Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

2551Re: [orthodox-synod] Troparia for Fathers of First Six Ecumenical Councils and Damnation

Expand Messages
  • Dionysios
    Jul 31, 2000
    • 0 Attachment
      Remember, it was "not just anyone" this is our church.
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Sandra Thompson
      To: orthodox-synod@egroups.com
      Sent: Monday, July 31, 2000 12:53 PM
      Subject: Re: [orthodox-synod] Troparia for Fathers of First Six Ecumenical Councils and Damnation


      I cannot understand how anyone can say who is in hell. Even Jesus said
      Judas is in his own place, he did not say in hell. I have always been
      afraid that if we say a person or a class of people are in hell, we are thus
      condemning ourselves.


      Message -----
      From: Daniel Lieuwen <lieuwen@...-labs.com>
      To: <orthodox-synod@egroups.com>
      Sent: Monday, July 31, 2000 9:36 AM
      Subject: [orthodox-synod] Troparia for Fathers of First Six Ecumenical
      Councils and Damnation


      > What really stuck out this weekend was one of the troparia which we sung
      > last night and this morning:
      >
      > The mindless Arius, showing himself to be a servant of a created being,
      > and Macedonius, likewise revealed as abominable,
      > are equally tormented in the fire of Gehenna with the Hellenes.
      >
      > There are very few direct statements in the liturgical texts about who is
      in
      > hell,
      > although many more in heaven (all the canonized saints are by virtue of
      > their
      > canonization known to be in heaven--they would not have been canonized
      > otherwise). This is only the second such troparia that I know of. The
      > other
      > says that Arius is tormented with the Hagarenes. Note that while classes
      of
      > people are mentioned, individuals (other than Arius and Macedonius) are
      > not. I do not know of any other individuals specifically listed among the
      > damned.
      > This shows how extraordinarily seriously the church took these heresies
      that
      > attacked
      > the divinity of the Son and the Spirit. Even great persecuters are not
      > mentioned
      > liturgically. I heard that an iconographer (in the free world)
      > put Stalin in his depiction of hell--and was
      > told he must remove it because we do not know who is in hell. (Stalin
      > certainly
      > seems likely, even if we cannot say with certainty, I must say).
      >
      > Am I missing other cases of people liturgically mentioned as in
      > Gehenna?
      >
      > Under the mercy,
      >
      > Daniel
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > This mailing list's archives are at
      http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod
      >
      >


      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------



      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      This mailing list's archives are at http://www.egroups.com/group/orthodox-synod





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Show all 3 messages in this topic