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RE: [pcgen] TAGS

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  • Shawn A. Chesak
    Well, this is not entirely accurate the documentation is missing what I consider quite a lot in regards tags and formatting thereof. And he did say a list of
    Message 1 of 6 , Dec 1, 2002
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      Well, this is not entirely accurate the documentation is missing what I
      consider quite a lot in regards tags and formatting thereof. And he did
      say a list of ALL; the documentation is definitely NOT comprehensive.

      Without assistance from this mailing list or a good example in an
      already existing data file it is impossible to figure out how to
      accomplish many things just from the documentation alone.

      I think also, the request was for just a "list" rather then the multiple
      pages of tags with so many numerous examples and the like that you need
      to do a lot of scrolling up and down to scan the entire set of tags. I
      too often think it would be "handy" just to have a brief list for each
      category, all on one page in order to be allow a "quick glance" to find
      what is needed. (In that respect, I think the old table-format
      documentation was more useful)

      Speaking of this, there are also quite a few errors in the documentation
      regarding formatting of several tags and the data which follows, such as
      the example showing a pipe where in fact a comma is required, or
      omitting part of a tag that is necessary, or showing a equals sign where
      one needs to actually use a period, etc. I spent the holiday weekend
      creating all of the lst files for several new sourcebooks that I
      recently purchased and stumbled on a fair number of these errors; wish
      I'd been a bit less focused on what I was working on and actually taken
      the time to keep track of the errors and omissions that I found. I
      apologize for my lack of forethought in that I didn't keep track at all.
      :(

      Shawn A. Chesak
      http://www.stormkeep.net


      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: Mynex [mailto:mynex@...]
      > Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 12:52 AM
      > To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: RE: [pcgen] TAGS
      >
      >
      > My guess would be in the documentation. ;p
      >
      > Mynex
      > - Code Monkey Publishing Co-Founder (www.codemonkeypublishing.com)
      > - PCGen's #1 Evil Assistant
      > - PCGen Data & Doc Silverback
      >
      >
      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: Florian MARTIN [mailto:florian.d.martin@...]
      > Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 3:40 AM
      > To: pcgen
      > Subject: [pcgen] TAGS
      >
      > is there a list of all TAGS available somewhere? Perhaps sorted by
      > category? (i.e. FEAT
      > TAGS, SKILL TAGS, CLASS TAGS etc...)?
      >
      >
      > Florian MARTIN
      > ________________________________________
      > 12, sq Jules Ferry, 95110 Sannois (FR)
      > Phone: (+33) 06 73 48 28 19
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
      > PCGen's FAQ: http://pedertest.officeline.no/PCGen
      > PCGen's alpha build: http://rpg.plambert.net/pcgen
      > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > pcgen-unsubscribe@egroups.com
      >
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
      > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
    • Tir Gwaith
      ... category? (i.e. FEAT ... In the Docs, perhaps? Part 3 of every release... Tir Gwaith Soul Reaper Silverback and List File Silverback Chief LST Chimp
      Message 2 of 6 , Dec 1, 2002
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        > is there a list of all TAGS available somewhere? Perhaps sorted by
        category? (i.e. FEAT
        > TAGS, SKILL TAGS, CLASS TAGS etc...)?

        In the Docs, perhaps? Part 3 of every release...

        Tir Gwaith
        Soul Reaper Silverback and List File Silverback
        Chief LST Chimp
        Strange Monkey
        MM Race Dragon
      • merton_monk
        ... what I ... he did ... comprehensive. That was more true in the past - lately we ve had a good crew of Doc Monkeys working to make sure that all the tags
        Message 3 of 6 , Dec 1, 2002
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          --- In pcgen@y..., "Shawn A. Chesak" <shawnchesak@s...> wrote:
          > Well, this is not entirely accurate the documentation is missing
          what I
          > consider quite a lot in regards tags and formatting thereof. And
          he did
          > say a list of ALL; the documentation is definitely NOT
          comprehensive.

          That was more true in the past - lately we've had a good crew of Doc
          Monkeys working to make sure that all the tags are accounted for and
          that they work as advertised. At this point in time I'm fairly
          certain that all (or at least 99.9% of them!) the tags are listed.
          For each file type (e.g. feats) there are 2 files you'd need to look
          in - 1 for the file type specifically (the feat file) and the global
          one.

          >
          > Without assistance from this mailing list or a good example in an
          > already existing data file it is impossible to figure out how to
          > accomplish many things just from the documentation alone.

          Very true - I'm not sure I've ever read any documentation that
          explained everything fully enough. The data files themselves are a
          wonderful working example for just about all the tags, so you can
          see how the tag is actually used. Many tags have many variations
          available - not all of the variations are used in the datafiles, but
          at least a couple of examples should give you enough to start.

          >
          > I think also, the request was for just a "list" rather then the
          multiple
          > pages of tags with so many numerous examples and the like that you
          need
          > to do a lot of scrolling up and down to scan the entire set of
          tags. I
          > too often think it would be "handy" just to have a brief list for
          each
          > category, all on one page in order to be allow a "quick glance" to
          find
          > what is needed. (In that respect, I think the old table-format
          > documentation was more useful)

          We're quickly approaching a point where I don't think many new
          significant tags will be required. Then it will be more appropriate
          to create a file which lists all the tags and tokens and can link
          you to a fuller description.

          >
          > Speaking of this, there are also quite a few errors in the
          documentation
          > regarding formatting of several tags and the data which follows,
          such as
          > the example showing a pipe where in fact a comma is required, or
          > omitting part of a tag that is necessary, or showing a equals sign
          where
          > one needs to actually use a period, etc. I spent the holiday
          weekend
          > creating all of the lst files for several new sourcebooks that I
          > recently purchased and stumbled on a fair number of these errors;
          wish
          > I'd been a bit less focused on what I was working on and actually
          taken
          > the time to keep track of the errors and omissions that I found. I
          > apologize for my lack of forethought in that I didn't keep track
          at all.
          > :(

          Just saying "there are errors in the documentation!" is likely to
          hurt the feelings of the doc monkeys who have spent so much time and
          energy on vastly improving the condition of it. Code Monkeys should
          never be left to document what they write - that's not their
          strength, and who wants to do something they're not good at??? ;)
          As you note, it would be better to give a list of the errors so the
          Doc Monkeys know what needs fixing. I don't think anyone would
          maintain that the documentation is perfect, but the scope of it is
          big enough that if you don't know exactly what's in error, it's not
          worth spending much time looking through the haystack. If you or
          anyone else comes across something where you think the documentation
          is insufficient, wrong or entirely missing, let us know! The Doc
          Monkeys take great pride in their work, and they're happy to make it
          better. The Data Monkeys appreciate the greatly improved status of
          the documentation because that means training new data monkeys is
          even easier and less time consuming. The Code Monkeys are happy
          because they have to spend less time spelunking through the code to
          figure out how that tag 'really' works!

          So.... telling someone to look in the documentation isn't a bogus
          answer - if they don't find what they're looking for, then that
          alone tells us that maybe the documentation could use some TLC in
          that area.

          -Bryan


          >
          > Shawn A. Chesak
          > http://www.stormkeep.net
          >
          >
          > > -----Original Message-----
          > > From: Mynex [mailto:mynex@w...]
          > > Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 12:52 AM
          > > To: pcgen@y...
          > > Subject: RE: [pcgen] TAGS
          > >
          > >
          > > My guess would be in the documentation. ;p
          > >
          > > Mynex
          > > - Code Monkey Publishing Co-Founder
          (www.codemonkeypublishing.com)
          > > - PCGen's #1 Evil Assistant
          > > - PCGen Data & Doc Silverback
          > >
          > >
          > > -----Original Message-----
          > > From: Florian MARTIN [mailto:florian.d.martin@w...]
          > > Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 3:40 AM
          > > To: pcgen
          > > Subject: [pcgen] TAGS
          > >
          > > is there a list of all TAGS available somewhere? Perhaps
          sorted by
          > > category? (i.e. FEAT
          > > TAGS, SKILL TAGS, CLASS TAGS etc...)?
          > >
          > >
          > > Florian MARTIN
          > > ________________________________________
          > > 12, sq Jules Ferry, 95110 Sannois (FR)
          > > Phone: (+33) 06 73 48 28 19
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
          > > PCGen's FAQ: http://pedertest.officeline.no/PCGen
          > > PCGen's alpha build: http://rpg.plambert.net/pcgen
          > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > pcgen-unsubscribe@e...
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
        • Shawn A. Chesak
          Shawn A. Chesak http://www.stormkeep.net ... That will be nice! BTW, I meant no slight in regards to this. I wasn t implying that this is what the doc s
          Message 4 of 6 , Dec 1, 2002
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            Shawn A. Chesak
            http://www.stormkeep.net
            > We're quickly approaching a point where I don't think many new
            > significant tags will be required. Then it will be more appropriate
            > to create a file which lists all the tags and tokens and can link
            > you to a fuller description.

            That will be nice! BTW, I meant no slight in regards to this. I wasn't
            implying that this is what the doc's currently "should" have, but rather
            what I believe the original poster was looking for.

            >
            > Just saying "there are errors in the documentation!" is likely to
            > hurt the feelings of the doc monkeys who have spent so much time and
            > energy on vastly improving the condition of it. Code Monkeys should
            > never be left to document what they write - that's not their
            > strength, and who wants to do something they're not good at??? ;)
            > As you note, it would be better to give a list of the errors so the
            > Doc Monkeys know what needs fixing. <snipped for brevity>
            >

            Yes, I do apologize for not keeping track better of where I found
            mistakes. I've been a user of PCGen practically since the program was
            first made available to us over the internet. During this time I have
            always made an effort to post here any problems, errors, or what have
            you that I find in order to help the team of you (previously just the
            individual) working on it.

            As I see it, this wonderful program is a tremendous tool for myself and
            the players in my game and I'm extremely grateful for all of those who
            work so hard to make it available for us. Because I can't consistently
            devote any portion of time to projects such as this, I have not
            volunteered my time to directly help y'all -- letting you know through
            this list about any problems I find is what I consider the little bit
            that I CAN do to help.

            And I will agree, the documentation is very comprehensive (just not 100
            percent complete...yet). But then, this can be also said regarding the
            program itself, as y'all are continuously working on, fixing, tweaking
            and improving upon it. Though this can occasionally create some
            complications or confusion for users, I'd say that it's a good thing,
            eh? ;-)
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