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Re: Fwd: Re: [orthodox-synod] MP Hierarchs

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  • Valentina Grigorieva
    ... the MP was elected after the fall of communism, and a number of those who had been compromised before, have been removed. UNQUOTE ...
    Message 1 of 3 , Feb 25, 2003
      > Valentina Grigorieva wrote:
      > > Dear list members,
      > > 2 months have passed now since Fr. John Shaw wrote
      > > following important words, so full of
      consequences:
      > > QUOTE" More than half of the current hierarchy of
      the MP was elected after the fall of communism, and a
      number of those who had been "compromised" before,
      have been removed." UNQUOTE
      --- "Fr. John R. Shaw" <vrevjrs@...> wrote
      ………………………
      > JRS: First of all, I do *not* recall receiving your
      > message.
      See my messages 7075 and 7092.

      > The Moscow Patriarchate publishes an annual
      > calendar, with photos and
      > ordination data on all of its bishops.
      > *Anyone* can look at this calendar, and compare it
      > with the last one before the fall of communism, or
      before the
      > beginning of perestroika, or with last year's, to
      see who was a bishop then,
      > who has died or been removed, and who was ordained
      since that time.
      > The number of bishops alone has more than doubled
      > since before the fall of communism, which should be
      enough evidence that
      > new bishops have been consecrated.
      Dear Father, I am quite intrigued by your facility to
      deal with MP. I personally never saw any MP Calendar
      in France (except in MP churches ?), even at the Paris
      « Rue Daru » Cathedral (Constantinople Jurisdiction) !
      May we deduct from your post that you receive it since
      the 90ies (15 years) and could check every year the
      new bishops elected and the ones being removed as you
      said?

      > But why you are asking me this, I simply am at a
      > loss to imagine! Do
      > you disbelieve what I said? If so, go take a look
      > for yourself. The information is in the public
      domain.
      Dear Father, I certainly have neither time nor the
      documents themselves to do that , and thought you
      would share with that list the results of your own
      checking. I am sorry to conclude that if you can’t
      provide any figures supporting your assertions (see
      quotation above), the list members will understand
      that they can’t consider it as valid?
      If it was only a matter of a few names, it would not
      have been so important as “half of the hierarchy has
      been removed” which means around 75 bishops?
      Again we see how difficult it is to have a real
      dialogue opposed to unproved facts. The same with Bp
      Varnava matter. The Synod issues a document to deposit
      a bishop without referring to the good numbers of
      Canons, priests are summoned practically the eve
      of the summon to leave France for Germany (is it
      fair?) to explain themselves, then 2 of them come back
      to the Synod bossom without repentance and still
      commemorating Vl Lavr AND Vl Vitaly, bans,
      punishments, Vl Vitaly’s "kidnapping",disorders and
      unending debates on the internet , in parishes, in the
      families, all this is the perfect illustration of the
      world of confusion in which we, laymen, have to live
      our Orthodox faith.
      To all the religious/politicians on that list and
      elsewhere, whatever their “plans” maybe,whatever the
      purity of their intentions is, whatever are the
      earthly honours they have been promised, for God’s
      sake, remember your spiritual inheritance and have
      mercy on your flock who trusted you that long way,
      even if it certainly goes against the “spirit of
      present time” but in the spirit of Lord's Gospel.
      I wish you all a good preparation to the forthcoming
      Great Lent.
      Valentina Grigorieva


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