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Re: vest of escape - +4 Open Lock

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  • StromMcLeod
    ... but, using your tool analogy: the vest comes with: a really really cool alan wrench the masterwork thieves toolkit comes with: a regular alan wrench
    Message 1 of 18 , Jul 1, 2002
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      --- In pcgen@y..., "kserrano76" <kernel_k@h...> wrote:
      > The way I see it, you can't use two different lockpicks at the same
      > time. It's like trying to hammer a nail with two different hammers at
      > the same time. This is why I think they don't stack.

      but, using your tool analogy:
      the vest comes with:
      a really really cool alan wrench

      the masterwork thieves toolkit comes with:
      a regular alan wrench
      adamantine hammer
      mithral chisel
      power drill with set of 12 drill bits of different sizes
      etc.

      So, the two stack... maybe.
    • cyberfunkr
      Just for reference: http://www.howstuffworks.com/lock-picking.htm Fueling the fire /Cyberfunkr ... free ... sufficient, ... Air ... pulled ... In the ... get
      Message 2 of 18 , Jul 1, 2002
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        Just for reference:

        http://www.howstuffworks.com/lock-picking.htm

        Fueling the fire
        /Cyberfunkr


        --- In pcgen@y..., "Don Mac Phee" <macphee@c...> wrote:
        > I've got a small wrench set that I cart around in my Jeep (came for
        free
        > with a camera), and contains the barest of essentials.
        >
        > Because there have been times where THAT set hasn't been wholly
        sufficient,
        > I carry a spare lock box full of odds and ends tools (Vise Grips,
        Air
        > inflator, bleed kit, etc.)
        >
        > Neither set will cover all jobs, but there have been times that I've
        pulled
        > tools from one, the other or both to get the job done.
        >
        > I would consider this example to parallel very well with lockpicks.
        In the
        > reading that I've done on the subject, for common locks, one could
        get by
        > with a half a dozen picks and a couple of pries, but that wouldn't
        cover
        > EVERYTHING, and you would possibly need an "expansion set" to cover
        some of
        > the newer locks, or traps.
        >
        > It's your world, but I think your mistaken.
        >
        > -Don
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: "kserrano76" <kernel_k@h...>
        > To: <pcgen@y...>
        > Sent: Monday, July 01, 2002 2:24 PM
        > Subject: [pcgen] Re: vest of escape - +4 Open Lock
        >
        >
        > > The way I see it, you can't use two different lockpicks at the
        same
        > > time. It's like trying to hammer a nail with two different hammers
        at
        > > the same time. This is why I think they don't stack.
        > >
        > > Back to the original question, what would I type to set the
        > > properties of the Vest of Escape to give a +4 to open lock and not
        > > stack with MW tools?
        > >
        > > Kristian
        > >
        > > --- In pcgen@y..., "micheledn94" <micheledn@a...> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Excuse me...but why wouldn't you want these to stack? If I
        > > remember
        > > > correctly, one gives a comepetence bonus and one gives a
        > > circumstance
        > > > bonus, thereby making them stackable.
        > > >
        > > > Wish I knew how to program...my thief is still waiting for her
        > > > character sheets to get this right. Poor Di'Ora...::sigh::
        > > >
        > > > ::wink, wink:: How are ya, Brian?
        > >
        > >
        > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
        > > PCGen's FAQ: http://pedertest.officeline.no/PCGen
        > > PCGen's alpha build: http://rpg.plambert.net/pcgen
        > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > pcgen-unsubscribe@e...
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
        http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        > >
        > >
        > >
      • kserrano76
        Beleive me if i can allow these tools to stack, I d be even happier. I ve spoken to the DM and he doesn t think they should. I understand tha analaogy of using
        Message 3 of 18 , Jul 3, 2002
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          Beleive me if i can allow these tools to stack, I'd be even happier.
          I've spoken to the DM and he doesn't think they should.

          I understand tha analaogy of using different tools from different
          kits. However, looking at it from the persepctive of bonuses, I
          think that it would be hard to allow bonuses to stack if I'm using
          parts of one kit and parts of another. The argument against stacking
          is that the bonus comes from using the whole set, not peices from
          the set.

          Anyway, my reason for posting this is not to debate whether they
          should stack but to find out how to customize the lst file so that
          they do not stack. However I still need the +2 from the MW tools for
          disable device as the vest of escape only applies to open lock.

          Kristian

          --- In pcgen@y..., "Don Mac Phee" <macphee@c...> wrote:
          > I've got a small wrench set that I cart around in my Jeep (came
          for free
          > with a camera), and contains the barest of essentials.
          >
          > Because there have been times where THAT set hasn't been wholly
          sufficient,
          > I carry a spare lock box full of odds and ends tools (Vise Grips,
          Air
          > inflator, bleed kit, etc.)
          >
          > Neither set will cover all jobs, but there have been times that
          I've pulled
          > tools from one, the other or both to get the job done.
          >
          > I would consider this example to parallel very well with
          lockpicks. In the
          > reading that I've done on the subject, for common locks, one could
          get by
          > with a half a dozen picks and a couple of pries, but that wouldn't
          cover
          > EVERYTHING, and you would possibly need an "expansion set" to
          cover some of
          > the newer locks, or traps.
          >
          > It's your world, but I think your mistaken.
          >
          > -Don
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: "kserrano76" <kernel_k@h...>
          > To: <pcgen@y...>
          > Sent: Monday, July 01, 2002 2:24 PM
          > Subject: [pcgen] Re: vest of escape - +4 Open Lock
          >
          >
          > > The way I see it, you can't use two different lockpicks at the
          same
          > > time. It's like trying to hammer a nail with two different
          hammers at
          > > the same time. This is why I think they don't stack.
          > >
          > > Back to the original question, what would I type to set the
          > > properties of the Vest of Escape to give a +4 to open lock and
          not
          > > stack with MW tools?
          > >
          > > Kristian
          > >
          > > --- In pcgen@y..., "micheledn94" <micheledn@a...> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Excuse me...but why wouldn't you want these to stack? If I
          > > remember
          > > > correctly, one gives a comepetence bonus and one gives a
          > > circumstance
          > > > bonus, thereby making them stackable.
          > > >
          > > > Wish I knew how to program...my thief is still waiting for her
          > > > character sheets to get this right. Poor Di'Ora...::sigh::
          > > >
          > > > ::wink, wink:: How are ya, Brian?
          > >
          > >
          > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
          > > PCGen's FAQ: http://pedertest.officeline.no/PCGen
          > > PCGen's alpha build: http://rpg.plambert.net/pcgen
          > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > pcgen-unsubscribe@e...
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
          > >
          > >
        • Emily Smirle
          ... Quick answer, change the type of the two sets of boni to be the same (ie Circumstance, or whatever). -- Beer is the mind-killer. Beer is the little death
          Message 4 of 18 , Jul 4, 2002
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            kserrano76 wrote:

            > Anyway, my reason for posting this is not to debate whether they
            > should stack but to find out how to customize the lst file so that
            > they do not stack. However I still need the +2 from the MW tools for
            > disable device as the vest of escape only applies to open lock.
            >


            Quick answer, change the type of the two sets of boni to be the same (ie
            Circumstance, or whatever).
            --
            "Beer is the mind-killer. Beer is the little death that brings total
            oblivion. I will face my beer. I will permit it to pass over me and
            through me. And when it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to
            see it's path. When the beer has gone there will be nothing.
            Only I will remain." - www.goats.com
          • Tir Gwaith
            Um.. but NOT Circumstance... that stacks (is in the stacks.lst or whatever the name of it is in /system) Tir Gwaith LST Chimp Strange Monkey MM Race Dragon ...
            Message 5 of 18 , Jul 4, 2002
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              Um.. but NOT Circumstance... that stacks (is in the stacks.lst or whatever
              the name of it is in /system)

              Tir Gwaith
              LST Chimp
              Strange Monkey
              MM Race Dragon
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "Emily Smirle" <smirle4498@...>
              To: <pcgen@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Thursday, July 04, 2002 9:43 AM
              Subject: Re: [pcgen] Re: vest of escape - +4 Open Lock


              > kserrano76 wrote:
              >
              > > Anyway, my reason for posting this is not to debate whether they
              > > should stack but to find out how to customize the lst file so that
              > > they do not stack. However I still need the +2 from the MW tools for
              > > disable device as the vest of escape only applies to open lock.
              > >
              >
              >
              > Quick answer, change the type of the two sets of boni to be the same (ie
              > Circumstance, or whatever).
              > --
              > "Beer is the mind-killer. Beer is the little death that brings total
              > oblivion. I will face my beer. I will permit it to pass over me and
              > through me. And when it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to
              > see it's path. When the beer has gone there will be nothing.
              > Only I will remain." - www.goats.com
              >
              >
              >
              > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
              > PCGen's FAQ: http://pedertest.officeline.no/PCGen
              > PCGen's alpha build: http://rpg.plambert.net/pcgen
              > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
              > pcgen-unsubscribe@egroups.com
              >
              >
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
              >
            • gsbingl
              Something other than Circumstance as it is in bonusstacks.lst Byngl ... that ... for ... same (ie ... and
              Message 6 of 18 , Jul 4, 2002
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                Something other than Circumstance as it is in bonusstacks.lst

                Byngl

                --- In pcgen@y..., Emily Smirle <smirle4498@r...> wrote:
                > kserrano76 wrote:
                >
                > > Anyway, my reason for posting this is not to debate whether they
                > > should stack but to find out how to customize the lst file so
                that
                > > they do not stack. However I still need the +2 from the MW tools
                for
                > > disable device as the vest of escape only applies to open lock.
                > >
                >
                >
                > Quick answer, change the type of the two sets of boni to be the
                same (ie
                > Circumstance, or whatever).
                > --
                > "Beer is the mind-killer. Beer is the little death that brings total
                > oblivion. I will face my beer. I will permit it to pass over me
                and
                > through me. And when it has gone past I will turn my inner eye to
                > see it's path. When the beer has gone there will be nothing.
                > Only I will remain." - www.goats.com
              • kserrano76
                Thank you all for your help. I will try this tomorrow before my game and let you know how it works. Kristian PS - This was a rather interesting discussion on
                Message 7 of 18 , Jul 4, 2002
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                  Thank you all for your help. I will try this tomorrow before my game
                  and let you know how it works.

                  Kristian

                  PS - This was a rather interesting discussion on whether the two
                  should stack or not. I think I will post this on the boards at
                  wizards to see what they have to say.


                  --- In pcgen@y..., "gsbingl" <byngl@h...> wrote:
                  > Something other than Circumstance as it is in bonusstacks.lst
                  >
                  > Byngl
                  >
                  > --- In pcgen@y..., Emily Smirle <smirle4498@r...> wrote:
                  > > kserrano76 wrote:
                  > >
                  > > > Anyway, my reason for posting this is not to debate whether
                  they
                  > > > should stack but to find out how to customize the lst file so
                  > that
                  > > > they do not stack. However I still need the +2 from the MW
                  tools
                  > for
                  > > > disable device as the vest of escape only applies to open lock.
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Quick answer, change the type of the two sets of boni to be the
                  > same (ie
                  > > Circumstance, or whatever).
                  > > --
                • kserrano76
                  For reference, on P. 114 of the PHB under Tools, Masterwork, it states that Bonuses provided by multiple masterwork items used toward the same skill do not
                  Message 8 of 18 , Jul 6, 2002
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                    For reference, on P. 114 of the PHB under Tools, Masterwork, it
                    states that Bonuses provided by multiple masterwork items used
                    toward the same skill do not stack. All magic items are considered
                    MW.

                    I'm still working on modifying the vest of escape so the bonuses
                    don't stack with MW tools. I was able to apply the circumstance
                    adjustment to Vest of Escape to remove the -2 penalty for not using
                    tools. Also, I think the MW Tools are somehow overriding the Vest of
                    Escape in the Open Lock skill Bonus.

                    --- In pcgen@y..., "kserrano76" <kernel_k@h...> wrote:
                    > Thank you all for your help. I will try this tomorrow before my
                    game
                    > and let you know how it works.
                    >
                    > Kristian
                    >
                    > PS - This was a rather interesting discussion on whether the two
                    > should stack or not. I think I will post this on the boards at
                    > wizards to see what they have to say.
                    >
                    >
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