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Re: Holy and worldly mathematics

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  • vkozyreff
    Dear Mr. Artzimovich, Thank you for your message. I could have found that indeed, Mr. Kazantsev is a real person, not a pseudonym. I have been misled, and I
    Message 1 of 51 , Dec 2, 2003
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      Dear Mr. Artzimovich,

      Thank you for your message. I could have found that indeed, Mr.
      Kazantsev is a real person, not a pseudonym. I have been misled, and
      I have disseminated incorrect information. I did it in good faith,
      but I accept full responsibility for this involuntary mistake and beg
      your and the List's pardon.

      I took more information, and I am now able to give a more exact
      account of the reality: (if you were familiar with both), you know
      that Vl Seraphim was in close contact with Mr. Kazantsev. The latter
      is a brilliant journalist, but not a specialist in Church matters at
      all. We know that he was in perfect agreement with Vl Seraphim about
      the policy being followed by the ROCOR with the MP.

      One may consider that Mr. Kazantsev's article is in fact a faithful
      reproduction of Vl Seraphim's thought, based on documentation and
      ideas provided by Vl. Seraphim, maybe even "authored" by him, as one
      says that Vl Philaret's sorrowful epistles were "authored" by Vl A.
      Grabbe. This does not take anything away from Mr. Kazantsev's paper,
      on the contrary. Nevertheless, this is not, strictly and technically
      speaking, an article written by Vl Seraphim under a pseudonym, as I
      mistakenly reported it.

      Vl Seraphim has sent, at about the same moment that the article was
      published, a letter of about the same content as the article's to Vl
      Lavr. It would be most interesting to see whether the ROCOR will
      publish it, but I fear she will not.

      Vl Seraphim wrote many papers under pseudonyms in "Nasha Strana",
      sometimes writing about himself in the third person, under titles
      like "They write to us from Lyon or Grenoble". His collaborators
      regretted this and tried to convince him to sign under his own name,
      but unsuccessfully. As seen again in this case, his authority, even
      in retirement would have been much greater under his own name.

      Below are a few references, which I should have found in due time.

      http://www.riuo.org/press/press.html
      http://www.nashastrana.narod.ru/
      http://www.nashastrana.narod.ru/2739.htm

      In God,

      Vladimir Kozyreff

      --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, "Victor Artzimovitch"
      <vartzimovitch@v...> wrote:
      > Dear Mr.Kozyreff,
      >
      > if you are referring to the article published in the russian
      newspaper
      > "Nasha Strana" in Buenos Aires (Argentina) under the signature of
      Nikolay
      > Kazantsev, please be informed that Mr.Kazantsev is the editor of
      this
      > publication.
      > Having very well known Vl. Seraphim and Mr. Kazantsev (during my
      long stay
      > in Argentina), I would be very interested to know from where do you
      have the
      > information about :
      > (Quote)He nevertheless published his
      > solemn appeal under the pseudonym of Kazantsev a few days before his
      > death. I reported this.(unquote)
      >
      > Thanks for letting the List know.
      > V.Artzimovitch
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: "vkozyreff" <vladimir.kozyreff@s...>
      > To: <orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com>
      > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 10:07 AM
      > Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Holy and worldly mathematics
      >
      >
      > Dear Father Daniel, bless.
      >
      > After I quoted « Nikolay Kazantsev's » letter in which he warned
      that
      > many parishes might leave, George ironically suggested that I
      entitle
      > the subject "why only 144 will be saved". This was ridiculing
      Nicolay
      > Kazantsev.
      >
      > After his retirement, as far as I know, Vl Seraphim was very silent
      > and declined to make any declaration. He nevertheless published his
      > solemn appeal under the pseudonym of Kazantsev a few days before his
      > death. I reported this. Is this "adding to a long list
      > of "authorities" used for people's advantage"? Whose advantage do
      you
      > have in mind? His? Mine? Did you read the last sentence of the
      > letter, in which he requests the orthodox to speak out?
      >
      > I do not equate myself to the Saviour (I took the precaution to
      > mention this explicitly). However (and again), "Meekness and
      > humility...should not yield before manifest evil." (Vl Averky).
      >
      > Instead of a reply to the content of the letter, we have seen only
      > mockery about numbers and "ad hominem remarks", which suggests that
      > the letter is really good.
      >
      > Is the ROCOR hierarchy well informed about whom, even among the
      > clergy, does support its MP policy?
      >
      > In God,
      >
      > Vladimir Kozyreff
      >
      >
      > --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, "orthodoxchurch_sg"
      > <orthodoxchurch_sg@y...> wrote:
      > > --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, "vkozyreff"
      > > <vladimir.kozyreff@s...> wrote:
      > > > Dear in Christ Father Daniel and George,
      > > >
      > > > Is the Truth on the side of those who ridicule, or on the side
      of
      > > > those who are ridiculed?
      > > >
      > > > "Then Herod and his soldiers ridiculed and mocked him". (Luke
      > 23:10-
      > > > 12)
      > > >
      > > > Please remember that you are not ridiculing me, but Archbishop
      > > > Seraphim of blessed memory. Remember also that the number of
      > > parishes
      > > > was among Vl Mark's concerns as well.
      > >
      > > Evlogeite!
      > > So - you put yourself on the level of our Saviour? Interesting. He
      > > was mocked unjustly - this in no way shows that some ideas do not
      > > deserve ridicule.
      > > Please indicate anywhere I ridiculed Archbishop Seraphim ~ this is
      > an
      > > unjust accusation.
      > > Sadly it looks like Archbishop Seraphim will be added to a long
      > list
      > > of "authorities" used for people's advantage. For years he is not
      > > mentioned or quoted - the moment he dies (and is conveniently
      > unable
      > > to confirm or deny) he is being quoted left right and centre and
      > > saying this and that to support causes and positions.
      > > God bless / Fr Daniel
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Archives located at http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod
      >
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
      http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    • vkozyreff
      Dear Mr. Boitchenko, The most important think for a captain is the safety of the ship and crew. Captains can take whatever advice they want, but they should
      Message 51 of 51 , Dec 8, 2003
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        Dear Mr. Boitchenko,

        The most important think for a captain is the safety of the ship and
        crew. Captains can take whatever advice they want, but they should
        take first the advice of their experienced and respected teachers and
        colleagues before they embark for dangerous crossings by new routes
        to new destinations.

        They should also refer to the classical teaching that they followed
        when they were trained. Examples of authoritative messages of caution
        to innovative captains have been numerous on this forum recently (See
        messages 9613, 9695, 9693, etc.etc).

        The fact that those messages of caution are systematically denied,
        ignored or deleted by the shipping company is worrying and seems to
        sign a change in the latter's policy. The management's denial sounds
        like a confirmation. A significant part of the fleet seems to have
        been lost and more losses are predicted.

        In God,

        Vladimir Kozyreff




        --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, "V. Boitchenko"
        <venceslav@s...> wrote:
        > Should captains take advice from "concerned passengers" as well?
        >
        >
        > >>As a rule, captains do take the weather warnings into account,
        > because their duty is to protect the ship and the crew at any cost
        > and because they know that they get severely condemned in case of
        > avoidable accident. At sea, captains have an obligation of results,
        > and they get condemned even if they took only one precaution when
        > they might have taken two of them. I guess you would not be
        > reassured, if you were on a ship commanded by a reckless captain,
        > with your brothers, sisters and all those who are dear to you.
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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