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Re: Questions on Seymour...

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  • Frank Northcutt
    We re pretty much in agreement. He deserves much more, he absolutely should be in camp, and he s treating the disagreement like a professional, quietly. One of
    Message 1 of 6 , Aug 1, 2005
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      We're pretty much in agreement. He deserves much more, he absolutely
      should be in camp, and he's treating the disagreement like a
      professional, quietly. One of the national sportswriters did a
      comparison of how Seymour is treating his hold-out vs. how TO is
      treating his. It was pretty funny, as you might imagine.

      Isn't one of the reasons someone in Seymour's position stays away is
      to avoid injury? That might completely destroy any bargaining position
      he may have. I'm not saying I agree with that position, but it may be
      part of his thinking.

      fdb

      --- In patriotzip@yahoogroups.com, "RandyZ. Pierce" <alaric02@s...>
      wrote:
      > I have found myself frequently in appreciation and/or agreement with
      your viewpoints but I vary a bit here. I do think Richard seems a bit
      more 'image' conscious than the typical Pats fan but contractually I
      think he faces a disparity similar to Brady's deal. He's slightly
      less pivotal to the team than Brady, IMO, but equally off the market
      value for his skills.
      >
      > Now if there is 'serious negotiation' in process, I think he belongs
      in camp supporting the team while they work out the details. I
      respect him for not waging the battle through the media and I support
      his option to sit out rather than play with the understanding he is
      forfeiting his paycheck (the fines essentially cover that as a team
      option). Teams can sever a contract at any point placing the player
      on the free agent market.Aplayer may take a similar approach by not
      playing and they forfeit the pay in varous means. It is a workable
      system with each having a recourse though neither is ideal.
      >
      > I place Richard Seymour as certainly top 5 and possibly (likely my
      opinion) top three in the DL world. I'd rather see him signed through
      2010 if it fits within the Pioli/BB money structure. If not, I've
      accepted their widom since Chad Eaton. The fact Jarvis is signed
      gives them some security to negotiate with Seymour. Fact is Bailey
      made more base money than Seymour last year and that's an unreasonable
      factoid to my performance evaluations.
      >
      > Hopefully this is the last week Richard isn't in camp.
      >
      > Go Pats!
      > Zip
      > www.patriotzip.com/ostend.html
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Frank Northcutt
      > To: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 7:57 AM
      > Subject: [patriotzip] Questions on Seymour...
      >
      >
      > I never considered the Tom Brady deal a precedent setting event. I
      > looked at it as the Pats dealing with players on a case-by-case
      > basis. TB was woefully underpaid, even though he had two years left.
      > I didn't think they would deviate from their position on such things,
      > except in such extrordinary circumstances.
      >
      > I didn't think that they would seriously negotiate with Seymour this
      > off season. If a quick and easy deal couldn't be done, they would
      > wait. Seymour would show up and play out the season. If they were
      > still far apart next off season, he would probably be traded.
      >
      > My opinion all changed upon hearing that serious negotiations were
      > indeed underway with Big Sey. I was also a bit surprised this
      > weekend, when Mike Vrabel received his extension, even though he had
      > THREE years left on his contract. Vrabel's a terrific player, and a
      > huge contributor, but it certainly wasn't the unique situation that
      > TB presented.
      >
      > Questions:
      > Have the Patriots altered their philosophy somewhat, to change with
      > the times; being more willing to negotiate earlier in a contract (and
      > if so, will this help or hurt the team, long term)?
      >
      > Could they be so far apart that we will not see Seymour at all this
      > year? I would think this unlikely, but who knows. He's a terrific
      > player, and by all accounts a great personality, but he does seem to
      > be hung up on the image thing a bit. I remember seeing him on one of
      > those pre-game shows, talking about his expensive suit and tie, and
      > his diamond cuff links, and how important it is to look good. You
      > don't hear that kind of stuff from TB.
      >
      > Everyone is concentrating on Seymour; what about Vinatieri, Givens,
      > and Harrison? I would think Adam definitely gets done. Do they let
      > Givens go to FA? Do they just let Rodney play out his current deal?
      >
      > Just thoughts for discussion...
      >
      > fdb
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > To unsubscribe from Zip's New England Patriots Fan Group, send an
      email to:
      > patriotzip-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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      >
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    • Don Diamant
      I m not so sure which actions are less professional, mouthing off, or not showing for training camp. T.O. showed up for training camp. Don _____ From:
      Message 2 of 6 , Aug 1, 2005
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        I’m not so sure which actions are less professional, mouthing off, or not showing for training camp…  T.O. showed up for training camp.

         

        Don

         


        From: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com [mailto: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Frank Northcutt
        Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 8:05 PM
        To: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [patriotzip] Re: Questions on Seymour ...

         

        We're pretty much in agreement. He deserves much more, he absolutely
        should be in camp, and he's treating the disagreement like a
        professional, quietly. One of the national sportswriters did a
        comparison of how Seymour is treating his hold-out vs. how TO is
        treating his. It was pretty funny, as you might imagine.

        Isn't one of the reasons someone in Seymour 's position stays away is
        to avoid injury? That might completely destroy any bargaining position
        he may have. I'm not saying I agree with that position, but it may be
        part of his thinking.

        fdb

        --- In patriotzip@yahoogroups.com , "RandyZ.  Pierce" <alaric02@s...>
        wrote:
        > I have found myself frequently in appreciation and/or agreement with
        your viewpoints but I vary a bit here.  I do think Richard seems a bit
        more 'image' conscious than the typical Pats fan but contractually I
        think he faces a disparity similar to Brady's deal.  He's slightly
        less pivotal to the team than Brady, IMO, but equally off the market
        value for his skills.
        >
        > Now if there is 'serious negotiation' in process, I think he belongs
        in camp supporting the team while they work out the details.  I
        respect him for not waging the battle through the media and I support
        his option to sit out rather than play with the understanding he  is
        forfeiting his paycheck (the fines essentially cover that as a team
        option).  Teams can sever a contract at any point placing the player
        on the free agent market.Aplayer may take a similar approach by not
        playing and they forfeit the pay in varous means.  It is a workable
        system with each having a recourse though neither is ideal.
        >
        > I place Richard Seymour as certainly top 5 and possibly (likely my
        opinion) top three in the DL world.  I'd rather see him signed through
        2010 if it fits within the Pioli/BB money structure.  If not, I've
        accepted their widom since Chad Eaton.  The fact Jarvis is signed
        gives them some security to negotiate with Seymour .  Fact is Bailey
        made more base money than Seymour last year and that's an unreasonable
        factoid to my performance evaluations.
        >
        > Hopefully this is the last week Richard isn't in camp.
        >
        > Go Pats!
        > Zip
        > www.patriotzip.com/ostend.html
        >
        >   ----- Original Message -----
        >   From: Frank Northcutt
        >   To: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com
        >   Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 7:57 AM
        >   Subject: [patriotzip] Questions on Seymour ...
        >
        >
        >   I never considered the Tom Brady deal a precedent setting event. I
        >   looked at it as the Pats dealing with players on a case-by-case
        >   basis. TB was woefully underpaid, even though he had two years left.
        >   I didn't think they would deviate from their position on such things,
        >   except in such extrordinary circumstances.
        >
        >   I didn't think that they would seriously negotiate with Seymour this
        >   off season. If a quick and easy deal couldn't be done, they would
        >   wait. Seymour would show up and play out the season. If they were
        >   still far apart next off season, he would probably be traded.
        >
        >   My opinion all changed upon hearing that serious negotiations were
        >   indeed underway with Big Sey. I was also a bit surprised this
        >   weekend, when Mike Vrabel received his extension, even though he had
        >   THREE years left on his contract. Vrabel's a terrific player, and a
        >   huge contributor, but it certainly wasn't the unique situation that
        >   TB presented.
        >
        >   Questions:
        >   Have the Patriots altered their philosophy somewhat, to change with
        >   the times; being more willing to negotiate earlier in a contract (and
        >   if so, will this help or hurt the team, long term)?
        >
        >   Could they be so far apart that we will not see Seymour at all this
        >   year? I would think this unlikely, but who knows. He's a terrific
        >   player, and by all accounts a great personality, but he does seem to
        >   be hung up on the image thing a bit. I remember seeing him on one of
        >   those pre-game shows, talking about his expensive suit and tie, and
        >   his diamond cuff links, and how important it is to look good. You
        >   don't hear that kind of stuff from TB.
        >
        >   Everyone is concentrating on Seymour ; what about Vinatieri, Givens,
        >   and Harrison ? I would think Adam definitely gets done. Do they let
        >   Givens go to FA? Do they just let Rodney play out his current deal?
        >
        >   Just thoughts for discussion...
        >
        >   fdb
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >   To unsubscribe from Zip's New England Patriots Fan Group, send an
        email to:
        >   patriotzip-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >   SPONSORED LINKS New england patriots  New england patriot football
        team  New england patriot football 
        >         New england patriot football ticket  New england patriot
        memorabilia  New england patriots tickets 
        >
        >
        >
        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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        >      
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      • Frank Northcutt
        Valid point. fdb ... or not ... left. ... things, ... this ... had ... (and ... seem to ... one of ...
        Message 3 of 6 , Aug 1, 2005
        • 0 Attachment
          Valid point.

          fdb

          --- In patriotzip@yahoogroups.com, "Don Diamant" <jeepndd@v...> wrote:
          > I'm not so sure which actions are less professional, mouthing off,
          or not
          > showing for training camp. T.O. showed up for training camp.
          >
          >
          >
          > Don
          >
          >
          >
          > _____
          >
          > From: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com [mailto:patriotzip@yahoogroups.com] On
          > Behalf Of Frank Northcutt
          > Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 8:05 PM
          > To: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [patriotzip] Re: Questions on Seymour...
          >
          >
          >
          > We're pretty much in agreement. He deserves much more, he absolutely
          > should be in camp, and he's treating the disagreement like a
          > professional, quietly. One of the national sportswriters did a
          > comparison of how Seymour is treating his hold-out vs. how TO is
          > treating his. It was pretty funny, as you might imagine.
          >
          > Isn't one of the reasons someone in Seymour's position stays away is
          > to avoid injury? That might completely destroy any bargaining position
          > he may have. I'm not saying I agree with that position, but it may be
          > part of his thinking.
          >
          > fdb
          >
          > --- In patriotzip@yahoogroups.com, "RandyZ. Pierce" <alaric02@s...>
          > wrote:
          > > I have found myself frequently in appreciation and/or agreement with
          > your viewpoints but I vary a bit here. I do think Richard seems a bit
          > more 'image' conscious than the typical Pats fan but contractually I
          > think he faces a disparity similar to Brady's deal. He's slightly
          > less pivotal to the team than Brady, IMO, but equally off the market
          > value for his skills.
          > >
          > > Now if there is 'serious negotiation' in process, I think he belongs
          > in camp supporting the team while they work out the details. I
          > respect him for not waging the battle through the media and I support
          > his option to sit out rather than play with the understanding he is
          > forfeiting his paycheck (the fines essentially cover that as a team
          > option). Teams can sever a contract at any point placing the player
          > on the free agent market.Aplayer may take a similar approach by not
          > playing and they forfeit the pay in varous means. It is a workable
          > system with each having a recourse though neither is ideal.
          > >
          > > I place Richard Seymour as certainly top 5 and possibly (likely my
          > opinion) top three in the DL world. I'd rather see him signed through
          > 2010 if it fits within the Pioli/BB money structure. If not, I've
          > accepted their widom since Chad Eaton. The fact Jarvis is signed
          > gives them some security to negotiate with Seymour. Fact is Bailey
          > made more base money than Seymour last year and that's an unreasonable
          > factoid to my performance evaluations.
          > >
          > > Hopefully this is the last week Richard isn't in camp.
          > >
          > > Go Pats!
          > > Zip
          > > www.patriotzip.com/ostend.html
          > >
          > > ----- Original Message -----
          > > From: Frank Northcutt
          > > To: patriotzip@yahoogroups.com
          > > Sent: Monday, August 01, 2005 7:57 AM
          > > Subject: [patriotzip] Questions on Seymour...
          > >
          > >
          > > I never considered the Tom Brady deal a precedent setting event. I
          > > looked at it as the Pats dealing with players on a case-by-case
          > > basis. TB was woefully underpaid, even though he had two years
          left.
          > > I didn't think they would deviate from their position on such
          things,
          > > except in such extrordinary circumstances.
          > >
          > > I didn't think that they would seriously negotiate with Seymour
          this
          > > off season. If a quick and easy deal couldn't be done, they would
          > > wait. Seymour would show up and play out the season. If they were
          > > still far apart next off season, he would probably be traded.
          > >
          > > My opinion all changed upon hearing that serious negotiations were
          > > indeed underway with Big Sey. I was also a bit surprised this
          > > weekend, when Mike Vrabel received his extension, even though he
          had
          > > THREE years left on his contract. Vrabel's a terrific player, and a
          > > huge contributor, but it certainly wasn't the unique situation that
          > > TB presented.
          > >
          > > Questions:
          > > Have the Patriots altered their philosophy somewhat, to change with
          > > the times; being more willing to negotiate earlier in a contract
          (and
          > > if so, will this help or hurt the team, long term)?
          > >
          > > Could they be so far apart that we will not see Seymour at all this
          > > year? I would think this unlikely, but who knows. He's a terrific
          > > player, and by all accounts a great personality, but he does
          seem to
          > > be hung up on the image thing a bit. I remember seeing him on
          one of
          > > those pre-game shows, talking about his expensive suit and tie, and
          > > his diamond cuff links, and how important it is to look good. You
          > > don't hear that kind of stuff from TB.
          > >
          > > Everyone is concentrating on Seymour; what about Vinatieri, Givens,
          > > and Harrison? I would think Adam definitely gets done. Do they let
          > > Givens go to FA? Do they just let Rodney play out his current deal?
          > >
          > > Just thoughts for discussion...
          > >
          > > fdb
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > To unsubscribe from Zip's New England Patriots Fan Group, send an
          > email to:
          > > patriotzip-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > SPONSORED LINKS New england patriots New england patriot football
          > team New england patriot football
          > > New england patriot football ticket New england patriot
          > memorabilia New england patriots tickets
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
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