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Re: [pcgen] Re: [a little ot] encounter ratings

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  • Lee Dowd
    ... ... Don t know if its official, or not, but here s how ... I belive that that is close to the way you are suppose to award experiance as oppose to
    Message 1 of 21 , Apr 1, 2003
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      --- "Paul W. King" <kingpaul@...> wrote:
      ...> Don't know if its official, or not, but here's
      how
      > my groups do it.
      >
      > If the party defeats the encounter fully, award XP
      > by adding what the
      > party would get by defeating a 2, 3 and 5 level
      > encounter.
      >
      > Paul W. King
      > OGL/PL SB and BoD

      I belive that that is close to the way you are suppose
      to award experiance as oppose to determine encounter
      level. Officialy I don't believe you have to defeat
      the encounter to get the experiance just encounter it.
      The EL is a tool for GM's to use to determine how
      much of a challenge a group encounter is. As such it
      must be used carefully as the number and power of the
      characters for instance can impact the real vs the
      calculated EL.

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    • matt+haffner
      ... It *is* official. You shouldn t use EL on the XP rewards chart in the DMG. It s intended to be used only for CR and that implies that you do it for each
      Message 2 of 21 , Apr 1, 2003
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        --- In pcgen@yahoogroups.com, "Paul W. King" <kingpaul@e...> wrote:
        > > Example: 4 generic orcs and an orc NPC (3rd level fighter) and an
        > > Ogre NPC (3rd level barbarian)
        > >
        > > A generic orc is CR .5, the orc captain is CR 3, and the ogre thug
        > > is CR 5.
        >
        > Don't know if its official, or not, but here's how my groups do it.
        >
        > If the party defeats the encounter fully, award XP by adding what the
        > party would get by defeating a 2, 3 and 5 level encounter.

        It *is* official. You shouldn't use EL on the XP rewards chart in the DMG. It's intended to be used only for CR and that implies that you do it for each challenge (monster, trap, etc.) in the encounter and add the results together. I

        wrote a long-ish post on another board on why using EL alone breaks down (I can hunt it down if anyone's curious), but I think a short summary is that using EL breaks down quite badly if you have either low-level PCs or a good number of low-level monsters in the encounter with higher-level PCs.

        Always use CR for awarding XP, not EL...

        mh - ZansForCans
      • Brass Tilde
        ... Where is that rule? Do you have a book and page?
        Message 3 of 21 , Apr 1, 2003
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          > There's a rule no one has mentioned yet that says CRs
          > less than 3 are added together until you start getting
          > ELs higher than 3.

          Where is that rule? Do you have a book and page?
        • Brass Tilde
          ... If that s the same one I was using last year, it uses a formula to calculate CR, which periodically came up with some different numbers than the table
          Message 4 of 21 , Apr 1, 2003
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            > > Personally, I use this
            > > http://www.d20reviews.com/Eric/downloads/Encounter_Calculator.htm
            >
            > Bless you! A thousand times, bless you!
            >
            > It's in javascript! I can see the source, so I can see how he does it!
            > Logical steps! Algorithms! Oh, bless you!

            If that's the same one I was using last year, it uses a formula to calculate
            CR, which periodically came up with some different numbers than the table
            lookup method from the DMG. Close, but not quite identical.

            If you want, I've got a spreadsheet that calculates FR type XP (which I use
            IMC) based on the tables in the DMG. It wouldn't be too hard to modify it
            (or fool it) into doing average party level type XP.
          • Phantom of Krankor
            ... Ah. Err. Well. I just report the news, I don t make it. ... And it s easy to edit, too. I ve modified it to have more rows than come with it. Something
            Message 5 of 21 , Apr 1, 2003
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              > Phantom of Krankor wrote:
              > > Personally, I use this
              > > http://www.d20reviews.com/Eric/downloads/Encounter_Calculator.htm
              >
              > Bless you! A thousand times, bless you!
              >
              > It's in javascript! I can see the source, so I can see how he does
              > it! Logical steps! Algorithms! Oh, bless you!
              >
              > *does a little "Hail Greg" dance*

              Ah. Err. Well. I just report the news, I don't make it.

              > Ahem. You know you've been a programmer too long when you have to use
              > a computer algorithm to judge encounter levels.

              And it's easy to edit, too. I've modified it to have more rows than
              come with it. Something about making encounters with 8 different
              monsters... >:)

              -Greg G


              =====
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            • The Dustmonger
              ... Hrm... not readily, it s not where I thought it was, but I can verify that WotC modules (like Sunless Citadel) stick to it, by my math.
              Message 6 of 21 , Apr 2, 2003
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                --- Brass Tilde <brasstilde@...> wrote:
                > Where is that rule? Do you have a book and page?

                Hrm... not readily, it's not where I thought it was,
                but I can verify that WotC modules (like Sunless
                Citadel) stick to it, by my math.

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              • Vance
                (one little voice from the sidelines meekly speaks up) One note ... Even if what you said is correct, the original question was reguarding Experience which is
                Message 7 of 21 , Apr 2, 2003
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                  (one little voice from the sidelines meekly speaks up)
                  One note ... Even if what you said is correct, the original question was
                  reguarding Experience which is calculated by individual "monster" CR, NOT by
                  EL. (DMG page 166, top left corner). The only lines concerning monsters
                  below CR1 are in the second column:
                  Speaking of Orsc .... CR 1/2 ...
                  "For these cases, calculate XP as if the creature were CR 1, then divide the
                  result by 2"
                  For 1/3 you would divide by 3, etc.

                  VR

                  >
                  > --- Brass Tilde <brasstilde@...> wrote:
                  > > Where is that rule? Do you have a book and page?
                  >
                  > Hrm... not readily, it's not where I thought it was,
                  > but I can verify that WotC modules (like Sunless
                  > Citadel) stick to it, by my math.
                • Emily Smirle
                  ... DANGER! DANGER WILL ROBINSON! I asked nothing about experience, as I don t use the experience charts. My players go up a level once every five sessions
                  Message 8 of 21 , Apr 2, 2003
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                    Vance wrote:
                    > (one little voice from the sidelines meekly speaks up)
                    > One note ... Even if what you said is correct, the original question was
                    > reguarding Experience which is calculated by individual "monster" CR, NOT by
                    > EL. (DMG page 166, top left corner).


                    DANGER! DANGER WILL ROBINSON!

                    I asked nothing about experience, as I don't use the experience charts.
                    My players go up a level once every five sessions (give or take). Yes,
                    this is over twice as fast as the DMG suggests. It's not Hurting Bad
                    Fun, however, so I don't care. :)

                    All I was looking for was how to calculate Encounter Level, which is a
                    reasonable ball-park figure for how tough a given group of critters is.
                    I like to start with an 'official' ball-park before I monkey with it for
                    situational modifiers (like throwing ghouls and ghasts at a party with
                    no clerics, paladins, and one incompetant elf : +2 CR )
                    --
                    "Is he an evil outsider?"
                    "Well, he was one of the loners in evil kindergarten..."
                  • Brass Tilde
                    ... If you find it, I d be interested. The only thing I ve ever seen is that creatures with a CR below one are combined until they total one. So, four 1/2 CR
                    Message 9 of 21 , Apr 2, 2003
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                      > --- Brass Tilde <brasstilde@...> wrote:
                      > > Where is that rule? Do you have a book and page?
                      >
                      > Hrm... not readily, it's not where I thought it was,
                      > but I can verify that WotC modules (like Sunless
                      > Citadel) stick to it, by my math.

                      If you find it, I'd be interested. The only thing I've ever seen is that
                      creatures with a CR below one are combined until they total one. So, four
                      1/2 CR Orcs would be treated as two CR 1 creatures, and four CR 1/4
                      creatures would be treated as one CR 1 creature. I *think* this is in the
                      back of the PHB, in that "mini-DMG" section, but I'll have to check.

                      I hope you won't feel too badly about me not paying too much attention to
                      the way a module does it. <g/>
                    • Vance
                      ... (and walks away with foot in mouth)
                      Message 10 of 21 , Apr 2, 2003
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                        > > (one little voice from the sidelines meekly speaks up)
                        (and walks away with foot in mouth)
                      • The Dustmonger
                        ... If I find it I ll let the group know... my roommate s car (which I share with him) was broken into, however, so I ll be a couple days before I have free
                        Message 11 of 21 , Apr 2, 2003
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                          --- Brass Tilde <brasstilde@...> wrote:
                          > If you find it, I'd be interested.
                          > I hope you won't feel too badly about me not paying
                          > too much attention to the way a module does it.

                          If I find it I'll let the group know... my roommate's
                          car (which I share with him) was broken into, however,
                          so I'll be a couple days before I have free time to
                          sit down and flip through books.

                          And if you can show me a man who runs everything by
                          the book, I'll show you a liar :)

                          Dusty

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                        • Vance
                          I run everything by the book! DMG Page 6 You get to decide how the rules work, which rules to use, and how strictly to adhere to them That s me...
                          Message 12 of 21 , Apr 3, 2003
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                            I run everything by the book!

                            DMG Page 6
                            "You get to decide how the rules work, which rules to use, and how strictly
                            to adhere to them"

                            That's me...

                            > And if you can show me a man who runs everything by
                            > the book, I'll show you a liar :)
                            >
                            > Dusty
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