Re: looking for answers in all the wrong places
- XPICTOC BOCKIPECE!!!
Allow me to join this discussion.
Father John: So you see, I don't feel that I need to read books, by
American journalists or retired KGB agents, about the Moscow
Vova: Father John I do not regarding these books or any of the
articles posted here as being about the Moscow Patriarchate per say,
but about an organization(s) and government that has targeted it (the
Moscow Patriarchate) and some of its people to be used in an
unorthodox way. These facts are well documented and actually are even
supported in Patriarch Alexy's statements. Some members of the Church
(both clergy and laity) appear to have had active participation in
such activities. That fact alone provides sufficient reason for
members of ROCOR (as well as other Churches) to be concerned. While
I would not attempt to speak on anyone else's behalf, I once again
wish to emphasize that it is not the majority of the laity nor the
clergy of the Church of Russia that I have questions about. There
has been sufficient evidence of corruption and non-clerical actions
committed at the highest levels of the current power structure of the
MP, (dare I say MP, Inc.?) Yet I have not seen in plain and simple
words an acknowledgement and or statement (request for forgiveness)
of personal responsibility for personal actions.
Unfortunately a simple American saying comes to mind, something about
a fish and the head. (I still try to be polite.)
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "Fr. John R. Shaw"
> XPICTOC BOCKPECE!
> Peter Bushunow wrote:
> > I find it amazing that you believe, and are willing to post
> > things "you have heard" about me, but refuse to believe or evenconsider
> > published, documented sources who write about the Patriarch,Putin and
> > their "group."of a group of people there with similar views.
> JRS: I wrote that I'd heard that you live in Rochester, and are one
>whom I was corresponding with.
> So far as I know, we have never even met.
> Until others gave me that information, I really had little idea
>well as a number of clergy and seminarians from or in Russia.
> I have, however, met and corresponded with Patriarch Alexy II, as
>church there, and experience the great spiritual intensity and fervor
> I was able to visit Russia twice, during the Brezhnev era, attend
of the Orthodox Christians who lived under Soviet rule, but who made
great sacrifices to keep the Faith.
>of "Moscow Patriarchate" background.
> Most of our parishioners here are recent arrivals, and are
>journalists or retired KGB agents, about the Moscow Patriarchate.
> So you see, I don't feel that I need to read books, by American
>Moscow Patriarchate, from whom you can get a first hand idea of what
> Have you ever been to Russia yourself? Do you have friends in the
it is like?
> > If you count me and my family as "enemies of ROCOR" then you
> > "friends" you are seeking.that you are quite firmly committed to certain misconceptions.
> JRS: I never said you were an "enemy". But I do get the impression
> > I pray that by voicing my questions and objections to this
> > union I can come to understand, and try to have you andother "leaders"
> > of our church understand that there are people who sincerelydisagree
> > with you.parish priest, continuously in good standing since I was ordained
> JRS: But why do you put "leaders" in quotation marks? I'm a ROCOR
more than 30 years ago.
>How could I, when we hear from them every day?
> I never doubted that there were people who "sincerely disagreed".
>and not just demand them.
> It is nevertheless possible to be sincere, but misled.
> And I have tried my best to give simple, clear and honest answers.
> If you really want to understand, you have to listen to answers,
> In Christ
> Fr. John R. Shaw
> CoreComm Webmail.
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]