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Why not make the "PRD"?

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  • Andrew
    Hi Folks, With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the increased onus to further support in each additional book (not to mention the
    Message 1 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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      Hi Folks,

      With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the increased "onus" to further
      support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I would like to put forth a
      radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website,
      maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain view. We already
      have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.

      So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause you are always loading
      everything available. You only update items if something comes along and changes the wording.

      A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests will drop. Fixing issues
      becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't be Books x, y and z any
      more, but just the PRD.

      (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always embrace change) But I think
      this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community. Adding in additional materials
      would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But ANYONE can submit items to
      be included in this manner.

      Thoughts?

      --
      Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
      Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
      Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
      Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
      Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
    • Andrew
      Just to clarify: Each book added into the PRD would go through the normal single book creation/review process as things stand now and when they ve completed
      Message 2 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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        Just to clarify:

        Each book added into the PRD would go through the normal 'single book creation/review' process as
        things stand now and when they've completed the full process from 'request to release' we'd still
        have the book set. But as long as the book is part of the Paizo's Pathfinder PRD, then they'd be
        added into the pcgen PRD data set to match.

        If it's not on the official Paizo PRD website, then it won't be included in the PCGen PRD.

        On 8/22/2013 2:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
        > Hi Folks,
        >
        > With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the increased "onus" to further
        > support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I would like to put forth a
        > radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website,
        > maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain view. We already
        > have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
        >
        > So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause you are always loading
        > everything available. You only update items if something comes along and changes the wording.
        >
        > A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests will drop. Fixing issues
        > becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't be Books x, y and z any
        > more, but just the PRD.
        >
        > (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always embrace change) But I think
        > this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community. Adding in additional materials
        > would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But ANYONE can submit items to
        > be included in this manner.
        >
        > Thoughts?
        >
      • David R. Bender
        Great idea. Couple of thoughts. Like you said, we still need the separate books. At the start of my last home campaign, I opened it up to anything in the PRD
        Message 3 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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          Great idea.

          Couple of thoughts. Like you said, we still need the separate books. At
          the start of my last home campaign, I opened it up to "anything in the
          PRD" so this would make that easy. I had to code up some of the Advanced
          Race Guide myself for one character. That said, I also am doing some PbP
          DMing and I *don't* open it up that much, usually just Core and Advanced
          Player Guide so having the separate books also works for that.

          For other reading this, because I know you already have thought this
          out. Keep the same variable names so whether I load the PRD or just Core
          other add-on books (not in the PRD) will continue to work.

          The three books that I am concerned about are NPC Codex, Ultimate
          Campaign, Game Mastery Guide because they have "sub-systems" in them or
          in the case of the NPC Codex a gazillion NPCs. Do you plan on adding
          those? or get the rest of them in first (CRB, APG, ARG, UC,UM, B1, B2,
          B3) andthen come back and do those?

          -- david
          Papa.DRB

          My better half and me (jpg)
          <https://picasaweb.google.com/102726903532570043857/Family#slideshow/5533056948910114610>

          Love Me If You Can by Toby Keith (video)
          <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhcfFekSbHQ&ob=av3e>
          Word of the Day (gif) <https://dl.dropbox.com/u/38647997/Exhaustipated.gif>

          Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
          For those who believe, no proof is necessary, for those who don't
          believe, no proof is possible. (Stuart Chase 1888-1985)
          On 2013-08-22 Thu 05:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
          > Hi Folks,
          >
          > With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the increased "onus" to further
          > support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I would like to put forth a
          > radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website,
          > maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain view. We already
          > have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
          >
          > So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause you are always loading
          > everything available. You only update items if something comes along and changes the wording.
          >
          > A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests will drop. Fixing issues
          > becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't be Books x, y and z any
          > more, but just the PRD.
          >
          > (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always embrace change) But I think
          > this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community. Adding in additional materials
          > would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But ANYONE can submit items to
          > be included in this manner.
          >
          > Thoughts?
          >
        • David R. Bender
          -- david Papa.DRB My better half and me (jpg) Love Me If You Can by
          Message 4 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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            -- david
            Papa.DRB

            My better half and me (jpg)
            <https://picasaweb.google.com/102726903532570043857/Family#slideshow/5533056948910114610>

            Love Me If You Can by Toby Keith (video)
            <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhcfFekSbHQ&ob=av3e>
            Word of the Day (gif) <https://dl.dropbox.com/u/38647997/Exhaustipated.gif>

            Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
            For those who believe, no proof is necessary, for those who don't
            believe, no proof is possible. (Stuart Chase 1888-1985)
            On 2013-08-22 Thu 06:02 PM, Andrew wrote:
            > Just to clarify:
            >
            >
            > If it's not on the official Paizo PRD website, then it won't be included in the PCGen PRD.
            >
            THIS has to be made abundantly clear as too many folks think that the
            d20pfsrd.com is "official"....
          • Stefan Radermacher
            ... You idea certainly has merit. However. the statement you give here is not exactly correct. Paizo s PRD site only lists the OGL content from their
            Message 5 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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              Am 22.08.13 23:57, schrieb Andrew:
              > The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website, maintained and
              > run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain
              > view. We already have an open permission to included everything
              > Pathfinder from them.

              You idea certainly has merit. However. the statement you give here is
              not exactly correct. Paizo's PRD site only lists the OGL content from
              their Pathfinder RPG product line, i.e. the hardcover rulebooks. Stuff
              included
              in Pathfinder Player Companion line or Pathfinder Campagn Setting line
              or other Golarion-specifict books is not included there. Neither are the
              Gods, even though they are integrated into domains and subdomains in the
              Core Rulebook and other books. Just something to consider in this regard.
            • Anestis Kozakis
              It;s a good idea in theory, and I like it. Pro: You load everything. Con: Increased memory usage, processing and loading times. Anestis. ... -- Anestis Kozakis
              Message 6 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                It;s a good idea in theory, and I like it.

                Pro: You load everything.

                Con: Increased memory usage, processing and loading times.

                Anestis.


                On 23 August 2013 08:02, Andrew <drew0500@...> wrote:

                > Just to clarify:
                >
                > Each book added into the PRD would go through the normal 'single book
                > creation/review' process as
                > things stand now and when they've completed the full process from 'request
                > to release' we'd still
                > have the book set. But as long as the book is part of the Paizo's
                > Pathfinder PRD, then they'd be
                > added into the pcgen PRD data set to match.
                >
                > If it's not on the official Paizo PRD website, then it won't be included
                > in the PCGen PRD.
                >
                > On 8/22/2013 2:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                > > Hi Folks,
                > >
                > > With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                > increased "onus" to further
                > > support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                > would like to put forth a
                > > radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system
                > has an OFFICIAL website,
                > > maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                > materials in plain view. We already
                > > have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                > >
                > > So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                > you are always loading
                > > everything available. You only update items if something comes along and
                > changes the wording.
                > >
                > > A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                > will drop. Fixing issues
                > > becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't
                > be Books x, y and z any
                > > more, but just the PRD.
                > >
                > > (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always
                > embrace change) But I think
                > > this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                > Adding in additional materials
                > > would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But
                > ANYONE can submit items to
                > > be included in this manner.
                > >
                > > Thoughts?
                > >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Related Lists
                > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links:
                > http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                > PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                >
                >
                > PCGen List File Help:
                > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                >
                > PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                > (for new official data source development)
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >


                --
                Anestis Kozakis | kenosti@... | http://www.akozakis.id.au/


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Billy Brown
                Perhaps one per set with books simply being lists of indexes, and in that way you could still include or exclude specific sources ... [Non-text portions of
                Message 7 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                  Perhaps one per set with books simply being lists of indexes, and in that
                  way you could still include or exclude specific sources
                  On Aug 22, 2013 5:57 PM, "Andrew" <drew0500@...> wrote:

                  > **
                  >
                  >
                  > Hi Folks,
                  >
                  > With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                  > increased "onus" to further
                  > support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I would
                  > like to put forth a
                  > radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system
                  > has an OFFICIAL website,
                  > maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials
                  > in plain view. We already
                  > have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                  >
                  > So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause you
                  > are always loading
                  > everything available. You only update items if something comes along and
                  > changes the wording.
                  >
                  > A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests will
                  > drop. Fixing issues
                  > becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't
                  > be Books x, y and z any
                  > more, but just the PRD.
                  >
                  > (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always
                  > embrace change) But I think
                  > this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community. Adding
                  > in additional materials
                  > would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But
                  > ANYONE can submit items to
                  > be included in this manner.
                  >
                  > Thoughts?
                  >
                  > --
                  > Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                  > Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                  > Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                  > Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                  > Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                  >
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Matthew Thompson
                  Honestly,   We re already having load problems just loading the core books anyway.  If I take 6.01.05 and load the following :  Core APG ARG Bestiary
                  Message 8 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                    Honestly,
                      We're already having load problems just loading the core books anyway.  If I take 6.01.05 and load the following : 

                    Core
                    APG
                    ARG
                    Bestiary
                    Bestiary II
                    Bestiary III (Beta)
                    UC
                    UM
                    UE (Beta)

                    The program takes several minutes to load, and after making one or two characters it starts hanging on every thing it does, taking a minute or two to add a feat, to add a class level, etc.  Just adding 8 class levels on a brand new character, just loaded dataset takes about 5 minutes.  

                    The Con below is a con if you were only going to load the Core, but, if that's all you wanted, you could just load the core and be done.  If we consolidated the PRD material into one file, we could eliminate duplications between files (saving some memory).

                    One other thing to consider would be to *not* load the core wands and scrolls.  Those all take up memory, and the application (as I just learned this week) can create those on the fly rather easily.  By not loading them seperately, that would also save memory at the cost of making it slightly more time consuming to create a character.  However, we're not currently creating those scrolls/wands in expansion books (UC, UM, ARG for example) so I think that might be ok, as it would at least be consistent, rather than having the core and APG spells having wands/scrolls and the UC/UM/ARG not.  

                    And I don't think it would be all that hard (granted, newbie here) to create a PRD file, as it would basically be copying finalized LST entries from the expansion LST files into the PRD files.  

                    Matt


                    ________________________________
                    From: Anestis Kozakis <kenosti@...>
                    To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:18 PM
                    Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?



                     
                    It;s a good idea in theory, and I like it.

                    Pro: You load everything.

                    Con: Increased memory usage, processing and loading times.

                    Anestis.

                    On 23 August 2013 08:02, Andrew <drew0500@...> wrote:

                    > Just to clarify:
                    >
                    > Each book added into the PRD would go through the normal 'single book
                    > creation/review' process as
                    > things stand now and when they've completed the full process from 'request
                    > to release' we'd still
                    > have the book set. But as long as the book is part of the Paizo's
                    > Pathfinder PRD, then they'd be
                    > added into the pcgen PRD data set to match.
                    >
                    > If it's not on the official Paizo PRD website, then it won't be included
                    > in the PCGen PRD.
                    >
                    > On 8/22/2013 2:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                    > > Hi Folks,
                    > >
                    > > With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                    > increased "onus" to further
                    > > support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                    > would like to put forth a
                    > > radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system
                    > has an OFFICIAL website,
                    > > maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                    > materials in plain view. We already
                    > > have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                    > >
                    > > So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                    > you are always loading
                    > > everything available. You only update items if something comes along and
                    > changes the wording.
                    > >
                    > > A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                    > will drop. Fixing issues
                    > > becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't
                    > be Books x, y and z any
                    > > more, but just the PRD.
                    > >
                    > > (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always
                    > embrace change) But I think
                    > > this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                    > Adding in additional materials
                    > > would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But
                    > ANYONE can submit items to
                    > > be included in this manner.
                    > >
                    > > Thoughts?
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Related Lists
                    > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                    > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links:
                    > http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                    > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                    > PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                    >
                    >
                    > PCGen List File Help:
                    > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                    > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                    >
                    > PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                    > (for new official data source development)
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >

                    --
                    Anestis Kozakis | kenosti@... | http://www.akozakis.id.au/

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Doug Limmer
                    I think making a PRD data set is a good idea. However, there are reasons beyond people don t always embrace change to keep the separate books as well. One
                    Message 9 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                      I think making a PRD data set is a good idea.

                      However, there are reasons beyond "people don't always embrace change"
                      to keep the separate books as well. One reason is potential memory
                      issues, as others have mentioned. Another is if someone doesn't want to
                      use a particular book. [For example, some people really don't like the
                      Gunslinger, Ninja, and Samurai from Ultimate Combat.] I'm sure there
                      are others.

                      DS/DL

                      On 8/22/2013 5:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi Folks,
                      >
                      > With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                      > increased "onus" to further
                      > support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                      > would like to put forth a
                      > radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder
                      > system has an OFFICIAL website,
                      > maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                      > materials in plain view. We already
                      > have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                      >
                      > So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                      > you are always loading
                      > everything available. You only update items if something comes along
                      > and changes the wording.
                      >
                      > A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                      > will drop. Fixing issues
                      > becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It
                      > won't be Books x, y and z any
                      > more, but just the PRD.
                      >
                      > (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't
                      > always embrace change) But I think
                      > this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                      > Adding in additional materials
                      > would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight.
                      > But ANYONE can submit items to
                      > be included in this manner.
                      >
                      > Thoughts?
                      >
                      > --
                      > Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                      > Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                      > Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                      > Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                      > Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                      >
                      >



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Andrew
                      Yes, that would be correct. It d be like loading the All Pathfinder Main Supplements we have today. The big difference is we wouldn t have the dupes issues
                      Message 10 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                        Yes, that would be correct. It'd be like loading the "All Pathfinder Main Supplements" we have
                        today. The big difference is we wouldn't have the dupes issues we have today.



                        On 8/22/2013 3:13 PM, Stefan Radermacher wrote:
                        > Am 22.08.13 23:57, schrieb Andrew:
                        >> The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website, maintained and
                        >> run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain
                        >> view. We already have an open permission to included everything
                        >> Pathfinder from them.
                        >
                        > You idea certainly has merit. However. the statement you give here is
                        > not exactly correct. Paizo's PRD site only lists the OGL content from
                        > their Pathfinder RPG product line, i.e. the hardcover rulebooks. Stuff
                        > included
                        > in Pathfinder Player Companion line or Pathfinder Campagn Setting line
                        > or other Golarion-specifict books is not included there. Neither are the
                        > Gods, even though they are integrated into domains and subdomains in the
                        > Core Rulebook and other books. Just something to consider in this regard.
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Related Lists
                        > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                        > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links: http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                        > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                        > PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                        >
                        >
                        > PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                        > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                        >
                        > PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                        > (for new official data source development)
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Andrew
                        Yes, see the clarification above, this would another set. We d still have the separate books. It s just a better way to handle the ever growing issue of
                        Message 11 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                          Yes, see the clarification above, this would another set. We'd still have the separate books. It's
                          just a better way to handle the ever growing issue of duplicates, and required thing from x book.

                          The difference between "Load all Pathfinder main supplements" and "PRD" is the books would all be
                          meshed together.


                          To address the PRD lack the deities et all, as part of the process, we can include each book OGL
                          license, and still include it. Since we already have the permission. Then the user gets the best of
                          both. - Call it the "PRD Plus!" set if it makes more sense.

                          On 8/22/2013 3:58 PM, Doug Limmer wrote:
                          > I think making a PRD data set is a good idea.
                          >
                          > However, there are reasons beyond "people don't always embrace change"
                          > to keep the separate books as well. One reason is potential memory
                          > issues, as others have mentioned. Another is if someone doesn't want to
                          > use a particular book. [For example, some people really don't like the
                          > Gunslinger, Ninja, and Samurai from Ultimate Combat.] I'm sure there
                          > are others.
                          >
                          > DS/DL
                          >
                          > On 8/22/2013 5:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                          >>
                          >> Hi Folks,
                          >>
                          >> With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                          >> increased "onus" to further
                          >> support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                          >> would like to put forth a
                          >> radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder
                          >> system has an OFFICIAL website,
                          >> maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                          >> materials in plain view. We already
                          >> have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                          >>
                          >> So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                          >> you are always loading
                          >> everything available. You only update items if something comes along
                          >> and changes the wording.
                          >>
                          >> A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                          >> will drop. Fixing issues
                          >> becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It
                          >> won't be Books x, y and z any
                          >> more, but just the PRD.
                          >>
                          >> (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't
                          >> always embrace change) But I think
                          >> this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                          >> Adding in additional materials
                          >> would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight.
                          >> But ANYONE can submit items to
                          >> be included in this manner.
                          >>
                          >> Thoughts?
                          >>
                          >> --
                          >> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                          >> Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                          >> Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                          >> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                          >> Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                          >>
                          >>
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > Related Lists
                          > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                          > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links: http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                          > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                          > PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                          >
                          >
                          > PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                          > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                          >
                          > PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                          > (for new official data source development)
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                        • Rob
                          Actually, this I a false con... You ll have LESS processing and less (even if by a little) loading times.. Why? A HUGE reason of one... FAR less .MOD entries.
                          Message 12 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                            Actually, this I a false con...

                            You'll have LESS processing and less (even if by a little) loading times..
                            Why? A HUGE reason of one... FAR less .MOD entries.

                            Think about spells alone... APG has 5 spell casting classes... I just
                            pulled up the APG_spells.mod lst file and yanked it into excel... sorted by
                            the name field and deleted all the comments out... for ONLY the spell
                            casters.. not the domains...

                            After doing that, there are 641 .mod entries for spells in the CRB... This
                            is an example of a spells.mod for just a class entry: Acid Splash.MOD >tab<
                            CLASSES:Inquisitor=0

                            641 of those... versus having no .mod entries... what would be done? In the
                            CRB spells file, the current field for Acid Splash is:
                            Acid Splash >tab< CLASSES:Sorcerer,Wizard=0

                            And would need to become:
                            Acid Splash CLASSES:Sorcerer,Wizard,Inquisitor =0
                            -----

                            Then you have .mod statements to other .mod - UM does this to the APG .mod
                            spell lst file for CRB spells that the APG already .mod'd... (If you're
                            brain hurts from that statement, you're not alone, so does mine. :| )

                            That doesn't include all the .mod entries for domains or wizard school's....

                            And that's just spells... Feats, abilities, etc...

                            Yes, there will still be .mod from 'outside the core PRD+', but the sheer
                            amount of them cut out from the main books... Should be making the coders
                            drooling with the resource return. :p


                            W. Robert Reed III
                            Mynex


                            -----Original Message-----
                            From: pcgen@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                            Anestis Kozakis
                            Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 6:18 PM
                            To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?

                            It;s a good idea in theory, and I like it.

                            Pro: You load everything.

                            Con: Increased memory usage, processing and loading times.

                            Anestis.
                          • Eric C Smith
                            Hi Folks! Hmmm, what I m seeing here are two sets to maintain. One large and extensive PRD plus all the individual PF RPG books. It will take extra effort to
                            Message 13 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                              Hi Folks!

                              Hmmm, what I'm seeing here are two sets to maintain. One large and extensive PRD plus all the individual PF RPG books. It will take extra effort to ensure that both "sets" remain up-to-date.

                              Maredudd

                              On Aug 22, 2013, at 7:12 PM, Andrew wrote:

                              > Yes, see the clarification above, this would another set. We'd still have the separate books. It's
                              > just a better way to handle the ever growing issue of duplicates, and required thing from x book.
                              >
                              > The difference between "Load all Pathfinder main supplements" and "PRD" is the books would all be
                              > meshed together.
                              >
                              > To address the PRD lack the deities et all, as part of the process, we can include each book OGL
                              > license, and still include it. Since we already have the permission. Then the user gets the best of
                              > both. - Call it the "PRD Plus!" set if it makes more sense.
                              >
                              > On 8/22/2013 3:58 PM, Doug Limmer wrote:
                              > > I think making a PRD data set is a good idea.
                              > >
                              > > However, there are reasons beyond "people don't always embrace change"
                              > > to keep the separate books as well. One reason is potential memory
                              > > issues, as others have mentioned. Another is if someone doesn't want to
                              > > use a particular book. [For example, some people really don't like the
                              > > Gunslinger, Ninja, and Samurai from Ultimate Combat.] I'm sure there
                              > > are others.
                              > >
                              > > DS/DL
                              > >
                              > > On 8/22/2013 5:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                              > >>
                              > >> Hi Folks,
                              > >>
                              > >> With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                              > >> increased "onus" to further
                              > >> support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                              > >> would like to put forth a
                              > >> radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder
                              > >> system has an OFFICIAL website,
                              > >> maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                              > >> materials in plain view. We already
                              > >> have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                              > >>
                              > >> So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                              > >> you are always loading
                              > >> everything available. You only update items if something comes along
                              > >> and changes the wording.
                              > >>
                              > >> A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                              > >> will drop. Fixing issues
                              > >> becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It
                              > >> won't be Books x, y and z any
                              > >> more, but just the PRD.
                              > >>
                              > >> (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't
                              > >> always embrace change) But I think
                              > >> this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                              > >> Adding in additional materials
                              > >> would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight.
                              > >> But ANYONE can submit items to
                              > >> be included in this manner.
                              > >>
                              > >> Thoughts?
                              > >>
                              > >> --
                              > >> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                              > >> Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                              > >> Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                              > >> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                              > >> Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > ------------------------------------
                              > >
                              > > Related Lists
                              > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                              > > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links: http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                              > > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                              > > PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                              > > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                              > >
                              > > PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                              > > (for new official data source development)
                              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • Rob
                              This is a valid point... Here s my rebuttal to it. :D 1. The individual books are still going to be exactly that, individual books per what Andrew said.. So
                              Message 14 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                                This is a valid point... Here's my rebuttal to it. :D

                                1. The individual books are still going to be exactly that, individual books
                                per what Andrew said.. So the SOURCExxx info doesn't change in any way...
                                it'll list book/page as always...

                                2. The PRD+, for things not on the PRD website, leave the source info
                                alone... for what is on the website, change the source info to point right
                                to it. Or list both (listing both might be a PITA, but that might actually
                                be a better way to handle it)

                                W. Robert Reed III
                                Mynex



                                -----Original Message-----
                                From: pcgen@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                Stefan Radermacher
                                Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 6:14 PM
                                To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?

                                Am 22.08.13 23:57, schrieb Andrew:
                                > The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website, maintained and
                                > run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain
                                > view. We already have an open permission to included everything
                                > Pathfinder from them.

                                You idea certainly has merit. However. the statement you give here is not
                                exactly correct. Paizo's PRD site only lists the OGL content from their
                                Pathfinder RPG product line, i.e. the hardcover rulebooks. Stuff included in
                                Pathfinder Player Companion line or Pathfinder Campagn Setting line or other
                                Golarion-specifict books is not included there. Neither are the Gods, even
                                though they are integrated into domains and subdomains in the Core Rulebook
                                and other books. Just something to consider in this regard.
                              • Andrew
                                *Looks at the tracker list* . *then looks at the commit list*
                                Message 15 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  *Looks at the tracker list* >.> *then looks at the commit list* <.<

                                  Yeah... Still not opposed to it. Plus, I've got this monkey who's like a QA uber monkey who will be
                                  reviewing all the materials, which should make this less error prone sets. Thus lessen any efforts
                                  except errata updates. \o/

                                  (In skype that's a disco dancing man - dance little man, dance!)

                                  Cheers,


                                  On 8/22/2013 5:19 PM, Eric C Smith wrote:
                                  > Hi Folks!
                                  >
                                  > Hmmm, what I'm seeing here are two sets to maintain. One large and extensive PRD plus all the individual PF RPG books. It will take extra effort to ensure that both "sets" remain up-to-date.
                                  >
                                  > Maredudd
                                  >
                                  > On Aug 22, 2013, at 7:12 PM, Andrew wrote:
                                  >
                                  >> Yes, see the clarification above, this would another set. We'd still have the separate books. It's
                                  >> just a better way to handle the ever growing issue of duplicates, and required thing from x book.
                                  >>
                                  >> The difference between "Load all Pathfinder main supplements" and "PRD" is the books would all be
                                  >> meshed together.
                                  >>
                                  >> To address the PRD lack the deities et all, as part of the process, we can include each book OGL
                                  >> license, and still include it. Since we already have the permission. Then the user gets the best of
                                  >> both. - Call it the "PRD Plus!" set if it makes more sense.
                                  >>
                                  >> On 8/22/2013 3:58 PM, Doug Limmer wrote:
                                  >>> I think making a PRD data set is a good idea.
                                  >>>
                                  >>> However, there are reasons beyond "people don't always embrace change"
                                  >>> to keep the separate books as well. One reason is potential memory
                                  >>> issues, as others have mentioned. Another is if someone doesn't want to
                                  >>> use a particular book. [For example, some people really don't like the
                                  >>> Gunslinger, Ninja, and Samurai from Ultimate Combat.] I'm sure there
                                  >>> are others.
                                  >>>
                                  >>> DS/DL
                                  >>>
                                  >>> On 8/22/2013 5:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> Hi Folks,
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                                  >>>> increased "onus" to further
                                  >>>> support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                                  >>>> would like to put forth a
                                  >>>> radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder
                                  >>>> system has an OFFICIAL website,
                                  >>>> maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                                  >>>> materials in plain view. We already
                                  >>>> have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                                  >>>> you are always loading
                                  >>>> everything available. You only update items if something comes along
                                  >>>> and changes the wording.
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                                  >>>> will drop. Fixing issues
                                  >>>> becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It
                                  >>>> won't be Books x, y and z any
                                  >>>> more, but just the PRD.
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't
                                  >>>> always embrace change) But I think
                                  >>>> this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                                  >>>> Adding in additional materials
                                  >>>> would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight.
                                  >>>> But ANYONE can submit items to
                                  >>>> be included in this manner.
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> Thoughts?
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>> --
                                  >>>> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                                  >>>> Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                                  >>>> Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                                  >>>> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                                  >>>> Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>> ------------------------------------
                                  >>>
                                  >>> Related Lists
                                  >>> PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                                  >>> PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links: http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                                  >>> PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                                  >>> PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>> PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                                  >>> (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                                  >>>
                                  >>> PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                                  >>> (for new official data source development)
                                  >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>>
                                  >>
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ------------------------------------
                                  >
                                  > Related Lists
                                  > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                                  > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links: http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
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                                  >
                                • Andrew
                                  I m going to say no. Here s the reason, 1) the individual books are still in existence and can be selected as you desire today. I don t plan on removing these
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Aug 22, 2013
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                                    I'm going to say no. Here's the reason,

                                    1) the individual books are still in existence and can be selected as you desire today. I don't plan
                                    on removing these books.
                                    2) We're back to making sure each new option is supported properly. This translates to more work for
                                    me. I don't mind dual supporting the book and the 'PRD+' set, but I'm not going to delve into
                                    supporting surgical incisions within the PRD+. I already have enough trouble getting people to give
                                    me detailed bug reports with the book the issue is in. Imagine the confusion this will create when
                                    they say they loaded x, y and z books, but didn't realize those were the "index" PRD options? I'll
                                    waste my time tracking down an issue in the wrong area, and the fix won't happen in a timely manner.
                                    3) Finally, why bother mashing everything together if you're gonna have someone come along behind to
                                    de-mash it? The PRD isn't set up like the M/R/SRD with file segregations and known cut off points.
                                    We'd basically be back to making multiple books. Which we already have. The alternative of course is
                                    to just make a master "PRD" pcc file, do what the PFS pcc already does, pick and choose files and
                                    such, make a few custom ones, and then that'd be that. But now we run the risk of breaking things
                                    any time one of those books is altered. It's a toss up on which is actually better if you weigh
                                    those two options. PFS style pcc linking would be easier I suppose.

                                    Cheers,



                                    On 8/22/2013 3:32 PM, Billy Brown wrote:
                                    > Perhaps one per set with books simply being lists of indexes, and in that
                                    > way you could still include or exclude specific sources
                                    > On Aug 22, 2013 5:57 PM, "Andrew" <drew0500@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    >> **
                                    >>
                                    >>
                                    >> Hi Folks,
                                    >>
                                    >> With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                                    >> increased "onus" to further
                                    >> support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I would
                                    >> like to put forth a
                                    >> radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system
                                    >> has an OFFICIAL website,
                                    >> maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials
                                    >> in plain view. We already
                                    >> have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                                    >>
                                    >> So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause you
                                    >> are always loading
                                    >> everything available. You only update items if something comes along and
                                    >> changes the wording.
                                    >>
                                    >> A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests will
                                    >> drop. Fixing issues
                                    >> becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't
                                    >> be Books x, y and z any
                                    >> more, but just the PRD.
                                    >>
                                    >> (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always
                                    >> embrace change) But I think
                                    >> this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community. Adding
                                    >> in additional materials
                                    >> would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But
                                    >> ANYONE can submit items to
                                    >> be included in this manner.
                                    >>
                                    >> Thoughts?
                                    >>
                                    >> --
                                    >> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
                                    >> Admin Silverback - PCGen Board of Directors
                                    >> Data 2nd, Docs Tamarin, OS Lemur
                                    >> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
                                    >> Unique Title "The Torturer of PCGen"
                                    >>
                                    >>
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > ------------------------------------
                                    >
                                    > Related Lists
                                    > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                                    > PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links: http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                                    > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                                    > PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                                    > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                                    >
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                                  • Andrew
                                    UE (Alpha) and Bestiary 3 (Alpha) it s not in the Release, they aren t ready for prime time, ergo it doesn t get to count as any errors those produce will skew
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Aug 23, 2013
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                                      UE (Alpha) and Bestiary 3 (Alpha) it's not in the Release, they aren't ready for prime time, ergo it
                                      doesn't get to count as any errors those produce will skew any real analysis and statistics. ;)

                                      Yes, consolidating the files into one set would remove our errors with duplicates issues. Reduce
                                      overhead, and it would decrease memory usage, contrary to the belief otherwise. Removing .MODs, and
                                      duplicate items, and reusing the abilities between companions and their 'real' counterparts. It'd
                                      also force a standards of file naming. I don't think we need 10 race files, 8 ability files, etc.
                                      Sort by class, race and other for the abilities - after all, most of them are race related, class
                                      related or a misc item - afflictions, item powers, etc.

                                      I looked at the core book PDF, and it appears someone just decided to add in the scrolls and wands.
                                      Since the normal policy is just to place in the set what is in the book.

                                      Anyways, I'm gathering a lot of people are in the positive for this idea.

                                      On 8/22/2013 3:51 PM, Matthew Thompson wrote:
                                      > Honestly,
                                      > We're already having load problems just loading the core books anyway. If I take 6.01.05 and load the following :
                                      >
                                      > Core
                                      > APG
                                      > ARG
                                      > Bestiary
                                      > Bestiary II
                                      > Bestiary III (Beta)
                                      > UC
                                      > UM
                                      > UE (Beta)
                                      >
                                      > The program takes several minutes to load, and after making one or two characters it starts hanging on every thing it does, taking a minute or two to add a feat, to add a class level, etc. Just adding 8 class levels on a brand new character, just loaded dataset takes about 5 minutes.
                                      >
                                      > The Con below is a con if you were only going to load the Core, but, if that's all you wanted, you could just load the core and be done. If we consolidated the PRD material into one file, we could eliminate duplications between files (saving some memory).
                                      >
                                      > One other thing to consider would be to *not* load the core wands and scrolls. Those all take up memory, and the application (as I just learned this week) can create those on the fly rather easily. By not loading them seperately, that would also save memory at the cost of making it slightly more time consuming to create a character. However, we're not currently creating those scrolls/wands in expansion books (UC, UM, ARG for example) so I think that might be ok, as it would at least be consistent, rather than having the core and APG spells having wands/scrolls and the UC/UM/ARG not.
                                      >
                                      > And I don't think it would be all that hard (granted, newbie here) to create a PRD file, as it would basically be copying finalized LST entries from the expansion LST files into the PRD files.
                                      >
                                      > Matt
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > ________________________________
                                      > From: Anestis Kozakis <kenosti@...>
                                      > To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                                      > Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:18 PM
                                      > Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > It;s a good idea in theory, and I like it.
                                      >
                                      > Pro: You load everything.
                                      >
                                      > Con: Increased memory usage, processing and loading times.
                                      >
                                      > Anestis.
                                      >
                                      > On 23 August 2013 08:02, Andrew <drew0500@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      >> Just to clarify:
                                      >>
                                      >> Each book added into the PRD would go through the normal 'single book
                                      >> creation/review' process as
                                      >> things stand now and when they've completed the full process from 'request
                                      >> to release' we'd still
                                      >> have the book set. But as long as the book is part of the Paizo's
                                      >> Pathfinder PRD, then they'd be
                                      >> added into the pcgen PRD data set to match.
                                      >>
                                      >> If it's not on the official Paizo PRD website, then it won't be included
                                      >> in the PCGen PRD.
                                      >>
                                      >> On 8/22/2013 2:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                                      >>> Hi Folks,
                                      >>>
                                      >>> With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                                      >> increased "onus" to further
                                      >>> support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                                      >> would like to put forth a
                                      >>> radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system
                                      >> has an OFFICIAL website,
                                      >>> maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                                      >> materials in plain view. We already
                                      >>> have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                                      >>>
                                      >>> So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                                      >> you are always loading
                                      >>> everything available. You only update items if something comes along and
                                      >> changes the wording.
                                      >>>
                                      >>> A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                                      >> will drop. Fixing issues
                                      >>> becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't
                                      >> be Books x, y and z any
                                      >>> more, but just the PRD.
                                      >>>
                                      >>> (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always
                                      >> embrace change) But I think
                                      >>> this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                                      >> Adding in additional materials
                                      >>> would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But
                                      >> ANYONE can submit items to
                                      >>> be included in this manner.
                                      >>>
                                      >>> Thoughts?
                                      >>>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >> ------------------------------------
                                      >>
                                      >> Related Lists
                                      >> PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                                      >> PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links:
                                      >> http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                                      >> PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                                      >> PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >> PCGen List File Help:
                                      >> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                                      >> (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                                      >>
                                      >> PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                                      >> (for new official data source development)
                                      >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >>
                                      >
                                    • Stefan Radermacher
                                      ... That was probably me, because I thought that would be better than to force users to use the item customizer for every scroll and wand. Stefan
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Aug 23, 2013
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                                        On 23.08.2013 11:19, Andrew wrote:
                                        > I looked at the core book PDF, and it appears someone just decided to add in the scrolls and wands.
                                        > Since the normal policy is just to place in the set what is in the book.

                                        That was probably me, because I thought that would be better than to
                                        force users to use the item customizer for every scroll and wand.

                                        Stefan
                                      • Jason D
                                        I think it s a fantastic idea. :) ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Aug 23, 2013
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          I think it's a fantastic idea. :)





                                          >________________________________
                                          > From: Andrew <drew0500@...>
                                          >To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                                          >Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 4:08 PM
                                          >Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >

                                          >Yes, that would be correct. It'd be like loading the "All Pathfinder Main Supplements" we have
                                          >today. The big difference is we wouldn't have the dupes issues we have today.
                                          >
                                          >On 8/22/2013 3:13 PM, Stefan Radermacher wrote:
                                          >> Am 22.08.13 23:57, schrieb Andrew:
                                          >>> The Paizo Pathfinder system has an OFFICIAL website, maintained and
                                          >>> run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL materials in plain
                                          >>> view. We already have an open permission to included everything
                                          >>> Pathfinder from them.
                                          >>
                                          >> You idea certainly has merit. However. the statement you give here is
                                          >> not exactly correct. Paizo's PRD site only lists the OGL content from
                                          >> their Pathfinder RPG product line, i.e. the hardcover rulebooks. Stuff
                                          >> included
                                          >> in Pathfinder Player Companion line or Pathfinder Campagn Setting line
                                          >> or other Golarion-specifict books is not included there. Neither are the
                                          >> Gods, even though they are integrated into domains and subdomains in the
                                          >> Core Rulebook and other books. Just something to consider in this regard.
                                          >>
                                          >>
                                          >> ------------------------------------
                                          >>
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                                          >>
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                                          >>
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                                          >
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                                          >

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                                        • Jon Catron
                                          Dunno if this is still an open topic of discussion, but I think it s a good idea. :) ________________________________ From: Andrew To:
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Aug 24, 2013
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Dunno if this is still an open topic of discussion, but I think it's a good idea. :)



                                            ________________________________
                                            From: Andrew <drew0500@...>
                                            To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                                            Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 5:19 AM
                                            Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?



                                             
                                            UE (Alpha) and Bestiary 3 (Alpha) it's not in the Release, they aren't ready for prime time, ergo it
                                            doesn't get to count as any errors those produce will skew any real analysis and statistics. ;)

                                            Yes, consolidating the files into one set would remove our errors with duplicates issues. Reduce
                                            overhead, and it would decrease memory usage, contrary to the belief otherwise. Removing .MODs, and
                                            duplicate items, and reusing the abilities between companions and their 'real' counterparts. It'd
                                            also force a standards of file naming. I don't think we need 10 race files, 8 ability files, etc.
                                            Sort by class, race and other for the abilities - after all, most of them are race related, class
                                            related or a misc item - afflictions, item powers, etc.

                                            I looked at the core book PDF, and it appears someone just decided to add in the scrolls and wands.
                                            Since the normal policy is just to place in the set what is in the book.

                                            Anyways, I'm gathering a lot of people are in the positive for this idea.

                                            On 8/22/2013 3:51 PM, Matthew Thompson wrote:
                                            > Honestly,
                                            > We're already having load problems just loading the core books anyway. If I take 6.01.05 and load the following :
                                            >
                                            > Core
                                            > APG
                                            > ARG
                                            > Bestiary
                                            > Bestiary II
                                            > Bestiary III (Beta)
                                            > UC
                                            > UM
                                            > UE (Beta)
                                            >
                                            > The program takes several minutes to load, and after making one or two characters it starts hanging on every thing it does, taking a minute or two to add a feat, to add a class level, etc. Just adding 8 class levels on a brand new character, just loaded dataset takes about 5 minutes.
                                            >
                                            > The Con below is a con if you were only going to load the Core, but, if that's all you wanted, you could just load the core and be done. If we consolidated the PRD material into one file, we could eliminate duplications between files (saving some memory).
                                            >
                                            > One other thing to consider would be to *not* load the core wands and scrolls. Those all take up memory, and the application (as I just learned this week) can create those on the fly rather easily. By not loading them seperately, that would also save memory at the cost of making it slightly more time consuming to create a character. However, we're not currently creating those scrolls/wands in expansion books (UC, UM, ARG for example) so I think that might be ok, as it would at least be consistent, rather than having the core and APG spells having wands/scrolls and the UC/UM/ARG not.
                                            >
                                            > And I don't think it would be all that hard (granted, newbie here) to create a PRD file, as it would basically be copying finalized LST entries from the expansion LST files into the PRD files.
                                            >
                                            > Matt
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ________________________________
                                            > From: Anestis Kozakis <kenosti@...>
                                            > To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                                            > Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2013 5:18 PM
                                            > Subject: Re: [pcgen] Why not make the "PRD"?
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > It;s a good idea in theory, and I like it.
                                            >
                                            > Pro: You load everything.
                                            >
                                            > Con: Increased memory usage, processing and loading times.
                                            >
                                            > Anestis.
                                            >
                                            > On 23 August 2013 08:02, Andrew <drew0500@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            >> Just to clarify:
                                            >>
                                            >> Each book added into the PRD would go through the normal 'single book
                                            >> creation/review' process as
                                            >> things stand now and when they've completed the full process from 'request
                                            >> to release' we'd still
                                            >> have the book set. But as long as the book is part of the Paizo's
                                            >> Pathfinder PRD, then they'd be
                                            >> added into the pcgen PRD data set to match.
                                            >>
                                            >> If it's not on the official Paizo PRD website, then it won't be included
                                            >> in the PCGen PRD.
                                            >>
                                            >> On 8/22/2013 2:57 PM, Andrew wrote:
                                            >>> Hi Folks,
                                            >>>
                                            >>> With the increasing workload of making sets work together, and the
                                            >> increased "onus" to further
                                            >>> support in each additional book (not to mention the back support). I
                                            >> would like to put forth a
                                            >>> radical idea which is well within precedent. The Paizo Pathfinder system
                                            >> has an OFFICIAL website,
                                            >>> maintained and run by the publisher and includes *ALL* their OGL
                                            >> materials in plain view. We already
                                            >>> have an open permission to included everything Pathfinder from them.
                                            >>>
                                            >>> So, we make a PRD set. Everything lumped in, no duplicate issues cause
                                            >> you are always loading
                                            >>> everything available. You only update items if something comes along and
                                            >> changes the wording.
                                            >>>
                                            >>> A Basic Loader for the entire PRD is nice, and then support requests
                                            >> will drop. Fixing issues
                                            >>> becomes simple since everything is condensed into one location. It won't
                                            >> be Books x, y and z any
                                            >>> more, but just the PRD.
                                            >>>
                                            >>> (We can still leave the separate books, cause I know people don't always
                                            >> embrace change) But I think
                                            >>> this would be a positive step forward in supporting the community.
                                            >> Adding in additional materials
                                            >>> would still go through the NFD process, and require chimp oversight. But
                                            >> ANYONE can submit items to
                                            >>> be included in this manner.
                                            >>>
                                            >>> Thoughts?
                                            >>>
                                            >>
                                            >>
                                            >> ------------------------------------
                                            >>
                                            >> Related Lists
                                            >> PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
                                            >> PCGen's Mailing Lists and Links:
                                            >> http://wiki.pcgen.org/Mailing_Lists_and_PCGen_Links
                                            >> PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
                                            >> PCGen's JIRA Tracker: http://jira.pcgen.org
                                            >>
                                            >>
                                            >> PCGen List File Help:
                                            >> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
                                            >> (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
                                            >>
                                            >> PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
                                            >> (for new official data source development)
                                            >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                            >>
                                            >>
                                            >>
                                            >>
                                            >



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