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Re "pouring" in baptism

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  • LJames6034@aol.com
    In about the year 90, the Didache ( Teaching, which claimed to be the teaching of the Holy Apostles) said: This is how you shall baptize: In living water,
    Message 1 of 4 , Aug 3, 2000
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      In about the year 90, the Didache ("Teaching," which claimed to be the
      teaching of the Holy Apostles) said: "This is how you shall baptize: In
      living water, by a three-fold immersion. If that is not possible, then in
      cold water. If that is not possible, then by pouring. If that is not
      possible, then by sprinkling of water, in the Name of the Father and of the
      Son and of the Holy Spirit."

      In the year 90, those who compiled that "book" were living so close to the
      time of the Apostles, the teaching likely WAS the teaching of the Holy
      Apostles. It would seem that, if my memory serves me correctly, the Holy
      Apostles (or those whom compiled what they are said to have taught) said: Do
      what you have to do, given the circumstances.

      Trying to put my library back together, I came upon a book I had forgotten I
      have: Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future, by Father Seraphim Rose. On
      p. 17, he says: " 'Christian' ecumenism at its best may be seen to
      represent a sincere and understandable error on the part of Protestants and
      Roman Catholics--the error of failing to realize that the visible Church of
      Christ already exists, and that they are outside it."

      Those of us who are inside it, however we were received, have received the
      grace of God in the sacraments of the Church, even if we were received via
      baptism that consisted of "pouring." Or, for that matter, given the above,
      which purports to be from the Holy Apostles, even if only a little water was
      used. Apparently, the Holy Apostles (or their editors, a few generations
      later) saw water as the significant element, not the amount one uses.


      Father Andrew
    • Michael Nikitin
      Wxactly! And if the is sick or the immersion is not possible then pour or sprinkle. But we should not WATER DOWN baptism to suit our pride of not wanting to
      Message 2 of 4 , Aug 3, 2000
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        Wxactly! And if the is sick or the immersion is not possible then pour or
        sprinkle. But we should not WATER DOWN baptism to suit our
        pride of not wanting to get in a container with water.
        If a person really wants to convert he will do so correctly for what is
        the reason to sprinkle a healthy person?



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        In about the year 90, the Didache ("Teaching," which claimed to be the
        teaching of the Holy Apostles) said: "This is how you shall baptize: In
        living water, by a three-fold immersion. If that is not possible, then in
        cold water. If that is not possible, then by pouring. If that is not
        possible, then by sprinkling of water, in the Name of the Father and of the
        Son and of the Holy Spirit."

        In the year 90, those who compiled that "book" were living so close to the
        time of the Apostles, the teaching likely WAS the teaching of the Holy
        Apostles. It would seem that, if my memory serves me correctly, the Holy
        Apostles (or those whom compiled what they are said to have taught) said:
        Do
        what you have to do, given the circumstances.

        Trying to put my library back together, I came upon a book I had forgotten I
        have: Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future, by Father Seraphim Rose.
        On
        p. 17, he says: " 'Christian' ecumenism at its best may be seen to
        represent a sincere and understandable error on the part of Protestants and
        Roman Catholics--the error of failing to realize that the visible Church of
        Christ already exists, and that they are outside it."

        Those of us who are inside it, however we were received, have received the
        grace of God in the sacraments of the Church, even if we were received via
        baptism that consisted of "pouring." Or, for that matter, given the above,
        which purports to be from the Holy Apostles, even if only a little water was
        used. Apparently, the Holy Apostles (or their editors, a few generations
        later) saw water as the significant element, not the amount one uses.


        Father Andrew

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      • Fr. Gregory Williams
        ... and THOSE are the operative words. The Didache does not say if that is not convenient , or if that is psychologically troublesome , or if that offends
        Message 3 of 4 , Aug 3, 2000
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          Wrote Fr. Andrew:

          >In about the year 90, the Didache ("Teaching," which claimed to be the
          >teaching of the Holy Apostles) said: "This is how you shall baptize: In
          >living water, by a three-fold immersion.

          Continuing the quotation:

          >If that is not possible,

          and THOSE are the operative words. The Didache does not say
          "if that is not convenient", or "if that is psychologically
          troublesome", or "if that offends somebody".

          >then in
          >cold water. If that is not possible, then by pouring. If that is not
          >possible, then by sprinkling of water, in the Name of the Father and of the
          >Son and of the Holy Spirit."
          >
          --
          --Fr. Gregory Williams

          * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
          1180 Orthodox Way
          Liberty, TN 37095-4366 USA

          Phone: (615) 536-5239
          FAX: (615) 536-5945
          E-mail: frgregory@...
        • LJames6034@aol.com
          It seems to me some are beating a horse that has no need of the whip. Where did quoting The Didache turn? I merely quoted what I remember it says. If others
          Message 4 of 4 , Aug 3, 2000
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            It seems to me some are beating a horse that has no need of the whip.

            Where did quoting The Didache turn? I merely quoted what I remember it says.

            If others need to whip up enthusiasm for something else, why, God bless them.

            The Didache says what it says. It is said to be the teaching of the Holy
            Apostles. What the rest of allt his is about is beyond me. Moreover, it has
            nothing whatsoever to do with what I said.

            ALJJ+
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