Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Re: [orthodox-synod] "It is time to learn our history"

Expand Messages
  • frvboldewskul@aol.com
    In a message dated 9/1/04 7:42:45 PM Pacific Daylight Time, ... Many many people have changed their views, because the situation in Russia and in the Russian
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 1, 2004
      In a message dated 9/1/04 7:42:45 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
      byakimov@... writes:

      > but on issues relating to the MP he has changed

      Many many people have changed their views, because the situation in Russia
      and in the Russian Church has changed dramatically in the last 16 years.
      Yesterday I had a warm 20 minute conversation with Archimandrite Luke, who is on the
      Commission and whose views on the question of the Moscow Patriarchate are well
      known to anyone who has read Orthodox Life since 1989 when he became editor.
      As he noted in his report, he was really struck by the changes. For example,
      when he was there 30 plus years ago, every corner had a banner "Lenin lives."
      I remarked that now there is an icon instead, to which he replied "and how."
      Many people feared giving legitimacy to the Moscow Patriarchate, but now
      cannot deny that there is a renewal from within occurring, and that the remaining
      problems should be resolved with our direct, positive assistance. As Fr. Luke
      noted, we are now discussing the issues that have divided us.

      It seems to me that the essence of our history which we must come to realize,
      is that we had lived with the hope that one day our prayers, as written in
      the Prayer for the Salvation of Russia, would be heard. Perhaps someone can post
      that prayer. Few believed change would occur in their lifetimes. At the same
      time, each had his own internal vision as to how the future liberation of
      Russia and restoration of the Russian Church would occur. An invasion from China,
      an earthquake, a military coup with Vladimir Kyrilich leading on a horse, or
      some other way? It takes time to notice subtle changes. It takes time to
      reconcile preconceived notions with reality on the field. It takes time to grasp
      the ever changing field. It takes time to reconcile all these changes into a
      new governing, personal paradigm. It is hard to except that what we perceive
      is the case, may not be the case. It takes time to adjust personal experience
      with new experiences. It is my general view that in many cases, the strong
      statements of concern (which at times has become rather mean) is rooted in the
      difficulty of reconciling old models and perceptions with the new ecclesiastical
      reality in Russia. I do think that steadily this is changing in our Church.
      There is nothing wrong in adjusting ones views, even if they seem to
      contradict, since Orthodoxy a living spirit that can transform everything around us.

      Yes, there are issues that have divided us and divide us with the Moscow
      Patriarchate, and these issues (sergianism, ecumenism) as Fr. Luke made very
      clear in his report and to me personally yesterday, are being discussed in a real,
      serious and open manner. There will be no Liturgical concelebration until
      these issues are resolved in an Orthodox manner.

      Did Fr. Alexander and many others hold different views before, probably yes.
      Why, because it was a different time and things were different in the Russian
      Church. The Moscow Patriarchate has changed its direction closer and closer to
      our position. The Orthodox position. And we cannot ignore that, nor turn our
      backs. Yesterday a priest who spoke strongly at the Jackson meeting against
      the Moscow Patriarchate, forcefully declared in Jordanville: "we must united
      around our Metropolitan!". I agree. Our Metropolitan is right, and he knows
      after 50 years of pastoral service the essence of Orthodoxy. In any case, He
      knows it much better than anyone on this or any other list.

      I do hope this is of some us to someone out there. If note, sorry to take up
      so much of each reader's time.

      In Christ,
      Priest Victor Boldewskul


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • romanraskolnikov
      I think that the important lesson learned here is that the unworthy protodeacon maintain sobriety before pressing send on his posts. --unworthy sinner in
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 1, 2004
        I think that the important lesson learned here is that the unworthy
        protodeacon maintain sobriety before pressing "send" on his posts.
        --unworthy sinner in Christ,
        Roman



        --- In orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com, byakimov@c... wrote:
        >
        > Forgive me Father Victor & Father Alexander I did go over board on
        this & I
        > know Father Alexander
        > is very bright but on issues relating to the MP he has changed &
        I should
        > said no more then that but as Father Victor
        > kindly pointed out I am indeed unworthy & a sinner.
        >
        > Again I ask Father Alexander to forgive as in my haste I wasted my
        time &
        > erred.
        >
        > Forgive me Father Alexander I should have not written what I wrote
        &
        > perhaps even my answer to Phil if it offends
        > anyone I ask forgiveness also.
        >
        > unworthy protodeacon Basil from Canberra
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > "lochmatow" <lochmven@n...> on 02/09/2004 12:01:27 PM
        >
        > Please respond to orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com
        >
        > To: orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com
        > cc:
        > Subject: [orthodox-synod] "It is time to learn our history"
        >
        >
        > Our "tall in stature" unworthy protodeacon in Australia has himself
        > gone overboard ! Father Alexander Lebed while at the Seminary in
        > Jordanville was one of the brightest and most intelligent students
        in
        > the history of said school. He then continued his education at
        > Norwich University and finally, Yale. At a early age was ordained
        and
        > has dedicated his life to the Holy Russian Orthodox Church. I for
        one
        > cannot stand by and watch such innuendo and slander.
        > Be careful Father Deacon. If stories of student life in Jordanville
        > were to be told, a few could also be told about yourself and they
        > would not be hearsay, but actual accounts to which I was a witness.
        > d.Victor
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Archives located at http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
      • DDD
        Forgive me, Deacon Basil. If I had read your post belowI would not have written or needed to write my previous post to you. *Except* that I find nothing in
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 2, 2004
          Forgive me, Deacon Basil. If I had read your post belowI would not have written or needed to write my previous post to you. *Except* that I find nothing in Fr. Alexander's article to be quoted out of context. He is actually putting the oft-quoted words of Metr. Anassasy about no relations with the MP *into* context, the context being: "for so long as they are found in close, active, and
          benevolent cooperation with the Soviet regime, which
          openly confesses its total-godlessness and strives to
          implant atheism in the entire Russian nation"

          Whatever the current Russian regime is, it is *not* confessing godlessness and is *not* striving to implant atheism into the Russian nation.

          --Dimitra D.

          ______________________________________

          On 2 Sep 2004 08:32:12 -0000, orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com wrote:
          From: byakimov@...
          Subject:


          Forgive me Father Victor & Father Alexander I did go over board on this & I
          know Father Alexander
          is very bright but on issues relating to the MP he has changed & I should
          said no more then that but as Father Victor
          kindly pointed out I am indeed unworthy & a sinner.

          Again I ask Father Alexander to forgive as in my haste I wasted my time &
          erred.

          Forgive me Father Alexander I should have not written what I wrote &
          perhaps even my answer to Phil if it offends
          anyone I ask forgiveness also.

          unworthy protodeacon Basil from Canberra
        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.