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Re: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG

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  • Michael Johnston
    Apologies for my typos; I m working on little sleep and without my reading glasses. Gods, I hate aging! I m only 38! ... [Non-text portions of this message
    Message 1 of 16 , May 3 9:39 AM
    • 0 Attachment
      Apologies for my typos; I'm working on little sleep and without my reading
      glasses. Gods, I hate aging! I'm only 38!

      On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:38 AM, Michael Johnston <johnstonmr@...>wrote:

      > It's working. Ainvar is incorrect when he says a 6th level sorcerer should
      > have 5 known spells plus his bloodline spell. According to the book, a 6th
      > level Sor. should have 4 known spells, plus the 1 bloodline spell. PCGen is
      > doing this just fine.
      >
      > The problem probably comes from the fact that the program bumps up the
      > "KNown Spells" table in the spells column by one, making it APPEAR that one
      > of your known spell slots is being used up by a spell that should not count
      > against known spells. For example, in PCGen, a 6th Level Sorcerer,
      > according tot he Spells Known table in the spells tab, should have 5 known
      > spells. In truth, however, he ought to have 4; the 5th is the bonus spell
      > added automatically due to the sorcerer's bloodline.
      >
      > I hope I haven't confused you further. The bottom line is, it works fine
      > but it appears not to if you don't double-check it agains the book.
      >
      >
      > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@...>wrote:
      >
      >>
      >>
      >> Hi Folks,
      >>
      >> I'm a little confused here -
      >>
      >> Is there an ISSUE or is it working?
      >>
      >> What is supposed to happen and what is currently happening?
      >>
      >> I can fix this in a about six hours, but only if I understand what the
      >> issue is. Are you supposed to get a free Bonus Known Spell with a
      >> certain selection? Is this not happening?
      >>
      >> Cheers,
      >>
      >>
      >> On 5/2/2010 8:25 PM, Michael wrote:
      >> > I ran into it too.
      >> >
      >> > --- In pcgen@yahoogroups.com <pcgen%40yahoogroups.com>, Ainvar
      >> G<ainvarg@...> wrote:
      >> >
      >> >> Background:
      >> >>
      >> >> Per the description of the sorcerer class, p 71 in the Bloodline
      >> description, the bonus spells that are granted to the sorcerer as a result
      >> of their bloodline do not count against their total spells known for their
      >> level. Or, to quote the text, "These spells are in addition to the number of
      >> spells given on Table 3�EUR"15." Table 3-15 being the Sorcerer Spells Known
      >> table where the number of spells available at a given level are provided.
      >>
      >> >>
      >> >>
      >> >> Running PCGen 5.16.2 with only Pathfinder Core dataset loaded, I
      >> created a sorcerer level 1, made all of the selections for a level 1
      >> sorcerer including the draconic (copper) bloodline. Saved that, then added 5
      >> more levels of sorcerer. As a sixth-level sorcerer, he should have 5 known
      >> spells + his bloodline spells (Mage Armor). PCGen is not allowing me to
      >> select a fifth spell, returning an error that he's already got all of his
      >> spells selected for that level (namely, 4 + Mage Armor).
      >> >>
      >> >> Is anyone else seeing this? I have not tested in-depth yet and thought
      >> that surely someone would have seen and corrected this by now, so before I
      >> spend a lot of time on it, I thought I would check here.
      >> >>
      >> >> AinvarG
      >> >>
      >> >>
      >> >
      >> >
      >> >
      >> > ------------------------------------
      >>
      >> >
      >> > Related Lists
      >> > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
      >> > PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
      >> > PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
      >> > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
      >> > PCGen's Online Docs:
      >> http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
      >> > PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
      >> http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html
      >> >
      >> > PCGen List File Help:
      >> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
      >> > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
      >> >
      >> > PCGen Experimental:
      >> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
      >> > (for new official data source development)
      >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
      >> >
      >> >
      >> >
      >> >
      >> >
      >>
      >> --
      >> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
      >> PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback
      >> Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
      >> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
      >>
      >>
      >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Andrew Maitland
      Hi Folks, Thanks. ... -- Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing) PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin Unique Title Quick-Silverback
      Message 2 of 16 , May 3 9:57 AM
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi Folks,

        Thanks.


        On 5/3/2010 9:39 AM, Michael Johnston wrote:
        > Apologies for my typos; I'm working on little sleep and without my reading
        > glasses. Gods, I hate aging! I'm only 38!
        >
        > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:38 AM, Michael Johnston<johnstonmr@...>wrote:
        >
        >
        >> It's working. Ainvar is incorrect when he says a 6th level sorcerer should
        >> have 5 known spells plus his bloodline spell. According to the book, a 6th
        >> level Sor. should have 4 known spells, plus the 1 bloodline spell. PCGen is
        >> doing this just fine.
        >>
        >> The problem probably comes from the fact that the program bumps up the
        >> "KNown Spells" table in the spells column by one, making it APPEAR that one
        >> of your known spell slots is being used up by a spell that should not count
        >> against known spells. For example, in PCGen, a 6th Level Sorcerer,
        >> according tot he Spells Known table in the spells tab, should have 5 known
        >> spells. In truth, however, he ought to have 4; the 5th is the bonus spell
        >> added automatically due to the sorcerer's bloodline.
        >>
        >> I hope I haven't confused you further. The bottom line is, it works fine
        >> but it appears not to if you don't double-check it agains the book.
        >>
        >>
        >> On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Andrew Maitland<drew0500@...>wrote:
        >>
        >>
        >>>
        >>> Hi Folks,
        >>>
        >>> I'm a little confused here -
        >>>
        >>> Is there an ISSUE or is it working?
        >>>
        >>> What is supposed to happen and what is currently happening?
        >>>
        >>> I can fix this in a about six hours, but only if I understand what the
        >>> issue is. Are you supposed to get a free Bonus Known Spell with a
        >>> certain selection? Is this not happening?
        >>>
        >>> Cheers,
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> On 5/2/2010 8:25 PM, Michael wrote:
        >>>
        >>>> I ran into it too.
        >>>>
        >>>> --- In pcgen@yahoogroups.com<pcgen%40yahoogroups.com>, Ainvar
        >>>>
        >>> G<ainvarg@...> wrote:
        >>>
        >>>>
        >>>>> Background:
        >>>>>
        >>>>> Per the description of the sorcerer class, p 71 in the Bloodline
        >>>>>
        >>> description, the bonus spells that are granted to the sorcerer as a result
        >>> of their bloodline do not count against their total spells known for their
        >>> level. Or, to quote the text, "These spells are in addition to the number of
        >>> spells given on Table 3âEUR"15." Table 3-15 being the Sorcerer Spells Known
        >>> table where the number of spells available at a given level are provided.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>>>
        >>>>> Running PCGen 5.16.2 with only Pathfinder Core dataset loaded, I
        >>>>>
        >>> created a sorcerer level 1, made all of the selections for a level 1
        >>> sorcerer including the draconic (copper) bloodline. Saved that, then added 5
        >>> more levels of sorcerer. As a sixth-level sorcerer, he should have 5 known
        >>> spells + his bloodline spells (Mage Armor). PCGen is not allowing me to
        >>> select a fifth spell, returning an error that he's already got all of his
        >>> spells selected for that level (namely, 4 + Mage Armor).
        >>>
        >>>>> Is anyone else seeing this? I have not tested in-depth yet and thought
        >>>>>
        >>> that surely someone would have seen and corrected this by now, so before I
        >>> spend a lot of time on it, I thought I would check here.
        >>>
        >>>>> AinvarG
        >>>>>
        >>>>>
        >>>>>
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>>> ------------------------------------
        >>>>
        >>>
        >>>> Related Lists
        >>>> PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
        >>>> PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
        >>>> PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
        >>>> PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
        >>>> PCGen's Online Docs:
        >>>>
        >>> http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
        >>>
        >>>> PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
        >>>>
        >>> http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html
        >>>
        >>>> PCGen List File Help:
        >>>>
        >>> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
        >>>
        >>>> (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
        >>>>
        >>>> PCGen Experimental:
        >>>>
        >>> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
        >>>
        >>>> (for new official data source development)
        >>>> Yahoo! Groups Links
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>>>
        >>> --
        >>> Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
        >>> PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback
        >>> Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
        >>> Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>
        >>
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Related Lists
        > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
        > PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
        > PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
        > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
        > PCGen's Online Docs: http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
        > PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs: http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html
        >
        > PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
        > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
        >
        > PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
        > (for new official data source development)
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >

        --
        Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
        PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback
        Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
        Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Ainvar G
        Michael s right - I had not realized the discrepancy between what PCGen said and what the PFRPG Core said. Thanks, Michael for providing this more complete
        Message 3 of 16 , May 3 10:47 AM
        • 0 Attachment
          Michael's right - I had not realized the discrepancy between what PCGen said and what the PFRPG Core said.

          Thanks, Michael for providing this more complete response -- I was still convinced there was an issue until you explained what was going on in this reply.

          AinvarG


          ----- Original Message ----
          From: Michael Johnston <johnstonmr@...>
          To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Mon, May 3, 2010 11:38:11 AM
          Subject: Re: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG

          It's working. Ainvar is incorrect when he says a 6th level sorcerer should
          have 5 known spells plus his bloodline spell. According to the book, a 6th
          level Sor. should have 4 known spells, plus the 1 bloodline spell. PCGen is
          doing this just fine.

          The problem probably comes from the fact that the program bumps up the
          "KNown Spells" table in the spells column by one, making it APPEAR that one
          of your known spell slots is being used up by a spell that should not count
          against known spells. For example, in PCGen, a 6th Level Sorcerer,
          according tot he Spells Known table in the spells tab, should have 5 known
          spells. In truth, however, he ought to have 4; the 5th is the bonus spell
          added automatically due to the sorcerer's bloodline.

          I hope I haven't confused you further. The bottom line is, it works fine
          but it appears not to if you don't double-check it agains the book.

          On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@...> wrote:

          >
          >
          > Hi Folks,
          >
          > I'm a little confused here -
          >
          > Is there an ISSUE or is it working?
          >
          > What is supposed to happen and what is currently happening?
          >
          > I can fix this in a about six hours, but only if I understand what the
          > issue is. Are you supposed to get a free Bonus Known Spell with a
          > certain selection? Is this not happening?
          >
          > Cheers,
          >
          >
          > On 5/2/2010 8:25 PM, Michael wrote:
          > > I ran into it too.
          > >
          > > --- In pcgen@yahoogroups.com <pcgen%40yahoogroups.com>, Ainvar
          > G<ainvarg@...> wrote:
          > >
          > >> Background:
          > >>
          > >> Per the description of the sorcerer class, p 71 in the Bloodline
          > description, the bonus spells that are granted to the sorcerer as a result
          > of their bloodline do not count against their total spells known for their
          > level. Or, to quote the text, "These spells are in addition to the number of
          > spells given on Table 3âEUR"15." Table 3-15 being the Sorcerer Spells Known
          > table where the number of spells available at a given level are provided.
          >
          > >>
          > >>
          > >> Running PCGen 5.16.2 with only Pathfinder Core dataset loaded, I created
          > a sorcerer level 1, made all of the selections for a level 1 sorcerer
          > including the draconic (copper) bloodline. Saved that, then added 5 more
          > levels of sorcerer. As a sixth-level sorcerer, he should have 5 known spells
          > + his bloodline spells (Mage Armor). PCGen is not allowing me to select a
          > fifth spell, returning an error that he's already got all of his spells
          > selected for that level (namely, 4 + Mage Armor).
          > >>
          > >> Is anyone else seeing this? I have not tested in-depth yet and thought
          > that surely someone would have seen and corrected this by now, so before I
          > spend a lot of time on it, I thought I would check here.
          > >>
          > >> AinvarG
          > >>
          > >>
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ------------------------------------
          >
          > >
          > > Related Lists
          > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
          > > PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
          > > PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
          > > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
          > > PCGen's Online Docs:
          > http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
          > > PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
          > http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html
          > >
          > > PCGen List File Help:
          > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
          > > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
          > >
          > > PCGen Experimental:
          > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
          > > (for new official data source development)
          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          > --
          > Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
          > PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback
          > Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
          > Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



          ------------------------------------

          Related Lists
          PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
          PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
          PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
          PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
          PCGen's Online Docs: http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
          PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs: http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html

          PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
          (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)

          PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
          (for new official data source development)
          Yahoo! Groups Links
        • Derrik H. Gilmore
          Mea culpa, mea culpa -mea maxima culpa - Michael is right. Don t I feel like a schmuck now =-) ... Derrik Gil Gilmore Dum Spiro, Spero ... From:
          Message 4 of 16 , May 3 6:21 PM
          • 0 Attachment
            Mea culpa, mea culpa -mea maxima culpa - Michael is right. Don't I feel
            like a schmuck now =-)

            ----
            Derrik "Gil" Gilmore
            "Dum Spiro, Spero"

            -----Original Message-----
            From: pcgen@yahoogroups.com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            Michael Johnston
            Sent: Monday, 03 May 2010 10:38
            To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG

            It's working. Ainvar is incorrect when he says a 6th level sorcerer should
            have 5 known spells plus his bloodline spell. According to the book, a 6th
            level Sor. should have 4 known spells, plus the 1 bloodline spell. PCGen is
            doing this just fine.

            The problem probably comes from the fact that the program bumps up the
            "KNown Spells" table in the spells column by one, making it APPEAR that one
            of your known spell slots is being used up by a spell that should not count
            against known spells. For example, in PCGen, a 6th Level Sorcerer,
            according tot he Spells Known table in the spells tab, should have 5 known
            spells. In truth, however, he ought to have 4; the 5th is the bonus spell
            added automatically due to the sorcerer's bloodline.

            I hope I haven't confused you further. The bottom line is, it works fine
            but it appears not to if you don't double-check it agains the book.

            On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@...> wrote:

            >
            >
            > Hi Folks,
            >
            > I'm a little confused here -
            >
            > Is there an ISSUE or is it working?
            >
            > What is supposed to happen and what is currently happening?
            >
            > I can fix this in a about six hours, but only if I understand what the
            > issue is. Are you supposed to get a free Bonus Known Spell with a
            > certain selection? Is this not happening?
            >
            > Cheers,
            >
            >
            > On 5/2/2010 8:25 PM, Michael wrote:
            > > I ran into it too.
            > >
            > > --- In pcgen@yahoogroups.com <pcgen%40yahoogroups.com>, Ainvar
            > G<ainvarg@...> wrote:
            > >
            > >> Background:
            > >>
            > >> Per the description of the sorcerer class, p 71 in the Bloodline
            > description, the bonus spells that are granted to the sorcerer as a result
            > of their bloodline do not count against their total spells known for their
            > level. Or, to quote the text, "These spells are in addition to the number
            of
            > spells given on Table 3âEUR"15." Table 3-15 being the Sorcerer Spells
            Known
            > table where the number of spells available at a given level are provided.
            >
            > >>
            > >>
            > >> Running PCGen 5.16.2 with only Pathfinder Core dataset loaded, I
            created
            > a sorcerer level 1, made all of the selections for a level 1 sorcerer
            > including the draconic (copper) bloodline. Saved that, then added 5 more
            > levels of sorcerer. As a sixth-level sorcerer, he should have 5 known
            spells
            > + his bloodline spells (Mage Armor). PCGen is not allowing me to select a
            > fifth spell, returning an error that he's already got all of his spells
            > selected for that level (namely, 4 + Mage Armor).
            > >>
            > >> Is anyone else seeing this? I have not tested in-depth yet and thought
            > that surely someone would have seen and corrected this by now, so before I
            > spend a lot of time on it, I thought I would check here.
            > >>
            > >> AinvarG
            > >>
            > >>
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > ------------------------------------
            >
            > >
            > > Related Lists
            > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
            > > PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
            > > PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
            > > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
            > > PCGen's Online Docs:
            > http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
            > > PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
            > http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html
            > >
            > > PCGen List File Help:
            > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
            > > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
            > >
            > > PCGen Experimental:
            > http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
            > > (for new official data source development)
            > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            > --
            > Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
            > PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback
            > Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
            > Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



            ------------------------------------

            Related Lists
            PCGen's release site: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net
            PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki.pcgen.org/
            PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki.pcgen.org/index.php?title=Roadmap
            PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen.sourceforge.net/07_autobuilds.php
            PCGen's Online Docs: http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
            PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
            http://pcgen.akozakis.id.au/autobuilds/download.html

            PCGen List File Help: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/PCGenListFileHelp/
            (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)

            PCGen Experimental: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/pcgen_experimental/
            (for new official data source development)
            Yahoo! Groups Links



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          • Ainvar G
            Hey, no need to feel like a schmuck. There s at least four of us (Michael included) that misunderstood what was going on. I m just glad I asked instead of
            Message 5 of 16 , May 3 7:45 PM
            • 0 Attachment
              Hey, no need to feel like a schmuck. There's at least four of us (Michael included) that misunderstood what was going on. I'm just glad I asked instead of wondering about it or trying to "work around" the "problem".




              ________________________________
              From: Derrik H. Gilmore <dhgilmore@...>
              To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Mon, May 3, 2010 8:21:51 PM
              Subject: RE: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG


              Mea culpa, mea culpa -mea maxima culpa - Michael is right. Don't I feel
              like a schmuck now =-)

              ----
              Derrik "Gil" Gilmore
              "Dum Spiro, Spero"

              -----Original Message-----
              From: pcgen@yahoogroups. com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
              Michael Johnston
              Sent: Monday, 03 May 2010 10:38
              To: pcgen@yahoogroups. com
              Subject: Re: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG

              It's working. Ainvar is incorrect when he says a 6th level sorcerer should
              have 5 known spells plus his bloodline spell. According to the book, a 6th
              level Sor. should have 4 known spells, plus the 1 bloodline spell. PCGen is
              doing this just fine.

              The problem probably comes from the fact that the program bumps up the
              "KNown Spells" table in the spells column by one, making it APPEAR that one
              of your known spell slots is being used up by a spell that should not count
              against known spells. For example, in PCGen, a 6th Level Sorcerer,
              according tot he Spells Known table in the spells tab, should have 5 known
              spells. In truth, however, he ought to have 4; the 5th is the bonus spell
              added automatically due to the sorcerer's bloodline.

              I hope I haven't confused you further. The bottom line is, it works fine
              but it appears not to if you don't double-check it agains the book.

              On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@yahoo. com> wrote:

              >
              >
              > Hi Folks,
              >
              > I'm a little confused here -
              >
              > Is there an ISSUE or is it working?
              >
              > What is supposed to happen and what is currently happening?
              >
              > I can fix this in a about six hours, but only if I understand what the
              > issue is. Are you supposed to get a free Bonus Known Spell with a
              > certain selection? Is this not happening?
              >
              > Cheers,
              >
              >
              > On 5/2/2010 8:25 PM, Michael wrote:
              > > I ran into it too.
              > >
              > > --- In pcgen@yahoogroups. com <pcgen%40yahoogroup s.com>, Ainvar
              > G<ainvarg@.. .> wrote:
              > >
              > >> Background:
              > >>
              > >> Per the description of the sorcerer class, p 71 in the Bloodline
              > description, the bonus spells that are granted to the sorcerer as a result
              > of their bloodline do not count against their total spells known for their
              > level. Or, to quote the text, "These spells are in addition to the number
              of
              > spells given on Table 3âEUR"15." Table 3-15 being the Sorcerer Spells
              Known
              > table where the number of spells available at a given level are provided.
              >
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> Running PCGen 5.16.2 with only Pathfinder Core dataset loaded, I
              created
              > a sorcerer level 1, made all of the selections for a level 1 sorcerer
              > including the draconic (copper) bloodline. Saved that, then added 5 more
              > levels of sorcerer. As a sixth-level sorcerer, he should have 5 known
              spells
              > + his bloodline spells (Mage Armor). PCGen is not allowing me to select a
              > fifth spell, returning an error that he's already got all of his spells
              > selected for that level (namely, 4 + Mage Armor).
              > >>
              > >> Is anyone else seeing this? I have not tested in-depth yet and thought
              > that surely someone would have seen and corrected this by now, so before I
              > spend a lot of time on it, I thought I would check here.
              > >>
              > >> AinvarG
              > >>
              > >>
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------ --------- --------- ------
              >
              > >
              > > Related Lists
              > > PCGen's release site: http://pcgen. sourceforge. net
              > > PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki. pcgen.org/
              > > PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki. pcgen.org/ index.php? title=Roadmap
              > > PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen. sourceforge. net/07_autobuild s.php
              > > PCGen's Online Docs:
              > http://pcgen-test.org/autobuilds/pcgen-docs/index.html
              > > PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
              > http://pcgen. akozakis. id.au/autobuilds /download. html
              > >
              > > PCGen List File Help:
              > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ PCGenListFileHel p/
              > > (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)
              > >
              > > PCGen Experimental:
              > http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ pcgen_experiment al/
              > > (for new official data source development)
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              > --
              > Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
              > PCGen Board of Directors, Admin Silverback
              > Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
              > Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              ------------ --------- --------- ------

              Related Lists
              PCGen's release site: http://pcgen. sourceforge. net
              PCGen's Wiki: http://wiki. pcgen.org/
              PCGen's Roadmap: http://wiki. pcgen.org/ index.php? title=Roadmap
              PCGen's alpha build: http://pcgen. sourceforge. net/07_autobuild s.php
              PCGen's Online Docs: http://pcgen- test.org/ autobuilds/ pcgen-docs/ index.html
              PCGen's Backup Autobuilds and Docs:
              http://pcgen. akozakis. id.au/autobuilds /download. html

              PCGen List File Help: http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ PCGenListFileHel p/
              (for assistance in creating new homebrew or official list files)

              PCGen Experimental: http://tech. groups.yahoo. com/group/ pcgen_experiment al/
              (for new official data source development)
              Yahoo! Groups Links

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            • James Dempsey
              Hi, That indicates to me that we need a new way of displaying things too, as the current way is doing a good job of confusing people! Any thoughts on what
              Message 6 of 16 , May 3 7:48 PM
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi,

                That indicates to me that we need a new way of displaying things too,
                as the current way is doing a good job of confusing people! Any
                thoughts on what might work here. We can then take that on as a
                feature request.

                Cheers,
                James Dempsey
                PCGen Code SB


                On 4 May 2010 12:45, Ainvar G <ainvarg@...> wrote:
                > Hey, no need to feel like a schmuck.  There's at least four of us (Michael included) that misunderstood what was going on.  I'm just glad I asked instead of wondering about it or trying to "work around" the "problem".
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ________________________________
                > From: Derrik H. Gilmore <dhgilmore@...>
                > To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                > Sent: Mon, May 3, 2010 8:21:51 PM
                > Subject: RE: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG
                >
                >
                > Mea culpa, mea culpa -mea maxima culpa  - Michael is right. Don't I feel
                > like a schmuck now =-)
                >
                > ----
                > Derrik "Gil" Gilmore
                > "Dum Spiro, Spero"
                >
                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: pcgen@yahoogroups. com [mailto:pcgen@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
                > Michael Johnston
                > Sent: Monday, 03 May 2010 10:38
                > To: pcgen@yahoogroups. com
                > Subject: Re: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG
                >
                > It's working.  Ainvar is incorrect when he says a 6th level sorcerer should
                > have 5 known spells plus his bloodline spell.   According to the book, a 6th
                > level Sor. should have 4 known spells, plus the 1 bloodline spell.  PCGen is
                > doing this just fine.
                >
                > The problem probably comes from the fact that the program bumps up the
                > "KNown Spells" table in the spells column by one, making it APPEAR that one
                > of your known spell slots is being used up by a spell that should not count
                > against known spells.  For example, in PCGen, a 6th Level Sorcerer,
                > according tot he Spells Known table in the spells tab, should have 5 known
                > spells.  In truth, however, he ought to have 4; the 5th is the bonus spell
                > added automatically due to the sorcerer's bloodline.
                >
                > I hope I haven't confused you further.  The bottom line is, it works fine
                > but it appears not to if you don't double-check it agains the book.
                >
                > On Mon, May 3, 2010 at 9:30 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@yahoo. com> wrote:
                >
                >>
                >>
                >> Hi Folks,
                >>
                >> I'm a little confused here -
                >>
                >> Is there an ISSUE or is it working?
                >>
                >> What is supposed to happen and what is currently happening?
                >>
                >> I can fix this in a about six hours, but only if I understand what the
                >> issue is. Are you supposed to get a free Bonus Known Spell with a
                >> certain selection? Is this not happening?
                >>
                >> Cheers,
                >>
                >>
                >> On 5/2/2010 8:25 PM, Michael wrote:
                >> > I ran into it too.
                >> >
                >> > --- In pcgen@yahoogroups. com <pcgen%40yahoogroup s.com>, Ainvar
                >> G<ainvarg@.. .> wrote:
                >> >
                >> >> Background:
                >> >>
                >> >> Per the description of the sorcerer class, p 71 in the Bloodline
                >> description, the bonus spells that are granted to the sorcerer as a result
                >> of their bloodline do not count against their total spells known for their
                >> level. Or, to quote the text, "These spells are in addition to the number
                > of
                >> spells given on Table 3âEUR"15." Table 3-15 being the Sorcerer Spells
                > Known
                >> table where the number of spells available at a given level are provided.
                >>
                >> >>
                >> >>
                >> >> Running PCGen 5.16.2 with only Pathfinder Core dataset loaded, I
                > created
                >> a sorcerer level 1, made all of the selections for a level 1 sorcerer
                >> including the draconic (copper) bloodline. Saved that, then added 5 more
                >> levels of sorcerer. As a sixth-level sorcerer, he should have 5 known
                > spells
                >> + his bloodline spells (Mage Armor). PCGen is not allowing me to select a
                >> fifth spell, returning an error that he's already got all of his spells
                >> selected for that level (namely, 4 + Mage Armor).
                >> >>
                >> >> Is anyone else seeing this? I have not tested in-depth yet and thought
                >> that surely someone would have seen and corrected this by now, so before I
                >> spend a lot of time on it, I thought I would check here.
                >> >>
                >> >> AinvarG
              • Saxum Caribetum
                ... as a compact display, take a leaf from clerics (Domain spells), and display the Sorcerer s known spells as known+bonus , eg 5+1 ? -- Neil Taylor Creo
                Message 7 of 16 , May 3 11:41 PM
                • 0 Attachment
                  On 04/05/2010 03:48, James Dempsey wrote:
                  > Hi,
                  >
                  > That indicates to me that we need a new way of displaying things too,
                  > as the current way is doing a good job of confusing people! Any
                  > thoughts on what might work here. We can then take that on as a
                  > feature request.
                  >
                  >

                  as a compact display, take a leaf from clerics (Domain spells), and
                  display the Sorcerer's known spells as "known+bonus", eg "5+1" ?

                  --
                  Neil Taylor "Creo Imaginem Mente"
                  ArM Code 1.5 5++ Ca++ R++p H++ ?L Y(96) T(5)- SG+++ G++++ P++ HoH(Ma++ Q+ Hg+) Fz(E)++ C++ :-) Cd++
                  Saga site at http://www.quantal.demon.co.uk/saga/
                  Sub Rosa Ars Magica zine - http://www.subrosamagazine.org/
                • Ainvar G
                  +1 I think that sounds sufficient and hopefully would not involve a lot of time away from the awesome crunch that is being developed behind the scenes.
                  Message 8 of 16 , May 4 6:10 AM
                  • 0 Attachment
                    +1

                    I think that sounds sufficient and hopefully would not involve a lot of time away from the awesome crunch that is being developed behind the scenes.




                    ________________________________
                    From: Saxum Caribetum <saxum.caribetum@...>
                    To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 1:41:51 AM
                    Subject: Re: [pcgen] Re: Bug? Spells known for sorcerers in PFRPG


                    On 04/05/2010 03:48, James Dempsey wrote:
                    > Hi,
                    >
                    > That indicates to me that we need a new way of displaying things too,
                    > as the current way is doing a good job of confusing people! Any
                    > thoughts on what might work here. We can then take that on as a
                    > feature request.
                    >
                    >

                    as a compact display, take a leaf from clerics (Domain spells), and
                    display the Sorcerer's known spells as "known+bonus" , eg "5+1" ?

                    --
                    Neil Taylor "Creo Imaginem Mente"
                    ArM Code 1.5 5++ Ca++ R++p H++ ?L Y(96) T(5)- SG+++ G++++ P++ HoH(Ma++ Q+ Hg+) Fz(E)++ C++ :-) Cd++
                    Saga site at http://www.quantal demon.co. uk/saga/
                    Sub Rosa Ars Magica zine - http://www.subrosamagazine.org/







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