            > > ArcanaEquipment.rft and ArcanaFXItems.rtf only the Greatsword
            > > is shown as PROFICIENT:Y. All the other ones are red. I can't
            > > find anything in the Data that might cause this. In fact, if
            > > I copy the MSRD Arcana directory into the 5.9.3 Data (where
            > > it hadn't been committed yet) and try the same procedure,
            > > everything works. Trying with the latest Autobuild, the bug
            > > is still around. I've found that WEAPONCATEGORY:Archaic was
            > > missing in the MSRD miscinfo.lst and already committed that,
            > > but that didn't cure the problem.
            > >
            >
            > ##########2005.12.26 --- Frank Kliewe##########
            >
            > Could really no one recreate this problem?
            >
            > -- Frank
            >
            > ##########2005.12.26 --- Eddy Anthony##########
            >
            > I just gave it a shot and could not recreate the problem :/
            > --
            > ~ Eddy Anthony (MoSaT)
            >
            > ##########2005.12.26 --- Frank Kliewe##########
            >
            > I just tried with a clean install of the latest autobuild and
            > I still get
            > that problem. When I load Complete/Modern and
            > Partial/Arcana/Modern-Arcana,
            > start a new character, click the kits button and add the Default Dwarf
            > (Shadowkind) kit and look at the Inventory tab, the Pickaxe appears as
            > non-proficient.
            >
            > When I look into the Weapon/Archaic tree, I see all arcana
            > weapons but the
            > greatsword as non-proficient. The archaic weapons from other
            > sources and the
            > greatsword are shown as proficient. :-(
            >
            > -- Frank
            >
            [snip]
            >
            > ##########2005.12.27 --- James Dempsey##########
            >
            > I've tried it out with the latest source and data from CVS
            > and I see the
            > problem. It is almost as if the proficiency is being
            > calculated before
            > the arcana file is loaded. Have you tried playing with the
            > priorities of
            > the PCC files?
            >
            [snip]
            > ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########
            >
            > > >
            > > I've tried it out with the latest source and data from CVS
            > > and I see the
            > > problem. It is almost as if the proficiency is being
            > > calculated before
            > > the arcana file is loaded. Have you tried playing with the
            > > priorities of
            > > the PCC files?
            > >
            >
            > Ah, finally someone else sees it. I was already thinking
            > there would be
            > gremlins in my PC. I haven't fiddled with the PCC rank yet, I
            > will make some
            > tests in that direction tonight. Good Idea.
            [snip]
            >
            > Cheerio,
            >
            > Frank Kliewe
            > PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur
            >
            > ##########2005.12.27 --- Frank Kliewe##########
            >
            > Testing this revealed that I can avoid this bug if I set
            > RANK:0 in the PCC.
            > Any other RANK (I actually only tested 1,2,3 and 9) does not
            > work. As a Core
            > campaign setting Arcana should have RANK:2
            >
            > Cheerio,
            >
            > Frank Kliewe
            > PCGen Data Chimp, OS & TM Lemur
          • Paul W. King
            ... Is it still present in 5.9.6? Paul W. King PR SB, BoD
            Message 5 of 19 , Mar 16 1:31 PM
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              > I still get this problem with 5.9.5

              Is it still present in 5.9.6?

              Paul W. King
              PR SB, BoD
            • Frank Kliewe
              ... I m afraid so, yes. Just tested and it still happens. Cheerio, Frank Kliewe PCGen Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS & TM Lemur The Modern Monkey -- You shouldn t
              Message 6 of 19 , Mar 16 1:50 PM
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                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: pcgen@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups.com] On
                > Behalf Of Paul W. King
                > Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2006 10:32 PM
                > To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [pcgen] Re: [BUG]5.9.4 Weird WEAPONPROF behavior
                >
                >
                > > I still get this problem with 5.9.5
                >
                > Is it still present in 5.9.6?
                >
                > Paul W. King
                > PR SB, BoD
                >

                I'm afraid so, yes. Just tested and it still happens.

                Cheerio,

                Frank Kliewe
                PCGen Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS & TM Lemur
                The Modern Monkey

                --
                You shouldn't keep souvenirs of a killing.
                You shouldn't have been that sentimental.
                (Scottie in "Vertigo", 1958)
              • Paul W. King
                [ 1451706 ] weird WEAPONPROF behavior https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1451706&group_id=25576&atid=384719 Paul W. King PR SB, BoD
                Message 7 of 19 , Mar 16 2:08 PM
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                  [ 1451706 ] weird WEAPONPROF behavior
                  https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1451706&group_id=25576&atid=384719

                  Paul W. King
                  PR SB, BoD
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