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Re: [orthodox-rocor] Re: more on 'The Golden Compass'

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  • Benjamin Bryant
    Ok. I used to hate all key lime pie - until I had a taste of a proper key-lime pie... Don t we Orthodox also hate all organized worship...save for Holy
    Message 1 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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      Ok.  I used to hate "all" key lime pie - until I had a taste of a proper key-lime pie...  Don't we Orthodox also hate all organized worship...save for Holy Orthodoxy which we love?  Since there is only one True Faith, can we really blame anyone who has not experienced it for hating "all religion"?

      Notwithstanding that there is a big contextual difference between soviet propaganda and Pullman's storytelling, I don't think that we should haphazardly "feed" anything to our children without knowing and communicating what it is and where it comes from.  Furthermore, one could make the argument the Little Mermaid (and the majority of Disney films) which subtly teaches our kids to "distrust their stupid parents if you want to do great things" is far more dangerous.  Even so, I didn't see a problem with sitting down with my daughter to watch this film when she was 5 years old.  But, you can be sure that we discussed it.  I would submit that no film is "safe" for parents to let their children freely consume without discussion, period.  No film is ok for everyone, and some films should be avoided altogether by most, if not all, for blatantly and purposefully graphic and/or blasphemous visual content.  Philisophical content, however, can always be discussed in the light of the Holy and Eternal Truth, and should be.  The Truth always prevails.  Darkeness flees from the Light.

      There are some who are concerned about the financial contribution to Pullman associated with watching the movie.  I am not one of them.  Regarding his motives, I wouldn't know, but it is my assessment that Pullman writes what fancies him, just like everyone else.  And, he wants to make money doing it.  If he really is a fully understanding anti-Orthodox atheist, then let him make all the money he wants...but I don't think he is.

      "Another tool" for Satan?  I don't think so.  There is nothing new to atheism, atheists, or atheist-inspired writing.  I see most modern atheism as being the child of western heresy.  What *is* new is that we might get some insight in to mind of modern atheism - might help those of us who engage with atheists on a day-to-day basis to angle our presentation of the Truth in a more meaningful way to them.  We might even come up with a proper interpretation of this film's content that ultimately glorifies God in a big way.

      Orthodoxy already condemns atheism.  We all know that.  Let's make people aware than Pullman is a purposeful atheist.  Ok, fine.  We've done that.  Yet, I think if we "turn the volume" up so much on the condemnation of this film we end up looking like a bunch of foolish protestants.  Being still wet with the Holy Chrism, this especially bothers me <grin>.

      Ben



      ----- Original Message ----
      From: George <kharaku@...>
      To: orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2007 10:39:59 PM
      Subject: Re: [orthodox-rocor] Re: more on 'The Golden Compass'


      On Saturday, December 08, 2007, at 08:24AM, "Benjamin Bryant" <bl_bryant@yahoo. com> wrote:
      >A few questions:
      >
      >1. Does Pullman hate God, or does he hate his own misconception of God? If he merely hates the false 'god' of the west, then he and I would be at least in some agreement.

      he hates organized worship period. he's stated as far as I recall a hope that his work encourages folks to abandon all organized worship not simply Christian worship.

      >2. Even if he understands who the One True God of the Orthodox Faith is and yet still hates Him, should the Church of Christ be so threatened by the hopes of this would-be rich atheist?

      Well. Should they have felt threatened by the soviet propaganda? many took the view of no and look where that led. never feed your children enemy propaganda; there's no good end to it.

      >3. If #2 is true then might we simply speed him on his way to wealth and prosperity so that he can all the sooner choke on them?

      his work isn't about getting rich it's about seducing young minds against God, the same as the Soviets did.

      >4. Certainly God is not threatened by Pullman's stories. He will use them for the accomplishment of His good will or else they would not exist. If we are so worried about them then where is our faith?

      Certainly Satan is happy with yet another tool to steal the sheep away.

      >I would like to see some Orthodox Christian engage Pullman in a dialog so that we can really understand where he is coming from.

      I would like to see all Orthodox condemn athiests propaganda period.

      George Greem

      >Ben
      >
      >----- Original Message ----
      >From: George <kharaku@mac. com>
      >To: orthodox-rocor@ yahoogroups. com
      >Sent: Friday, December 7, 2007 9:12:30 PM
      >Subject: Re: [orthodox-rocor] Re: more on 'The Golden Compass'
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      >>2) Increase sales of his God-hating books, which have not been cleaned up at all, unlike the movie... which will make the God-hating author richer still, and expose many more children to his God-hating ideas.
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      >which is exactly what the author hopes!
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      >george green
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    • Benjamin Bryant
      Father Bless! Hey thanks! I wouldn t have known if didn t say something. Ben ... From: Fr David Straut To:
      Message 2 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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        Father Bless!

        Hey thanks!  I wouldn't have known if didn't say something.

        Ben

        ----- Original Message ----
        From: Fr David Straut <frdavidstraut@...>
        To: orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Sunday, December 9, 2007 12:32:18 PM
        Subject: Re: [orthodox-rocor] Re: more on 'The Golden Compass'


        --- Benjamin Bryant <bl_bryant@yahoo. com> wrote:

        >
        > Arius was a bishop of the Church,

        Actually, Arius was a presbyter, not a Bishop.

        Fr David Straut

        ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
        Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail. yahoo.com




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      • Al Green
        ... themselves from this intentional blasphemous nonsense. ... ***I ll see the film later this sweek. I found a good theater cam copy on the internet to
        Message 3 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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          --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, George <kharaku@...> wrote:
          >
          >
          > >***If I were the producer of the Golden Compass, I would be just
          > >ecstatic over the negative publicity. All that has been written is
          > >100 percent free publicity and because of it I would be much richer.
          > >Controversy breeds curiosity and that results in greenbacks in my
          > >pocket.
          >
          > Let the atheists and apostates read it and let the Orthodox keep
          themselves from this intentional blasphemous nonsense.
          >
          > George Green


          ***I'll see the film later this sweek. I found a good theater cam copy
          on the internet to download... I'll get back to you. I'll be traveling
          Thursday and Friday and I'll watch the film in the motel room...

          Al
        • DDD
          Ben wrote: Yet, I think if we turn the volume up so much on the condemnation of this film we end up looking like a bunch of foolish protestants. Being
          Message 4 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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            Ben wrote:

             

            Yet, I think if we "turn the volume" up so much on the condemnation of this film we end up looking like a bunch of foolish protestants.  Being still wet with the Holy Chrism, this especially bothers me <grin>.”

             

            The fact is, “foolish protestants” aren’t incorrect about *everything.*  Sometimes (even) they can recognize the work of the evil one.  Some of them get so good at it that they eventually become Orthodox! ;)

            But we Orthodox shouldn’t worry about who we look like; we only need to say what needs saying, and not be cowed or intimidated into silence because it’s not politically correct—or because it sounds like…. Protestants <grin>.

             

            --Dimitra Dwelley

          • Fr David Straut
            Perhaps you should not broadcast an activity of questionable legality over the internet. I hope no law enforcement officials join you in your motel room. ;-)
            Message 5 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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              Perhaps you should not broadcast an activity of questionable legality
              over the internet. I hope no law enforcement officials join you in your
              motel room. ;-)

              Fr David Straut


              --- Al Green <aggreen1@...> wrote:

              > --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, George <kharaku@...> wrote:
              > >
              > >
              > > >***If I were the producer of the Golden Compass, I would be just
              > > >ecstatic over the negative publicity. All that has been written is
              >
              > > >100 percent free publicity and because of it I would be much
              > richer.
              > > >Controversy breeds curiosity and that results in greenbacks in my
              > > >pocket.
              > >
              > > Let the atheists and apostates read it and let the Orthodox keep
              > themselves from this intentional blasphemous nonsense.
              > >
              > > George Green
              >
              >
              > ***I'll see the film later this sweek. I found a good theater cam
              > copy
              > on the internet to download... I'll get back to you. I'll be
              > traveling
              > Thursday and Friday and I'll watch the film in the motel room...
              >
              > Al
              >
              >
              >
              >



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            • Archpriest Stefan Pavlenko
              Get ready to see the Orthodox Church blasphemed in certain scenes showing the outer wall of a building made to look like a Russian Orthodox Church Altar
              Message 6 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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                Get ready to see the Orthodox Church blasphemed in certain scenes
                showing the outer wall of a building made to look like a Russian
                Orthodox Church Altar Screen, Icons, lamps, Holy (Royal)Gates and all-
                -desecrated by the hero Polar Bear King. Also the evil Army of the
                Magisterium is made up of Russian speaking Cossacks sicing
                their "Demon" dogs on innocent and helpless children. The story is
                stupid, complicated and needlessly convoluted, but the imagery is
                rich, fascinating; and sinister images were chosen very specifically
                to disparage things that are Sacred to Christians, with a special
                effort to envisage Orthodox Iconography and to disparage it!

                Archpriest Stefan Pavlenko




                --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, "Al Green" <aggreen1@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, George <kharaku@> wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > > >***If I were the producer of the Golden Compass, I would be just
                > > >ecstatic over the negative publicity. All that has been written
                is
                > > >100 percent free publicity and because of it I would be much
                richer.
                > > >Controversy breeds curiosity and that results in greenbacks in
                my
                > > >pocket.
                > >
                > > Let the atheists and apostates read it and let the Orthodox keep
                > themselves from this intentional blasphemous nonsense.
                > >
                > > George Green
                >
                >
                > ***I'll see the film later this sweek. I found a good theater cam
                copy
                > on the internet to download... I'll get back to you. I'll be
                traveling
                > Thursday and Friday and I'll watch the film in the motel room...
                >
                > Al
                >
              • Al Green
                ***Good point! ;-) However, I will not have spent a dime to see it. Al ... legality ... your ... just ... written is ... my ... keep
                Message 7 of 23 , Dec 10, 2007
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                  ***Good point! ;-) However, I will not have spent a dime to see it.

                  Al


                  --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, Fr David Straut
                  <frdavidstraut@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Perhaps you should not broadcast an activity of questionable
                  legality
                  > over the internet. I hope no law enforcement officials join you in
                  your
                  > motel room. ;-)
                  >
                  > Fr David Straut
                  >
                  >
                  > --- Al Green <aggreen1@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, George <kharaku@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > >***If I were the producer of the Golden Compass, I would be
                  just
                  > > > >ecstatic over the negative publicity. All that has been
                  written is
                  > >
                  > > > >100 percent free publicity and because of it I would be much
                  > > richer.
                  > > > >Controversy breeds curiosity and that results in greenbacks in
                  my
                  > > > >pocket.
                  > > >
                  > > > Let the atheists and apostates read it and let the Orthodox
                  keep
                  > > themselves from this intentional blasphemous nonsense.
                  > > >
                  > > > George Green
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ***I'll see the film later this sweek. I found a good theater cam
                  > > copy
                  > > on the internet to download... I'll get back to you. I'll be
                  > > traveling
                  > > Thursday and Friday and I'll watch the film in the motel room...
                  > >
                  > > Al
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > __________________________________________________________
                  > Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com
                  >
                • Al Green
                  ***Quick follow up. the drive to concord, New Hampshire Thursday turned out to be a treacherous trip. the six-hour drive was doubled. When I got to the motel I
                  Message 8 of 23 , Dec 14, 2007
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                    ***Quick follow up. the drive to concord, New Hampshire Thursday
                    turned out to be a treacherous trip. the six-hour drive was doubled.
                    When I got to the motel I crashed without supper and slept 'till this
                    morning. I watched no movie...didn't even bring the portable DVD
                    player out of the truck. Today's drive home after picking up our
                    daughter was a breeze...the roads were clear.

                    ***Glad I'm home in the Endless Mountains of Northeast Pennsylvania
                    where the warning of a heavy nor'easter snowstorm with possible
                    blizzard conditions Saturday night through Monday morning will
                    probably necessitate my watching Divine Liturgy live-streamed over
                    the internet! My garden tractor and snow blower is getting a good
                    workout. See the last picture at
                    http://aggreen.net/homestead/homestead.html

                    Al

                    --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, "Al Green" <aggreen1@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > ***Good point! ;-) However, I will not have spent a dime to see
                    it.
                    >
                    > Al
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, Fr David Straut
                    > <frdavidstraut@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Perhaps you should not broadcast an activity of questionable
                    > legality
                    > > over the internet. I hope no law enforcement officials join you
                    in
                    > your
                    > > motel room. ;-)
                    > >
                    > > Fr David Straut
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- Al Green <aggreen1@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > > --- In orthodox-rocor@yahoogroups.com, George <kharaku@> wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > >***If I were the producer of the Golden Compass, I would be
                    > just
                    > > > > >ecstatic over the negative publicity. All that has been
                    > written is
                    > > >
                    > > > > >100 percent free publicity and because of it I would be much
                    > > > richer.
                    > > > > >Controversy breeds curiosity and that results in greenbacks
                    in
                    > my
                    > > > > >pocket.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Let the atheists and apostates read it and let the Orthodox
                    > keep
                    > > > themselves from this intentional blasphemous nonsense.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > George Green
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > ***I'll see the film later this sweek. I found a good theater
                    cam
                    > > > copy
                    > > > on the internet to download... I'll get back to you. I'll be
                    > > > traveling
                    > > > Thursday and Friday and I'll watch the film in the motel room...
                    > > >
                    > > > Al
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > __________________________________________________________
                    > > Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com
                    > >
                    >
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