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Re: The Problems with PCGen and Solutions?

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  • mocha@mcs.net
    We ve talked about a currency system, and it definitely will get done, just not for the 2.0.0 release. We ll let you define which currency is the standard ,
    Message 1 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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      We've talked about a currency system, and it definitely will get
      done, just not for the 2.0.0 release. We'll let you define which
      currency is the 'standard', and the 'gold' field in the Items tab
      will be tied to how many of those coins you have. All the other
      coins will have a cost associated with them, which will give us an
      exchange rate. Our thinking was to do this as equipment, but in
      thinking about this I realize that the coins would then show up in
      the Equipment lists on the charactersheets, which may not be desired
      behavior. You could also display them in a separate 'wealth' section
      by using the EQTYPE.Coins token, but maybe breaking them out of
      equipment into a Wealth object would be a better implementation.
      Anyway, the idea is pretty much there, just need to work out the
      kinks. :)

      -Bryan

      --- In pcgen@y..., Lonestar <Lonestar@l...> wrote:
      > kyc> I'd also like to address the gold issue. If you go under the
      misc.
      > kyc> tab in the program and put in the amount of gold, silver,
      copper, or
      > kyc> platinum peices the person in the party has it shows up on the
      ROG
      > kyc> sheet under gold!
      >
      > I think currency support is supposed to be on the to-do list.
      > It should be possible to have a self defined currency system for
      each
      > campaign (region?).
      > In the Forgotten Realms it is:
      > 1 platinum = 10 gold = 100 silver = 1000 copper coins
      > In Waterdeep thers the toal (a square brass coin with a central
      hole,
      > worth 2gp) and the harbor moon (a flat crescent platinum with a
      > central hole and an electrum inlay, worth 50 gp in Waterdeep and
      30gp
      > elsewhere).
      > Then there are trade bars of silver or gold in different weights (1
      to
      > 10 pounds) and there are some other exotic currencies like the Gond
      > bells (small brass bells. worth 10gp in trade and 20gp in Gond
      > temples) or the Shaar rings (pierced and polished slices of ivory,
      > worth 3gp each) plus an assortment of pearls (used by undersea
      > creatures as currency).
      >
      > Ok, thats a rather complex currency system, but it would be great if
      > it would be supported by PCGen ;)
      >
      >
      > Lonestar mailto:Lonestar@l...
    • mocha@mcs.net
      ... the ... Hey - I m always open to ideas! :) ... couple ... to ... questions ... major ... over ... and Weapon ... The feats tab looks very different - most
      Message 2 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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        --- In pcgen@y..., "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...> wrote:
        > Since PCGen was being partially rewritten anyways, I figured that I
        > would give a couple suggestions on features that would make PCGen
        the
        > best program it can be.

        Hey - I'm always open to ideas! :)

        >
        > I finally convinced a programmer friend of mine to try PCGen to
        > generate characters, he liked the Master Tools demo for that. He
        > thinks that this program has so much potential but there are a
        couple
        > things that need to be changed. He says they would be fairly easy
        to
        > repair and said he might be willing to help should you have
        questions
        > as to how to implement these features. What we see as a couple
        major
        > flaws of the program that are limiting its effectiveness are as
        > follows:
        >
        > 1. Feats need to have a screen set up to drag "available feats"
        over
        > to a "chosen feats" section. This will allow you to take any feats
        > more than once, unlike the current system. Each feat will need a
        > descriptor for whether or not it allows mulitple or not.
        >
        > It also allows you to easily see which feats you currently have as
        > well as easily take things like "Weapon Focus: longsword"
        and "Weapon
        > Focus: short sword".

        The feats tab looks very different - most tabs (feats included) are
        dominated by a table displaying all the relevant info. For feats
        this means whether or not you qualify for it, it's name, how you have
        it (virtual, no, yes), any pre-requisites, it's description and
        source file. The options (virtual, yes, no) is actually a button,
        and by clicking on the button you're selecting/de-selecting the feat
        (any choices related to it are then presented). You can sort by any
        column in the table (same for all tables in PCGen except for the
        stats table) and you can even filter out which feats are displayed.
        Our API will be open, so your friend would be able to construct his
        own interface if he wanted to. A largely drag-and-drop type
        interface would certainly be a good choice, but I like the amount of
        info you can provide in a table. It also gives you more sorting
        options than you'd have in a drag-n-drop solution. Just comes down to
        preferences.

        >
        > 2. You need to be able to sort the equipment by all the
        categories.
        > As well, a system like the feats above where you drag items into
        your
        > inventory. Items could either be set as multiple or not. Multiple
        > items would allow you to buy more than one of something at once as
        be
        > listed as "7 days rations", whereas some items could only be bought
        > one at a time, so you could drag "Short Sword" over to your
        inventory
        > and have one. If you wanted a second one for your offhand, you
        could
        > drag another "Short Sword" over, each one would be listed as
        > different items.
        >
        > You would need a button called add or something so you could select
        a
        > multiple item in your inventory and add 1 to it. So you would drag
        > over "Days of Iron Rations" and it would automatically assign 1 to
        > it, then you could click on it and add more, so you could put it up
        > to 7. This would also enable you to make "groups" of items. For
        > instance, in this same situation, after taking 7 days of rations,
        you
        > could drag another "days of iron rations" over, it would auto
        assign
        > 1 to that one, and then you could add 6 more to it, and therefore
        > have 2 "groups" of 7 days iron rations. This would make it easier
        to
        > marks weeks of rations for instance off your character sheet.
        >
        > This system would enable you to actually equip one short sword in
        > each hand. It could be done by making your equipment into an array.

        All tables (minus one) will be sortable by every column, so that
        request is already handled.:) I have big plans on how to change the
        equipping functionality, but we just didn't have time to get that in
        this initial release. The way I want to handle it is via a drag-n-
        drop type interface which is very intuitive - I also plan on handling
        putting stuff in containers all in the same interface... so we'll get
        there, just not in 2.0.0 (maybe 2.0.1, but we'll see...) :)

        >
        > 3. We need to have a similar system as the items for the skills.
        > Drag a skill over when you take it, it would set the skill at 1.0
        or
        > 0.5 if it is cross class. It would also ask you for the
        > specialization when you first move it over. For instance, if you
        > drag "History" over, it would come up with a list of choices for
        > specialization like "local" or "The Dales" or "Waterdeep" or
        > something.

        I take it you like drag-n-drop? :) My preference is definitely on
        the table side. Technically everyone has all skills (except
        exclusive ones) because ranks are really just modifiers, whereas drag-
        n-drop would indicate that you don't have the skill at all unless you
        allocate at least one skill-point to it. I like the table
        presentation because I can display in one column your total,
        modifiers, ranks and whatnot and you can sort on any of them. You
        can also use a filter to filter on just class-skills, cross-class
        skills, exclusive or untrained. I think you'll like it. :)

        >
        > 4. The amount of gold you have left after you purchase your
        equipment
        > should print somewhere on the character sheets, it doesn't yet.
        You
        > have to manually enter it into the money section

        As ROG mentioned - this is a charactersheet issue. The GOLD token
        does this, but the wealth issue is about to get a face-lift
        afterwhich time ROG will add those tokens to his charactersheet.

        >
        > 5. I would like to request the ability to add a bonus to all skills
        > based off of one attribute like "+2 to all charisma based skills".
        I
        > don't know if you can already do this, however, right now the
        circlet
        > of persuasion is listed as +2 to charisma instead of +2 to all
        > charisma based skills.

        Ah - then it should really be +4 to charisma to give a +2 mod.

        >
        > When I say "drag" in these examples, I believe something like the
        > current spell system, where you click on something then click a
        > button to add it would work too.

        Our drag-n-drop method for equipping, when completed, will look a lot
        like a file brower. You'll see objects displayed in a hierarchy, with
        containers displayed like a directory. In java this is called a
        JTree - so you can actually click on the object and drag it over the
        container you want to put it in.

        >
        > I believe this system would require more information to be stored
        in
        > the character save files themselves. If you are already storing
        more
        > information in the character sheets, would it be possible to store
        > information like the stats on all your weapons, spells, abilities
        of
        > your current levels of classes, etc. on your character save file so
        > you could load it in any copy of PCGen without that copy having the
        > appropriate lst files so you could still view your character and
        > create character sheets, but you wouldn't be able to increase your
        > level in any class that you didn't have the lst files for.
        >
        > I understand that some of it would be a lot of work, however, right
        > now as it stands, you cannot take multiple toughness feats, or
        equip
        > 2 of the same weapons. As well, taking equipment is very difficult
        > right now, at the very least, this needs an "Add" button, so you
        > could select an item and then click the add button to add 1.
        >
        > I hope this helps slightly, you know I've been around a while
        trying
        > to make PCGen better, as I believe it can truly be THE best
        character
        > generator for D20.

        I'm certainly glad to hear your suggestions. PCGen wouldn't have
        gotten nearly this far if I'd insisted on only using my own ideas -
        many people have come up with absolutely fantastic ideas and have
        made coding it a lot of fun. I think that part of what makes PCGen
        special is that there's such a strong community effort behind it.
        Maybe by the time that GenCon rolls around we'll be up-to-date in
        terms of supporting all material that's been released by that time.
        That's pretty aggresive, but it's certainly worth a shot. :)

        -Bryan

        >
        > Chris Wachal
      • sorrow@talk21.com
        *looks at Bryan s comments on V2.0* Oooooh. Every time someone mentions the new version, it sounds better ;) Can t wait to see this.
        Message 3 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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          *looks at Bryan's comments on V2.0*

          Oooooh. Every time someone mentions the new version, it sounds
          better ;)

          Can't wait to see this.
        • Damian
          Lots of stuff below. v Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult, Erin ... From: mocha@mcs.net [mailto:mocha@mcs.net] Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 9:52 AM
          Message 4 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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            Lots of stuff below.
             

            v     Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult,

            Erin

            -----Original Message-----
            From: mocha@... [mailto:mocha@...]
            Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 9:52 AM
            To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [pcgen] Re: The Problems with PCGen and Solutions?

            --- In pcgen@y..., "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...> wrote:
            > Since PCGen was being partially rewritten anyways, I figured that I
            > would give a couple suggestions on features that would make PCGen
            the
            > best program it can be.

            Hey - I'm always open to ideas! :)

            >
            > I finally convinced a programmer friend of mine to try PCGen to
            > generate characters, he liked the Master Tools demo for that.  He
            > thinks that this program has so much potential but there are a
            couple
            > things that need to be changed.  He says they would be fairly easy
            to
            > repair and said he might be willing to help should you have
            questions
            > as to how to implement these features.  What we see as a couple
            major
            > flaws of the program that are limiting its effectiveness are as
            > follows:
            >
            > 1. Feats need to have a screen set up to drag "available feats"
            over
            > to a "chosen feats" section.  This will allow you to take any feats
            > more than once, unlike the current system.  Each feat will need a
            > descriptor for whether or not it allows mulitple or not.
            >
            > It also allows you to easily see which feats you currently have as
            > well as easily take things like "Weapon Focus: longsword"
            and "Weapon
            > Focus: short sword".

            The feats tab looks very different - most tabs (feats included) are
            dominated by a table displaying all the relevant info.  For feats
            this means whether or not you qualify for it, it's name, how you have
            it (virtual, no, yes), any pre-requisites, it's description and
            source file.  The options (virtual, yes, no) is actually a button,
            and by clicking on the button you're selecting/de-selecting the feat
            (any choices related to it are then presented).  You can sort by any
            column in the table (same for all tables in PCGen except for the
            stats table) and you can even filter out which feats are displayed. 
            Our API will be open, so your friend would be able to construct his
            own interface if he wanted to.  A largely drag-and-drop type
            interface would certainly be a good choice, but I like the amount of
            info you can provide in a table.  It also gives you more sorting
            options than you'd have in a drag-n-drop solution. Just comes down to
            preferences. 
             
            I like the table method too.  I want LOTS of info in my generator.  that's part of the problem i had with the one that came with the Players Handbook. 

            >
            > 2. You need to be able to sort the equipment by all the
            categories. 
            > As well, a system like the feats above where you drag items into
            your
            > inventory.  Items could either be set as multiple or not.  Multiple
            > items would allow you to buy more than one of something at once as
            be
            > listed as "7 days rations", whereas some items could only be bought
            > one at a time, so you could drag "Short Sword" over to your
            inventory
            > and have one.  If you wanted a second one for your offhand, you
            could
            > drag another "Short Sword" over, each one would be listed as
            > different items.
            >
            > You would need a button called add or something so you could select
            a
            > multiple item in your inventory and add 1 to it.  So you would drag
            > over "Days of Iron Rations" and it would automatically assign 1 to
            > it, then you could click on it and add more, so you could put it up
            > to 7.  This would also enable you to make "groups" of items.  For
            > instance, in this same situation, after taking 7 days of rations,
            you
            > could drag another "days of iron rations" over, it would auto
            assign
            > 1 to that one, and then you could add 6 more to it, and therefore
            > have 2 "groups" of 7 days iron rations.  This would make it easier
            to
            > marks weeks of rations for instance off your character sheet.
            >
            > This system would enable you to actually equip one short sword in
            > each hand.  It could be done by making your equipment into an array.

            All tables (minus one) will be sortable by every column, so that
            request is already handled.:)  I have big plans on how to change the
            equipping functionality, but we just didn't have time to get that in
            this initial release.  The way I want to handle it is via a drag-n-
            drop type interface which is very intuitive - I also plan on handling
            putting stuff in containers all in the same interface... so we'll get
            there, just not in 2.0.0 (maybe 2.0.1, but we'll see...) :) 

            >
            > 3. We need to have a similar system as the items for the skills. 
            > Drag a skill over when you take it, it would set the skill at 1.0
            or
            > 0.5 if it is cross class.  It would also ask you for the
            > specialization when you first move it over.  For instance, if you
            > drag "History" over, it would come up with a list of choices for
            > specialization like "local" or "The Dales" or "Waterdeep" or
            > something.

            I take it you like drag-n-drop? :)  My preference is definitely on
            the table side.  Technically everyone has all skills (except
            exclusive ones) because ranks are really just modifiers, whereas drag-
            n-drop would indicate that you don't have the skill at all unless you
            allocate at least one skill-point to it.  I like the table
            presentation because I can display in one column your total,
            modifiers, ranks and whatnot and you can sort on any of them.  You
            can also use a filter to filter on just class-skills, cross-class
            skills, exclusive or untrained. I think you'll like it. :) 
             
            Are we going to have pop up text fields for nonstandard specializations?  Stuff that's not in the books? 

            >
            > 4. The amount of gold you have left after you purchase your
            equipment
            > should print somewhere on the character sheets, it doesn't yet. 
            You
            > have to manually enter it into the money section

            As ROG mentioned - this is a charactersheet issue.  The GOLD token
            does this, but the wealth issue is about to get a face-lift
            afterwhich time ROG will add those tokens to his charactersheet.

            >
            > 5. I would like to request the ability to add a bonus to all skills
            > based off of one attribute like "+2 to all charisma based skills". 
            I
            > don't know if you can already do this, however, right now the
            circlet
            > of persuasion is listed as +2 to charisma instead of +2 to all
            > charisma based skills.

            Ah - then it should really be +4 to charisma to give a +2 mod. 
             
            well, +4 to Charisma for purposes of skills.

            >
            > When I say "drag" in these examples, I believe something like the
            > current spell system, where you click on something then click a
            > button to add it would work too.

            Our drag-n-drop method for equipping, when completed, will look a lot
            like a file brower. You'll see objects displayed in a hierarchy, with
            containers displayed like a directory.  In java this is called a
            JTree - so you can actually click on the object and drag it over the
            container you want to put it in.
             
            Going the rout of the old Core Rules stuff, eh?  cool, i liked how that worked, and is what i was going to suggest anyway (or did suggest, my minds a little glitchy right now).  Don't forget to allow containers within containers, and you COULD give them a HOME container, for stuff they want to HAVE, but don't carry with them.

            >
            > I believe this system would require more information to be stored
            in
            > the character save files themselves.  If you are already storing
            more
            > information in the character sheets, would it be possible to store
            > information like the stats on all your weapons, spells, abilities
            of
            > your current levels of classes, etc. on your character save file so
            > you could load it in any copy of PCGen without that copy having the
            > appropriate lst files so you could still view your character and
            > create character sheets, but you wouldn't be able to increase your
            > level in any class that you didn't have the lst files for.
            >
            > I understand that some of it would be a lot of work, however, right
            > now as it stands, you cannot take multiple toughness feats, or
            equip
            > 2 of the same weapons.  As well, taking equipment is very difficult
            > right now, at the very least, this needs an "Add" button, so you
            > could select an item and then click the add button to add 1.
            >
            > I hope this helps slightly, you know I've been around a while
            trying
            > to make PCGen better, as I believe it can truly be THE best
            character
            > generator for D20.

            I'm certainly glad to hear your suggestions.  PCGen wouldn't have
            gotten nearly this far if I'd insisted on only using my own ideas -
            many people have come up with absolutely fantastic ideas and have
            made coding it a lot of fun.  I think that part of what makes PCGen
            special is that there's such a strong community effort behind it. 
            Maybe by the time that GenCon rolls around we'll be up-to-date in
            terms of supporting all material that's been released by that time. 
            That's pretty aggresive, but it's certainly worth a shot. :)
             
            Grrrrrr. still pissed that i'm not going to be able to go this year.  I'm already savign up for next year.
             

            v     Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult,

            Erin

             
            -Bryan

            >
            > Chris Wachal



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          • mocha@mcs.net
            ... specializations? ... I don t follow your question... I remember discussing a feature recently where we talked about adding text to any kind of object - is
            Message 5 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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              --- In pcgen@y..., "Damian" <westfam@a...> wrote:
              > Lots of stuff below.
              >
              > v Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult,
              >
              > Erin
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: mocha@m... [mailto:mocha@m...]
              > Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 9:52 AM
              > To: pcgen@y...
              > Subject: [pcgen] Re: The Problems with PCGen and Solutions?
              >
              >
              > --- In pcgen@y..., "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...> wrote:

              >
              > Are we going to have pop up text fields for nonstandard
              specializations?
              > Stuff that's not in the books?

              I don't follow your question... I remember discussing a feature
              recently where we talked about adding text to any kind of object - is
              that what you're referring to? That'll be in the feature request
              list, but it won't be in 2.0.0. The new version will be quite like
              PCGen 1.4 in terms of what it can handle - it's mostly a gui facelift
              and the ability to run on non-Windows OSes that's driving the initial
              release.



              > >
              > > When I say "drag" in these examples, I believe something like
              the
              > > current spell system, where you click on something then click a
              > > button to add it would work too.
              >
              > Our drag-n-drop method for equipping, when completed, will look a
              lot
              > like a file brower. You'll see objects displayed in a hierarchy,
              with
              > containers displayed like a directory. In java this is called a
              > JTree - so you can actually click on the object and drag it over
              the
              > container you want to put it in.
              >
              > Going the rout of the old Core Rules stuff, eh? cool, i liked
              how that
              > worked, and is what i was going to suggest anyway (or did suggest,
              my minds
              > a little glitchy right now). Don't forget to allow containers
              within
              > containers, and you COULD give them a HOME container, for stuff
              they want to
              > HAVE, but don't carry with them.

              I've never seen the Core Rules, but it's possible the guy who started
              that work for me got his inspiration from there. I think he wants to
              treat everything (and throw in body parts as well...) as containers.
              That way you can put daggers in your cloak, or on your left ankle, or
              whatever. Containers will definitely be allowed to be nested - but I
              think we're planning on having it show what they're carrying and how
              they're carrying it. If we let you pick different modes (say you
              take items a-g while in a dungeon crawl, but only items a, d & e
              while in town. That would be messy to determine your encumberance
              because I wouldn't know where you were and that would impact your
              speed et al).



              > I'm certainly glad to hear your suggestions. PCGen wouldn't have
              > gotten nearly this far if I'd insisted on only using my own
              ideas -
              > many people have come up with absolutely fantastic ideas and have
              > made coding it a lot of fun. I think that part of what makes
              PCGen
              > special is that there's such a strong community effort behind it.
              > Maybe by the time that GenCon rolls around we'll be up-to-date in
              > terms of supporting all material that's been released by that
              time.
              > That's pretty aggresive, but it's certainly worth a shot. :)
              >
              > Grrrrrr. still pissed that i'm not going to be able to go this
              year. I'm
              > already savign up for next year.

              I'm hoping to go to GenCon. I've never gone before and this is its
              last year in Milwaukee. I'd like to go once just to see what the hub-
              bub is all about. I joke about making a T-Shirt about PCGen just to
              see if anyone knows what I'm talking about while I there.... ;)

              -Bryan

              >
              > v Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult,
              >
              > Erin
              >
              >
              > -Bryan
              >
              > >
              > > Chris Wachal
              >
              >
              >
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            • Damian
              I don t follow your question... I remember discussing a feature recently where we talked about adding text to any kind of object - is that what you re
              Message 6 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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                I don't follow your question... I remember discussing a feature
                recently where we talked about adding text to any kind of object - is
                that what you're referring to?  That'll be in the feature request
                list, but it won't be in 2.0.0.  The new version will be quite like
                PCGen 1.4 in terms of what it can handle - it's mostly a gui facelift
                and the ability to run on non-Windows OSes that's driving the initial
                release.
                 
                For instanc you could select Craft, and put "automobile" as the type. 

                >   >
                >   >
                When I say "drag" in these examples, I believe something like
                the
                >   > current spell system, where you click on
                something then click a
                >   > button to add it would work
                too.
                >
                >   Our drag-n-drop method for equipping, when
                completed, will look a
                lot
                >   like a file brower. You'll
                see objects displayed in a hierarchy,
                with
                >   containers
                displayed like a directory.  In java this is called a
                >  
                JTree - so you can actually click on the object and drag it over
                the
                >   container you want to put it in.
                >
                >   Going the rout of the old Core Rules stuff, eh?  cool,
                i liked
                how that
                > worked, and is what i was going to suggest anyway
                (or did suggest,
                my minds
                > a little glitchy right now).  Don't
                forget to allow containers
                within
                > containers, and you COULD give
                them a HOME container, for stuff
                they want to
                > HAVE, but don't carry
                with them.

                I've never seen the Core Rules, but it's possible the guy who started
                that work for me got his inspiration from there.  I think he wants to
                treat everything (and throw in body parts as well...) as containers.
                That way you can put daggers in your cloak, or on your left ankle, or
                whatever. Containers will definitely be allowed to be nested - but I
                think we're planning on having it show what they're carrying and how
                they're carrying it.  If we let you pick different modes (say you
                take items a-g while in a dungeon crawl, but only items a, d & e
                while in town.  That would be messy to determine your encumberance
                because I wouldn't know where you were and that would impact your
                speed et al).



                >   I'm certainly glad to hear your
                suggestions.  PCGen wouldn't have
                >   gotten nearly this
                far if I'd insisted on only using my own
                ideas -
                >   many
                people have come up with absolutely fantastic ideas and have
                >  
                made coding it a lot of fun.  I think that part of what makes
                PCGen
                >   special is that there's such a strong community
                effort behind it.
                >   Maybe by the time that GenCon rolls around
                we'll be up-to-date in
                >   terms of supporting all material
                that's been released by that
                time.
                >   That's pretty
                aggresive, but it's certainly worth a shot. :)
                >
                >  
                Grrrrrr. still pissed that i'm not going to be able to go this
                year.  I'm
                > already savign up for next year.

                I'm hoping to go to GenCon.  I've never gone before and this is its
                last year in Milwaukee.  I'd like to go once just to see what the hub-
                bub is all about.  I joke about making a T-Shirt about PCGen just to
                see if anyone knows what I'm talking about while I there.... ;)

                -Bryan
                 2002 is the last year.  i checked the wizards.com schedule.  http://www.wizards.com/gencon/2001/future_gencons.asp
              • Damian
                v Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult, Erin ... From: Damian [mailto:westfam@awesomenet.net] Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 6:13 PM To:
                Message 7 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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                  v     Cleverly Disguised As A Responsible Adult,

                  Erin

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Damian [mailto:westfam@...]
                  Sent: Monday, June 04, 2001 6:13 PM
                  To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [pcgen] Re: The Problems with PCGen and Solutions?


                  I don't follow your question... I remember discussing a feature
                  recently where we talked about adding text to any kind of object - is
                  that what you're referring to?  That'll be in the feature request
                  list, but it won't be in 2.0.0.  The new version will be quite like
                  PCGen 1.4 in terms of what it can handle - it's mostly a gui facelift
                  and the ability to run on non-Windows OSes that's driving the initial
                  release.
                   
                  For instanc you could select Craft, and put "automobile" as the type.  
                   
                  That is, in addition to the other choices.  you know, have a "blank" choice that will let you type in it, or you can use the pull down.  better explanaion? 
                • maggard@aztec.asu.edu
                  A seperate area for Wealth would allow the gems, precious metals, etc. to be in one area. And equipment becomes the tools to do your job. ... desired ...
                  Message 8 of 26 , Jun 4, 2001
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                    A seperate area for Wealth would allow the gems, precious metals,
                    etc. to be in one area. And equipment becomes the tools to do your
                    job.

                    --- In pcgen@y..., mocha@m... wrote:
                    > We've talked about a currency system, and it definitely will get
                    > done, just not for the 2.0.0 release. We'll let you define which
                    > currency is the 'standard', and the 'gold' field in the Items tab
                    > will be tied to how many of those coins you have. All the other
                    > coins will have a cost associated with them, which will give us an
                    > exchange rate. Our thinking was to do this as equipment, but in
                    > thinking about this I realize that the coins would then show up in
                    > the Equipment lists on the charactersheets, which may not be
                    desired
                    > behavior. You could also display them in a separate 'wealth'
                    section
                    > by using the EQTYPE.Coins token, but maybe breaking them out of
                    > equipment into a Wealth object would be a better implementation.
                    > Anyway, the idea is pretty much there, just need to work out the
                    > kinks. :)
                    >
                    > -Bryan
                    >
                    > --- In pcgen@y..., Lonestar <Lonestar@l...> wrote:
                    > > kyc> I'd also like to address the gold issue. If you go under
                    the
                    > misc.
                    > > kyc> tab in the program and put in the amount of gold, silver,
                    > copper, or
                    > > kyc> platinum peices the person in the party has it shows up on
                    the
                    > ROG
                    > > kyc> sheet under gold!
                    > >
                    > > I think currency support is supposed to be on the to-do list.
                    > > It should be possible to have a self defined currency system for
                    > each
                    > > campaign (region?).
                    > > In the Forgotten Realms it is:
                    > > 1 platinum = 10 gold = 100 silver = 1000 copper coins
                    > > In Waterdeep thers the toal (a square brass coin with a central
                    > hole,
                    > > worth 2gp) and the harbor moon (a flat crescent platinum with a
                    > > central hole and an electrum inlay, worth 50 gp in Waterdeep and
                    > 30gp
                    > > elsewhere).
                    > > Then there are trade bars of silver or gold in different weights
                    (1
                    > to
                    > > 10 pounds) and there are some other exotic currencies like the
                    Gond
                    > > bells (small brass bells. worth 10gp in trade and 20gp in Gond
                    > > temples) or the Shaar rings (pierced and polished slices of ivory,
                    > > worth 3gp each) plus an assortment of pearls (used by undersea
                    > > creatures as currency).
                    > >
                    > > Ok, thats a rather complex currency system, but it would be great
                    if
                    > > it would be supported by PCGen ;)
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Lonestar mailto:Lonestar@l...
                  • mocha@mcs.net
                    I see... I think someone already mentioned that this would cause potential problems for Feats like Skill Focus. I am planning on putting in PCGen the ability
                    Message 9 of 26 , Jun 6, 2001
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                      I see... I think someone already mentioned that this would cause
                      potential problems for Feats like Skill Focus. I am planning on
                      putting in PCGen the ability to 'collapse' skills. This has been a
                      long-standing request... basically some skills are related and you
                      don't necessarily always want to see all of them listed. The Filters
                      in PCGen 2.0 get you part of the way since you can pick if you want
                      to see Class skills, Cross-Class, Untrained or Exclusive. But to
                      collapse all the Knowledge skills into one row is also on the board.
                      It won't make the initial release - but you'll see the disabled
                      checkbox which will make it happen at some point... If you really
                      want to select a Knowledge Skill you can uncollapse the skill view,
                      if you want to collapse the hundred billion Knowledge, Craft and
                      Profession skills, just click on the checkbox. It should make
                      naviagating the skill list a lot easier.

                      -Bryan

                      --- In pcgen@y..., "Damian" <westfam@a...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I don't follow your question... I remember discussing a feature
                      > recently where we talked about adding text to any kind of object -
                      is
                      > that what you're referring to? That'll be in the feature request
                      > list, but it won't be in 2.0.0. The new version will be quite like
                      > PCGen 1.4 in terms of what it can handle - it's mostly a gui
                      facelift
                      > and the ability to run on non-Windows OSes that's driving the
                      initial
                      > release.
                      >
                      > For instanc you could select Craft, and put "automobile" as the
                      type.
                    • mocha@mcs.net
                      I think what I ll do is keep wealth (like coins, gems, etc.) in the equipment list to keep purchasing/selling simple. When you produce a character sheet I ll
                      Message 10 of 26 , Jun 6, 2001
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                        I think what I'll do is keep wealth (like coins, gems, etc.) in the
                        equipment list to keep purchasing/selling simple. When you produce a
                        character sheet I'll strip those items out of the equipment list and
                        put them in a separate list with a new token to output them. When
                        the charactersheet is done I'll put them back in the equipment list.
                        I might be able to get this done before the release of 2.0... but I'm
                        not sure.

                        -Bryan

                        --- In pcgen@y..., maggard@a... wrote:
                        > A seperate area for Wealth would allow the gems, precious metals,
                        > etc. to be in one area. And equipment becomes the tools to do your
                        > job.
                        >
                        > --- In pcgen@y..., mocha@m... wrote:
                        > > We've talked about a currency system, and it definitely will get
                        > > done, just not for the 2.0.0 release. We'll let you define which
                        > > currency is the 'standard', and the 'gold' field in the Items tab
                        > > will be tied to how many of those coins you have. All the other
                        > > coins will have a cost associated with them, which will give us
                        an
                        > > exchange rate. Our thinking was to do this as equipment, but in
                        > > thinking about this I realize that the coins would then show up
                        in
                        > > the Equipment lists on the charactersheets, which may not be
                        > desired
                        > > behavior. You could also display them in a separate 'wealth'
                        > section
                        > > by using the EQTYPE.Coins token, but maybe breaking them out of
                        > > equipment into a Wealth object would be a better implementation.
                        > > Anyway, the idea is pretty much there, just need to work out the
                        > > kinks. :)
                        > >
                        > > -Bryan
                        > >
                        > > --- In pcgen@y..., Lonestar <Lonestar@l...> wrote:
                        > > > kyc> I'd also like to address the gold issue. If you go under
                        > the
                        > > misc.
                        > > > kyc> tab in the program and put in the amount of gold, silver,
                        > > copper, or
                        > > > kyc> platinum peices the person in the party has it shows up on
                        > the
                        > > ROG
                        > > > kyc> sheet under gold!
                        > > >
                        > > > I think currency support is supposed to be on the to-do list.
                        > > > It should be possible to have a self defined currency system
                        for
                        > > each
                        > > > campaign (region?).
                        > > > In the Forgotten Realms it is:
                        > > > 1 platinum = 10 gold = 100 silver = 1000 copper coins
                        > > > In Waterdeep thers the toal (a square brass coin with a central
                        > > hole,
                        > > > worth 2gp) and the harbor moon (a flat crescent platinum with a
                        > > > central hole and an electrum inlay, worth 50 gp in Waterdeep
                        and
                        > > 30gp
                        > > > elsewhere).
                        > > > Then there are trade bars of silver or gold in different
                        weights
                        > (1
                        > > to
                        > > > 10 pounds) and there are some other exotic currencies like the
                        > Gond
                        > > > bells (small brass bells. worth 10gp in trade and 20gp in Gond
                        > > > temples) or the Shaar rings (pierced and polished slices of
                        ivory,
                        > > > worth 3gp each) plus an assortment of pearls (used by undersea
                        > > > creatures as currency).
                        > > >
                        > > > Ok, thats a rather complex currency system, but it would be
                        great
                        > if
                        > > > it would be supported by PCGen ;)
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > Lonestar mailto:Lonestar@l...
                      • maggard@aztec.asu.edu
                        Any chance of taking this one step further so you can collaps different levels of each skills? e.g. + Craft Skills - Knowledge Skills + A - D + E - H + I - L +
                        Message 11 of 26 , Jun 6, 2001
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                          Any chance of taking this one step further so you can collaps
                          different levels of each skills?
                          e.g.
                          + Craft Skills
                          - Knowledge Skills
                          + A - D
                          + E - H
                          + I - L
                          + M - p
                          + Q - T
                          + U - Z
                          + Profession Skills


                          --- In pcgen@y..., mocha@m... wrote:
                          > I see... I think someone already mentioned that this would cause
                          > potential problems for Feats like Skill Focus. I am planning on
                          > putting in PCGen the ability to 'collapse' skills. This has been a
                          > long-standing request... basically some skills are related and you
                          > don't necessarily always want to see all of them listed. The
                          Filters
                          > in PCGen 2.0 get you part of the way since you can pick if you want
                          > to see Class skills, Cross-Class, Untrained or Exclusive. But to
                          > collapse all the Knowledge skills into one row is also on the
                          board.
                          > It won't make the initial release - but you'll see the disabled
                          > checkbox which will make it happen at some point... If you really
                          > want to select a Knowledge Skill you can uncollapse the skill view,
                          > if you want to collapse the hundred billion Knowledge, Craft and
                          > Profession skills, just click on the checkbox. It should make
                          > naviagating the skill list a lot easier.
                          >
                          > -Bryan
                        • Chris Wachal
                          ... have ... feat ... any ... displayed. ... of ... to ... I agree, however, I like to be able to see the feats I currently have in a quick list so that I can
                          Message 12 of 26 , Jun 6, 2001
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                            > The feats tab looks very different - most tabs (feats included) are
                            > dominated by a table displaying all the relevant info. For feats
                            > this means whether or not you qualify for it, it's name, how you
                            have
                            > it (virtual, no, yes), any pre-requisites, it's description and
                            > source file. The options (virtual, yes, no) is actually a button,
                            > and by clicking on the button you're selecting/de-selecting the
                            feat
                            > (any choices related to it are then presented). You can sort by
                            any
                            > column in the table (same for all tables in PCGen except for the
                            > stats table) and you can even filter out which feats are
                            displayed.
                            > Our API will be open, so your friend would be able to construct his
                            > own interface if he wanted to. A largely drag-and-drop type
                            > interface would certainly be a good choice, but I like the amount
                            of
                            > info you can provide in a table. It also gives you more sorting
                            > options than you'd have in a drag-n-drop solution. Just comes down
                            to
                            > preferences.
                            >

                            I agree, however, I like to be able to see the feats I currently have
                            in a quick list so that I can see "I've spend 2 feats on toughness, I
                            already have power attack, hmm...I guess I could take cleave" and
                            then search for the feat in the list.

                            Also, being able to quickly bypass feats that I can not take would be
                            handy, either being able to filter them out or make them greyed out,
                            it is not easy to see the * beside it.


                            > All tables (minus one) will be sortable by every column, so that
                            > request is already handled.:) I have big plans on how to change
                            the
                            > equipping functionality, but we just didn't have time to get that
                            in
                            > this initial release. The way I want to handle it is via a drag-n-
                            > drop type interface which is very intuitive - I also plan on
                            handling
                            > putting stuff in containers all in the same interface... so we'll
                            get
                            > there, just not in 2.0.0 (maybe 2.0.1, but we'll see...) :)
                            >

                            I'm glad to hear this. This should all work out good. I do think
                            that the feature of Master Tools to set up "Sets" of equipment for
                            things like "what are my pluses with 2 weapons", "what about with a
                            weapon and a shield?".

                            If the equipment section isn't changing in the next version, could
                            you at least add a button to add one to the currently selected
                            equipment? Also, supporting shield proficiencies would be handy.


                            > I take it you like drag-n-drop? :) My preference is definitely on
                            > the table side. Technically everyone has all skills (except
                            > exclusive ones) because ranks are really just modifiers, whereas
                            drag-
                            > n-drop would indicate that you don't have the skill at all unless
                            you
                            > allocate at least one skill-point to it. I like the table
                            > presentation because I can display in one column your total,
                            > modifiers, ranks and whatnot and you can sort on any of them. You
                            > can also use a filter to filter on just class-skills, cross-class
                            > skills, exclusive or untrained. I think you'll like it. :)
                            >

                            That is technically incorrect. All players have all the untrained
                            skills, however that is less than half the list. You need to have at
                            least 1 rank in a trained skill to be able to use that skill.

                            Having a list of available skills and ones you have access to would
                            be handy. Maybe start the skill list of skills you already have with
                            all of the untrained skills. This way newbies can see "Oh, I already
                            have swim at 4 total because I have an 18 strength, but I can't play
                            an instrument yet." I think for newbies, it helps to be able to
                            see "these are all the skills I can use, and these are the ones I
                            can't".

                            For us who play DND a lot, it is easy to just say "I know that any
                            skill that has a cost of 1.0 is a class skill and anyone with a cost
                            of 2.0 is a cross classed skill." Being able to filter the skill
                            list to "untrained, trained, class skills, cross-class skills,
                            exclusive, and all" would be handy.

                            Also, I want to make a request for my friend. He apparently hates
                            clicking an add button, he wants to be able to enter the number of
                            ranks in a field for a skill.


                            > As ROG mentioned - this is a charactersheet issue. The GOLD token
                            > does this, but the wealth issue is about to get a face-lift
                            > afterwhich time ROG will add those tokens to his charactersheet.
                            >

                            I now know about the gold issue. I thought there might have been the
                            capability to put them on the character sheet. I just thought it
                            kind of strange that the program had that capability and it didn't
                            print it.


                            > >
                            > > 5. I would like to request the ability to add a bonus to all
                            skills
                            > > based off of one attribute like "+2 to all charisma based
                            skills".
                            > I
                            > > don't know if you can already do this, however, right now the
                            > circlet
                            > > of persuasion is listed as +2 to charisma instead of +2 to all
                            > > charisma based skills.
                            >
                            > Ah - then it should really be +4 to charisma to give a +2 mod.
                            >

                            That doesn't work correctly, however. A +4 charisma does add the
                            correct modifier to all your skills, however it also adds +2 to your
                            spell DCs if you are a sorcerer and your saves if you are a paladin.
                            The circlet isn't supposed to do that.

                            Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing the
                            circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based skill
                            individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based skill in
                            a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.

                            A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off of any
                            one stat" would be handy.


                            > I'm certainly glad to hear your suggestions. PCGen wouldn't have
                            > gotten nearly this far if I'd insisted on only using my own ideas -
                            > many people have come up with absolutely fantastic ideas and have
                            > made coding it a lot of fun. I think that part of what makes PCGen
                            > special is that there's such a strong community effort behind it.
                            > Maybe by the time that GenCon rolls around we'll be up-to-date in
                            > terms of supporting all material that's been released by that
                            time.
                            > That's pretty aggresive, but it's certainly worth a shot. :)
                            >
                            > -Bryan

                            No problem, I like trying to help. I take no offense at any
                            criticism of my comments either, they may not be the best way to do
                            things, but I think they will help.

                            Chris Wachal
                          • nezzir@home.com
                            Someone mentioned there was a box to check that would include all skills on the html page. Right now it just shows the ones I have put points in...
                            Message 13 of 26 , Jun 7, 2001
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                              Someone mentioned there was a box to check that would include all skills on
                              the html page. Right now it just shows the ones I have put points in...
                            • mocha@mcs.net
                              In the main tab where you select options there s a checkbox for Include Untrained Skills. If you click on this *BEFORE* you import or create a new character,
                              Message 14 of 26 , Jun 8, 2001
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                                In the main tab where you select options there's a checkbox for
                                Include Untrained Skills. If you click on this *BEFORE* you import
                                or create a new character, all the untrained skills will be added to
                                your character. In PCGen 2.0.0 this has been expanded slightly to a
                                selection box where you can pick None (meaning no extra skills),
                                Untrained (like clicking on this checkbox) and All (you get
                                everything, trained & exclusive...)

                                -Bryan

                                --- In pcgen@y..., "nezzir@h..." <nezzir@h...> wrote:
                                > Someone mentioned there was a box to check that would include all
                                skills on
                                > the html page. Right now it just shows the ones I have put points
                                in...
                              • Gary
                                There s also items like the luck stone and an ioun stone that give you a +1 to stat checks or a +1 to ALL skill checks. We d rather not have to specify each
                                Message 15 of 26 , Jun 8, 2001
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                                  There's also items like the luck stone and an ioun stone that give you
                                  a +1 to stat checks or a +1 to ALL skill checks. We'd rather not have
                                  to specify each skill on those items. I'm sure more will crop up.

                                  --- In pcgen@y..., "House Gryphon" <gryps@b...> wrote:
                                  > ----- Original Message -----
                                  > From: "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...>
                                  > > Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing the
                                  > > circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based skill
                                  > > individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based skill
                                  in
                                  > > a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.
                                  > > A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off of
                                  any
                                  > > one stat" would be handy.
                                  >
                                  > Actually, this may be the best way to do it.
                                  >
                                  > The condition "skills based off a stat" is just one of the many
                                  weird and
                                  > wonderful combinations that could crop up.
                                  >
                                  > My view is that:
                                  > * It is a waste coding for all the possibilities that may never crop
                                  up.
                                  > * If there is only one item like this it is easier to modify the
                                  item,
                                  > rather than add more complex functionality to the software - change
                                  the LST
                                  > data file isn't too difficult.
                                  > * Once a bit of functionality becomes common, then it is worth it to
                                  add to
                                  > a new version of the software.
                                  >
                                  > Question: Are there more items like the circlet ??? Most of the
                                  others I
                                  > can think of off the top of my head add to stats, not skills (eg
                                  Potion of
                                  > Cat's Grace, Girdle of Giant Strength, etc).
                                  >
                                  > - Sly
                                • mocha@mcs.net
                                  I think BONUS:SKILL|LIST|1 would work for this. At least I think it ought to... let me know if it doesn t! -Bryan ... you ... have ... the ... skill ... skill
                                  Message 16 of 26 , Jun 8, 2001
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                                    I think BONUS:SKILL|LIST|1 would work for this. At least I think it
                                    ought to... let me know if it doesn't!

                                    -Bryan

                                    --- In pcgen@y..., "Gary" <dinthron@y...> wrote:
                                    > There's also items like the luck stone and an ioun stone that give
                                    you
                                    > a +1 to stat checks or a +1 to ALL skill checks. We'd rather not
                                    have
                                    > to specify each skill on those items. I'm sure more will crop up.
                                    >
                                    > --- In pcgen@y..., "House Gryphon" <gryps@b...> wrote:
                                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                                    > > From: "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...>
                                    > > > Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing
                                    the
                                    > > > circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based
                                    skill
                                    > > > individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based
                                    skill
                                    > in
                                    > > > a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.
                                    > > > A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off
                                    of
                                    > any
                                    > > > one stat" would be handy.
                                    > >
                                    > > Actually, this may be the best way to do it.
                                    > >
                                    > > The condition "skills based off a stat" is just one of the many
                                    > weird and
                                    > > wonderful combinations that could crop up.
                                    > >
                                    > > My view is that:
                                    > > * It is a waste coding for all the possibilities that may never
                                    crop
                                    > up.
                                    > > * If there is only one item like this it is easier to modify the
                                    > item,
                                    > > rather than add more complex functionality to the software -
                                    change
                                    > the LST
                                    > > data file isn't too difficult.
                                    > > * Once a bit of functionality becomes common, then it is worth it
                                    to
                                    > add to
                                    > > a new version of the software.
                                    > >
                                    > > Question: Are there more items like the circlet ??? Most of the
                                    > others I
                                    > > can think of off the top of my head add to stats, not skills (eg
                                    > Potion of
                                    > > Cat's Grace, Girdle of Giant Strength, etc).
                                    > >
                                    > > - Sly
                                  • john.sussenberger@libertymutual.com
                                    Even more reason to have this coded :) Then I can make cool magic items that increase your Charisma skillz!! ... From: Gary [mailto:dinthron@yahoo.com] Sent:
                                    Message 17 of 26 , Jun 8, 2001
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                                      Even more reason to have this coded :)
                                       
                                      Then I can make cool magic items that increase your Charisma skillz!!
                                      -----Original Message-----
                                      From: Gary [mailto:dinthron@...]
                                      Sent: Friday, June 08, 2001 2:01 PM
                                      To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: [pcgen] Re: Magic items that modify skills

                                      There's also items like the luck stone and an ioun stone that give you
                                      a +1 to stat checks or a +1 to ALL skill checks.  We'd rather not have
                                      to specify each skill on those items.  I'm sure more will crop up.

                                      --- In pcgen@y..., "House Gryphon" <gryps@b...> wrote:
                                      > ----- Original Message -----
                                      > From: "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...>
                                      > > Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing the
                                      > > circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based skill
                                      > > individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based skill
                                      in
                                      > > a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.
                                      > > A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off of
                                      any
                                      > > one stat" would be handy.
                                      >
                                      > Actually, this may be the best way to do it.
                                      >
                                      > The condition "skills based off a stat" is just one of the many
                                      weird and
                                      > wonderful combinations that could crop up.
                                      >
                                      > My view is that:
                                      > * It is a waste coding for all the possibilities that may never crop
                                      up.
                                      > * If there is only one item like this it is easier to modify the
                                      item,
                                      > rather than add more complex functionality to the software - change
                                      the LST
                                      > data file isn't too difficult.
                                      > * Once a bit of functionality becomes common, then it is worth it to
                                      add to
                                      > a new version of the software.
                                      >
                                      > Question: Are there more items like the circlet ???  Most of the
                                      others I
                                      > can think of off the top of my head add to stats, not skills (eg
                                      Potion of
                                      > Cat's Grace, Girdle of Giant Strength, etc).
                                      >
                                      > - Sly



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                                    • mocha@mcs.net
                                      Hm - something like BONUS:SKILL|CHA|1 would be easy to do - what s the likelihood of a skill named STR,DEX,CON,INT,WIS or CHA? That would take almost a whole
                                      Message 18 of 26 , Jun 8, 2001
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                                        Hm - something like BONUS:SKILL|CHA|1 would be easy to do - what's
                                        the likelihood of a skill named STR,DEX,CON,INT,WIS or CHA?
                                        That would take almost a whole line of code to implement...

                                        -Bryan

                                        --- In pcgen@y..., john.sussenberger@l... wrote:
                                        > Even more reason to have this coded :)
                                        >
                                        > Then I can make cool magic items that increase your Charisma
                                        skillz!!
                                        >
                                        > -----Original Message-----
                                        > From: Gary [mailto:dinthron@y...]
                                        > Sent: Friday, June 08, 2001 2:01 PM
                                        > To: pcgen@y...
                                        > Subject: [pcgen] Re: Magic items that modify skills
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > There's also items like the luck stone and an ioun stone that give
                                        you
                                        > a +1 to stat checks or a +1 to ALL skill checks. We'd rather not
                                        have
                                        > to specify each skill on those items. I'm sure more will crop up.
                                        >
                                        > --- In pcgen@y..., "House Gryphon" <gryps@b...> wrote:
                                        > > ----- Original Message -----
                                        > > From: "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...>
                                        > > > Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing
                                        the
                                        > > > circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based
                                        skill
                                        > > > individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based
                                        skill
                                        > in
                                        > > > a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.
                                        > > > A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off
                                        of
                                        > any
                                        > > > one stat" would be handy.
                                        > >
                                        > > Actually, this may be the best way to do it.
                                        > >
                                        > > The condition "skills based off a stat" is just one of the many
                                        > weird and
                                        > > wonderful combinations that could crop up.
                                        > >
                                        > > My view is that:
                                        > > * It is a waste coding for all the possibilities that may never
                                        crop
                                        > up.
                                        > > * If there is only one item like this it is easier to modify the
                                        > item,
                                        > > rather than add more complex functionality to the software -
                                        change
                                        > the LST
                                        > > data file isn't too difficult.
                                        > > * Once a bit of functionality becomes common, then it is worth it
                                        to
                                        > add to
                                        > > a new version of the software.
                                        > >
                                        > > Question: Are there more items like the circlet ??? Most of the
                                        > others I
                                        > > can think of off the top of my head add to stats, not skills (eg
                                        > Potion of
                                        > > Cat's Grace, Girdle of Giant Strength, etc).
                                        > >
                                        > > - Sly
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
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                                      • Gary
                                        I tried this, and it didn t work. So I m letting you know. Ioun Stone (Pale green) TYPE:Magic Item.Wonderous Cost:20000 WT:0
                                        Message 19 of 26 , Jun 16, 2001
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                                          I tried this, and it didn't work. So I'm letting you know.

                                          Ioun Stone (Pale green) TYPE:Magic Item.Wonderous Cost:20000
                                          WT:0 BONUS:CHECKS|Fortitude,Willpower,Reflex|1
                                          BONUS:WEAPON|TOHIT|1 BONUS:WEAPONPROF=Unarmed Attack|TOHIT|1
                                          BONUS:SKILL|LIST|1

                                          The description says it gives +1 bonus to attacks, saving throws and
                                          skill checks.

                                          --- In pcgen@y..., mocha@m... wrote:
                                          > I think BONUS:SKILL|LIST|1 would work for this. At least I think it
                                          > ought to... let me know if it doesn't!
                                          >
                                          > -Bryan
                                          >
                                          > --- In pcgen@y..., "Gary" <dinthron@y...> wrote:
                                          > > There's also items like the luck stone and an ioun stone that give
                                          > you
                                          > > a +1 to stat checks or a +1 to ALL skill checks. We'd rather not
                                          > have
                                          > > to specify each skill on those items. I'm sure more will crop up.
                                          > >
                                          > > --- In pcgen@y..., "House Gryphon" <gryps@b...> wrote:
                                          > > > ----- Original Message -----
                                          > > > From: "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@h...>
                                          > > > > Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing
                                          > the
                                          > > > > circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based
                                          > skill
                                          > > > > individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based
                                          > skill
                                          > > in
                                          > > > > a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.
                                          > > > > A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off
                                          > of
                                          > > any
                                          > > > > one stat" would be handy.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Actually, this may be the best way to do it.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > The condition "skills based off a stat" is just one of the many
                                          > > weird and
                                          > > > wonderful combinations that could crop up.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > My view is that:
                                          > > > * It is a waste coding for all the possibilities that may never
                                          > crop
                                          > > up.
                                          > > > * If there is only one item like this it is easier to modify the
                                          > > item,
                                          > > > rather than add more complex functionality to the software -
                                          > change
                                          > > the LST
                                          > > > data file isn't too difficult.
                                          > > > * Once a bit of functionality becomes common, then it is worth
                                          it
                                          > to
                                          > > add to
                                          > > > a new version of the software.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Question: Are there more items like the circlet ??? Most of the
                                          > > others I
                                          > > > can think of off the top of my head add to stats, not skills (eg
                                          > > Potion of
                                          > > > Cat's Grace, Girdle of Giant Strength, etc).
                                          > > >
                                          > > > - Sly
                                        • Brass Tilde
                                          ... _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
                                          Message 20 of 26 , Jun 16, 2001
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                                            > -----Original Message-----
                                            > From: Gary [mailto:dinthron@...]
                                            >
                                            > I tried this, and it didn't work. So I'm letting you know.
                                            >
                                            > Ioun Stone (Pale green) TYPE:Magic Item.Wonderous Cost:20000
                                            > WT:0 BONUS:CHECKS|Fortitude,Willpower,Reflex|1
                                            > BONUS:WEAPON|TOHIT|1 BONUS:WEAPONPROF=Unarmed Attack|TOHIT|1
                                            > BONUS:SKILL|LIST|1
                                            >

                                            This bug has been entered at the SourceForge site as bug report #433808.

                                            You may access the SourceForge bug tracking page at:
                                            https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?group_id=25576&atid=384719

                                            _________________________________________________________
                                            Do You Yahoo!?
                                            Get your free @... address at http://mail.yahoo.com
                                          • House Gryphon
                                            ... From: Chris Wachal ... Actually, this may be the best way to do it. The condition skills based off a stat is just one of the many
                                            Message 21 of 26 , Jun 23, 2001
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                                              ----- Original Message -----
                                              From: "Chris Wachal" <cwachal@...>
                                              > Right now, I have made a work around on my system by changing the
                                              > circlet of persuasion to add plus 2 to every charisma based skill
                                              > individually, however if anyone adds another charisma based skill in
                                              > a LST file, the circlet would not add to that.
                                              > A function to do something like "Add 2 to all skills based off of any
                                              > one stat" would be handy.

                                              Actually, this may be the best way to do it.

                                              The condition "skills based off a stat" is just one of the many weird and
                                              wonderful combinations that could crop up.

                                              My view is that:
                                              * It is a waste coding for all the possibilities that may never crop up.
                                              * If there is only one item like this it is easier to modify the item,
                                              rather than add more complex functionality to the software - change the LST
                                              data file isn't too difficult.
                                              * Once a bit of functionality becomes common, then it is worth it to add to
                                              a new version of the software.

                                              Question: Are there more items like the circlet ??? Most of the others I
                                              can think of off the top of my head add to stats, not skills (eg Potion of
                                              Cat's Grace, Girdle of Giant Strength, etc).

                                              - Sly
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