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[orthodox-synod] Re: Sv: Sv: Concerning ... Rights and Duties ...

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  • Nikolaj
    Dear Joseph Peace to you! You wrote: The monarchy (including the last two saintly czars you mentioned) ran and profited by the sale of vodka to a very
    Message 1 of 8 , Mar 29, 2000
      Dear Joseph
      Peace to you!
       
      You wrote:
      "The monarchy
      (including the last two saintly czars you mentioned)
      ran and profited by the sale of vodka to a very
      addicted society. "
       
      The above is true but only to the degree that the Tsar Martyr Nikolaj
      did all he could to abandon the Vodka selling. I am surprised that
      you do not even know that actually he forbid the sale Vodka in 1914?
      This he had ben wanting to do for a long time, and during the war he saw
      his chance to do so.
       
      It is also strange to me that you are not aware that the Tsar Martyr Nikolaj
      wanted very much to revive the Patriarchate, and in 1904 even suggested himself
      as candidate for the post, since the Holy Synod (To which we belong) dragged
      their feet all they could. He would then have abdicated the Throne to Mihail
      and he and the Tsaritsa would have taken Monastic vows.
       
      But of course ignorance is not a sin.
      I suggest you read a little more about The Tsar Martyr.
       
      Yours in Christ
      Nikolaj
       
      PS - Maybe you are not a modernist, but when you are airing anti-Orthodoxox monarchy
      views, you may eventually find that you can be mistaken for one.
       
       
       
       
      "Dukhovnye Kazaki
      Ego Imperatoskogo
      Velichestva Konvoja"
      (D.K.E.I.V.K.)
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2000 1:41 AM
      Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Sv: Concerning ... Rights and Duties ...

      Nikolaj:
      First of all, I belong to the Synod and am not an
      ämerican modernist.
      Second- when you or anyone else posts anything in
      English on the Web- then it invites Americans to
      respond. If you don't want an American reponse, then
      keep your posts relegated to the Russian language.
      Three- the last two Czars were pious Orthodox
      Christians- and they are saints. But that does not put
      them above some of their policies: i.e. the
      maintainence of the destruction of the Patriarhcate
      until 1917 being one of them. The Orthodox Church is
      critical of one part of the theology of St.Gregory
      Nyssa where he maintained that Hell would not last
      forever (he followed Origen in this matter). That did
      not affect his sanctity but the Orthodox Church and
      its members have every duty to oppose that public
      opinion of him. Blessed Augustine is also guilty of
      many theological mistakes and the Orthodox Church is
      duty-bound to oppose publically his mistakes and the
      perpetuation of those mistakes.
      St. Elizabeth was critical of the monarchy of St.
      Nicholas and Alexandra in one aspect and she
      confronted them on this. She did not consider them
      infallible. I merely pointed this out. The monarchy
      (including the last two saintly czars you mentioned)
      ran and profited by the sale of vodka to a very
      addicted society. Is this a virtue or a vice? If it is
      a vice and a sin, then Russia today needs to deal with
      these types of behavior. Millions are afflicted with
      this disease. Millions are born alcoholics with
      FAS and FAE syndrome. Does being born with such a
      disease make them more Orthodox Christian? The
      monarchy since the importation of vodka in the late
      15th century bears direct responsibility for the
      addiction of Russia. They profited from it and they
      maintained the sale of it as a state enterprize.
      My opinion is that this addiction has done more harm
      to Orthodox people in Russia than the Communists have
      because it has eaten away at the fabric of the family
      and Church from the inside out. The end result is that
      the population was too weak to resist evil from the
      outside (the Communists). And the absolute monarchs
      are absolutely accountable for the maintanence of this
      affliction. I am second generation Irish on my
      mother's side and can commiserate with the plight of
      the Russian people in terms of alcohol but this
      addiction has to be faced by the Church and not swept
      under the rug.
      Also the monarchy might be the best step for Russia-
      but an Orthodox monarchy in the real sense. But
      understand this. While your monarchs were sunning
      themselves with their cousins from England in the 19th
      century, my people, the Irish were being murdered and
      imprisoned on coffin ships in the mid-Atlantic with
      the blessing of Queen Victoria.
      If Russia reinstitutes the monarchy, it will have to
      be a vastly improved monarchy then the ones who were
      sunning themselves while subjected peoples were
      perishing.
      Finally- you maintain that a "modernist American"has
      no right to respond to a post that implied that force
      must be used to bring the former Russian nation back
      into the fold. This indicates to me a lack of
      tolerance for any dialogue that deals with Russia and
      also that the non-Russians in the Synod or elsewhere
      have no right to respond to this call for action. I
      opposed U.S. intervention in Kosovo and I oppose
      Russian intervention in the Ukraine. Don't tar me with
      support of the Kosovo campaign just because I am an
      American.
      Wishing you the best//

      --- Nikolaj Pravoslavie@... wrote:
      > Dear Friends
      >
      > The last two Tsars of Russia was extremely serious
      > Orthodox Christians.
      > Every authentic source points to this.
      > There are not many Russian Orthodox Churches around
      > the world who has not benefitted
      > from Tsar Alexander III or Tsar Nikolaj II's reign.
      > Especially the Tsar Martyr Nikolaj was a pious
      > Orthodox believer and I appeal
      > to you americans, that you treat his memory with
      > respect! He is canonized in our Church, and should
      > be treated with equal respect as other canonized
      > Martyrs!
      >
      > Regarding the criticism of Monarchy below - it is
      > not for american modernists to judge Russian
      > Orthodox Autocracy.
      > Your democracy has showed its true face very well in
      > Kosovo already!
      > With a Russian Orthodox Tsar on his rightful throne
      > in Russia - none of this would have happened.
      >
      > "Let none besmirch the fair name of the martyrs, let
      > none rob them of the glory of their crown.
      > The strength and purity of their faith stands
      > unimpaired:
      > nothing can be said or done against Christ by one
      > whose whole hope and faith,
      > whose whole strength and glory abides in Christ."
      > St. Cyprian of Carthage.
      >
      >
      > Yours in Christ
      > Nikolaj
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > "Dukhovnye Kazaki
      > Ego Imperatoskogo
      > Velichestva Konvoja"
      > (D.K.E.I.V.K.)
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Joseph Digrande
      > To: orthodox-synod@egroups.com
      > Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 10:55 AM
      > Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Concerning ... Rights
      > and Duties ...
      >
      >
      > The Ukrainian people have decided that they belong
      > to
      > a unique nation state- one much older than the
      > Russian
      > state. This state was oppressed (in the eyes of the
      > Ukranians) on the military, political and cultural
      > fronts for centuries. The Ukranians have fought
      > against that (and not just the Western Ukraine).
      > This new state is also armed with nuclear missiles
      > and
      > wants to be left alone. The best any Orthodox people
      > can hope for is the type of relationship that exists
      > between Great Britain and Canada (minus Quebec)
      > Also- from the Orthodox perspective- it is much
      > better
      > to be decentralized according to nation and
      > language.
      > The Ukranians believe themselves to be culturally
      > separate from the Russians. Both countries are huge
      > in
      > terms of Europe. Russia has its hands full with
      > itself: the atheism of the last 80 years,
      > skyrocketing
      > abortion and alcohol rates, rampant crime and the
      > environmental castastrophe--- and lastly its
      > economic
      > health. The Church has its hands full in this
      > situation- and since the episcopate is still dealing
      > with the legacy of Met. Sergius and Nikodim- they
      > are
      > ill prepared to deal with another nation and
      > culture.
      > Time to take the beam out of one's own eye and let
      > the
      > Ukraine deal with itself. Time to leave the Muslims
      > alone and take the beam out of one's own eyes.
      > Whenever Russia has taken the road of the "Third
      > Rome", blind belief in the monarchy or blind belief
      > in
      > the West it has been full of tragic consequences:
      > the
      > monarchy of Ivan the Terrible, Peter I, the
      > slaughter
      > of the Judaizers and the Old Rite, Katherine, the
      > import of the Jesuits, the use of torture as a moral
      > and political tool, the profit from and use of vodka
      > as a form of control. Even the blind adherence to
      > democracy is false. Perhaps Russia needs the
      > monarchy
      > but not the monarchy of the last 600 years. Absolute
      > power demands absolute accountalibity- and very few
      > of
      > the monarchs of the last 600 years even came close
      > to
      > that.
      > It would be much to Russia's benefit to listen to
      > the
      > voices of the past who opposed its monarchs- St.
      > Phillip, St. Maxim the Greek, Avakuum, St. Elizabeth
      > then to its monarchs themselves. In the main their
      > Orthodox sense did not even extend to the bare
      > minimum: marrying someone within the Church rather
      > than looking for political marriages outside the
      > Church.
      > Currently the Moscow Patriarchate is selling
      > cigarettes and vodka for profit- just like the Czars
      > and Russia's mortality rate is the lowest is
      > Europe--
      > where is the absolute accountalibity? And does
      > anyone
      > blame large chunks of the former Empire from saying
      > goodby?
      > Joseph Digrande
      > --- intrprtr@... wrote:
      > >
      > > CONCERNING THE RIGHTS AND DUTIES OF THE RUSSIAN
      > > NATION BEFORE GOD AND THE
      > > FATHERLAND
      > >
      > > Russia - One, Great and Indivisible -- is not a
      > > federation, or a
      > > confederacy, or some "all-Russian commonwealth of
      > > nations"; nor is it an
      > > alliance of nations, or of republics, or of
      > > independent states, etc.
      > >
      > > Russia was, is, and ever will be a strictly
      > Russian
      > > state, possessed of all
      > > the "state sovereignty" and "state status" of the
      > > clans and peoples that
      > > stem therefrom.
      > >
      > > It is Russians alone -- and none else -- who are
      > > responsible, in full
      > > measure, for Russia's fate. When the Russian State
      > > is styled either a
      > > "Union of Socialist Republics," or a "Commonwealth
      > > of Independent States,"
      > > or a totally-devastated "Russian Federation," it
      > > becomes entirely clear
      > > what purpose is being served by such a
      > > counterfeiting of concepts.
      > >
      > > The goal is a singular one -- that of
      > pushing-aside
      > > the Russians from being
      > > able to govern in their own land.
      > >
      > > From ocean to ocean, Russia has been, since of
      > old,
      > > a Russian realm -- the
      > > land of our ancestors; of those who had passed
      > this
      > > way before; an
      > > hereditary Russian possession.
      > >
      > > Great Russia, as a State, was created by Russians.
      > >
      > > The representatives of other nationalities were
      > > either a help or a
      > > hindrance to doing so -- a present example is that
      > > of Chechnya.
      > >
      > > When the triune Russian Nation is divided up into
      > > Ukrainian Slavs,
      > > Belorussian Slavs, and Russian Slavs, it becomes
      > > clearly evident just who
      > > is interested in such division.
      > >
      > > This situation is advantageous to those states
      > > which, at the present time,
      > > have destroyed Orthodox Serbia through the
      > creation
      > > of an artificial
      > > grouping -- that of the Croat-Muslim federation.
      > > Could it be that it is
      > > our bitter lot to be fated to see a
      > > "Ukrainian-Uniate" or a
      > > "Belorussian-Lithuanian" Federation? And God
      > forbid
      > > that we should have to
      > > find ourselves fighting against our brothers by
      > > blood!
      > >
      > > But this can be precisely the price of
      > manipulating
      > > the idea of a "Russian
      > > Nation."
      >
      === message truncated ===

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    • Nikolaj
      Dear Joseph. Just a few more comments. My opinion is that this addiction has done more harm to Orthodox people in Russia than the Communists have Please
      Message 2 of 8 , Mar 29, 2000
        Dear Joseph.
        Just a few more comments.
         
        "My opinion is that this addiction has done more harm
        to Orthodox people in Russia than the Communists have"
        Please understand that It is not like alcoholism disappeared because the  reds took power in Russia.
        And it is impossible to compare the damage made by alcoholism to the damage
        made by state-atheism.
        An alcoholic can repent on behalf of his own sins - individually. To believe that alcoholism is a "political matter of the state" is not the whole truth.
        It might also be an individual spiritual trial from God to be an alcoholic.
        Communism is the manifestation of atheistic evil on earth. It can not be viewed as an individual trial, but rather a collective one.
        Furthermore dear Joseph - on what do you base this "opinion" ??
        What is worst? Spiritual death or physical death?
        Indeed alcoholism is a kind of "communism of the body"
         
        "St. Elizabeth was critical of the monarchy of St.
        Nicholas and Alexandra in one aspect and she
        confronted them on this. She did not consider them
        infallible"
         
        Please understand, that the Orthodox Tsar is not a pope. He is indeed fallible but is responsible to God alone.
        Not to some democratic riff-raff parliament.
        I would like if you could please state a little more clearly in what aspect The Holy New Martyr Elizabeth was critical of the Monarchy as you say?
         
        "Finally- you maintain that a "modernist American"has
        no right to respond to a post that implied that force
        must be used to bring the former Russian nation back
        into the fold. This indicates to me a lack of
        tolerance for any dialogue that deals with Russia and
        also that the non-Russians in the Synod or elsewhere
        have no right to respond to this call for action."
         
        1) I was not born russian.
         
        2) Yes I will maintain forever that american modernism has no right to judge The Holy Russian Orthodox Tsar!
        The american system of rule has been one of the the most violent and murderous the world has ever seen.
        Nowadays it is disguising its violent craving for earthly power in the feathers of "human rights" and "democracy"
        All inventions of the masons to crush the remnants of true patristic Orthodoxy, to leave only denominations like the toothlees and watered-out denominations found in the modernist part of "Orthodoxy "
         
        Go ahead and call me intolerant. I take that as a compliment. I feel absolutely no obligation to be tolerant towards democracy, seing how spiritualy intolerant the western democracies are in effect. I am not afraid to be political incorrect, if that is what it takes to tell the truth.
         
        Yours in Christ
        Nikolaj
         
         
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2000 1:41 AM
        Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Sv: Concerning ... Rights and Duties ...

        Nikolaj:
        First of all, I belong to the Synod and am not an
        ämerican modernist.
        Second- when you or anyone else posts anything in
        English on the Web- then it invites Americans to
        respond. If you don't want an American reponse, then
        keep your posts relegated to the Russian language.
        Three- the last two Czars were pious Orthodox
        Christians- and they are saints. But that does not put
        them above some of their policies: i.e. the
        maintainence of the destruction of the Patriarhcate
        until 1917 being one of them. The Orthodox Church is
        critical of one part of the theology of St.Gregory
        Nyssa where he maintained that Hell would not last
        forever (he followed Origen in this matter). That did
        not affect his sanctity but the Orthodox Church and
        its members have every duty to oppose that public
        opinion of him. Blessed Augustine is also guilty of
        many theological mistakes and the Orthodox Church is
        duty-bound to oppose publically his mistakes and the
        perpetuation of those mistakes.
        St. Elizabeth was critical of the monarchy of St.
        Nicholas and Alexandra in one aspect and she
        confronted them on this. She did not consider them
        infallible. I merely pointed this out. The monarchy
        (including the last two saintly czars you mentioned)
        ran and profited by the sale of vodka to a very
        addicted society. Is this a virtue or a vice? If it is
        a vice and a sin, then Russia today needs to deal with
        these types of behavior. Millions are afflicted with
        this disease. Millions are born alcoholics with
        FAS and FAE syndrome. Does being born with such a
        disease make them more Orthodox Christian? The
        monarchy since the importation of vodka in the late
        15th century bears direct responsibility for the
        addiction of Russia. They profited from it and they
        maintained the sale of it as a state enterprize.
        My opinion is that this addiction has done more harm
        to Orthodox people in Russia than the Communists have
        because it has eaten away at the fabric of the family
        and Church from the inside out. The end result is that
        the population was too weak to resist evil from the
        outside (the Communists). And the absolute monarchs
        are absolutely accountable for the maintanence of this
        affliction. I am second generation Irish on my
        mother's side and can commiserate with the plight of
        the Russian people in terms of alcohol but this
        addiction has to be faced by the Church and not swept
        under the rug.
        Also the monarchy might be the best step for Russia-
        but an Orthodox monarchy in the real sense. But
        understand this. While your monarchs were sunning
        themselves with their cousins from England in the 19th
        century, my people, the Irish were being murdered and
        imprisoned on coffin ships in the mid-Atlantic with
        the blessing of Queen Victoria.
        If Russia reinstitutes the monarchy, it will have to
        be a vastly improved monarchy then the ones who were
        sunning themselves while subjected peoples were
        perishing.
        Finally- you maintain that a "modernist American"has
        no right to respond to a post that implied that force
        must be used to bring the former Russian nation back
        into the fold. This indicates to me a lack of
        tolerance for any dialogue that deals with Russia and
        also that the non-Russians in the Synod or elsewhere
        have no right to respond to this call for action. I
        opposed U.S. intervention in Kosovo and I oppose
        Russian intervention in the Ukraine. Don't tar me with
        support of the Kosovo campaign just because I am an
        American.
        Wishing you the best//

        --- Nikolaj Pravoslavie@... wrote:
        > Dear Friends
        >
        > The last two Tsars of Russia was extremely serious
        > Orthodox Christians.
        > Every authentic source points to this.
        > There are not many Russian Orthodox Churches around
        > the world who has not benefitted
        > from Tsar Alexander III or Tsar Nikolaj II's reign.
        > Especially the Tsar Martyr Nikolaj was a pious
        > Orthodox believer and I appeal
        > to you americans, that you treat his memory with
        > respect! He is canonized in our Church, and should
        > be treated with equal respect as other canonized
        > Martyrs!
        >
        > Regarding the criticism of Monarchy below - it is
        > not for american modernists to judge Russian
        > Orthodox Autocracy.
        > Your democracy has showed its true face very well in
        > Kosovo already!
        > With a Russian Orthodox Tsar on his rightful throne
        > in Russia - none of this would have happened.
        >
        > "Let none besmirch the fair name of the martyrs, let
        > none rob them of the glory of their crown.
        > The strength and purity of their faith stands
        > unimpaired:
        > nothing can be said or done against Christ by one
        > whose whole hope and faith,
        > whose whole strength and glory abides in Christ."
        > St. Cyprian of Carthage.
        >
        >
        > Yours in Christ
        > Nikolaj
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > "Dukhovnye Kazaki
        > Ego Imperatoskogo
        > Velichestva Konvoja"
        > (D.K.E.I.V.K.)
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: Joseph Digrande
        > To: orthodox-synod@egroups.com
        > Sent: Wednesday, March 29, 2000 10:55 AM
        > Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Concerning ... Rights
        > and Duties ...
        >
        >
        > The Ukrainian people have decided that they belong
        > to
        > a unique nation state- one much older than the
        > Russian
        > state. This state was oppressed (in the eyes of the
        > Ukranians) on the military, political and cultural
        > fronts for centuries. The Ukranians have fought
        > against that (and not just the Western Ukraine).
        > This new state is also armed with nuclear missiles
        > and
        > wants to be left alone. The best any Orthodox people
        > can hope for is the type of relationship that exists
        > between Great Britain and Canada (minus Quebec)
        > Also- from the Orthodox perspective- it is much
        > better
        > to be decentralized according to nation and
        > language.
        > The Ukranians believe themselves to be culturally
        > separate from the Russians. Both countries are huge
        > in
        > terms of Europe. Russia has its hands full with
        > itself: the atheism of the last 80 years,
        > skyrocketing
        > abortion and alcohol rates, rampant crime and the
        > environmental castastrophe--- and lastly its
        > economic
        > health. The Church has its hands full in this
        > situation- and since the episcopate is still dealing
        > with the legacy of Met. Sergius and Nikodim- they
        > are
        > ill prepared to deal with another nation and
        > culture.
        > Time to take the beam out of one's own eye and let
        > the
        > Ukraine deal with itself. Time to leave the Muslims
        > alone and take the beam out of one's own eyes.
        > Whenever Russia has taken the road of the "Third
        > Rome", blind belief in the monarchy or blind belief
        > in
        > the West it has been full of tragic consequences:
        > the
        > monarchy of Ivan the Terrible, Peter I, the
        > slaughter
        > of the Judaizers and the Old Rite, Katherine, the
        > import of the Jesuits, the use of torture as a moral
        > and political tool, the profit from and use of vodka
        > as a form of control. Even the blind adherence to
        > democracy is false. Perhaps Russia needs the
        > monarchy
        > but not the monarchy of the last 600 years. Absolute
        > power demands absolute accountalibity- and very few
        > of
        > the monarchs of the last 600 years even came close
        > to
        > that.
        > It would be much to Russia's benefit to listen to
        > the
        > voices of the past who opposed its monarchs- St.
        > Phillip, St. Maxim the Greek, Avakuum, St. Elizabeth
        > then to its monarchs themselves. In the main their
        > Orthodox sense did not even extend to the bare
        > minimum: marrying someone within the Church rather
        > than looking for political marriages outside the
        > Church.
        > Currently the Moscow Patriarchate is selling
        > cigarettes and vodka for profit- just like the Czars
        > and Russia's mortality rate is the lowest is
        > Europe--
        > where is the absolute accountalibity? And does
        > anyone
        > blame large chunks of the former Empire from saying
        > goodby?
        > Joseph Digrande
        > --- intrprtr@... wrote:
        > >
        > > CONCERNING THE RIGHTS AND DUTIES OF THE RUSSIAN
        > > NATION BEFORE GOD AND THE
        > > FATHERLAND
        > >
        > > Russia - One, Great and Indivisible -- is not a
        > > federation, or a
        > > confederacy, or some "all-Russian commonwealth of
        > > nations"; nor is it an
        > > alliance of nations, or of republics, or of
        > > independent states, etc.
        > >
        > > Russia was, is, and ever will be a strictly
        > Russian
        > > state, possessed of all
        > > the "state sovereignty" and "state status" of the
        > > clans and peoples that
        > > stem therefrom.
        > >
        > > It is Russians alone -- and none else -- who are
        > > responsible, in full
        > > measure, for Russia's fate. When the Russian State
        > > is styled either a
        > > "Union of Socialist Republics," or a "Commonwealth
        > > of Independent States,"
        > > or a totally-devastated "Russian Federation," it
        > > becomes entirely clear
        > > what purpose is being served by such a
        > > counterfeiting of concepts.
        > >
        > > The goal is a singular one -- that of
        > pushing-aside
        > > the Russians from being
        > > able to govern in their own land.
        > >
        > > From ocean to ocean, Russia has been, since of
        > old,
        > > a Russian realm -- the
        > > land of our ancestors; of those who had passed
        > this
        > > way before; an
        > > hereditary Russian possession.
        > >
        > > Great Russia, as a State, was created by Russians.
        > >
        > > The representatives of other nationalities were
        > > either a help or a
        > > hindrance to doing so -- a present example is that
        > > of Chechnya.
        > >
        > > When the triune Russian Nation is divided up into
        > > Ukrainian Slavs,
        > > Belorussian Slavs, and Russian Slavs, it becomes
        > > clearly evident just who
        > > is interested in such division.
        > >
        > > This situation is advantageous to those states
        > > which, at the present time,
        > > have destroyed Orthodox Serbia through the
        > creation
        > > of an artificial
        > > grouping -- that of the Croat-Muslim federation.
        > > Could it be that it is
        > > our bitter lot to be fated to see a
        > > "Ukrainian-Uniate" or a
        > > "Belorussian-Lithuanian" Federation? And God
        > forbid
        > > that we should have to
        > > find ourselves fighting against our brothers by
        > > blood!
        > >
        > > But this can be precisely the price of
        > manipulating
        > > the idea of a "Russian
        > > Nation."
        >
        === message truncated ===

        __________________________________________________
        Do You Yahoo!?
        Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
        http://im.yahoo.com

        This mailing list's archives are at http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod

        eGroups.com Home: http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod
        www.egroups.com - Simplifying group communications
      • Joseph Digrande
        Dear Nikolaj: Alcohol is both a physcial and a spiritual sickness. It is at the root of many other sins: murder, child abuse, domestic abuse, theft, breaking
        Message 3 of 8 , Mar 30, 2000
          Dear Nikolaj: Alcohol is both a physcial and a
          spiritual sickness. It is at the root of many other
          sins: murder, child abuse, domestic abuse, theft,
          breaking of the fasts, adultery etc etc. 85% of many
          crimes in this country are committed while
          intoxicated.
          If the czars are selling it and reaping the profits,
          then they are no longer acting like Orthodox monarchs,
          but worse than pagans.
          What is an Orthodox czar. Is he only answerable to
          God. I think not: he is answerable to his conscience,
          to the canons, to his spiritual father, his Bishop,
          the Gospel and the Church in general.
          The Church did not have the power or refused to wield
          the power to control the Czars over much of the last
          600 years.
          How do you control czars? juast like St. Ambrose of
          Milan controlled St. Theodosius the Great in 379 A.D.
          He killed 7000 men women and children in Thessalonica
          and he was excommunicated by St. Ambrose and was told
          he could not receive commuion etc. He repented and
          went on to become a saint.
          Had that attitude been put into action in Russia, the
          czars would still be in power. But the Church was
          unwillingly to stand up to the czars in matters
          pertaining to the Gospel.
          Had Russia crushed the importation of vodka from Genoa
          (where it was a medicine only) in 1480 and punished
          those who sold it, Russian society would have been
          infinitely stronger in the face of the Communists.
          St. Elizabeth confronted the Royal family on the
          question of the effect of Rasputin on their rule. She
          was ignored. I got this from the Massie book on the
          Czar.
          I have no rights to respond to any post. It is a
          privledge. I do not defend the United States in all or
          even in most matters. But freedom of expression is one
          of them. I would think most Russians would agree.
          I would also think that if Russia is to have another
          czar, he or she would think long and hard about the
          last 600 years. Dialogues in millions of Orthodox
          households and over the Internet need to occur so that
          the mistakes of the past are not continued.
          And finally the Church has to exert its moral power
          over the Czars when then attempt to overthrow the
          Gospel, the Canons, the Creed. To do that both the
          legacy of the passive Czarist controlled state agency
          and the Communist-controlled episcipate have to be
          eradicated.
          Finally- we both share the Body and Blood of Christ.
          Emnity between us is as stupid as emnity between the
          Ukraine and Russia. Or as stupid as the wars in the
          first part of the 20th century between Orthodox Balkan
          countries.
          You misuderstand me- I feel this dialogue needs to
          occur and many others. We are both non-Russian.
          I have a dear friend who is a total monarchist. we
          disagree on this subject but the monarchy in any
          society is not a prerequisite specified by either the
          Gospel or the Canons. There is no dogma of the
          moonarchy. For both the Irish and the Sicilians, any
          monarchy after the Norman invasions was satanic in
          nature and not Orthodox. There are many people in
          Russia who have many historic reservations about the
          monarchy for justifiable reasons (some of which I have
          stated). I am not against the monarchy in Russia. I
          just want it to be Orthodox and not based on brute
          power and sin.
          Take care///Joseph
          --- Nikolaj <Pravoslavie@...> wrote:
          > Dear Joseph.
          > Just a few more comments.
          >
          > "My opinion is that this addiction has done more
          > harm
          > to Orthodox people in Russia than the Communists
          > have"
          >
          > Please understand that It is not like alcoholism
          > disappeared because the reds took power in Russia.
          > And it is impossible to compare the damage made by
          > alcoholism to the damage
          > made by state-atheism.
          > An alcoholic can repent on behalf of his own sins -
          > individually. To believe that alcoholism is a
          > "political matter of the state" is not the whole
          > truth.
          > It might also be an individual spiritual trial from
          > God to be an alcoholic.
          > Communism is the manifestation of atheistic evil on
          > earth. It can not be viewed as an individual trial,
          > but rather a collective one.
          > Furthermore dear Joseph - on what do you base this
          > "opinion" ??
          > What is worst? Spiritual death or physical death?
          > Indeed alcoholism is a kind of "communism of the
          > body"
          >
          > "St. Elizabeth was critical of the monarchy of St.
          > Nicholas and Alexandra in one aspect and she
          > confronted them on this. She did not consider them
          > infallible"
          >
          > Please understand, that the Orthodox Tsar is not a
          > pope. He is indeed fallible but is responsible to
          > God alone.
          > Not to some democratic riff-raff parliament.
          > I would like if you could please state a little more
          > clearly in what aspect The Holy New Martyr Elizabeth
          > was critical of the Monarchy as you say?
          >
          > "Finally- you maintain that a "modernist
          > American"has
          > no right to respond to a post that implied that
          > force
          > must be used to bring the former Russian nation back
          > into the fold. This indicates to me a lack of
          > tolerance for any dialogue that deals with Russia
          > and
          > also that the non-Russians in the Synod or elsewhere
          > have no right to respond to this call for action."
          >
          > 1) I was not born russian.
          >
          > 2) Yes I will maintain forever that american
          > modernism has no right to judge The Holy Russian
          > Orthodox Tsar!
          > The american system of rule has been one of the the
          > most violent and murderous the world has ever seen.
          > Nowadays it is disguising its violent craving for
          > earthly power in the feathers of "human rights" and
          > "democracy"
          > All inventions of the masons to crush the remnants
          > of true patristic Orthodoxy, to leave only
          > denominations like the toothlees and watered-out
          > denominations found in the modernist part of
          > "Orthodoxy "
          >
          > Go ahead and call me intolerant. I take that as a
          > compliment. I feel absolutely no obligation to be
          > tolerant towards democracy, seing how spiritualy
          > intolerant the western democracies are in effect. I
          > am not afraid to be political incorrect, if that is
          > what it takes to tell the truth.
          >
          > Yours in Christ
          > Nikolaj
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: Joseph Digrande
          > To: orthodox-synod@egroups.com
          > Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2000 1:41 AM
          > Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Sv: Concerning ...
          > Rights and Duties ...
          >
          >
          > Nikolaj:
          > First of all, I belong to the Synod and am not an
          > �merican modernist.
          > Second- when you or anyone else posts anything in
          > English on the Web- then it invites Americans to
          > respond. If you don't want an American reponse, then
          > keep your posts relegated to the Russian language.
          > Three- the last two Czars were pious Orthodox
          > Christians- and they are saints. But that does not
          > put
          > them above some of their policies: i.e. the
          > maintainence of the destruction of the Patriarhcate
          > until 1917 being one of them. The Orthodox Church is
          > critical of one part of the theology of St.Gregory
          > Nyssa where he maintained that Hell would not last
          > forever (he followed Origen in this matter). That
          > did
          > not affect his sanctity but the Orthodox Church and
          > its members have every duty to oppose that public
          > opinion of him. Blessed Augustine is also guilty of
          > many theological mistakes and the Orthodox Church is
          > duty-bound to oppose publically his mistakes and the
          > perpetuation of those mistakes.
          > St. Elizabeth was critical of the monarchy of St.
          > Nicholas and Alexandra in one aspect and she
          > confronted them on this. She did not consider them
          > infallible. I merely pointed this out. The monarchy
          > (including the last two saintly czars you mentioned)
          > ran and profited by the sale of vodka to a very
          > addicted society. Is this a virtue or a vice? If it
          > is
          > a vice and a sin, then Russia today needs to deal
          > with
          > these types of behavior. Millions are afflicted with
          > this disease. Millions are born alcoholics with
          > FAS and FAE syndrome. Does being born with such a
          > disease make them more Orthodox Christian? The
          > monarchy since the importation of vodka in the late
          > 15th century bears direct responsibility for the
          > addiction of Russia. They profited from it and they
          > maintained the sale of it as a state enterprize.
          > My opinion is that this addiction has done more harm
          > to Orthodox people in Russia than the Communists
          > have
          > because it has eaten away at the fabric of the
          > family
          > and Church from the inside out. The end result is
          > that
          > the population was too weak to resist evil from the
          > outside (the Communists). And the absolute monarchs
          > are absolutely accountable for the maintanence of
          > this
          > affliction. I am second generation Irish on my
          > mother's side and can commiserate with the plight of
          > the Russian people in terms of alcohol but this
          > addiction has to be faced by the Church and not
          > swept
          > under the rug.
          > Also the monarchy might be the best step for Russia-
          > but an Orthodox monarchy in the real sense. But
          > understand this. While your monarchs were sunning
          > themselves with their cousins from England in the
          > 19th
          > century, my people, the Irish were being murdered
          > and
          > imprisoned on coffin ships in the mid-Atlantic with
          > the blessing of Queen Victoria.
          > If Russia reinstitutes the monarchy, it will have to
          > be a vastly improved monarchy then the ones who were
          > sunning themselves while subjected peoples were
          > perishing.
          > Finally- you maintain that a "modernist American"has
          > no right to respond to a post that implied that
          > force
          > must be used to bring the former Russian nation back
          > into the fold. This indicates to me a lack of
          > tolerance for any dialogue that deals with Russia
          > and
          > also that the non-Russians in the Synod or elsewhere
          > have no right to respond to this call for action. I
          > opposed U.S. intervention in Kosovo and I oppose
          > Russian intervention in the Ukraine. Don't tar me
          > with
          > support of the Kosovo campaign just because I am an
          > American.
          > Wishing you the best//
          >
          > --- Nikolaj Pravoslavie@... wrote:
          > > Dear Friends
          > >
          > > The last two Tsars of Russia was extremely serious
          > > Orthodox Christians.
          > > Every authentic source points to this.
          > > There are not many Russian Orthodox Churches
          > around
          > > the world who has not benefitted
          > > from Tsar Alexander III or Tsar Nikolaj II's
          > reign.
          > > Especially the Tsar Martyr Nikolaj was a pious
          > > Orthodox believer and I appeal
          > > to you americans, that you treat his memory with
          > > respect! He is canonized in our Church, and should
          > > be treated with equal respect as other canonized
          > > Martyrs!
          > >
          > > Regarding the criticism of Monarchy below - it is
          > > not for american modernists to judge Russian
          > > Orthodox Autocracy.
          > > Your democracy has showed its true face very well
          > in
          > > Kosovo already!
          > > With a Russian Orthodox Tsar on his rightful
          > throne
          > > in Russia - none of this would have happened.
          >
          === message truncated ===

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        • David Constantine Wright
          Glory to Jesus Christ! Glory Forever! ... If memory serves me correctly, one of the Metropolitans of Moscow (I forget who at the moment) did almost the same
          Message 4 of 8 , Mar 30, 2000
            Glory to Jesus Christ! Glory Forever!

            On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Joseph Digrande wrote:

            > How do you control czars? juast like St. Ambrose of
            > Milan controlled St. Theodosius the Great in 379 A.D.
            > He killed 7000 men women and children in Thessalonica
            > and he was excommunicated by St. Ambrose and was told
            > he could not receive commuion etc. He repented and
            > went on to become a saint.

            If memory serves me correctly, one of the Metropolitans of Moscow (I
            forget who at the moment) did almost the same thing with Czar Ivan the
            Terrible.

            I agree that the "symphonic" Orthodox Monarchy of the East Roman
            "Byzantine" Empire is to be preferred over the westernized version Russia
            came to possess in its later days. May God indeed grant that such an
            Orthodox Emperor come to rule in *each* land... Holy Russia, our own
            America, Greece and throughout all the world.

            With Christ's love,
            Rd. Constantine

            ##############################################################
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            # PO Box 774 Department of Religion #
            # Athens, GA 30603 University of Georgia #
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          • Nikolaj
            You wrote: Saint or not, nice guy or not, Nicholas II was not capable of leading hungry troops to a chow hall, and the same was true for his predecessor
            Message 5 of 8 , Mar 30, 2000
              You wrote:
               
              " Saint or not, nice guy or not, Nicholas II was not capable of leading
              "hungry troops to a chow hall, and the same was true for his predecessor"
               
              Holy Royal Martyrs of Russia!
              Pray unto God for us sinners!
              Forgive us our spiritual ignorance
              and interceed for us to the Lord Christ!
               
              Nikolaj
               
              PS - You are being disrespectful both to your own Church, if you are ROCOR at all? as well as to the Martyrs canonized by the same Church.
              But on the other hand your posting is very good, since it is very symptomatic for the modernistic humanistic disease spreading in our Church.
              I fail to understand why people absolutely want to be members of The Russian Orthodox Church, if they have so much against Holy Russia? There are many alternatives with a much more easygoing politics in the "Light" denominations of Orthodoxy.
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Thursday, March 30, 2000 2:21 PM
              Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Sv: Concerning ... Rights and Duties ...

              In a message dated 3/29/00 10:31:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
              natashinka@... writes:
              
              
              Not Natasha's quote!!!!!
              << 
               > Regarding the criticism of Monarchy below - it is
               > not for american modernists to judge Russian
               > Orthodox Autocracy.
               > Your democracy has showed its true face very well in
               > Kosovo already!
               > With a Russian Orthodox Tsar on his rightful throne
               > in Russia - none of this would have happened.
              
              
              
               > >>
              
              and a whole lot more rambling
              
              Dear list -- I'm frightened!
              
              It's no wonder that so many outsiders refer to our ROCOR as sectarian 
              crackpots if there really are folks that believe the above sentiments out 
              there.
              
              1.  The autocracy will not be restored
              2.  Saint or not, nice guy or not, Nicholas II was not capable of leading 
              hungry troops to a chow hall, and the same was true for his predecessor.  
              That was one of the big reasons they had a coupld of revolutions.
              3.  Despite the admonitions of St Ignaty Brianchanninov (yep, the 
              Patriarchate has, as I understand it, canonized him),  there seems to be a 
              real need for the "suffering Russian people" (at least the ones in the 
              diaspora) to get their miracles with bells and whistles -- or "'streaming 
              myrrh."
              
              Get a life, folks.  
              
              In Christ,
              
              Vova
              

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            • John Hoyle
              Furthermore dear Joseph - on what do you base this opinion ?? What is worst? Spiritual death or physical death? Indeed alcoholism is a kind of communism of
              Message 6 of 8 , Mar 30, 2000
                 
                Furthermore dear Joseph - on what do you base this "opinion" ??
                What is worst? Spiritual death or physical death?
                Indeed alcoholism is a kind of "communism of the body"
                 
                You underestimate the insidious power of alcohol.  As one who has spent years in the field of drug and alcohol recovery, I'm convinced that addiction is, more than anything else, a SPIRITUAL disease.  First it robs the victim of his/her spiritual life (a false god takes the place of the living God), then their emotional development, and finally their physical health.  To assist the patient with recovery, a reverse order of treatment must be used. First, restore the physical life with detoxification, vitamin injections, etc., then restore the emotional life with group therapy, and lastly restore the spiritual life with a simple spiritual program (AA works best for most patients just rediscovering a spirituality...I call it Spirituality 101).  At any rate, a drugged society is by definition a god-less society.  It's no wonder that so many people were unable to distinguish the threat of communism when they "lacked eyes to see."
                 
                 
              • Joseph Digrande
                John: I totally agree with your assessment. But it is time for the Orthodox people and Church all over the world to institute their own systemm for the
                Message 7 of 8 , Mar 30, 2000
                  John:
                  I totally agree with your assessment. But it is time
                  for the Orthodox people and Church all over the world
                  to institute their own systemm for the millions
                  afflicted with both this disease and pattern of sin.
                  What has our Church done in this regard? Currently the
                  MP is selling vodka for profit in Russia. Why can't
                  parishes start their own program that meets all the
                  needs of the afflicted (physical, emotional,
                  spiritual). Every parish has a doctor in it. Every
                  parish has a priest and every parish has the means to
                  dialogue about this. Group meetings should be taken
                  that far surpass the process in the secular world
                  (E.G. AA)
                  I will tell a sad story. When I worked up in northern
                  Alaska I used to tell young men about Mt. Athos. We
                  had many group meetings on a variety of subjects and
                  five or six teenagers were willing to spend their oil
                  money to make a pilgrimage.
                  But I realized that once on Mt. Athos they would be
                  offered ouzo at every stop. Not only would this be a
                  great temptation for them but they lose total respect
                  for any priest, much less a monk who drinks or has
                  booze in their monastery or skete. They would end up
                  feling worse abou the Church than they already do.
                  Many of our monasteries are afflicted by this desease
                  and sin and yet alcohol is part of their life
                  officially- What about the bizarre idea of our
                  monasteries being alcohol-free (except of course for
                  wine in Church)? we like to talk about the Thebaid,
                  the desert etc in Orthodox circles, about leaving the
                  world and one's podvig. I don't remember booze as
                  being a part of hospitality in the deserts of Egypt
                  where monasticism started. Isn't it rather absurd to
                  fast from meat for life and then have vodka readily
                  available (is the life of stillness improved with
                  alcohol available and what is the subtle message sent
                  to all our people afflicted with this passion?
                  Joseph Digrande

                  --- John Hoyle <limabean@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Furthermore dear Joseph - on what do you base
                  > this "opinion" ??
                  > What is worst? Spiritual death or physical
                  > death?
                  > Indeed alcoholism is a kind of "communism of the
                  > body"
                  >
                  > You underestimate the insidious power of
                  > alcohol. As one who has spent years in the field of
                  > drug and alcohol recovery, I'm convinced that
                  > addiction is, more than anything else, a SPIRITUAL
                  > disease. First it robs the victim of his/her
                  > spiritual life (a false god takes the place of the
                  > living God), then their emotional development, and
                  > finally their physical health. To assist the
                  > patient with recovery, a reverse order of treatment
                  > must be used. First, restore the physical life with
                  > detoxification, vitamin injections, etc., then
                  > restore the emotional life with group therapy, and
                  > lastly restore the spiritual life with a simple
                  > spiritual program (AA works best for most patients
                  > just rediscovering a spirituality...I call it
                  > Spirituality 101). At any rate, a drugged society
                  > is by definition a god-less society. It's no wonder
                  > that so many people were unable to distinguish the
                  > threat of communism when they "lacked eyes to see."
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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                  > http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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                  > registered, there's a good chance you'll find your
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                  >
                  http://click.egroups.com/1/2622/5/_/4386/_/954436633/
                  >
                  > -- 20 megs of disk space in your group's Document
                  > Vault
                  > --
                  > http://www.egroups.com/docvault/orthodox-synod/?m=1
                  >
                  >

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                • Nikolaj
                  to be Orthodox means to decide the question of government ... THANK you for confessing the truth about Holy Russia! Unfortunately my english is not good
                  Message 8 of 8 , Apr 1, 2000
                    " to be Orthodox means to decide the question of government
                    >from the point of view of the Orthodox Church;
                    that is, to consider as
                    >genuine only that form of government which is
                    both responsible to God and
                    >God-pleasing. [Wherefore t]he Church came to
                    love Autocracy because
                    >supreme authority therein belongs to that which is
                    least corrupted in the
                    >sinful human nature -- one's
                    conscience...."
                     
                    THANK you for confessing the truth about Holy Russia!
                    Unfortunately my english is not good enough for this!
                     
                     
                    "Bozhe, milostiv budi nam greshnym, v gresyekh nashykh, i pomilui nas!_ [O
                    God, be merciful to us sinners in our sins, and have mercy upon us!] For
                    how long, O Lord?... How long wilt Thou tolerate our sacrilege and our
                    blasphemies? No wonder we still pine away in exile, "strangers in a
                    strange land," as the Scriptures say."

                    I weep with you brother!
                     
                    You are in my prayers
                     
                    In Christ
                    imperfect Nikolaj
                     
                     
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 2:02 AM
                    Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: Sv: Concerning ... Rights and Duties ...


                    At 07:21 AM 3/30/00 -0500, Antiquariu@... wrote:

                    >1. The autocracy will not be restored

                    Perhaps it will not... On the other hand, perhaps it *will*... It all
                    depends on us, in the final analysis...

                    God, by way of some of the greatest Saints ever to walk the Russian Land,
                    *did* promise us (and that includes those of us in the Russian Diaspora, as
                    well), that there *would* be a Tsar' in Russia once again. However, He
                    also informed us that His promises are conditioned upon a Divine-human
                    *synergy* (i.e., a cooperation between His will and ours). Thus, while God
                    is certainly willing, we also have to do *our* part.

                    And just what is our part? one might ask. It is a sincere repentance for
                    our having fallen away from Christ and for having participated in the
                    slaying of His Anointed One, whether through direct participation, or
                    through acquiescence to the deed, or through justification of the same
                    after the fact, as some on this List seem to be doing. For each mocking
                    remark made, each slanderous word uttered against God's Anointed One, is a
                    further participation in that dreadful sin of regicide; is the infliction
                    of yet another additional wound to an Innocent Victim; is a further falling
                    away from God!

                    Much like the ancient Hebrews, we Russians, too, have been presented with a
                    choice: God or Baal; the Way of Life or the Way of Death... Of Monarchy
                    or of masonry... We are the arbiters of our own future destiny -- and,
                    thereby, of the ultimate destiny of the world.

                    If we Russians repent of our sins against God and against His Anointed One
                    ("Touch not Mine Anointed"...), we will be given a brief respite before the
                    End (..."and there was silence in Heaven, for the space of half an
                    hour"...). Russia will flourish and the Word of God (which Dostoyevskii
                    labelled "the New Russian Word") will go forth from there to all the earth
                    (..."and this Gospel of the end will be preached unto all
                    nations"...). And only then will the end come...

                    But, if we do not repent, we may as well "bring down the Final Curtain"
                    now, for it is true, then, that...

                    >1. The autocracy will not be restored

                    .....

                    >2. Saint or not, nice guy or not, Nicholas II was not capable of leading
                    >hungry troops to a chow hall,

                    *Tsk!* *Tsk!* *Tsk!* For shame! For shame! This sort of
                    communist-inspired "rhetoric" is entirely uncalled for, especially on a
                    ROCOR List -- and, in particular, as the course of the war began to turn
                    about when Tsar' Nikolai took over personal command in 1915, as is evident
                    from the words of Winston Churchill (who was not particularly partial to
                    Tsarist Russia, as we all know, wherefore his words bear that much more
                    weight), who informs us:

                    >Surely to no nation has fate been more malignant than to Russia. Her ship
                    >went down in sight of port. She had actually weathered the storm when all
                    >was cast away. Every sacrifice had been made; the toil was
                    >achieved. Despair and Tyranny usurped command at the very moment when the
                    >task was done.
                    >
                    >The long retreats were ended; the munition famine was broken; arms were
                    >pouring in; stronger, larger, better equipped armies guarded the immense
                    >front; the depots overflowed with strong men. Alexeiev directed the Army
                    >and Koltchak the Fleet. Moreover, no difficult action was now required:
                    >to remain in presence: to lean with heavy weight upon the far-stretched
                    >Teutonic line: to hold without exceptional activity the weakened hostile
                    >forces on her front: in a word, to endure -- that was all that stood
                    >between Russia and the fruits of general victory. Says Ludendorff,
                    >surveying the scene at the close of 1916: "Russia, in particular, produced
                    >very strong formations, divisions were reduced to twelve battalions, the
                    >batteries to six guns; new divisions were formed out of surplus fourth
                    >battalions and the seventh and eighth guns of each battery. This
                    >reorganization made a great increase of strength." (Ludendorff, Vol. I, p. 305)
                    >
                    >It meant in fact that the Russian Empire marshalled for the campaign of
                    >1917 a far larger and better equipped army than that with which she had
                    >started the war. In March the Czar was on his throne; the Russian Empire
                    >and people stood, the front was safe, and victory certain.
                    >
                    >It is the shallow fashion of these times to dismiss the Czarist regime as
                    >a purblind, corrupt, incompetent tyranny. But a survey of its thirty
                    >month's war with Germany and Austria should correct these loose
                    >impressions and expose the dominant facts. We may measure the strength of
                    >the Russian Empire by the battering it endured, by the disasters it had
                    >survived, by the inexhaustible forces it had developed, and by the
                    >recovery it had made. In the governments of states, when great events are
                    >afoot, the leader of the nation, whoever he be, is held accountable for
                    >failures and vindicated by success. No matter who wrought the toil, who
                    >planned the struggle, to the supreme responsible authority belongs the
                    >blame or credit for the result.
                    >
                    >Why should this stern test be denied to Nicholas II? ... He was ... of
                    >merciful disposition, upheld in all his daily life by his faith in
                    >God. But the brunt of supreme decisions centered upon him. At the summit
                    >where all problems are reduced to yea or nay, where events transcend the
                    >faculties of men and where all is inscrutable, he had to give the
                    >answers. His was the function of the compass-needle. War or no
                    >war? Advance or retreat? Right or left? Democratize or hold firm? Quit
                    >or persevere? These were the battlefields of Nicholas II. Why should he
                    >reap no honour for them? The devoted onset of the Russian armies which
                    >saved Paris in 1914; the mastered agony of the munitionless retreat; the
                    >slowly regathered forces; the victories of Brussilov; the Russian entry
                    >upon the campaign of 1917, unconquered, stronger than ever; has he no
                    >share in these? ... [T]he regime he personified, over which he presided,
                    >to which his personal character gave the vital spark, had at this moment
                    >won the war for Russia.
                    >
                    >He is about to be struck down. A dark hand ... now intervenes. Exit
                    >Czar. Deliver his and all he loved to wounds and death. Belittle his
                    >efforts, asperse his conduct, insult his memory: but pause then and tell
                    >us who else was found capable. Who or what could guide the Russian
                    >State? Men gifted and daring; men ambitious and fierce; spirits audacious
                    >and commanding -- of these there was no lack. But none could answer the
                    >few plain questions on which the life and fame of Russia turned.

                    (Excerpted from "The World Crisis, 1916 - 1918," pp. 223 - 225)

                    Equally uncalled for is the appended slandering of Alexander III, the
                    "Tsar'-Peacemaker" [_"Tsar'-Mirotvorets"_], by the epimethean verbal _post
                    scriptum_:

                    >and the same was true for his predecessor.

                    For, _au contraire_, Alexander III was a great Tsar' who...

                    >... reigned for only thirteen years. All these years were a time of
                    >profound peace. The _Gosudar'_ [Sovereign] dedicated them to caring for
                    >the betterment of Russia's domestic strength and prosperity. The military
                    >was improved, several warships were built, a military harbour was
                    >constructed in Libau. To ameliorate the well-being of the residents of
                    >Siberia, the building of a railroad was begun through the whole of this
                    >far-distant and remote _okraina_ [frontier region] of Russia. Peasant
                    >banks were set up in many of the _gubernii_ [government districts] of the
                    >Empire, which provided the peasants with loans to acquire
                    >land.
                    >
                    >+++++ FINALLY, IN 1891 AND 1892, THE EMPEROR SAVED AN ENTIRE _KRAI_
                    >[REGION] FROM FAMINE AND DEATH BY STARVATION; HE COMMANDED THAT SUPPLIES
                    >FOR TWENTY _GUBERNII_ BE PURCHASED AT GOVERNMENT EXPENSE AND AT THE
                    >EXPENSE OF PRIVATE TAX-PAYERS. THE HEIR TO THE THRONE, ... _GOSUDAR'_
                    >EMPEROR NIKOLAI ALEKSANDROVICH AND THE ENTIRE IMPERIAL FAMILY LIKEWISE
                    >TOOK PART IN THIS ACTIVITY. +++++ [This point, incidentally, puts the lie
                    >to the *entirety* of Point 2, above...]
                    >
                    >
                    >In addition, instead of [Russia's former] antiquated court system -- slow,
                    >secret and [occasionally] unjust -- he established an open, public court
                    >system -- "righteous, speedy, merciful and equal for all," of the _mir_
                    >[village community] and circuit-court types, such as existed in other
                    >_gubernii_ of Russia.
                    >
                    >Emperor Alexander III reposed on 20 October 1894, and was sincerely
                    >lamented by his subjects.

                    {Excerpted and translated into English by G. Spruksts, from the Russian
                    text contained in _"Kratkaya Russkaya Istoriya v ocherkakh i biografiyakh"_
                    ["A Concise History Of Russia In Sketches And Biographies"], compiled by
                    Konstantin Voskresenskii, Edition 28, Reprinted by Archimandrite
                    Panteleimon, Holy Trinity Monastery, Jordanville, NY,
                    1958. English-language translation copyright (c) 1985 by The Russian
                    Cultural Heritage Society and the Translator. All rights reserved.}

                    Consequently, the conclusion drawn:

                    >That was one of the big reasons they had a coupld of revolutions.

                    is obviously a _non sequitur_, for "one of the big reasons they had a
                    coupld {sic.} of revolutions" was because Holy Rus', "the Third Rome," the
                    last bastion of Orthodoxy in the world, was the only power still capable of
                    withstanding the encroaching masonic "New World Order." Consequently,
                    "they" embarked upon their mission by "unleashing the dogs of war" (World
                    War I) and, rephrasing it slightly, uttered Scipio Africanus' _dictum_:
                    _"Russia delenda est!"_ ["Russia must be destroyed!"]. And what made
                    Russia's destruction especially imperative was the fact that

                    >"... The Orthodox ... Church, preaching the Christian doctrine of God's
                    >Righteousness, has made [us]... aware that Orthodox ... Autocracy is the
                    >best possible type of government upon our imperfect earth, being an
                    >historically-justified form of divine authority: one established by God and
                    >having a Tsar' -- God's Anointed -- at its head. ...
                    >
                    >"... [And, that] to be Orthodox means to decide the question of government
                    >from the point of view of the Orthodox Church; that is, to consider as
                    >genuine only that form of government which is both responsible to God and
                    >God-pleasing. [Wherefore t]he Church came to love Autocracy because
                    >supreme authority therein belongs to that which is least corrupted in the
                    >sinful human nature -- one's conscience...."
                    >
                    >"...[For, being Anointed by the Church,] the Tsar' is guided ... by the
                    >will of God and by his conscience, as the voice of God's will. The Nation
                    >understands the burden of royal authority placed [upon the Tsar'] by God
                    >as a great service to God and His Righteousness. The supreme goal of an
                    >Orthodox system of government is to bring about those conditions of life
                    >in which the [Orthodox] Christian can grow and develop. Therefore did
                    >Orthodox thought come to a clear awareness of the necessity for an
                    >authority guided by an Orthodox world-view -- an authority subject to God:
                    >... Orthodox Autocratic Monarchy....
                    >
                    >"...[Hence, while] a[n Orthodox Christian] Tsar' is an unrestricted ruler,
                    >... his power *is* limited [nevertheless] by [his] Orthodox world-view, and he
                    >finds himself under the moral control of the Church and of the entire
                    >Nation, before both of which he had sworn his [coronation] oath. The
                    >principle of autocracy protects the Monarch's freedom; hence, also, the
                    >potential for moral responsibility, for one who is unfree cannot be capable
                    >of it. The unfree head of a parliamentarian ['constitutional'] monarchy
                    >neither is, nor can be, morally responsible for his every action which has
                    >both a juridical and a formal defence. Consequently, the primary moral
                    >force of Orthodox Christian Monarchy is lost, and the principle of
                    >autocratic rule falls by the wayside, making way for a "democratic state"
                    >that is freed from any responsibilities in regard to God, the Church, and
                    >the spiritual condition of the Nation [the masonic, _cum_ bolshevik,
                    >principle of 'separation of Church and State']....
                    >
                    >"...[Then] does 'humanitarianism,' being an expression of a human _hubris_
                    >which has convinced itself that it is capable of establishing social
                    >well-being without Christ and without love for each and every human
                    >individual, become a counterfeit substitute for the Righteousness of
                    >Christ. ["I love humankind; it's _people_ that I can't stand!"]...
                    >
                    >"...[Any] move in this direction ... [i]s never so much political, as it is
                    >spiritual. [And any] so-called ... 'liberation' -- and, thereafter,
                    >'revolutionary' movement ...[i]s particularly an _a-religious_ and
                    >*anti-religious* movement. It is specifically on account of this that
                    >[they] have evoked such great alarm in Venerable Serafim of Sarov, in Fr.
                    >Ioann of Kronstadt, in Dostoyevskii, in Metropolitan Antonii
                    >(Khrapovitsii), [and in many others]....
                    >
                    >"...an Orthodox Tsar' [on the other hand] reigns in order that there might
                    >exist an Orthodox-oriented milieu; that is the reason for a Tsar's bearing
                    >[the burden] of his royal service. When the desire for a Christian state
                    >and surroundings begins to fade in a nation, Orthodox Monarchy loses the
                    >prerequisites for its existence and its _raison d'etre_. Whence comes the
                    >self-evident condition for the appearance of Orthodox Monarchical rule,
                    >which is only then possible when a nation again begins to manifest its
                    >desire to live in accordance with Divine Righteousness."..

                    {Excerpted and translated into English by G. Spruksts, from the Russian
                    text of _"O Pravoslavnoi Monarkhii"_ ["Concerning Orthodox
                    Monarchy"]. English-language translation copyright (c) 1993 by The Russian
                    Cultural Heritage Society and the Translator. All rights reserved.}

                    >3. Despite the admonitions of St Ignaty Brianchanninov (yep, the
                    >Patriarchate has, as I understand it, canonized him), there seems to be a
                    >real need for the "suffering Russian people" (at least the ones in the
                    >diaspora) to get their miracles with bells

                    Bells have always been an integral part of Russian religious
                    life. Unfortunately, in Diaspora (alas!), zoning ordinances frequently
                    make their use impossible... {Sigh!}

                    >and whistles

                    Sorry, but very few of "the 'suffering Russian people'" -- even "the ones
                    in diaspora" -- are given to evoking _lyeshiye_ [wood demons] by whistling
                    -- especially if their _babushka_s [grannies] are still alive to teach them
                    what's what! It's primarily *the* _lyeshyiis_ "thynge" -- and not that of
                    "the 'suffering Russian people'" -- to whistle, don'cha know?...

                    >-- or "'streaming myrrh."

                    Great, let's get rid of our miracle-working ikons and then let's jettison
                    the relics of St. Nicholas (of Myra), St. Neilos (the Myrrh-streaming), St.
                    Elizaveta Feodorovna, the Royal Martyr, et al. That will subsequently make
                    it even easier to get rid of the "bread and wine" ("Alcoholics Anonymous"
                    must be appeased, after all); and, finally, we can repudiate the
                    "cruci-Fiction," too! Oh, yeah!...

                    _Bozhe, milostiv budi nam greshnym, v gresyekh nashykh, i pomilui nas!_ [O
                    God, be merciful to us sinners in our sins, and have mercy upon us!] For
                    how long, O Lord?... How long wilt Thou tolerate our sacrilege and our
                    blasphemies? No wonder we still pine away in exile, "strangers in a
                    strange land," as the Scriptures say.

                    >Get a life, folks.

                    Only make certain that the "life" in question is of the "Eternal" variety,
                    or it's good for nothing, being absolutely worthless...

                    -- GeoS


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