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[Pathfinder] CMD not Displayed

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  • Hollis McCray
    I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD isn t displayed.
    Message 1 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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      I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
      noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
      isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?

      --
      Hollis McCray
      ascensionschild@...
    • Andrew Maitland
      ... Which sheet? Htm? PDF? -- Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing) Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin Unique Title Quick-Silverback
      Message 2 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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        Hollis McCray wrote:
        > I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
        > noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
        > isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?
        >
        >

        Which sheet? Htm? PDF?

        --

        Andrew Maitland (LegacyKing)
        Admin Silverback, PCGen Board of Directors
        Data Chimp, Docs Tamarin
        Unique Title "Quick-Silverback Tracker Monkey"
      • Tir Gwaith
        On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:01 AM, Hollis McCray ... Can someone explain the final rules CMB vs. CMD? That way I can figure out how the sheet needs to be
        Message 3 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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          On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:01 AM, Hollis McCray
          <ascensionschild@...> wrote:
          > I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
          > noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
          > isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?

          Can someone explain the final rules CMB vs. CMD? That way I can
          figure out how the sheet needs to be changed to output that stuff..

          Tir Gwaith
          PCGen LST Chimp
        • David R. Bender
          I just uploaded my Pathfinder output sheet that includes CMB & CMD to the files section and had Yahoo send a note. It is a simple html sheet that you can use
          Message 4 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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            I just uploaded my Pathfinder output sheet that includes CMB & CMD to
            the files section and had Yahoo send a note. It is a simple html sheet
            that you can use as an example or just use as is.

            David
            Papa.DRB

            Grognard (definition 1)
            <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Grognard.html>
            My better half and me
            <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Nana-and-Papa2.JPG>
            Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
            The Internet: Because None of Us Are As Dumb as All of Us


            Hollis McCray wrote:
            > I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
            > noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
            > isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?
            >
            >
          • David R. Bender
            http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html Search for Combat Maneuvers David Papa.DRB Grognard (definition 1)
            Message 5 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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              http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html

              Search for "Combat Maneuvers"

              David
              Papa.DRB

              Grognard (definition 1)
              <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Grognard.html>
              My better half and me
              <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Nana-and-Papa2.JPG>
              Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
              The Internet: Because None of Us Are As Dumb as All of Us


              Tir Gwaith wrote:
              > On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:01 AM, Hollis McCray
              > <ascensionschild@...> wrote:
              >
              >> I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
              >> noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
              >> isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?
              >>
              >
              > Can someone explain the final rules CMB vs. CMD? That way I can
              > figure out how the sheet needs to be changed to output that stuff..
              >
              > Tir Gwaith
              > PCGen LST Chimp
              >
              >
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            • Hollis McCray
              ... It was the PDF output sheet. -- Hollis McCray Mutant Registration Number #US2002023904 Warning: Proximity to this individual may expose you to the
              Message 6 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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                On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 9:04 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                >
                > Hollis McCray wrote:
                > > I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
                > > noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
                > > isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?
                > >
                > >
                >
                > Which sheet? Htm? PDF?

                It was the PDF output sheet.
                --
                Hollis McCray
                Mutant Registration Number #US2002023904

                Warning: Proximity to this individual may expose you to the following RPGs:
                Fate: http://www.faterpg.com
                Mutants & Masterminds: http://www.mutantsandmasterminds.com
                Swashbucklers of the Seven Skies: http://www.7skies.net/
                Please visit these websites in order to protect yourself.
              • Tir Gwaith
                ... Differences from the Beta? I have the PDF set up for the Beta, and I need to figure out what I need to do to accomodate the final release. Tir Gwaith
                Message 7 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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                  On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David R. Bender <Papa.DRB@...> wrote:
                  > http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html
                  >
                  > Search for "Combat Maneuvers"

                  Differences from the Beta? I have the PDF set up for the Beta, and I
                  need to figure out what I need to do to accomodate the final release.

                  Tir Gwaith
                  PCGen LST Chimp
                • David R. Bender
                  The Beta did not have CMD (Combat Maneuver Defense), so that is completely new. David Papa.DRB Grognard (definition 1)
                  Message 8 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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                    The Beta did not have CMD (Combat Maneuver Defense), so that is
                    completely new.

                    David
                    Papa.DRB

                    Grognard (definition 1)
                    <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Grognard.html>
                    My better half and me
                    <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Nana-and-Papa2.JPG>
                    Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
                    The Internet: Because None of Us Are As Dumb as All of Us


                    Tir Gwaith wrote:
                    > On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David R. Bender <Papa.DRB@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >> http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html
                    >>
                    >> Search for "Combat Maneuvers"
                    >>
                    >
                    > Differences from the Beta? I have the PDF set up for the Beta, and I
                    > need to figure out what I need to do to accomodate the final release.
                    >
                    > Tir Gwaith
                    > PCGen LST Chimp
                    >
                    >
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                  • Tir Gwaith
                    Ok, from reading it, it sounds just like the CMB defense from Beta (with substitution of Dex+Str instead Str)... I ll check the VARs used. Might just need a
                    Message 9 of 17 , Oct 2, 2009
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                      Ok, from reading it, it sounds just like the CMB defense from Beta
                      (with substitution of Dex+Str instead Str)...

                      I'll check the VARs used. Might just need a bit of a tweek on the base.xml


                      Tir Gwaith
                      PCGen LST Chimp



                      On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:37 AM, David R. Bender <Papa.DRB@...> wrote:
                      > The Beta did not have CMD (Combat Maneuver Defense), so that is
                      > completely new.
                      >
                      > David
                      > Papa.DRB
                      >
                      > Grognard (definition 1)
                      > <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Grognard.html>
                      > My better half and me
                      > <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Nana-and-Papa2.JPG>
                      > Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
                      > The Internet: Because None of Us Are As Dumb as All of Us
                      >
                      >
                      > Tir Gwaith wrote:
                      >> On Fri, Oct 2, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David R. Bender <Papa.DRB@...> wrote:
                      >>
                      >>> http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html
                      >>>
                      >>> Search for "Combat Maneuvers"
                      >>>
                      >>
                      >> Differences from the Beta?  I have the PDF set up for the Beta, and I
                      >> need to figure out what I need to do to accomodate the final release.
                      >>
                      >> Tir Gwaith
                      >> PCGen LST Chimp
                      >>
                      >>
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                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------------------------------
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                    • rexhammerforge
                      The sheet looks nice! Thanks for doing the work. I ll be putting that into my homebrew sheet! My players pointed out to me that there isn t a + in front of CMD
                      Message 10 of 17 , Oct 3, 2009
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                        The sheet looks nice! Thanks for doing the work. I'll be putting that into my homebrew sheet!

                        My players pointed out to me that there isn't a + in front of CMD it's like AC, just a number.

                        Thanx again.
                        Rex

                        --- In pcgen@yahoogroups.com, "David R. Bender" <Papa.DRB@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I just uploaded my Pathfinder output sheet that includes CMB & CMD to
                        > the files section and had Yahoo send a note. It is a simple html sheet
                        > that you can use as an example or just use as is.
                        >
                        > David
                        > Papa.DRB
                        >
                        > Grognard (definition 1)
                        > <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Grognard.html>
                        > My better half and me
                        > <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edavidstuff/Nana-and-Papa2.JPG>
                        > Madness takes its toll - please have exact change.
                        > The Internet: Because None of Us Are As Dumb as All of Us
                        >
                        >
                        > Hollis McCray wrote:
                        > > I was inputting a character from a Pathfinder session on Sunday, and I
                        > > noticed something missing on the sheet. The CMB is there, but the CMD
                        > > isn't displayed. Do we need a specialized sheet for Pathfinder?
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • Saxum Caribetum
                        ... Can I ask if (please!) anyone is working to make the standard PDF xslt include the CMD? I had a brief look, and concluded that my assumption was correct,
                        Message 11 of 17 , Oct 6, 2009
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                          David R. Bender wrote:
                          > I just uploaded my Pathfinder output sheet that includes CMB & CMD to
                          > the files section and had Yahoo send a note. It is a simple html sheet
                          > that you can use as an example or just use as is.
                          >


                          Can I ask if (please!) anyone is working to make the standard PDF xslt
                          include the CMD? I had a brief look, and concluded that my assumption
                          was correct, and I don't understand XLST, so I can't fix it.

                          If so, could they also note that the formatting is wrong for -ve CMB
                          values: the PDF reads "+-1" for one of our PCs, rather than the expected
                          "-1"


                          --
                          Neil Taylor "Creo Imaginem Mente"
                          ArM Code 1.5 5++ Ca++ R++p H++ ?L Y(96) T(5)- SG+++ G++++ P++ HoH(Ma++ Q+ Hg+) Fz(E)++ C++ :-) Cd++
                          Saga site at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/saxum.caribetum/
                          Sub Rosa Ars Magica zine - http://www.subrosamagazine.org/
                        • Andrew Maitland
                          Hi Saxum, I believe Tir is handling that particular issue. ________________________________ From: Saxum Caribetum To:
                          Message 12 of 17 , Oct 6, 2009
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                            Hi Saxum,

                            I believe Tir is handling that particular issue.




                            ________________________________
                            From: Saxum Caribetum <saxum.caribetum@...>
                            To: pcgen@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Tuesday, October 6, 2009 6:26:09 AM
                            Subject: Re: [pcgen] [Pathfinder] CMD not Displayed

                            David R. Bender wrote:
                            > I just uploaded my Pathfinder output sheet that includes CMB & CMD to
                            > the files section and had Yahoo send a note. It is a simple html sheet
                            > that you can use as an example or just use as is.



                            Can I ask if (please!) anyone is working to make the standard PDF xslt
                            include the CMD? I had a brief look, and concluded that my assumption
                            was correct, and I don't understand XLST, so I can't fix it.

                            If so, could they also note that the formatting is wrong for -ve CMB
                            values: the PDF reads "+-1" for one of our PCs, rather than the expected
                            "-1"


                            --
                            Neil Taylor "Creo Imaginem Mente"
                            ArM Code 1.5 5++ Ca++ R++p H++ ?L Y(96) T(5)- SG+++ G++++ P++ HoH(Ma++ Q+ Hg+) Fz(E)++ C++ :-) Cd++
                            Saga site at http://homepage.ntlworld.com/saxum.caribetum/
                            Sub Rosa Ars Magica zine - http://www.subrosamagazine.org/



                            ------------------------------------

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                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Hollis McCray
                            ... Wow... I just want to say that I personally am amazed by how fast the response was to this. RL stuff has kept me busy since Friday, but the code monkeys
                            Message 13 of 17 , Oct 6, 2009
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                              On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 7:14 AM, Andrew Maitland <drew0500@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Hi Saxum,
                              >
                              > I believe Tir is handling that particular issue.

                              Wow...

                              I just want to say that I personally am amazed by how fast the
                              response was to this. RL stuff has kept me busy since Friday, but the
                              code monkeys were all over this.

                              Way to go team!
                              --
                              Hollis McCray
                              Mutant Registration Number #US2002023904

                              Warning: Proximity to this individual may expose you to the following RPGs:
                              Fate: http://www.faterpg.com
                              Mutants & Masterminds: http://www.mutantsandmasterminds.com
                              Swashbucklers of the Seven Skies: http://www.7skies.net/
                              Please visit these websites in order to protect yourself.
                            • Tir Gwaith
                              Ok, anyone correct me if I m wrong, I m summarizing the Beta vs. Final versions of Pathfinder CMB. If I have this wrong, I m going to waste some serious time
                              Message 14 of 17 , Oct 7, 2009
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                                Ok, anyone correct me if I'm wrong, I'm summarizing the Beta vs. Final
                                versions of Pathfinder CMB. If I have this wrong, I'm going to waste
                                some serious time on the PDF layout.

                                CMB base stays the same. Looks like all the CMB actions are now
                                standard, so no need for the multiple attacks bits? Is that right?

                                CMB Defense is now "CMD" which adds Dex and Str to the base defense.
                                We'll still need the various defenses, since Dwarves get the bonus to
                                Trip and Bull Rush still (so I can assume the rest will have various
                                bonuses in places). The bigger need for the CMD various actions is
                                lessened since the "Improved" Feats now don't seem to add to both
                                attack and defense for the action..

                                Is all that right? If so, then I think I can make the PDF changes.
                                Most of the work will be the new XSL adding Dex into the bit (base
                                layout is the hardest bit for me - the loopy stuff I've kinda got
                                under my belt - just takes time to code..) and the rest aligning up to
                                the new VARs from the newer dataset.


                                Tir Gwaith
                                PCGen LST Chimp
                              • Stefan Radermacher
                                ... The CMB calculation stays the same, however, you also get all bonuses (and penalties) you would get to an attack with the weapon you are using to make the
                                Message 15 of 17 , Oct 7, 2009
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                                  On Wednesday 07 October 2009 12:16:59 Tir Gwaith wrote:
                                  > Ok, anyone correct me if I'm wrong, I'm summarizing the Beta vs. Final
                                  > versions of Pathfinder CMB. If I have this wrong, I'm going to waste
                                  > some serious time on the PDF layout.
                                  >
                                  > CMB base stays the same. Looks like all the CMB actions are now
                                  > standard, so no need for the multiple attacks bits? Is that right?

                                  The CMB calculation stays the same, however, you also get all bonuses (and
                                  penalties) you would get to an attack with the weapon you are using to make
                                  the combat maneuver with, i.e. from feats like Weapon Focus, spells like
                                  Bless, or conditions like sickened.

                                  Not all maneuvers are standard actions, some (like Trip, for example) can be
                                  used in place of an attack, and thus as part of a full attack or even a monk's
                                  flurry of blow. In these cases, they get the appropriate -5/-10/-15 penalty
                                  for iterative attacks.

                                  Also note that now, tiny ans smaller creatures now use their Dexterity bonus
                                  instead of Strength for CMB calculation.

                                  > CMB Defense is now "CMD" which adds Dex and Str to the base defense.
                                  > We'll still need the various defenses, since Dwarves get the bonus to
                                  > Trip and Bull Rush still (so I can assume the rest will have various
                                  > bonuses in places). The bigger need for the CMD various actions is
                                  > lessened since the "Improved" Feats now don't seem to add to both
                                  > attack and defense for the action..

                                  The CMD also includes all non-material bonuses to AC, like dodge, deflection,
                                  or insight bonuses. Basically - for a medium-sizes creature - CMD is equal to
                                  CMB plus Touch AC.

                                  > Is all that right? If so, then I think I can make the PDF changes.
                                  > Most of the work will be the new XSL adding Dex into the bit (base
                                  > layout is the hardest bit for me - the loopy stuff I've kinda got
                                  > under my belt - just takes time to code..) and the rest aligning up to
                                  > the new VARs from the newer dataset.

                                  The calculations are all made in the data set, and I have implemented this in
                                  my private OS I'm using in my campaign. If you like, we can talk this over on
                                  IRC, so you don't need to do any duplicate work. I am online there but it
                                  might take me some minutes to notice activity in the channel from time to
                                  time.

                                  Regards,
                                  Stefan.
                                • Stefan Radermacher
                                  ... I forgot this. How are you getting this? For example: Improved Grapple (Combat) You are skilled at grappling opponents. Prerequisite: Dex 13, Improved
                                  Message 16 of 17 , Oct 7, 2009
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                                    On Wednesday 07 October 2009 12:16:59 Tir Gwaith wrote:
                                    > The bigger need for the CMD various actions is
                                    > lessened since the "Improved" Feats now don't seem to add to both
                                    > attack and defense for the action..

                                    I forgot this. How are you getting this? For example:

                                    Improved Grapple (Combat)

                                    You are skilled at grappling opponents.

                                    Prerequisite: Dex 13, Improved Unarmed Strike.

                                    Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when performing a grapple
                                    combat maneuver. In addition, you receive a +2 bonus on checks made to grapple
                                    a foe. You also receive a +2 bonus to your Combat Maneuver Defense whenever an
                                    opponent tries to grapple you.

                                    Normal: You provoke an attack of opportunity when performing a grapple combat
                                    maneuver.

                                    (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/feats.html#improved-grapple)
                                  • Tir Gwaith
                                    On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:00 AM, Stefan Radermacher ... Ah.. Went off the feat table in the PDF, not the full description. So the breakout is definitely still
                                    Message 17 of 17 , Oct 7, 2009
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                                      On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 6:00 AM, Stefan Radermacher
                                      <radermacher@...> wrote:
                                      > On Wednesday 07 October 2009 12:16:59 Tir Gwaith wrote:
                                      >> The bigger need for the CMD various actions is
                                      >> lessened since the "Improved" Feats now don't seem to add to both
                                      >> attack and defense for the action..
                                      >
                                      > I forgot this. How are you getting this? For example:
                                      >
                                      > Improved Grapple (Combat)
                                      >
                                      > You are skilled at grappling opponents.
                                      >
                                      > Prerequisite: Dex 13, Improved Unarmed Strike.
                                      >
                                      > Benefit: You do not provoke an attack of opportunity when performing a grapple
                                      > combat maneuver. In addition, you receive a +2 bonus on checks made to grapple
                                      > a foe. You also receive a +2 bonus to your Combat Maneuver Defense whenever an
                                      > opponent tries to grapple you.

                                      Ah.. Went off the feat table in the PDF, not the full description.
                                      So the breakout is definitely still needed. If you kept those VARs
                                      the same, then all I need to do is change the CMB Defense main bit to
                                      CMD... :)

                                      I'll go on IRC when I get home (about 6 hours)

                                      Tir Gwaith
                                      PCGen LST Chimp
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