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Clinch Mountain Backstep

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  • Anna Snook
    Dad and I have been going back and forth with this song; what the chords are for it. In my group, The Band Annas , the chords just consist of Ami and E
    Message 1 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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      Dad and I have been going back and forth with this song; what the
      chords are for it. In my group, 'The Band Annas', the chords just
      consist of Ami and E (maybe 'cause we just started picking a little less
      than a year ago) but Dad insists that the chords switch from A to G and
      then to E. I have heard this song a lot lately, at Wenatche especially,
      but several times at Stevenson as well. As in a jam, sometimes people
      don't play the same chords, so I couldn't really tell which was the
      majority. All of the performing bands at Wenatchee that played it played
      it with the Ami chord or from Ami to G....
      So what are your opinions on this? What chords have you heard the
      most, or seem the best. We probably won't change our version of it
      anyway, but I would like to hear someone else's ideas besides my own and
      Dad's all the time.
      ~Anna



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Jim Rooks
      ... the ... own and ... I m pretty sure tha Ralph s version is just A and E. Ralph didn t write tunes with too many chords. Witness Train 45.
      Message 2 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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        --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "Anna Snook" <anna@j...> wrote:
        > So what are your opinions on this? What chords have you heard
        the
        > most, or seem the best. We probably won't change our version of it
        > anyway, but I would like to hear someone else's ideas besides my
        own and
        > Dad's all the time.
        > ~Anna
        >
        I'm pretty sure tha Ralph's version is just A and E. Ralph didn't
        write tunes with too many chords. Witness Train 45.
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • mandoholic2@aol.com
        Okay, so I m a bit of a traditionalist. The chords for this tune are A and E, only. There is a minor sound to the tune, but that is supplied by the lead
        Message 3 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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          Okay, so I'm a bit of a traditionalist. The chords for this tune are A and
          E, only.
          There is a minor sound to the tune, but that is supplied by the lead
          instrument playing a C instead of C# and also G instead of G#. Am and G will work
          with this tune, but they will rob the tune of the tension that was intended by
          Dr. Ralph. It is very common in traditional bluegrass to play or sing minor
          scales against major chords, it's just part of the sound. Some of the more
          modern bands have changed the chords to pretty up the sound and make it more
          palatable to the masses and end up with, my opinion, folk music.

          Clyde Clevenger
          Just my opinion, but it's right.
          Visit our website at <A HREF="www.bluegrassboutique.com">www.bluegrassboutique.com</A>


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Dave Campbell
          I can be a bit of a non-traditionalist in my approach to things at times but I d have to say that Clyde is way right on this one. If you take the tension out
          Message 4 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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            I can be a bit of a non-traditionalist in my approach to things at times but
            I'd have to say that Clyde is way right on this one. If you take the
            tension out of this tune, you might as well just not play it (my opinion).
            You have to learn to truly revel in the dissonances. That is one of the
            characteristics that contributes strongly to the energy and emotion in
            bluegrass music.

            -Dave
            (Woodinville, WA)

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: <mandoholic2@...>
            To: <nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 5:17 PM
            Subject: Re: [nwbluegrass] Clinch Mountain Backstep


            > Okay, so I'm a bit of a traditionalist. The chords for this tune are A
            and
            > E, only...
            > ...Some of the more modern bands have changed the chords to pretty up the
            sound and > make it more palatable to the masses and end up with, my
            opinion, folk music.
            >
            > Clyde Clevenger
            > Just my opinion, but it's right.
          • eddard
            Heck, Anna, the Dillards play Clinch Mountain Backstep with a C and a D in it. (in the key of A major, not A minor) Alan Munde (and I) play it the way you
            Message 5 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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              Heck, Anna, the Dillards play "Clinch Mountain Backstep" with a C and a D in it. (in the key of A major, not A minor)

              Alan Munde (and I) play it the way you do, with just the Ami and Emi.

              I've heard people put a G in it sometimes; used pretty much the same way as in "Old Joe Clark," which "Clinch Mountain Backstep" resembles greatly. If one experiments at length with such differences (using the G or not) it does a lot to increase comprehension of just how much difference it makes; and in most cases the difference is very subtle, espcially when it's a major chord versus its relative minor, since G6 is identical to Emi7, containing exactly the same four notes; G,B,D, and E compared with E,G,B, and D.

              I also have a banjo-playing friend who plays it WITHOUT the backstep, so I've learned to play it fully prepared for that backstep either to be or not to be. And for just a moment, that IS the question.

              I personally remember that early in my bluegrass days, I often confused "Clinch Mountain Backstep" with a folk fersion of "Shady Grove" that I had learned long before and sung quite a bit. When they'd get to the backstep, I'd miss it, because I had a different tune running in my head. In those days, I thought Bluegrassers were a bunch of ignorant hillbillies because they didn't even know how "Shady Grove" was supposed to go. (The Bluegrass "Shady Grove" is very very different from the one I had been singing for next to ever, and it doesn't sound like "Clinch Mountain Backstep".)

              So a lot depends on where you learn a tune in the first place. Some songs end up being played so differently in one part of the U.S. from the way they're played in some other part of the U.S. that the two versions are not compatible with each other, and one fears to bring them out in a jam for fear of busting the jam. I'm aware of several, and I sure wish I could remember their names at the moment.

              I do know for sure that "Cherokee Shuffle" is played differently here than it is in West Virginia and Maryland, people from there remark on it if they come here, and I even got just one chance to hear it the "back east" way when I jammed with Bob Jones at the Fossil festival this year. It's just a small difference in the way the last line of the verse is delivered, they have what sounds to me like a repetition of one bar or two at that point in the song, and it puts people who know it their way out of sync with the band to try to play it the way it's done here. And while we're on "Cherokee Shuffle," there is a tune called "Lost Indian" which has the same chords as the "A" part of "Cherokee Shuffle," and no "B" part at all (consult Norman Blake and Tony Rice or the Osborne Brothers), but there is ANOTHER "Lost Indian" which doesn't sound like "Cherokee Shuffle" at all. (Bernie Stocks, Benny Thomasson, Country Gazette)

              Another famous one (not about chords, but about timing) is whether to hold the note in the melody on which the word "now" occurs in "Worried Man Blues," in the chorus where the words ar "I'm worried now, but I won't be worried long." The Kingston Trio did hold that note for three counts, bluegrassers generally do not, and I have seen disagreements about how it ought to be done get pretty heated, a few times in my life.

              I'd like to do "Cluck Old Hen," but I can't seem to find two versions that agree. I like Alison Krauss' version of it a lot, though, so may get into learning that one.

              I don't have a recording of "Clinch Mountain Backstep" by Ralph Stanley or the Stanley Brothers, But that has to be the authority in the case of "Clinch Mountain Backstep." It's their tune. Now; can we find two different Stanley recordings; one with and another without the G chord? Maybe. Sometimes a particular musician will change the way he does a tune over the years, and record it more than once, which further clouds the picture of how the song "REALLY" goes.

              One other example that comes to mind is "House of the Rising Sun." I first learned this song from Joan Baez' recording of it, which, in A minor uses E7, not D for the third chord, and never goes to F, the way Eric Burdon and the Animals recorded the song. But the Animals' recording was such a huge hit that most of America my age (60) and younger are dissatisfied with the song if it doesn't contain that F. I still think Joan had it right, using E7 in place of both the D and the F that the animals use. It's not really a 60's rock song, and that "power chord," (the F, so called because its third is the root of the tonic chord) doesn't sound like traditional American harmony to this player of fretted guitars. I do suspect that the use of the F was pioneered by a slide guitar player, and if I knew where the Animals learned the song, maybe I'd rest easier. We could also argue that D minor is a better chord than D major to use in this context, but nobody does it. The rule is: "SOME accidentals offend SOME ears. Some substututions also do." Totally useless rule, but it's true.

              I hope this is helpful. It's more or less my regular way of playing referee when people get into disagreements about how it goes. The sad thing is that they just quit talking about how it goes and agree to disagree, usually, and then they don't play that song together any more. A better plan is to take turns, play it one person's way one time, and the other person's way the next time. Then everybody's fully prepared for BOTH traditions.

              eddard
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Anna Snook
              To: nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 4:08 PM
              Subject: [nwbluegrass] Clinch Mountain Backstep


              Dad and I have been going back and forth with this song; what the
              chords are for it. In my group, 'The Band Annas', the chords just
              consist of Ami and E (maybe 'cause we just started picking a little less
              than a year ago) but Dad insists that the chords switch from A to G and
              then to E. I have heard this song a lot lately, at Wenatche especially,
              but several times at Stevenson as well. As in a jam, sometimes people
              don't play the same chords, so I couldn't really tell which was the
              majority. All of the performing bands at Wenatchee that played it played
              it with the Ami chord or from Ami to G....
              So what are your opinions on this? What chords have you heard the
              most, or seem the best. We probably won't change our version of it
              anyway, but I would like to hear someone else's ideas besides my own and
              Dad's all the time.
              ~Anna



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • eddard
              As so often happens, you hit the nail on the head, Dave; might as well not play the song as skip that tension. As a guitar player, I try to avoid the third in
              Message 6 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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                As so often happens, you hit the nail on the head, Dave; might as well not play the song as skip that tension.

                As a guitar player, I try to avoid the third in any block chords I play and just do the open fifths; A and E for the A chord and E and B for the E chord, so it's really as if I were droning every E on the guitar, and then moving back and forth between A and B for my chord changes. The G in the Emi chord doesn't really hurt the song, but I do NOT want to hear C#.

                This could be done best on an instrument tuned E A E A E A, or something like that. Then all you'd have to do is finger the A strings on the second fret when you went to the other chord, and then take 'em back off when you went to the other chord, and so on.
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Dave Campbell
                To: nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 6:13 PM
                Subject: Re: [nwbluegrass] Clinch Mountain Backstep


                I can be a bit of a non-traditionalist in my approach to things at times but
                I'd have to say that Clyde is way right on this one. If you take the
                tension out of this tune, you might as well just not play it (my opinion).
                You have to learn to truly revel in the dissonances. That is one of the
                characteristics that contributes strongly to the energy and emotion in
                bluegrass music.

                -Dave
                (Woodinville, WA)

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: <mandoholic2@...>
                To: <nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 5:17 PM
                Subject: Re: [nwbluegrass] Clinch Mountain Backstep


                > Okay, so I'm a bit of a traditionalist. The chords for this tune are A
                and
                > E, only...
                > ...Some of the more modern bands have changed the chords to pretty up the
                sound and > make it more palatable to the masses and end up with, my
                opinion, folk music.
                >
                > Clyde Clevenger
                > Just my opinion, but it's right.



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                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Matthew Snook
                I m afraid all of us old guys are weighing in against you this time, Anna. The chords are Amaj and Emaj or E7. Minors are not permitted. I know it sounds
                Message 7 of 19 , Jul 29, 2003
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                  I'm afraid all of us old guys are weighing in against you this time,
                  Anna. The chords are Amaj and Emaj or E7. Minors are not permitted. I
                  know it sounds minor, that's the beauty of the Mixolydian scale. I
                  throw the G in sometimes when the melody hits the G just to further
                  emphasize that flatted seventh note. But no minors. Your fiddle
                  teacher has never run into clever Clyde or Mr. Campbell at a jam! Your
                  break sounds great either way!

                  Now I'll betray my academic bent by backing up my assertions with some
                  references. Here are three:
                  http://www.co-mando.com/music/tab/showtab.cfm?tab_ID=173
                  http://users.argonet.co.uk/users/gatherer/tunes/tab/tab1/clin.html
                  http://www.singout.org/banjo463.pdf

                  The last is a complete transcription of Ralph's original recording, with
                  interpretation and some biographical notes. Just to keep things stirred
                  up a bit, there is also a quote from Ralph explaining that he plays
                  "old-time mountain music," not bluegrass.






                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: mandoholic2@... [mailto:mandoholic2@...]
                  Subject: Re: [nwbluegrass] Clinch Mountain Backstep

                  Okay, so I'm a bit of a traditionalist. The chords for this tune are A
                  and
                  E, only.
                  There is a minor sound to the tune, but that is supplied by the lead
                  instrument playing a C instead of C# and also G instead of G#. Am and G
                  will work
                  with this tune, but they will rob the tune of the tension...

                  Clyde Clevenger
                • Anna Snook
                  ;I also have a banjo-playing friend who plays it WITHOUT the backstep, so I ve learned to play it fully prepared for that backstep either to be or not to be.
                  Message 8 of 19 , Jul 30, 2003
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                    ;I also have a banjo-playing friend who plays it WITHOUT the backstep,
                    so I've learned to play it fully prepared for that backstep either to be
                    or not to be. And for just a moment, that IS the question.'

                    Hm, that's interesting. You'd think that without the backstep,
                    it wouldn't be a Backstep would it? But sometimes if I try it in a jam,
                    some jammers don't understand it, so I have to play it without. But I
                    still forget and play it everytime!

                    'Heck, Anna, the Dillards play "Clinch Mountain Backstep" with a C and a
                    D in it. (in the key of A major, not A minor)'
                    How did they do that? Where would you stick the C and D?

                    'Alan Munde (and I) play it the way you do, with just the Ami and Emi.'
                    Good, well then, I'll agree to agree with you and Alan Munde,
                    who, if I happened to play banjo, would be someone I would be inspired
                    by.

                    ~Anna



                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: eddard [mailto:eddard@...]
                    Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 8:25 PM
                    To: nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [nwbluegrass] Clinch Mountain Backstep
                  • mandoholic2@aol.com
                    If you listen to the early recordings of CMBS you will hear the rhythm instruments play right through the backstep, as if it weren t there, just the lead
                    Message 9 of 19 , Jul 30, 2003
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                      If you listen to the early recordings of CMBS you will hear the rhythm
                      instruments play right through the backstep, as if it weren't there, just the lead
                      players accent the backstep. I'ts just a 2/4 measure in the middle of the B
                      part and requires no change from the rhythm section, ya just gotta count.
                      That's the way I've played it for years, just as I don't jump up and down on the B
                      part of Gold Rush, undignified for a fat guy. Also, while I'm stirring the
                      pot, there is no Em in Foggy Mountain Breakdown, just an E. AND there should
                      never be a minor chord in Sittin' on Top of the World, unless you are in
                      California. Bluegrass isn't pretty. But I do like The Barley Brothers minor version
                      of Folsom Prison Blues. Okay, so I'm confused again.

                      Clyde Clevenger
                      Just my opinion, but it's right.
                      Visit our website at <A HREF="www.bluegrassboutique.com">www.bluegrassboutique.com</A>


                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Suzanne
                      Clyde - You re not a fat guy anymore. The new and reduced Clyde can jump up and down in a highly dignified manner, I m sure... now you ll be even more
                      Message 10 of 19 , Jul 31, 2003
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                        Clyde - You're not a fat guy anymore. The new and reduced Clyde can
                        jump up and down in a highly dignified manner, I'm sure... now you'll
                        be even more confused.


                        --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, mandoholic2@a... wrote:
                        > If you listen to the early recordings of CMBS you will hear the
                        rhythm
                        > instruments play right through the backstep, as if it weren't
                        there, just the lead
                        > players accent the backstep. I'ts just a 2/4 measure in the middle
                        of the B
                        > part and requires no change from the rhythm section, ya just gotta
                        count.
                        > That's the way I've played it for years, just as I don't jump up
                        and down on the B
                        > part of Gold Rush, undignified for a fat guy. Also, while I'm
                        stirring the
                        > pot, there is no Em in Foggy Mountain Breakdown, just an E. AND
                        there should
                        > never be a minor chord in Sittin' on Top of the World, unless you
                        are in
                        > California. Bluegrass isn't pretty. But I do like The Barley
                        Brothers minor version
                        > of Folsom Prison Blues. Okay, so I'm confused again.
                        >
                        > Clyde Clevenger
                        > Just my opinion, but it's right.
                        > Visit our website at <A
                        HREF="www.bluegrassboutique.com">www.bluegrassboutique.com</A>
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Zymoguy
                        So here s a question for you Clyde, one that I m sure you have an opinion on, (and of course it s right! :-) I learned to play Panhandle Rag in A, which is the
                        Message 11 of 19 , Jul 31, 2003
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                          So here's a question for you Clyde, one that I'm sure
                          you have an opinion on, (and of course it's right! :-)
                          I learned to play Panhandle Rag in A, which is the key
                          I think it sounds best in, but lots of other folks
                          play it in D. I was in two separate jams at Darrington
                          in which someone called the tune and everyone but me
                          knew to play it in D.

                          Now for a mandolin player, the transition from A to D
                          is pretty simple (just move everything up a set of
                          strings), though I tend to play it a little sloppier
                          out of D. But what I want to know is--what's RIGHT?

                          Dave Campbell said last night at practice that he
                          thinks it's regional. He said he's noticed that folks
                          from Oregon and CA tend to play it in D, while the
                          crusty old Washingtonians play it out of A. So how
                          about you folks from OR and CA: do you play this tune?
                          If you do, what key do you like? Any ideas of what key
                          it was written in?

                          Out of key in WA Jason


                          --- mandoholic2@... wrote:
                          > If you listen to the early recordings of CMBS you
                          > will hear the rhythm
                          > instruments play right through the backstep, as if
                          > it weren't there, just the lead
                          > players accent the backstep. I'ts just a 2/4
                          > measure in the middle of the B
                          > part and requires no change from the rhythm section,
                          > ya just gotta count.
                          > That's the way I've played it for years, just as I
                          > don't jump up and down on the B
                          > part of Gold Rush, undignified for a fat guy. Also,
                          > while I'm stirring the
                          > pot, there is no Em in Foggy Mountain Breakdown,
                          > just an E. AND there should
                          > never be a minor chord in Sittin' on Top of the
                          > World, unless you are in
                          > California. Bluegrass isn't pretty. But I do like
                          > The Barley Brothers minor version
                          > of Folsom Prison Blues. Okay, so I'm confused
                          > again.
                          >
                          > Clyde Clevenger
                          > Just my opinion, but it's right.
                          > Visit our website at <A
                          >
                          HREF="www.bluegrassboutique.com">www.bluegrassboutique.com</A>
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been
                          > removed]
                          >
                          >


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                        • Clyde Clevenger
                          ... As it turns out, I do have an opinion on Panhandle Rag. I learned the tune in A, which is right of course. BUT it seems that most folks west of the
                          Message 12 of 19 , Jul 31, 2003
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                            --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, Zymoguy <zymoguy@y...> wrote:
                            > So here's a question for you Clyde, one that I'm sure
                            > you have an opinion on, (and of course it's right! :-)
                            > I learned to play Panhandle Rag in A, which is the key
                            > I think it sounds best in, but lots of other folks
                            > play it in D. > >

                            As it turns out, I do have an opinion on Panhandle Rag. I learned
                            the tune in A, which is right of course. BUT it seems that most
                            folks west of the Mississippi play it in D, no problem on the
                            mandolin, but a little more work on guitar or banjo. There are a lot
                            of regional differences in tunes, and folks that will argue that
                            their way is the only way (not me) and most of them are wrong. In a
                            band setting I'm going to play the tune in the "right" key, in a jam
                            I will just go with the flow, it's all good. I have opinions, but I
                            don't judge. (unless it's a band contest)

                            Clyde (just my opinion, but it's right)
                          • pdx_malloy
                            ... singer. The best thing to do is learn it so good you can play it in any key. My Opinion Is a litlle more right than Clydes ... lot ... jam ... I
                            Message 13 of 19 , Jul 31, 2003
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                              --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "Clyde Clevenger"
                              <mandoholic2@a...> wrote:
                              > I always played it in C with the band I was in to accomadate the
                              singer. The best thing to do is learn it so good you can play it in
                              any key. My Opinion Is a litlle more right than Clydes
                              > As it turns out, I do have an opinion on Panhandle Rag. I learned
                              > the tune in A, which is right of course. BUT it seems that most
                              > folks west of the Mississippi play it in D, no problem on the
                              > mandolin, but a little more work on guitar or banjo. There are a
                              lot
                              > of regional differences in tunes, and folks that will argue that
                              > their way is the only way (not me) and most of them are wrong. In a
                              > band setting I'm going to play the tune in the "right" key, in a
                              jam
                              > I will just go with the flow, it's all good. I have opinions, but
                              I
                              > don't judge. (unless it's a band contest)
                              >
                              > Clyde (just my opinion, but it's right)
                            • Sally Jane Wilson
                              Jason, A whole bunch of people on this list, most notably Dave Campbell and Brad Hull, know that I love this swing tune. I learned it in A. I have played bass
                              Message 14 of 19 , Aug 1, 2003
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                                Jason,

                                A whole bunch of people on this list, most notably Dave Campbell and
                                Brad Hull, know that I love this swing tune. I learned it in A. I
                                have played bass on it in both keys, and actually, both are really
                                good keys for the bass but I have always preferred it in A. David
                                Hargreaves, who taught me this tune, has always played it in A and
                                open on the dobro.

                                However...the version on The Chapmans' CD, "Notes From Home" is in D
                                and those guys tend to have a somewhat traditional, albeit creative
                                approach to the music. I have also encountered people in jams who
                                just assume it will be played in D. I always ask first thing.

                                I say next time we meet at a festival let's do it at least once in
                                each key, just because we can!


                                -Schwingin' Sal, that Scio Gal
                              • Matthew Snook
                                I asked the folks over on the resoguit-l list (for resonateers only), ... Hi, Matt - I ve always heard that Panhandle was in E, and I just confirmed that off
                                Message 15 of 19 , Aug 1, 2003
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                                  I asked the folks over on the 'resoguit-l' list (for resonateers only),
                                  and received this reply:

                                  ----------------------------
                                  Hi, Matt -

                                  I've always heard that Panhandle was in E, and I just confirmed that off
                                  a CD I got over the weekend which contains Leon's recording from
                                  1/9/49...

                                  ...Regards,

                                  Gary,
                                  Texas
                                  -----------------------------

                                  But then provenance plays no part in how we play a song, right? I mean
                                  we'd never insist a song should be done in 'B' just because Mr. Monroe
                                  sang it there, would we?

                                  Keep on pickin' in any key,
                                  Matt
                                • sunbeam98592
                                  ... Sal, Panhandle (Rag) is one of my very favorite tunes to play, and I learned it years ago when Barbara Collins and I played as part of Caravan. She plays
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Aug 1, 2003
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                                    ---
                                    Sal,

                                    Panhandle (Rag) is one of my very favorite tunes to play, and I
                                    learned it years ago when Barbara Collins and I played as part of
                                    Caravan. She plays it in A and that's my favored key and the one I
                                    thought was the norm. That is until I jammed it with people like
                                    Pete martin and Dale Williams. They do it in D. Now in Runaway
                                    Train we also do it in D. I still favor A. Sal - I'd love to play
                                    that with you next time you're up my way (in A)!

                                    Greg

                                    In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "Sally Jane Wilson"
                                    <sallyjanem@h...> wrote:
                                    > Jason,
                                    >
                                    > A whole bunch of people on this list, most notably Dave Campbell
                                    and
                                    > Brad Hull, know that I love this swing tune. I learned it in A. I
                                    > have played bass on it in both keys, and actually, both are really
                                    > good keys for the bass but I have always preferred it in A. David
                                    > Hargreaves, who taught me this tune, has always played it in A and
                                    > open on the dobro.
                                    >
                                    > However...the version on The Chapmans' CD, "Notes From Home" is in
                                    D
                                    > and those guys tend to have a somewhat traditional, albeit
                                    creative
                                    > approach to the music. I have also encountered people in jams who
                                    > just assume it will be played in D. I always ask first thing.
                                    >
                                    > I say next time we meet at a festival let's do it at least once in
                                    > each key, just because we can!
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > -Schwingin' Sal, that Scio Gal
                                  • pdx_malloy
                                    ... I hate to be a stickler but Panhandle Rag Is Actually a song because it actually has words. So there is no corrct key to play it in. I have always gone by
                                    Message 17 of 19 , Aug 2, 2003
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                                      --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "sunbeam98592" <thelin@h...>
                                      wrote:
                                      > ---
                                      I hate to be a stickler but Panhandle Rag Is Actually a song because
                                      it actually has words. So there is no corrct key to play it in.
                                      I have always gone by the rule that a tune, as in fidle tune, has no
                                      words, and you play them in the key they were written in, but when
                                      you play a song you have to consider the singer. Now I know that most
                                      people trat it as a tune because most people dont even know it is a
                                      song,so it is open to whatever works best for you. All that being
                                      said it is always good to learn it in as many kes as possible, you
                                      tend to find different licks and tricks that way.
                                      >
                                      > Panhandle (Rag) is one of my very favorite tunes to play, >
                                      > Greg
                                      >
                                      > In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "Sally Jane Wilson"
                                      > <sallyjanem@h...> wrote:
                                      > > Jason,
                                      > >
                                      > > A whole bunch of people on this list, most notably Dave Campbell
                                      > and
                                      > > Brad Hull, know that I love this swing tune. I learned it in A. I
                                      > > have played bass on it in both keys, and actually, both are
                                      really
                                      > > good keys for the bass but I have always preferred it in A. David
                                      > > Hargreaves, who taught me this tune, has always played it in A
                                      and
                                      > > open on the dobro.
                                      > >
                                      > > However...the version on The Chapmans' CD, "Notes From Home" is
                                      in
                                      > D
                                      > > and those guys tend to have a somewhat traditional, albeit
                                      > creative
                                      > > approach to the music. I have also encountered people in jams who
                                      > > just assume it will be played in D. I always ask first thing.
                                      > >
                                      > > I say next time we meet at a festival let's do it at least once
                                      in
                                      > > each key, just because we can!
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > -Schwingin' Sal, that Scio Gal
                                    • sunbeam98592
                                      ... written by the original author? Greg In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, pdx_malloy ... because ... no ... most ... a ... Campbell ... A. I
                                      Message 18 of 19 , Aug 2, 2003
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                                        ---I've not heard of words to this - what are they? Were they
                                        written by the original author?

                                        Greg



                                        In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "pdx_malloy" <pdx_malloy@y...>
                                        wrote:
                                        > --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "sunbeam98592" <thelin@h...>
                                        > wrote:
                                        > > ---
                                        > I hate to be a stickler but Panhandle Rag Is Actually a song
                                        because
                                        > it actually has words. So there is no corrct key to play it in.
                                        > I have always gone by the rule that a tune, as in fidle tune, has
                                        no
                                        > words, and you play them in the key they were written in, but when
                                        > you play a song you have to consider the singer. Now I know that
                                        most
                                        > people trat it as a tune because most people dont even know it is
                                        a
                                        > song,so it is open to whatever works best for you. All that being
                                        > said it is always good to learn it in as many kes as possible, you
                                        > tend to find different licks and tricks that way.
                                        > >
                                        > > Panhandle (Rag) is one of my very favorite tunes to play, >
                                        > > Greg
                                        > >
                                        > > In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "Sally Jane Wilson"
                                        > > <sallyjanem@h...> wrote:
                                        > > > Jason,
                                        > > >
                                        > > > A whole bunch of people on this list, most notably Dave
                                        Campbell
                                        > > and
                                        > > > Brad Hull, know that I love this swing tune. I learned it in
                                        A. I
                                        > > > have played bass on it in both keys, and actually, both are
                                        > really
                                        > > > good keys for the bass but I have always preferred it in A.
                                        David
                                        > > > Hargreaves, who taught me this tune, has always played it in A
                                        > and
                                        > > > open on the dobro.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > However...the version on The Chapmans' CD, "Notes From Home"
                                        is
                                        > in
                                        > > D
                                        > > > and those guys tend to have a somewhat traditional, albeit
                                        > > creative
                                        > > > approach to the music. I have also encountered people in jams
                                        who
                                        > > > just assume it will be played in D. I always ask first thing.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > I say next time we meet at a festival let's do it at least
                                        once
                                        > in
                                        > > > each key, just because we can!
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > -Schwingin' Sal, that Scio Gal
                                      • pdx_malloy
                                        ... I was wanderin through a Texas border town Just another guy with plenty of time She was ramblin too when her eye caught mine New Panhandle Rag I was
                                        Message 19 of 19 , Aug 2, 2003
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                                          --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "sunbeam98592" <thelin@h...>
                                          wrote:
                                          > ---I've not heard of words to this - what are they? Were they
                                          > written by the original author?
                                          >
                                          > Greg
                                          >
                                          > New Panhandle Rag
                                          I was wanderin through a Texas border town
                                          Just another guy with plenty of time
                                          She was ramblin too when her eye caught mine
                                          New Panhandle Rag
                                          I was wanderin through a Texas border town
                                          Just another guy with plenty of time
                                          She was ramblin too when her eye caught mine
                                          In a panhandle town along the border line

                                          The night was cold a dreary
                                          And the rain it was a fallin
                                          Sure was fallin fast
                                          I was gettin weary
                                          For I'd left another deary
                                          In a Texas town I'd passed

                                          But I'll never roam from the border town
                                          For I married that gal and now we've settled down

                                          Her pretty eyes were blue her rosy cheeks were red
                                          She smiled at me and it went right to my head
                                          How do you do were the words she said
                                          And in a month or two that gal and I were wed



                                          ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                                          ----------
                                          -----------------------------

                                          >
                                          > In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "pdx_malloy" <pdx_malloy@y...>
                                          > wrote:
                                          > > --- In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "sunbeam98592" <thelin@h...>
                                          > > wrote:
                                          > > > ---
                                          > > I hate to be a stickler but Panhandle Rag Is Actually a song
                                          > because
                                          > > it actually has words. So there is no corrct key to play it in.
                                          > > I have always gone by the rule that a tune, as in fidle tune, has
                                          > no
                                          > > words, and you play them in the key they were written in, but
                                          when
                                          > > you play a song you have to consider the singer. Now I know that
                                          > most
                                          > > people trat it as a tune because most people dont even know it is
                                          > a
                                          > > song,so it is open to whatever works best for you. All that being
                                          > > said it is always good to learn it in as many kes as possible,
                                          you
                                          > > tend to find different licks and tricks that way.
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Panhandle (Rag) is one of my very favorite tunes to play, >
                                          > > > Greg
                                          > > >
                                          > > > In nwbluegrass@yahoogroups.com, "Sally Jane Wilson"
                                          > > > <sallyjanem@h...> wrote:
                                          > > > > Jason,
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > A whole bunch of people on this list, most notably Dave
                                          > Campbell
                                          > > > and
                                          > > > > Brad Hull, know that I love this swing tune. I learned it in
                                          > A. I
                                          > > > > have played bass on it in both keys, and actually, both are
                                          > > really
                                          > > > > good keys for the bass but I have always preferred it in A.
                                          > David
                                          > > > > Hargreaves, who taught me this tune, has always played it in
                                          A
                                          > > and
                                          > > > > open on the dobro.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > However...the version on The Chapmans' CD, "Notes From Home"
                                          > is
                                          > > in
                                          > > > D
                                          > > > > and those guys tend to have a somewhat traditional, albeit
                                          > > > creative
                                          > > > > approach to the music. I have also encountered people in jams
                                          > who
                                          > > > > just assume it will be played in D. I always ask first thing.
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > I say next time we meet at a festival let's do it at least
                                          > once
                                          > > in
                                          > > > > each key, just because we can!
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > >
                                          > > > > -Schwingin' Sal, that Scio Gal
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