Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [rocaclergy] RE: letter to V.Rev. Ilya Gorsky

Expand Messages
  • Richard
    ... reputations ... false ... for them; ... We have ... armchair ... saved without ... Fr. John s observation about bearing false witness stands right on. You
    Message 1 of 5 , Dec 31, 2005
    • 0 Attachment
      --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, "vkozyreff" <vladimir.
      kozyreff@s...> wrote:
      >
      > Dear Father John,
      >
      > Your write: If they do not mind falsely besmirching the
      reputations
      > of our hierarchs and loyal clergy, then "thou shalt not bear
      false
      > witness" and the rest of the 10 Commandments, play no role
      for them;
      > and they are foreign to Christian charity.
      >
      > It is a particularly exquisite treat to hear from a supporter of the
      > union with sergianism, that its opponents bear false witness.
      We have
      > been told at lenghth by Father Alexander Lebedeff that only
      armchair
      > dreamers could believe that the Church might have been
      saved without
      > false witnesses.
      >
      > In Christ,
      >
      > Vladimir Kozyreff


      Fr. John's observation about bearing false witness stands right
      on. You not only attributed an asserion to Fr. John that he didn't
      originate, but it's a distortion of what was actually written. Earlier
      in October in post #15262, Fr. John quoted the "Epistle to the
      Flock" by the Synod of Bishops of the ROCOR in 1933. The
      epistle states...

      "We are taking fully into account the extraordinary difficulties of
      the position of Metropolitan Sergius, who is now the de facto
      head of the Church of Russia, and are aware of the heavy
      burden of responsibility for the fate of the latter, which lies upon
      him. No one, therefore, has the audacity to accuse him for the
      mere attempt to enter into dialogue with the Soviet regime so as
      to obtain legal standing for the Church of Russia. Not without
      foundation does the deputy locum tenens of the Patriarchal
      Throne say in his aforementioned Declaration that only
      "armchair dreamers can think that such a vast community as our
      Orthodox Church, with all its organization, can exist peacefully in
      a country while walling itself off from the authorities."

      In Christ,
      Richard.
    • Miller
      Who is Richard? I am most weary of the sarcasm and nastiness, no matter who is right or wrong. FrJM ... From: Richard To:
      Message 2 of 5 , Jan 1, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        Who is Richard?

        I am most weary of the sarcasm and nastiness, no matter who is
        right or wrong.

        FrJM

        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Richard" <rchrdmason@...>
        To: <orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2005 7:24 PM
        Subject: [orthodox-synod] Re: [rocaclergy] RE: letter to V.Rev.
        Ilya Gorsky


        > --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, "vkozyreff" <vladimir.
        > kozyreff@s...> wrote:
        >>
        >> Dear Father John,
        >>
        >> Your write: If they do not mind falsely besmirching the
        > reputations
        >> of our hierarchs and loyal clergy, then "thou shalt not bear
        > false
        >> witness" and the rest of the 10 Commandments, play no role
        > for them;
        >> and they are foreign to Christian charity.
        >>
        >> It is a particularly exquisite treat to hear from a supporter
        >> of the
        >> union with sergianism, that its opponents bear false witness.
        > We have
        >> been told at lenghth by Father Alexander Lebedeff that only
        > armchair
        >> dreamers could believe that the Church might have been
        > saved without
        >> false witnesses.
        >>
        >> In Christ,
        >>
        >> Vladimir Kozyreff
        >
        >
        > Fr. John's observation about bearing false witness stands right
        > on. You not only attributed an asserion to Fr. John that he
        > didn't
        > originate, but it's a distortion of what was actually written.
        > Earlier
        > in October in post #15262, Fr. John quoted the "Epistle to the
        > Flock" by the Synod of Bishops of the ROCOR in 1933. The
        > epistle states...
        >
        > "We are taking fully into account the extraordinary
        > difficulties of
        > the position of Metropolitan Sergius, who is now the de facto
        > head of the Church of Russia, and are aware of the heavy
        > burden of responsibility for the fate of the latter, which lies
        > upon
        > him. No one, therefore, has the audacity to accuse him for the
        > mere attempt to enter into dialogue with the Soviet regime so
        > as
        > to obtain legal standing for the Church of Russia. Not without
        > foundation does the deputy locum tenens of the Patriarchal
        > Throne say in his aforementioned Declaration that only
        > "armchair dreamers can think that such a vast community as our
        > Orthodox Church, with all its organization, can exist
        > peacefully in
        > a country while walling itself off from the authorities."
        >
        > In Christ,
        > Richard.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups
        >
        > Archives located at http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
      • Fr. Alexander Lebedeff
        ... This is about the umpteenth time that Vladimir has misquoted me (talk about bearing false witness!) and attributed to me words that are not mine at all,
        Message 3 of 5 , Jan 4, 2006
        • 0 Attachment
          Vladimir Kozyreff wrote:


          >We have
          >been told at lenghth by Father Alexander Lebedeff that only armchair
          >dreamers could believe that the Church might have been saved without
          >false witnesses.


          This is about the umpteenth time that Vladimir has misquoted me (talk
          about bearing false witness!) and attributed to me words that are not
          mine at all, but were quoted from the Epistle of the Sobor of Bishops
          of the Church Abroad in 1933, as has been pointed out by another
          member of this list.

          That Epistle (again -- NOT my words) stated:

          "We are taking fully into account the extraordinary
          > difficulties of
          > the position of Metropolitan Sergius, who is now the de facto
          > head of the Church of Russia, and are aware of the heavy
          > burden of responsibility for the fate of the latter, which lies
          > upon
          > him. No one, therefore, has the audacity to accuse him for the
          > mere attempt to enter into dialogue with the Soviet regime so
          > as
          > to obtain legal standing for the Church of Russia. Not without
          > foundation does the deputy locum tenens of the Patriarchal
          > Throne say in his aforementioned Declaration that only
          > "armchair dreamers can think that such a vast community as our
          > Orthodox Church, with all its organization, can exist
          > peacefully in
          > a country while walling itself off from the authorities."

          With love in Christ,

          Prot. Alexander Lebedeff


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.