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Extraneous tags allowed?

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  • elves_are_mortal
    Hi. I am unfamiliar with XML, so please excuse me if this is a silly question. However, I was wondering if, in the switch to XML, we could have tags in the
    Message 1 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
      Hi.

      I am unfamiliar with XML, so please excuse me if this is a silly
      question. However, I was wondering if, in the switch to XML, we
      could have tags in the XML (lst) files that PCGen would not use.
      This is probably only an issue for cross-program usage.

      For instance, say I am creating a program that uses the spells XML
      files. The program I create needs to have a short description
      included in the files, in addition to the standard description tag
      (best I could think of off-hand). Could I add a <shortdesc> tag
      without affecting PCGen?

      I'm actually thinking of making (well, making as we speak. . . er,
      type) a program that would be compatible with PCGen files, so this
      is important to me.


      Thanks.
      /Mortal_Elf/
    • David Braun
      I just joined the group because I have a need for the e-tools xml schema, of which I can t find it published anywhere. I m writing a conversion tools from cg3
      Message 2 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
        I just joined the group because I have a need for the e-tools xml schema, of
        which I can't find it published anywhere. I'm writing a conversion tools
        from cg3 to xml.

        What it the status of the xml definition? Is there any where that I can help
        out in pcgen? I have alot of experiences with java and xml but I haven't
        looked at the code as of yet and I really didn't want to step on any ones
        toes.


        Later.
        David Braun.

        CogBots Inc
      • Brass Tilde
        ... of ... This group isn t directly related to e-tools, but, if you haven t already, you might want to try the Code Monkey Publishing site
        Message 3 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
          > I just joined the group because I have a need for the e-tools xml schema,
          of
          > which I can't find it published anywhere. I'm writing a conversion tools
          > from cg3 to xml.

          This group isn't directly related to e-tools, but, if you haven't already,
          you might want to try the Code Monkey Publishing site
          (www.codemonkeypublishing.com), and the message boards there, to see if it's
          available. CMP has contracted with WotC to provide some fixes for E-Tools,
          so if there is such a thing, they'll likely know if and where it's
          available.

          > What it the status of the xml definition? Is there any where that I can
          help
          > out in pcgen? I have alot of experiences with java and xml but I haven't
          > looked at the code as of yet and I really didn't want to step on any ones
          > toes.

          Keith will no doubt be along to take you up on that. If he doesn't, he's
          been rather busy with Real Life, I suggest you contact him directly. You
          should be able to glean his address from past messages. I suspect he'll
          take any help he can get.

          On another note, since you *are* familiar with Java and XML, do you have any
          favorite resources that you use? Are any of those suitable for beginners?
          Web sites, good books, etc? A few days ago, I posted a number of web links
          that I got from a search engine, but I haven't had a chance to actually look
          at more than a couple of them, so I don't really know how good they are.

          Thanks,
          Brass
        • Keith Davies
          ... The simplest answer is yes, you will be able to do this . PCGen will use only those elements and attributes[1] that it knows about and will ignore the
          Message 4 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
            On Fri, Mar 28, 2003 at 09:01:01AM +0000, elves_are_mortal wrote:
            > Hi.
            >
            > I am unfamiliar with XML, so please excuse me if this is a silly
            > question. However, I was wondering if, in the switch to XML, we
            > could have tags in the XML (lst) files that PCGen would not use.
            > This is probably only an issue for cross-program usage.
            >
            > For instance, say I am creating a program that uses the spells XML
            > files. The program I create needs to have a short description
            > included in the files, in addition to the standard description tag
            > (best I could think of off-hand). Could I add a <shortdesc> tag
            > without affecting PCGen?
            >
            > I'm actually thinking of making (well, making as we speak. . . er,
            > type) a program that would be compatible with PCGen files, so this
            > is important to me.

            The simplest answer is 'yes, you will be able to do this'. PCGen will
            use only those elements and attributes[1] that it knows about and will
            ignore the rest.

            [1] elements are the things that look like <this>, attributes are inside
            the element, <like this='y'>; elements may be empty (no children or
            text), but attributes must be assigned a value if they are present.
            Attributes may have default values specified by the schema
            description; if an attribute is not explicitly present in the data
            file, it will be treated as having the default value.

            The more complex answer depends on the parser and other tools used.
            Nonvalidating parsers just check that that syntax is conformant XML...
            elements are opened and closed correctly, attributes are correctly
            marked, and so on, without concern for the actual content of those
            things.

            A validating parser will stop processing if it finds something it was
            not told was valid in a particular place. To use your example, if you
            modify a PCGen file and add the element you mentioned above, and PCGen
            was using a validating parser, when it hit the <shortdesc> element it
            would stop and say 'umm... this isn't supposed to be here, your data
            file is in error'.

            Which is why we're planning to *not* use a validating parser and do the
            validation ourselves.

            Incidentally (and, if you're not familiar with XML, might not make much
            sense yet) if you're going to extend the schema, please put your
            elements and attributes into another namespace so they are easily
            identified. This will help avoid clashes in the future as we extend and
            maintain the software.


            Keith
            --
            Keith Davies
            keith.davies@...

            PCGen: <reaper/>, smartass
            "You just can't argue with a moron. It's like handling Nuclear
            waste. It's not good, it's not evil, but for Christ's sake, don't
            get any on you!!" -- Chuck, PCGen mailing list
          • Keith Davies
            ... To the best of my knowledge (pretty good), not yet. E-Tools is still using Access at this point. ... RL has been rough this week. I was sick for most of
            Message 5 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
              On Fri, Mar 28, 2003 at 08:31:22AM -0500, Brass Tilde wrote:
              > > I just joined the group because I have a need for the e-tools xml
              > > schema, of which I can't find it published anywhere. I'm writing a
              > > conversion tools from cg3 to xml.
              >
              > This group isn't directly related to e-tools, but, if you haven't
              > already, you might want to try the Code Monkey Publishing site
              > (www.codemonkeypublishing.com), and the message boards there, to see
              > if it's available. CMP has contracted with WotC to provide some fixes
              > for E-Tools, so if there is such a thing, they'll likely know if and
              > where it's available.

              To the best of my knowledge (pretty good), not yet. E-Tools is still
              using Access at this point.

              > > What it the status of the xml definition? Is there any where that I
              > > can help out in pcgen? I have alot of experiences with java and xml
              > > but I haven't looked at the code as of yet and I really didn't want
              > > to step on any ones toes.
              >
              > Keith will no doubt be along to take you up on that. If he doesn't,
              > he's been rather busy with Real Life, I suggest you contact him
              > directly. You should be able to glean his address from past messages.
              > I suspect he'll take any help he can get.

              RL has been rough this week. I was sick for most of a week (the week
              I'd taken off and planned to Get Things Done, dammit), and borked my
              computer the other day (it has since been defenstrated -- no more
              Windows for me!) and got it sorted out yesterday just in time to help a
              friend deal with an emotional crisis. She's better now, so I expe

              So, yes, I'd be happy to take this poor young monkey in hand. I've got
              places I can put him to good use.

              > On another note, since you *are* familiar with Java and XML, do you
              > have any favorite resources that you use? Are any of those suitable
              > for beginners? Web sites, good books, etc? A few days ago, I posted
              > a number of web links that I got from a search engine, but I haven't
              > had a chance to actually look at more than a couple of them, so I
              > don't really know how good they are.

              Good question to ask, thanks Brass.


              Keith
              --
              Keith Davies
              keith.davies@...

              PCGen: <reaper/>, smartass
              "You just can't argue with a moron. It's like handling Nuclear
              waste. It's not good, it's not evil, but for Christ's sake, don't
              get any on you!!" -- Chuck, PCGen mailing list
            • Brass Tilde
              ... That s true, which means that it may be possible to extract something from which a schema could be derived. I know that ADO has the capability of
              Message 6 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
                > > > because I have a need for the e-tools xml schema, of which I
                > >
                > > if it's available. CMP has contracted with WotC to provide some fixes
                > > for E-Tools, so if there is such a thing, they'll likely know if and
                > > where it's available.
                >
                > To the best of my knowledge (pretty good), not yet. E-Tools is still
                > using Access at this point.

                That's true, which means that it may be possible to extract something from
                which a schema could be derived. I know that ADO has the capability of
                extracting resultsets as XML rather than recordsets, and while this won't
                yield a schema directly, ADO *does* have methods for getting the information
                I suspect would be required for a schema, as XML.

                If you wish to descend to the Windows area, that is. <g/>

                > > On another note, since you *are* familiar with Java and XML, do you
                > > have any favorite resources that you use? Are any of those suitable
                >
                > Good question to ask, thanks Brass.

                Hey, I want 'em as badly as you do.

                Brass
              • David Braun
                Now, now, there is only one of me. The first step to understanding xml and java is understand the parsers. There are SAX and DOM parsers. Each of which have
                Message 7 of 7 , Mar 28, 2003
                  Now, now, there is only one of me.

                  The first step to understanding xml and java is understand the parsers. There
                  are SAX and DOM parsers. Each of which have different strenghts. When I
                  started with java and xml I used the sun site and apache.

                  SAX parsers take less time to implement but don't really allow random access
                  to a xml file, but are faster as loading. Validation is the issue with SAX,
                  there is a varity of answers to this one.

                  DOM parsers take longer to implement because you have the option of building a
                  collection of objects that parse the data. This is really good is you know
                  your document well and its not going to change alot. Basically because you
                  will have alot of time invested in developing the objects etc...

                  I have used tools like castor before to generate data objects from a schema,
                  its nothing like breeze etc but its a good first shot at it. Sun is also
                  defining an api along these lines.

                  Let me know if this helps.


                  On Friday 28 March 2003 01:31 pm, Brass Tilde wrote:
                  > > > > because I have a need for the e-tools xml schema, of which I
                  > > >
                  > > > if it's available. CMP has contracted with WotC to provide some fixes
                  > > > for E-Tools, so if there is such a thing, they'll likely know if and
                  > > > where it's available.
                  > >
                  > > To the best of my knowledge (pretty good), not yet. E-Tools is still
                  > > using Access at this point.
                  >
                  > That's true, which means that it may be possible to extract something from
                  > which a schema could be derived. I know that ADO has the capability of
                  > extracting resultsets as XML rather than recordsets, and while this won't
                  > yield a schema directly, ADO *does* have methods for getting the
                  > information I suspect would be required for a schema, as XML.
                  >
                  > If you wish to descend to the Windows area, that is. <g/>
                  >
                  > > > On another note, since you *are* familiar with Java and XML, do you
                  > > >
                  > > > have any favorite resources that you use? Are any of those suitable
                  > >
                  > > Good question to ask, thanks Brass.
                  >
                  > Hey, I want 'em as badly as you do.
                  >
                  > Brass
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
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