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Re: Surgery in July and questions

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  • rakushka
    Wow, I did not realize blood donation before the surgery is not free! Is that the case all the time? I m also O positive, so blood will be hard to find if I
    Message 1 of 12 , May 1, 2004
      Wow, I did not realize blood donation before the surgery is not
      free! Is that the case all the time? I'm also O positive, so blood
      will be hard to find if I ever need it.

      >
      > I don't know if it's possible in your area, but I checked with my
      surgeon and
      > I was given permission to ask for relatives and siblings to donate
      blood,
      > if needed. That saves the cost of having to store the blood, and I
      have
      > confidence in my sister and brothers. Of course, they still perform
      a series
      > of test, just in case. But it's reassuring to know where the blood
      comes from.
      > Also, being of the O+ blood type, my options are limited lot!
      >
      > Check to see if someone in your family could donate blood, and if
      they know
      > for sure their blood type (and yours, at the same time), and ask
      the hospital
      > if they'll allow you to get blood from one of them. However, that
      could mean
      > one of them spending the day with you, or being close to the
      hospital. My
      > sister will be waiting outside the operating room, just in case.
      >
      > Ray
    • ceast36532
      Just wondering... Are those U.S. dollars? My impression was that it s about $40 a pint for autologous donations here, but that may be outdated info. Some folks
      Message 2 of 12 , May 1, 2004
        Just wondering... Are those U.S. dollars? My impression was that it's
        about $40 a pint for autologous donations here, but that may be
        outdated info.

        Some folks think that giving so much blood shortly before surgery can
        trigger a need for transfusions. If my surgeon had told me to do it,
        I would have done it. (I know of one person having surgery for
        something totally unrelated who was instructed to do two autologous
        donations. The surgeon withdrew, and second surgeon who actually did
        the surgery saw no need for donations.)

        That does seem like a heckuva lot of bucks, but hey -- not if you
        wind up needing it!

        Cammie

        --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, "Ray"
        <carbone@v...> wrote:
        > Hello Sindy,
        >
        > > (c) About the blood transfusion concerns: The blood bank mentioned
        > > that I will have to give 4times of blood with less quantity
        (normal is two times)
        > > because my weight is less than 100lbs. And it will cost me $400
        per time
        > > ($1600 as a whole)!! In a way I don't really feel secured to have
        blood from
        > > other people directly in the blood bank in case I need blood
        transfusion after
        > > surgery. My surgeon says that there is a chance of 5% who would
        need blood
        > > transfusion. I'm wondering if anybody out there got this problem
        as mine.
        > > I mean I'm concerned about 4 consecutive weeks of blood donations
        right
        > > before I have surgery. And of course, $$ would be also a concern.
        >
        > I don't know if it's possible in your area, but I checked with my
        surgeon and
        > I was given permission to ask for relatives and siblings to donate
        blood,
        > if needed. That saves the cost of having to store the blood, and I
        have
        > confidence in my sister and brothers. Of course, they still perform
        a series
        > of test, just in case. But it's reassuring to know where the blood
        comes from.
        > Also, being of the O+ blood type, my options are limited lot!
        >
        > Check to see if someone in your family could donate blood, and if
        they know
        > for sure their blood type (and yours, at the same time), and ask
        the hospital
        > if they'll allow you to get blood from one of them. However, that
        could mean
        > one of them spending the day with you, or being close to the
        hospital. My
        > sister will be waiting outside the operating room, just in case.
        >
        > Ray
      • ceast36532
        I am by no means a specialist in such things, but I believe there are usually some alternatives, if whole blood of your type is in short supply. Like packed
        Message 3 of 12 , May 1, 2004
          I am by no means a specialist in such things, but I believe there are
          usually some alternatives, if whole blood of your type is in short
          supply. Like packed red cells, or plasma, or even saline to pump up
          the volume of your body fluids.

          But no, I think autologous donations are not free. I do not, for the
          life of me, understand why our blood banks don't take the blood, put
          it through the usual tests, hold it for the donor and then, if it is
          not needed, make it available to others who do need it.

          Perhaps there is a professional in the field out there who can
          enlighten me. I worked with the Red Cross for years, particularly in
          their blood drives (as I have had two family members who have needed
          and benefitted from transfusions) and have given several gallons
          myself, so I am in support of the program. But this part of it, I
          don't comprehend, given the heart-rending pleas they send out
          continuously for more donors.

          Cammie

          --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, "rakushka"
          <rakushka@y...> wrote:
          > Wow, I did not realize blood donation before the surgery is not
          > free! Is that the case all the time? I'm also O positive, so
          blood
          > will be hard to find if I ever need it.
          >
        • rakushka
          I hear ya... I m a regular blood donor, and it makes me feel a little resentful to know that Red Cross has no problem actually calling me at home and asking me
          Message 4 of 12 , May 1, 2004
            I hear ya...
            I'm a regular blood donor, and it makes me feel a little resentful
            to know that Red Cross has no problem actually calling me at home
            and asking me to donate for other people, but makes me pay if I'm
            the one who might end up using the blood. Doesn't make much sense,
            does it?

            --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, ceast36532
            <no_reply@y...> wrote:
            > I am by no means a specialist in such things, but I believe there
            are
            > usually some alternatives, if whole blood of your type is in short
            > supply. Like packed red cells, or plasma, or even saline to pump
            up
            > the volume of your body fluids.
            >
            > But no, I think autologous donations are not free. I do not, for
            the
            > life of me, understand why our blood banks don't take the blood,
            put
            > it through the usual tests, hold it for the donor and then, if it
            is
            > not needed, make it available to others who do need it.
            >
            > Perhaps there is a professional in the field out there who can
            > enlighten me. I worked with the Red Cross for years, particularly
            in
            > their blood drives (as I have had two family members who have
            needed
            > and benefitted from transfusions) and have given several gallons
            > myself, so I am in support of the program. But this part of it, I
            > don't comprehend, given the heart-rending pleas they send out
            > continuously for more donors.
            >
            > Cammie
          • fiddlesticks220002
            My friend works for the Canadian Blood Service, so I have asked this of her before. Autologous blood is not subjected to the same testing (if it s tested at
            Message 5 of 12 , May 1, 2004
              My friend works for the Canadian Blood Service, so I have asked this
              of her before.

              Autologous blood is not subjected to the same testing (if it's
              tested at all) that they do for regular donated blood. I think the
              concept is that if you have some disease like HIV, there's no
              problem giving it back to you. So it's a decision right at the front
              end of the process - collect it, store it, toss it out if it's not
              used by the donor.

              From a business perspective (and hospitals have to think about costs
              too), you want your own blood instead of someone else's? Why doesn't
              it make sense that you pay some of that cost? (hey, sorry if I
              offend anyone, that's the beancounter in me coming out)

              As for subsequent testing, I don't know. Maybe expiry issues, maybe
              they don't want it coming through the collection process from the
              back door of surgery, I don't know. Good question, I'll ask my
              friend next time I talk to her.

              Susan

              --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, ceast36532
              <no_reply@y...> wrote:
              > I am by no means a specialist in such things, but I believe there
              are
              > usually some alternatives, if whole blood of your type is in short
              > supply. Like packed red cells, or plasma, or even saline to pump
              up
              > the volume of your body fluids.
              >
              > But no, I think autologous donations are not free. I do not, for
              the
              > life of me, understand why our blood banks don't take the blood,
              put
              > it through the usual tests, hold it for the donor and then, if it
              is
              > not needed, make it available to others who do need it.
              >
              > Perhaps there is a professional in the field out there who can
              > enlighten me. I worked with the Red Cross for years, particularly
              in
              > their blood drives (as I have had two family members who have
              needed
              > and benefitted from transfusions) and have given several gallons
              > myself, so I am in support of the program. But this part of it, I
              > don't comprehend, given the heart-rending pleas they send out
              > continuously for more donors.
              >
              > Cammie
              >
              > --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, "rakushka"
              > <rakushka@y...> wrote:
              > > Wow, I did not realize blood donation before the surgery is not
              > > free! Is that the case all the time? I'm also O positive, so
              > blood
              > > will be hard to find if I ever need it.
              > >
            • lexicology2000
              If you re only buying it for these few weeks and won t use it otherwise,
              Message 6 of 12 , May 2, 2004
                <<a) Any suggestion of brand/model of a good and reliable blender &
                food processor? >>

                If you're only buying it for these few weeks and won't use it
                otherwise, brand names aren't so important. When I bought my food
                processor (and I really do cook) I shopped around and found that
                Bed, Bath and Beyond was the cheapest place to buy the same models
                that were more expensive at all the other stores, even a factory
                outlet.

                More than my blender, I use an immersion blender. It's a long stick
                with a blade on the end that goes down into a glass and blends one
                drink at a time. I bought two bar mixers to go with it. (Tall,
                stainless steel cups like you'd mix a milkshake in if you had that
                kind of blender, or like you see guys in bars shaking their drinks
                in, only I didn't buy lids.) Mine was $10 and worth every penny.

                <<(b) My surgeon also says that I would need something like drainer
                so as to easily get the liquid. Any suggestion on this? >>

                I think you mean a strainer. It's a mesh 'cup' that fits over a
                glass or bowl. Any place that sells kithen stuff would have a
                variety of sizes.

                <<(c) About the blood transfusion concerns: >>

                My doc told me NOT to donate blood because it takes the healthy,
                young blood cells from your body just when you need them to heal,
                and then makes your body produce more young cells at the same time
                that it's trying to heal from the surgery. Since the need for
                transfusions is so low (he's never actually had anyone who needed
                one) he says it's not worth it. But every doc is different, and you
                might not have the option of disagreeing with yours. Are you in the
                States? I wasn't aware that our blood supply was so chancy.


                <<(d) Is there anything else I can get prepared or buy to wait for
                the day to come so that I will get my life easier after surgery? >>

                Things I wish I had done:
                Gotten my hair cut so it didn't get all tangled up in the hospital.
                At least braided it or something.
                Learned to use a water pik BEFORE I had to deal with not squirting
                my incision site.

                Things I glad I did do:
                Find a good vitamin, eat right, and get very healthy BEFORE surgery.
                Make broth and freeze it in ice cube trays so that I could thin any
                amount of food easily.
                Borrow a lazy boy to sleep in. My aunt gave me a wedge, too - that
                worked as a graduation from the chair to the bed.
                Set up someone else to field phone calls, meals, and visits. I told
                everyone not to call me, but call my parents for the first week.
                They gave progress reports, made sure people only visited when I was
                up to having visitors, cooked meals, and did my dishes and laundry.
                I never had to answer the phone the first week.

                <<e) Any suggestions on food products for liquid diet?>>

                I've stated my suggestion before, but I'll say it again - Boost and
                Ensure are no more than sugar, oil, flavorings, and vitamins. Get a
                good powdered vitamin and mix it into any healthy beverage you want,
                and you'll have a healthier drink that tastes better. Otherwise,
                broth will thin out just about anything and keep the flavor nice.

                <<f) After surgery, is there anything to put on so as to fix the
                head during sleeping? >>

                Sleep sitting up in a recliner with pillows on both sides of you to
                hold you up. I liked having a towel folded behind the small of my
                back and behind my neck, and a pillow under my knees. It didn't
                make sleep comfortable, but it did keep me from sliding around. At
                two weeks my doc said I could sleep in bed, on my side or my stomach
                if I wanted, as long as I didn't put my arm under my head. I put a
                kleenex under my face to catch the drool. Depending on how much you
                drool, a towel might be better.

                Kris
              • ceast36532
                Ask em about it. I think the autologous donations may be expensive because it s a lot of trouble (and probably time of expensive people) to keep your units
                Message 7 of 12 , May 3, 2004
                  Ask 'em about it.

                  I think the autologous donations may be expensive because it's a lot
                  of trouble (and probably time of expensive people) to keep your units
                  separate from the rest of the blood supply. But I don't know that.

                  It used to be the case that you could store up donated units, and
                  specify them to cover the "cost" of blood other people used, or
                  indeed, use them to cover your own needs. I don't know whether that's
                  still the case, but doubt that it is, as the whole system seems to
                  have changed. I do know that the needs are much greater now, in part
                  because newer medical techniques use a lot more blood -- open heart
                  surgery, for example -- but they can split a unit into components and
                  use one unit to help several people.

                  My last go at working with the program was in the 1960s, so it's
                  reasonable that things have changed. (I'd hope so!)

                  And no, overall, it does make sense that they call when they need
                  you. The intention is to provide for everybody's needs. If everybody
                  gave regularly (or those who can do so, did, anyhow) there probably
                  would not be a shortage. But if you're doing it just for yourself and
                  it can't be used by anyone else, then you pays your $$$.

                  Cammie

                  --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, "rakushka"
                  <rakushka@y...> wrote:
                  > I hear ya...
                  > I'm a regular blood donor, and it makes me feel a little resentful
                  > to know that Red Cross has no problem actually calling me at home
                  > and asking me to donate for other people, but makes me pay if I'm
                  > the one who might end up using the blood. Doesn't make much sense,
                  > does it?
                  >
                  > --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, ceast36532
                  > <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                  > > I am by no means a specialist in such things, but I believe there
                  > are
                  > > usually some alternatives, if whole blood of your type is in
                  short
                  > > supply. Like packed red cells, or plasma, or even saline to pump
                  > up
                  > > the volume of your body fluids.
                  > >
                  > > But no, I think autologous donations are not free. I do not, for
                  > the
                  > > life of me, understand why our blood banks don't take the blood,
                  > put
                  > > it through the usual tests, hold it for the donor and then, if it
                  > is
                  > > not needed, make it available to others who do need it.
                  > >
                  > > Perhaps there is a professional in the field out there who can
                  > > enlighten me. I worked with the Red Cross for years, particularly
                  > in
                  > > their blood drives (as I have had two family members who have
                  > needed
                  > > and benefitted from transfusions) and have given several gallons
                  > > myself, so I am in support of the program. But this part of it, I
                  > > don't comprehend, given the heart-rending pleas they send out
                  > > continuously for more donors.
                  > >
                  > > Cammie
                • ceast36532
                  I think those are all excellent ideas, but I do have one quibble, Kris, and it s not a new one. You say, Boost and Ensure are no more than sugar, oil,
                  Message 8 of 12 , May 3, 2004
                    I think those are all excellent ideas, but I do have one quibble,
                    Kris, and it's not a new one.

                    You say, "Boost and
                    Ensure are no more than sugar, oil, flavorings, and vitamins."

                    Nope, not exactly so. They have sufficient PROTEIN, which is what you
                    need to keep healing. Not that I'm a dietitian, but our resident one,
                    Cheryl, has fought this battle before.

                    Around here, the radiation oncologists recommend both Boost and
                    Ensure to their healing patients who cannot eat, and I can think of
                    no circumstance in which good nutrition would be needed to support
                    the healing process.

                    If you find something else that works better for you -- by all means,
                    go for it. But what you need mainly are the PROTEINS. Vitamins, too,
                    of course. But mainly the PROTEINS.

                    Cheryl, if I have it wrong, I will stand corrected. But I don't think
                    I do.

                    Cammie
                  • Ray
                    ... Cammie, I would agree with you on Ensure / Boost / Enrich (whatever it s called elsewhere). My uncle had a throat cancer and was ship home, from the
                    Message 9 of 12 , May 3, 2004
                      > Cheryl, if I have it wrong, I will stand corrected. But I don't think
                      > I do.
                      >
                      > Cammie

                      Cammie, I would agree with you on Ensure / Boost / Enrich (whatever
                      it's called elsewhere). My uncle had a throat cancer and was ship
                      home, from the hospital, with a box full of Ensure (24 or 48 I think
                      it was). My mother in law was routinely fed with with Ensure when
                      she had a problem in the digestive tube, right at the hospital.
                      If the hospitals are giving them, I think it's pretty safe to say they're
                      good the body :-)

                      Ray
                    • lexicology2000
                      I definitely agree about the proteins. My vitamin suppliment has many amino acids (building blocks of proteins), and I guess I just included that in my
                      Message 10 of 12 , May 3, 2004
                        I definitely agree about the proteins. My vitamin suppliment has
                        many amino acids (building blocks of proteins), and I guess I just
                        included that in my recommendation of a 'good vitamin suppliment'.
                        You can also buy straight protein powder and put that into any
                        liquid you'd like.

                        I'm not trying to start (or continue) a fight about the Boost and
                        Ensure. Everyone has their own opinion, and that's fine. My
                        opinion has been stated before and I'm not going to flog it - but
                        I'm not going to hide it, either, just because I'm the only one who
                        thinks sugar and canola oil aren't good for you and work against the
                        healing process. The suggestion to drink Boost and Ensure (whether
                        you like them or not) is very often repeated, and I hope that
                        putting forth my contrasting opinion once in every great while isn't
                        too much. We all know from experience that new people do not read
                        back posts. : )

                        <<I can think of no circumstance in which good nutrition would be
                        needed to support the healing process.>>

                        I'm sorry, I don't get this. Good nutrition doesn't help you heal?

                        Again, I'm not trying to be argumentative. Let me keep my opinion
                        and I'll try not to drag it onto this site very often. And next
                        time I'll try to remember to mention the proteins along with the
                        vitamins.

                        Kris

                        --- In orthognathicsurgerysupport@yahoogroups.com, ceast36532
                        <no_reply@y...> wrote:
                        > I think those are all excellent ideas, but I do have one quibble,
                        > Kris, and it's not a new one.
                        >
                        > You say, "Boost and
                        > Ensure are no more than sugar, oil, flavorings, and vitamins."
                        >
                        > Nope, not exactly so. They have sufficient PROTEIN, which is what
                        you
                        > need to keep healing. Not that I'm a dietitian, but our resident
                        one,
                        > Cheryl, has fought this battle before.
                        >
                        > Around here, the radiation oncologists recommend both Boost and
                        > Ensure to their healing patients who cannot eat, and I can think
                        of
                        > no circumstance in which good nutrition would be needed to support
                        > the healing process.
                        >
                        > If you find something else that works better for you -- by all
                        means,
                        > go for it. But what you need mainly are the PROTEINS. Vitamins,
                        too,
                        > of course. But mainly the PROTEINS.
                        >
                        > Cheryl, if I have it wrong, I will stand corrected. But I don't
                        think
                        > I do.
                        >
                        > Cammie
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