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"Sviatitiel'" Sergii?

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  • vkozyreff
    Dear List, I do not share the ROCOR(L) optimism regarding the predicted evolution of the MP judgement about its sergianist past. Indeed, various recent
    Message 1 of 71 , Sep 22, 2004
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      Dear List,

      I do not share the ROCOR(L) optimism regarding the predicted
      evolution of the MP judgement about its sergianist past. Indeed,
      various recent powerful signals seemed to indicate that the MP would
      keep its claim that Met. Sergii did save the Church.

      Below is the latest news that I gathered on this subject. Would
      anybody in this list be able to confirm or infirm that information?

      In God,

      Vladimir Kozyreff


      "During the meetings of the commission on reunion with the MP that
      have taken place lately in Munich,

      http://www.mospat.ru/text/news/id/7648.html

      the MP side flatly refused to discuss (and even less to condemn) the
      actions of metropolitan Sergii (Stragorodsky). As ROCOR
      representatives timidly suggested to put this topic on the agenda,
      the MP bishops gave this short reply: " He is our sviatitiel', he
      saved the Church. He is above any question"."

      20 September
      http://www.russia-talk.com
    • vkozyreff
      Dear Father Victor, bless. The MP should not repent in Met. Sergius s place, but should repent for following him and for claiming that he took the right
      Message 71 of 71 , Oct 6, 2004
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        Dear Father Victor, bless.

        The MP should not repent in Met. Sergius's place, but should repent
        for following him and for claiming that he took the right decision.
        The MP should not condemn Met. Sergius but condemn his actions and
        his false teaching.

        Some in ROCOR, in their effort to justify the rapprochement with the
        MP, maintain the confusion between condemning a person and
        condemning his actions. "Seergianism is all right because we cannot
        condemn Met Sergius. We cannot condemn him, because we all sin". The
        distinction between condemning a person and condemning actions is
        however elementary in the exercise of discernment.

        Stating that in the negotiations with the MP in Munich, it was
        resolved that the person and the actions of Met Sergius were not to
        be discussed because "he is MP's sviatitiel' " is hogwash.

        Stating that we have resolved on this forum that the person and the
        actions of Met Sergius should not be discussed is not hogwash.

        Is it hogwash to believe that the MP does not want Met Sergius's
        person and actions to be discussed (whether in Munich or in Moscow)
        and that the ROCOR agrees with this?

        I am afraid we are not progressing at all, except in deliberately
        organised confusion.

        In God,

        Vladimir Kozyreff



        --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, frvboldewskul@a... wrote:
        > Dear Vladimir,
        > Context. My comment was in a context to Fr. Basil. Likewise, Fr.
        Alexander's
        > comment of "hogwash" was within a context, and not related to
        anything I or
        > Protodeacon Basil wrote.
        >
        > Priest Victor Boldewskul
        >
        > In a message dated 10/5/04 4:55:13 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
        > vladimir.kozyreff@s... writes:
        >
        > > Dear father Victor, bless.
        > >
        > > You write: "At least we resolved that the Moscow Patriarchate
        does
        > > not need to repent for or condemn Metropolitan Sergius. The
        person
        > > of Metropolitan Sergius then is off the table. We are making
        > > progress".
        > >
        > > Do you mean that this is not "hogwash" after all?
        > >
        > > In God,
        > >
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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