Re: Level, Skills, Feats, and Summary Tab
- I really don't see where all the confusion lies in determining
Con/Int modifiers being retroactive. There is no other way to do hit
points without a direct reflection of the Con modifier. When you
gain a Con point, your body is tougher all over, not tougher in some
spots versus others. Your WHOLE body takes a hit the same, and
making Con mods unretroactive doesn't make any sense in the grand
scheme of things.
However, as people age, they get smarter. Therefore, the game
mechanic uses a point of Intelligence to reflect that. Does that
mean my brain "magically" gains knowledge when I get smarter? No.
Do certain events/spells/skills insert themselves into my brain as if
i've always known them? No. Intelligence is not retroactive because
you cannot suddenly learn things or know things as if you've always
known them. If I took a course in a subject, my brain doesnt all of
the sudden become more aborbent to everything around me, including
Sorry, but it seems to me that this debate is pointless.
"Life's a hench." - Nodwick coffee mug
--- In pcgen@y..., "StromMcLeod" <pkmf@y...> wrote:
> --- In pcgen@y..., Keith Davies <keith.davies@k...> wrote:
> >  this may be slightly more generous than the rules state; I
> > recall someone saying the other day that you get the benefit
> > improved Con when rolling hit points, but not improved Int for
> > skills. I prefer consistency. Neither of these attributes'
> > benefits can be pushed back -- you don't the extra hit points
> > skill points if you advance for the levels before your
> > You do get the benefits for the level in which you advance
> actually, you can see the official (unless errata'ed) rules on page
> 10 of the PHB...
> It starts with "For example, when Mialee becomes a 4th-level
> she decides to increase her Intelligence to 16...." then "as a new
> 4th level char, she get the skill points AFTER raising her Int,
> giving her 5 instead of 4." then, "but this is not retroactive" so
> she doesn't gain 3 extra points from the previous levels where it
> wasn't 5.
> So, Increased Int does not affect skill points retroactively.
> However, ability increase happens BEFORE selecting the class to
> On the other hand, page 145 gives a checklist of "When your
> achieves a new level" and... just to add spice to our lives, puts
> them in this order/sequence:
> Choose Class, BAB, Base Saves, Skill Points, Ability Score, Hit
> Point, Feats, Spells, Class Features.
> Under Hit Points, there are also 2 contradictory statements! :)
> Pg 146 says: Roll hit die, add Con mod, add the result to Total Hit
> This would assume that CON changes are also not retroactive.
> However... back on page 9: "If a character's Constitution changes
> enough to alter his or her Con Mod, his or her hitpoints also
> increase or decrease accordingly."
> more fun!
> maybe they fixed these in the erratas...
- I will say this again...and this is the last time.
I was merely pointing out that the rules in the book, as they apply
to the way PCGen implements them, are very clear. Thus, the debate
that was being made, on this PCGen oriented board which deals with
the way PCGen implements rules from sourcebooks, was pointless.
Hopefully this clears up any misconceptions about my opinions on
debates. Debates about relevant topics are good...I enjoy a good
Ah well, clear as mud, right?
and, the obligatory quote from Forrest Gump, "That's all I have to
say about that."
"Life's a hench." <HEE HAW> - Nodwick coffee mug
--- In pcgen@y..., Mynex <mynex3@c...> wrote:
> Haffhand, the very same question could be asked of you for this
> Regardless, debates on this group happen quite often, and many, MANY
> people play devil's advocate. Many people on this group are more
> willing to look at issues multiple times from different directions
> a consensus is reached on how to handle something. And sometimes
> have to repeat their arguments as the original message has been
> the shuffle or misunderstood through various replies. This is
> new here, and won't change, nor do we want it to change.
> As for 'traits' to be inferred, I _could_ make many of them from
> question, as I've seen many "questions" like this at the WotC
> but we're generally a bit more friendly here.
> - #1 Evil Assistant to the PCGen Code Monkeys
> - List files & Documentation Silverback
> - RPG Reviews Editor & Reviewer
> -----Original Message-----
> From: haffhand [mailto:bacchus@m...]
> Sent: Wednesday, July 03, 2002 11:02 PM
> To: pcgen@y...
> Subject: [pcgen] Re: Level, Skills, Feats, and Summary Tab
> --- In pcgen@y..., "arknathd" <gemguard@h...> wrote:
> > --- In pcgen@y..., Scott Ellsworth <scott@a...> wrote:
> > >
> But I still say the debate is pointless.
> This is twice now you've engaged in a debate you believe to be
> pointless. Same debate, but done twice. What traits of you is one
> supposed to infer from that?