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Re: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov

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  • michael nikitin
    Yes, I believe Peter Ustinov is Metr.Vitaly s half-brother. Metr.Vitaly is head of ROCOR(V) or ROCIE. www.russianorthodoxchurchinexile.com Michael N tvrfcc
    Message 1 of 12 , Apr 2, 2004
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      Yes, I believe Peter Ustinov is Metr.Vitaly's half-brother.

      Metr.Vitaly is head of ROCOR(V) or ROCIE.

      www.russianorthodoxchurchinexile.com

      Michael N

      tvrfcc <ccalin@...> wrote:
      I have been told that Peter Ustinov is related to the retired
      Metropolitan. Any truth to that? Thanks.

      Igumen Christopher
      NYC

      Sir Peter Ustinov
      1921-2004





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    • Fr. Basil Grisel
      It was posted earlier, Metropolitan Vitaly and Peter Usitnov are not related at all. ... From: William Zurmuehl To:
      Message 2 of 12 , Apr 2, 2004
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        It was posted earlier, Metropolitan Vitaly and Peter Usitnov are not related at all.
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: William Zurmuehl<mailto:sdnjosephz@...>
        To: orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com<mailto:orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Friday, April 02, 2004 10:17 AM
        Subject: RE: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov


        I heard that through the grapevine myself a time or two

        Subdeacon Joseph Zurmuehl
        Joy of all Who Sorrow Orthodox Church
        Russian Orthodox Church Abroad





        >From: "tvrfcc" <ccalin@...<mailto:ccalin@...>>
        >Reply-To: orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com<mailto:orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com>
        >To: orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com<mailto:orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com>
        >Subject: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov
        >Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 05:52:04 -0000
        >
        >I have been told that Peter Ustinov is related to the retired
        >Metropolitan. Any truth to that? Thanks.
        >
        >Igumen Christopher
        >NYC
        >
        >Sir Peter Ustinov
        >1921-2004
        >
        >
        >

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      • Elias Gorsky
        Even though Father Alexei Duncan remembers Vladika Vitaly saying it was just a rumor, I remember the opposite, that Metropolitan Vitaly said that he WAS
        Message 3 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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          Even though Father Alexei Duncan remembers Vladika Vitaly saying it was just
          a rumor, I remember the opposite, that Metropolitan Vitaly said that he WAS
          related to him, a distant cousin. But since I am older, my memory is
          probably suspect, so I checked with my matushka and she remembers the same
          (but she's getting on in years, too; and now she is a grandmother, to boot,
          so go figure).

          Now we will hear more memoirs on this important subject ... [;-))>>

          Greetings to everyone on the conclusion of the Holy Quadecimacy. (can
          someone suggest a better translation of "Chetyredesyatnitsa"?)

          With love in Christ,
          p.Ilya

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Fr. John R. Shaw [mailto:vrevjrs@...]
          Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 7:42 AM
          To: orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Fw: Re: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov


          Regarding:

          > It was posted earlier, Metropolitan Vitaly and Peter Usitnov are not
          related at all.

          JRS: They were certainly *related* -- the question is merely how close
          the relationship was!

          In Christ
          Fr. John R. Shaw




          --
          CoreComm Webmail.
          http://home.core.com

          ----------


          Regarding:

          > It was posted earlier, Metropolitan Vitaly and Peter Usitnov are not
          related at all.

          JRS: They were certainly *related* -- the question is merely how close
          the relationship was.

          In Christ
          Fr. John R. Shaw




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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        • antiquariu@aol.com
          In a message dated 4/3/2004 11:39:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, elias.gorsky@egcon.com writes: Even though Father Alexei Duncan remembers Vladika Vitaly saying
          Message 4 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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            In a message dated 4/3/2004 11:39:09 AM Eastern Standard Time,
            elias.gorsky@... writes:
            Even though Father Alexei Duncan remembers Vladika Vitaly saying it was just
            a rumor, I remember the opposite, that Metropolitan Vitaly said that he WAS
            related to him, a distant cousin.
            Batushki and others, bless!

            I'm always amused by the need of the diaspora Orthodox to get in with the "me
            too" validations, so as to show that we Orthodox are cool, too. Sir Peter
            was a marginally practising Lutheran and exile British subject, born in England
            as the son of a German father of Russian ancestry and a French mother of
            Russian ancestry. His grandfather had been a Tsarist officer who was exiled for
            refusing to swear the loyalty oath to the Orthodox Church under Alexander III,
            who had instituted such a requirement in an effort to Russify the increasingly
            cosmopolitan (and German/Finnish and French-speaking) elites in the military
            and nobility after 150 years of relatively secular post-Petrine Russia. He
            moved to Wuerttemberg with his German wife. Wuerttemberg was a liberal Germanic
            principality, the princess of which, Olga von Hohenlohe, was a daughter of the
            Tsar who received many refugees from her autocratic father.

            The Ustinovs may have been related, but it was extremely distant, and
            certainly not something that Sir Peter ever made any comments on. He was extremely
            negative to the ritualism of Orthodoxy as well as other liturgical faiths,
            refering to it has buffoonery on more than one occasion.

            And it's not exactly an uncommon name. Metropolitan Vitaly's father served
            in the Caucasus and the Black Sea Fleet, Sir Peter's grandfather was an army
            officer.

            Cheers,

            Vova Hindrichs


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Wally Wally
            Peter Ustinov was Vladika Vitaly`s second cousin. Vladika was my spiritual father for over 30 years. michael nikitin wrote:Yes, I
            Message 5 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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              Peter Ustinov was Vladika Vitaly`s second cousin. Vladika was my spiritual father for over 30 years.

              michael nikitin <nikitinmike@...> wrote:Yes, I believe Peter Ustinov is Metr.Vitaly's half-brother.

              Metr.Vitaly is head of ROCOR(V) or ROCIE.

              www.russianorthodoxchurchinexile.com

              Michael N

              tvrfcc <ccalin@...> wrote:
              I have been told that Peter Ustinov is related to the retired
              Metropolitan. Any truth to that? Thanks.

              Igumen Christopher
              NYC

              Sir Peter Ustinov
              1921-2004





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            • Fr. John R. Shaw
              ... the me ... JRS: Nevertheless, we are all related in any case. Those of us who accept the Biblical account of Adam and Eve as literal know this, and there
              Message 6 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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                Vova Hindrichs wrote:

                > I'm always amused by the need of the diaspora Orthodox to get in with
                the "me
                > too" validations, so as to show that we Orthodox are cool, too.

                JRS: Nevertheless, we are all related in any case.

                Those of us who accept the Biblical account of Adam and Eve as literal
                know this, and there are references to the fact in the Orthodox funeral
                service.

                Those, on the other hand, who believe in Darwinism and evolution also
                have to believe the same thing. For a new species to "evolve", it would
                ultimately have to go back to one source, one "gene pool", and one
                parentage.

                Not everyone who has the same surname is closely related, but we are
                all related in the long run. And most of those with a relatively
                uncommon last name, could trace it back to one ancestor.

                Thus, as George Bernard Shaw once quipped, "The Shaws, like most of the
                Irish, came from Yorkshire".

                > Sir Peter
                > was ... born in England
                > as the son of a German father of Russian ancestry and a French mother
                of
                > Russian ancestry.

                JRS: In his own words, he was "conceived in St. Petersburg, born in
                London and baptized in Germany".

                Vl. Vitaly was both conceived and born in St. Petersburg, about a
                decade earlier.

                > His grandfather had been a Tsarist officer who was exiled for
                > refusing to swear the loyalty oath to the Orthodox Church under
                Alexander III...

                JRS: According to Sir Peter, that is not exactly how it was.

                His grandfather was raised in the Orthodox Church, but apostasized and
                turned Protestant, which was what led to his punishment by exile.

                > The Ustinovs may have been related, but it was extremely distant, and
                > certainly not something that Sir Peter ever made any comments on.

                JRS: In one of his writings, which I haven't time to look up now, he
                did mention having a relative who was a Russian Orthodox bishop, and
                whom he found exasperating.

                He described a conversation in which the unnamed bishop told him, "We
                are gaining more converts all the time, mostly at the expense of the
                Roman Catholics".

                That remark struck Sir Peter as utterly narrow and fanatical!

                > He was extremely
                > negative to the ritualism of Orthodoxy as well as other liturgical
                faiths,
                > refering to it has buffoonery on more than one occasion.

                JRS: Yes, that sounds like him.

                However, he also had a curious kind of hate/love relationship with the
                Orthodox Church, perhaps a little along the lines of the late Leo N.
                Tolstoy's attitude.

                > And it's not exactly an uncommon name. Metropolitan Vitaly's father
                served
                > in the Caucasus and the Black Sea Fleet, Sir Peter's grandfather was
                an army
                > officer.

                JRS: The name is not all that common.

                It is derived from "Iustin" (Justin), which was transformed
                into "Ustin" by dropping the initial "I" in the same way as "Iulian"
                (Julian) became "Ulyan", and gave rise to the surname "Ulyanov".

                In Christ
                Fr. John R. Shaw
              • Fr. Alexis Duncan
                You must not be that much older...after all, you came up with quadecimacy! ... From: Elias Gorsky [mailto:elias.gorsky@egcon.com] Sent: Saturday, April 03,
                Message 7 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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                  You must not be that much older...after all, you came up with
                  "quadecimacy!"
                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Elias Gorsky [mailto:elias.gorsky@...]
                  Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 11:31 AM
                  To: 'orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com'
                  Subject: RE: Re: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov


                  Even though Father Alexei Duncan remembers Vladika Vitaly
                  saying it was just
                  a rumor, I remember the opposite, that Metropolitan Vitaly said
                  that he WAS
                  related to him, a distant cousin. But since I am older, my
                  memory is
                  probably suspect, so I checked with my matushka and she
                  remembers the same
                  (but she's getting on in years, too; and now she is a
                  grandmother, to boot,
                  so go figure).


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • antiquariu@aol.com
                  In a message dated 4/3/2004 3:55:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, vrevjrs@execpc.com writes: JRS: In his own words, he was conceived in St. Petersburg, born in
                  Message 8 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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                    In a message dated 4/3/2004 3:55:39 PM Eastern Standard Time,
                    vrevjrs@... writes:
                    JRS: In his own words, he was "conceived in St. Petersburg, born in
                    London and baptized in Germany".
                    Father bless!

                    I think Sir Peter was using a figure of speech here to laud his Russian
                    roots. In an exhaustive personal interview with Der Spiegel, he provides his
                    genealogy; the Wurttemberg connection is pretty explicit, and he specifically
                    states that the period of exile -- 40 years -- for his grandfather is what soured
                    the family on Imperial Russia.

                    But I do agree with your comment that everyone is related, and that holds
                    true whether you subscribe to Adam and Eve or mitochondrial evidence, and I
                    accept both. My "me too" comment was not directed at you, Father, since you are
                    one of the most reasonable voices in this medium and I respect what you have to
                    say practically all of the time. Rather, it was directed at the rash of
                    commentary that comes up when almost anyone with a Slavic surname pops up in the
                    obits or the People section.

                    Father bless, and best wishes for the impending Resurrection!

                    Vova Hindrichs


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Elias Gorsky
                    It s that dang English language; can t say anything right in it! ... From: Fr. Alexis Duncan [mailto:7848@adelphia.net] Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 4:23 PM
                    Message 9 of 12 , Apr 3, 2004
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                      It's that dang English language; can't say anything right in it!

                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: Fr. Alexis Duncan [mailto:7848@...]
                      Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 4:23 PM
                      To: orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: RE: Re: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov

                      You must not be that much older...after all, you came up with
                      "quadecimacy!"
                      -----Original Message-----
                      From: Elias Gorsky [mailto:elias.gorsky@...]
                      Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2004 11:31 AM
                      To: 'orthodox-synod@yahoogroups.com'
                      Subject: RE: Re: [orthodox-synod] Peter Ustinov


                      Even though Father Alexei Duncan remembers Vladika Vitaly
                      saying it was just
                      a rumor, I remember the opposite, that Metropolitan Vitaly said
                      that he WAS
                      related to him, a distant cousin. But since I am older, my
                      memory is
                      probably suspect, so I checked with my matushka and she
                      remembers the same
                      (but she's getting on in years, too; and now she is a
                      grandmother, to boot,
                      so go figure).


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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