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Re: [NH] Tidy Warning For

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  • Marcelo Bastos
    ... I really don t see anything wrong -- that CSS snippet *should* have the desired effect. I would have to see the actual HTML page and CSS sheet to be able
    Message 1 of 14 , Dec 5, 2009
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      Interviewed by CNN on 5/12/2009 23:10, Ray Shapp told the world:

      > I have adapted a style sheet which is included below. I also have found info
      > about pseudo-classes in the CSS Reference from Web Design Group. It says:
      >
      > A:link { color: red }
      > A:active { color: blue; font-size: 125% }
      > A:visited { color: green; font-size: 85% }
      >
      > Copyright ©1997. Web Design Group.
      >
      > After appending these pseudo-classes to my style sheet, none of the hyperlinks
      > take on the color and sizes shown above.
      >
      > To get inactive, active, and visited links to change color and size must I
      > create a new selector in the style sheet or must I make some kind of reference
      > to these pseudo-classes in the web page? Please show me an example.
      >
      > Thank you for the help.

      I really don't see anything wrong -- that CSS snippet *should* have the
      desired effect. I would have to see the actual HTML page and CSS sheet
      to be able to debug the issue. It might be something really simple, like
      a problem with closing the curly brackets in the line above...

      Aside: I used to have lots of problems when editing CSS because
      sometimes I inserted stuff and forgot the semicolons; now I *always* end
      a CSS expression with a semicolon, even right before the "}".

      (My first thought was that the A: should be in lowercase, because that's
      the way I have always seen it done and I thought I remembered CSS being
      case-sensitive -- but testing revealed that an uppercase A: selector
      works as well as a lowercase one).


      --
      MCBastos

      This message has been protected with the 2ROT13 algorithm. Unauthorized
      use will be prosecuted under the DMCA.

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    • loro
      ... That doesn t make sense. ... Well, if you use Strict doctype you can t have those attributes in the BODY tag. ... The WDG has actually made a little
      Message 2 of 14 , Dec 5, 2009
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        Ray Shapp wrote:
        >When I use HTML Validator v0.8.5.8 in Firefox v3.5.5, I get a warning that
        >says the alink attribute is proprietary to Netscape or Internet Explorer.

        That doesn't make sense.

        >As a
        >result, Tidy also says my Doctype statement doesn't agree with content which
        >appears to be HTML proprietary. The suggestion is that I use CSS.

        Well, if you use Strict doctype you can't have those attributes in
        the BODY tag.

        >I have adapted a style sheet which is included below. I also have found info
        >about pseudo-classes in the CSS Reference from Web Design Group. It says:
        >
        > A:link { color: red }
        > A:active { color: blue; font-size: 125% }
        > A:visited { color: green; font-size: 85% }


        >After appending these pseudo-classes to my style sheet, none of the
        >hyperlinks
        >take on the color and sizes shown above.

        The WDG has actually made a little mistake (that's a first!). The
        order should be link-visited-focus-hover-active. The :active rule
        will be overridden by the :visited rule with the order above. A
        visited link that's in the active state is still visited and when two
        selectors are otherwise equal, the last one wins. That doesn't
        explain that nothing shows up though. Could you possible link to a
        sample page? When things are out of context it's hard to know what's wrong.

        BTW are you sure you don't want :hover rather than :active (or maybe both)?

        Lotta
      • Ray Shapp
        Hi Marcelo and Lotta, Thanks for the quick replies. I should have said I m really a novice at using CSS. My problem is very basic. I m not sure how or where to
        Message 3 of 14 , Dec 5, 2009
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          Hi Marcelo and Lotta,

          Thanks for the quick replies.

          I should have said I'm really a novice at using CSS. My problem is very basic.
          I'm not sure how or where to add pseudo-classes. That's why I asked whether
          they go into the style sheet or into the web page (or a little of both).



          I said, "I get a warning that says the alink attribute is proprietary to
          Netscape or Internet Explorer.", and Lotta replied, "That doesn't make sense."
          OK, here is the offending line (next below). I want to replace everything
          except "<body>" with the equivalent CSS.

          <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#D3D3D3" link="#0000FF" vlink= "#800000"
          alink="#FF0000">



          Lotta said, "The :active rule will be overridden by the :visited rule with the
          order above." As you can see above, when the page was all HTML without any
          CSS, the alink was last in sequence. Yes, I would like to provide for
          link-visited-focus-hover-active. Please give me an example.

          Now, I'm trying to do two things at once. I'm cleaning the shoddy markup on a
          page I did years ago, and I'm trying to introduce a basic style sheet that I
          can use throughout the website.

          I'll gladly include here the web page and my best current effort at producing
          a style sheet. I've already used this style sheet for a few other pages, but
          even my recently updated pages have the plain vanilla anchor tags without any
          CSS treatment of the links. The web page follows the style sheet below.

          Again, I thank you.

          Ray Shapp

          ***style sheet "C:\asterism\styles\AAIbasic.css" begins after one blank line
          below***

          @charset "utf-8";
          /* CSS Document */
          /* Adapted by Ray Shapp */
          /* New pages in AAI website can link to this style sheet */
          /* Revised 11/23/2009 */

          .basic_headline_black_largest {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : 1.8em;
          font-weight : bold;
          }

          .basic_headline_black_larger {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : 1.6em;
          font-weight : bold;
          }

          .basic_headline_black_large {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : 1.4em;
          font-weight : bold;
          }

          .basic_headline_black_medium {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : 1.2em;
          font-weight : bold;
          }

          .basic_issue {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          line-height: 1.2em;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_page {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          line-height: 1.2em;
          margin-left: 2%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_title {
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          line-height: 1.2em;
          font-weight : bold;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_author {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          line-height: 1.2em;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_subtitle {
          display: block;
          color : #dd5622;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          font-weight : bold;
          margin-left: 2%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_summary {
          display: block;
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          margin-left: 2%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_leading {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .5em;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_body_text {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : 1.0em;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_nav_text {
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          font-weight : bold;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }

          .basic_prototype {
          background-color : #D3D3D3;
          border-top : 1px solid #000000;
          width : 800px;
          color : #000000;
          font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
          font-size : .8em;
          vertical-align: bottom;
          font-weight : bold;
          padding : 2px 5px;
          line-height: 1.2em;
          margin-left: 0%;
          margin-right: 0%;
          }





          ***the web page "C:\asterism\gallery\weasner.htm" follows one blank line
          below***

          <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
          "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd"><html>
          <head>
          <title>
          Amateur Astronomers, Inc. - Weasners Visit Sperry
          </title>
          <link rel="StyleSheet" href="../styles/AAIbasic.css" type=
          "text/css" title="Common Style for AAI">
          </head>
          <!--==== Program: weasner.htm , Author: Ray Shapp ==========-->
          <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#D3D3D3" link="#0000FF" vlink=
          "#800000" alink="#FF0000">
          <center>
          <table border="0" cellpadding="2" width="460">
          <tr>

          <td>
          <img src="../gifs/astrline.gif" alt=
          "Drawing of Observatory" width="460" height="42">
          </td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td>
          <center>
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "5"><b><u>The Weasners Visit Sperry</u></b></font>

          </center><br>
          <br>
          </td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td>
          <p align="left">
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "3">Mike and Laurraine Weasner visited Sperry
          Observatory on August 15, 2001. Mike has operated
          <a href=
          "http://www.weasner.com/etx/menu.html">Weasner's
          Mighty ETX</a> website since September, 1996. Mike's
          website emphasizes the Meade ETX line of telescopes,
          but it also gives very useful tips and techniques for
          the Meade LX-90 , the AutoStar robotic controller, as
          well as other information which is of broad
          applicability to amateur astronomers. Mike Weasner
          has received the 2001 annual Astronomical
          Achievements Award from the Arkansas Sky
          Observatory.</font>

          </p><font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "3"><br>
          <br></font>
          </td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td align="center">
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "3"><a><img src="gifs/weasnr1.jpg" width="586" height=
          "384" border="0" alt="Weasners arrive"></a></font>
          <p>
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "3">Joe Powell and Ray Shapp greet the Weasners in
          front of the Sperry Obseratory.</font>

          </p><br>
          <br>
          </td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td align="center">
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "3"><a><img src="gifs/weasn2.jpg" width="496" height=
          "480" border="0" alt=
          "Weasners in the west dome"></a></font>
          <p>
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "3">The Weasners and Joe Powell in the west dome
          which houses the 24-inch Cassegrain telescope.</font>

          </p>
          </td>
          </tr>
          </table><br>
          <br>
          <center>
          <table width="460" border="0" cellpadding="2">
          <tr>
          <td align="center">

          <a href="gallry01.htm"><img src=
          "../gifs/orangbl1.gif" border="0" alt="Orange ball bullet">
          <font class="basic_nav_text">
          <b>Return to Photo
          Gallery</b></font></a><br>
          </td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td align="center">
          <a href="../aaihome.htm"><img src=
          "../gifs/orangbl1.gif" border="0" alt="Orange ball bullet">
          <font class="basic_nav_text">
          <b>Return to Home</b></font></a>

          </td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td></td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
          <td align="center">
          <font face="Arial,Helvetica" color="#000000" size=
          "2">Maintained by <script type="text/javascript">
          <!--
          document.write("<a
          href='mailto:ray@asterism.org'>
          Ray Shapp<\/a>")
          // -->
          </script><br>
          Page last updated 12/05/2009</font>
          </td>

          </tr>
          </table>
          </center>
          </center>
          </body>
          </html>
        • Marcelo Bastos
          ... Oh. Pseudo-classes are treated similarly to regular classes, only they are generated automatically from the context. The only real mistake you did was...
          Message 4 of 14 , Dec 5, 2009
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            Interviewed by CNN on 6/12/2009 02:44, Ray Shapp told the world:
            > Hi Marcelo and Lotta,
            >
            > Thanks for the quick replies.
            >
            > I should have said I'm really a novice at using CSS. My problem is very basic.
            > I'm not sure how or where to add pseudo-classes. That's why I asked whether
            > they go into the style sheet or into the web page (or a little of both).

            Oh. Pseudo-classes are treated similarly to regular classes, only they
            are generated automatically from the context. The only real "mistake"
            you did was... well, not actually inserting the styles into the stylesheet.

            So, you don't have to do anything to the HTML (well, except removing
            those offending attributes from the <body> tag); it's all done in the CSS.

            So, you might change the beginning of your CSS file as such:

            *** Begin stylesheet snippet ***


            @charset "utf-8";
            /* CSS Document */
            /* Adapted by Ray Shapp */
            /* New pages in AAI website can link to this style sheet */
            /* Revised 11/23/2009 */

            body {color:#000000;
            background-color:#D3D3D3;}

            a:link { color: red }
            a:visited { color: green; font-size: 85%; }
            /* a:focus { color: blue; font-size: 125%; } */
            /* a:hover { color: blue; font-size: 125%; } */
            a:active { color: blue; font-size: 125%; }

            .basic_headline_black_largest {
            color : #000000;
            font-family : Arial, sans-serif;
            font-size : 1.8em;
            font-weight : bold;
            }



            *** End Stylesheet snippet ***

            Note that, as pointed out by Lotta, I moved "active" to the last
            position. "Active" is the style applied WHEN YOU ARE ACTUALLY CLICKING
            ON THE LINK.
            I added dummy lines (commented out) for "Hover" and "focus" too.
            "Hover" is the one applied when your mouse passes over the link.
            "Focus" applies when you are moving from link to link using the
            keyboard, mostly.
            Many people don't bother to declare a "focus" style.



            And the HTML file heading

            > <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#D3D3D3" link="#0000FF" vlink= "#800000"
            > alink="#FF0000">

            would become just <body>. Well, I like to declare a language here, so
            you might as well put <body lang="en"> to declare that the text is in
            English, so spellcheckers and such have an easier time.

            A hint: try not to mess with font size, family, weight, style and such
            in pseudo-classes -- since the link words will probably change size
            (even for monospaced fonts!), it creates a "moving text" effect that is
            kinda weird. Colors, borders and text-decoration are much safer.

            --
            MCBastos

            This message has been protected with the 2ROT13 algorithm. Unauthorized
            use will be prosecuted under the DMCA.

            -=-=-
            ... BOFH excuse #4:
            static from nylon underwear
            * TagZilla 0.0661 * http://tagzilla.mozdev.org on Seamonkey 2.0
          • loro
            ... They are CSS, so in your style sheet. ... Still isn t proprietary but, as said, not allowed in Strict. But I see below that you use Transitional, so
            Message 5 of 14 , Dec 5, 2009
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              Ray wrote:
              >I'm not sure how or where to add pseudo-classes. That's why I asked whether
              >they go into the style sheet or into the web page (or a little of both).

              They are CSS, so in your style sheet.

              >I said, "I get a warning that says the alink attribute is proprietary to
              >Netscape or Internet Explorer.", and Lotta replied, "That doesn't
              >make sense."
              >OK, here is the offending line (next below). I want to replace everything
              >except "<body>" with the equivalent CSS.

              Still isn't proprietary but, as said, not allowed in Strict. But I
              see below that you use Transitional, so nothing wrong with it at all.
              The HTML validates without errors.

              > As you can see above, when the page was all HTML without any
              >CSS, the alink was last in sequence.

              Yeah, but that's HTML. The order is of no importance.

              >Yes, I would like to provide for
              >link-visited-focus-hover-active. Please give me an example.

              a:link { color:red; background: inherit }
              a:visited { color: green; background: inherit }
              a:hover { color: white; background: red }

              ....and so on. You just add them one after the other. But in the right order!


              >I'll gladly include here the web page and my best current effort at producing
              >a style sheet. I've already used this style sheet for a few other pages, but
              >even my recently updated pages have the plain vanilla anchor tags without any
              >CSS treatment of the links. The web page follows the style sheet below.

              Yeah, but the link rules you posted before isn't in that style sheet.
              Nothing at all about links there.

              Lotta
            • Ray Shapp
              Hi Marcelo and Lotta, It WORKS! In all the variations of the style sheet I had tried, I preceded the a with a period (and sometimes other stuff too) as in
              Message 6 of 14 , Dec 5, 2009
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                Hi Marcelo and Lotta,

                It WORKS!

                In all the variations of the style sheet I had tried, I preceded the "a" with
                a period (and sometimes other stuff too) as in the following example of
                incorrect coding:

                .a:link { color: blue }

                The fix was almost too simple. Marcelo, your style sheet snippet did the trick
                for me. I also am now using the language attribute in <body lang="en">.

                I have a long way to go to get good benefit from style sheets, but I feel I am
                making progress.

                Many thanks to you both!

                Ray Shapp
              • loro
                ... Yay! :-) ... For the record, that would refer to a any element with the class a but only apply to unvisited links with the class a. This is one of the
                Message 7 of 14 , Dec 6, 2009
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                  Ray Shapp wrote:
                  >It WORKS!

                  Yay! :-)

                  >In all the variations of the style sheet I had tried, I preceded the "a" with
                  >a period (and sometimes other stuff too) as in the following example of
                  >incorrect coding:
                  >
                  > .a:link { color: blue }

                  For the record, that would refer to a any element with the class a
                  but only apply to unvisited links with the class a.

                  This is one of the reasons why it's often better to show the real
                  thing, just as it is. Snips get changed more often than not.

                  >I also am now using the language attribute in <body lang="en">.

                  It's probably better to use lang with HTML. That way you cover the
                  whole document, including TITLE.

                  >I have a long way to go to get good benefit from style sheets, but I
                  >feel I am
                  >making progress.

                  You'll get there.

                  Lotta
                • Axel Berger
                  ... That s not how understood it. My reading is, it applies to ALL links unless overridden my a more specific definition like :visited that is defined after
                  Message 8 of 14 , Dec 6, 2009
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                    loro wrote:
                    > > .a:link { color: blue }
                    >
                    > that would refer to a any element with the class a
                    > but only apply to unvisited links with the class a.

                    That's not how understood it. My reading is, it applies to ALL links
                    unless overridden my a more specific definition like :visited that is
                    defined after it. N.B: I found this rule for remebering the correct
                    sequence:

                    Lord Vaders Former Handle Anakin
                    Link Visited Focus Hover Active

                    Axel
                  • Ray Shapp
                    Hi Lotta, ... The line is in the C: asterism gallery weasner.htm page. It is not in the style sheet. Is that what you mean? BTW, I had
                    Message 9 of 14 , Dec 6, 2009
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                      Hi Lotta,

                      > It's probably better to use lang with HTML. That way you cover the
                      > whole document, including TITLE.

                      The "<body lang="en">" line is in the C:\asterism\gallery\weasner.htm page. It
                      is not in the style sheet. Is that what you mean?


                      BTW, I had intended that the subject line for this thread be "Tidy Warning
                      For 'aline' Anchor Attribute", but I truncated it accidentally.

                      Thanks again for all the help.

                      Ray Shapp
                    • Cary Driscoll
                      Lotta meant the attribute should be used with the HTML tag, rather than the BODY tag. ... From: Ray Shapp
                      Message 10 of 14 , Dec 6, 2009
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                        Lotta meant the attribute should be used with the HTML tag, rather than the
                        BODY tag.

                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: "Ray Shapp"


                        > Hi Lotta,
                        >
                        >> It's probably better to use lang with HTML. That way you cover the
                        >> whole document, including TITLE.
                        >
                        > The "<body lang="en">" line is in the C:\asterism\gallery\weasner.htm
                        > page. It
                        > is not in the style sheet. Is that what you mean?
                      • Ray Shapp
                        Hi Cary, Thank you for the clarification. I have made the correction.
                        Message 11 of 14 , Dec 8, 2009
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                          Hi Cary,

                          <<Lotta meant the attribute should be used with the HTML tag, rather than the
                          BODY tag.>>

                          Thank you for the clarification. I have made the correction.

                          Ray Shapp
                        • loro
                          ... Just to be clear. It wasn t an error, the way you had it.You can use lang with almost anything. I just meant that if you intend it to be good for the whole
                          Message 12 of 14 , Dec 8, 2009
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                            Ray wrote:
                            ><<Lotta meant the attribute should be used with the HTML tag, rather than the
                            >BODY tag.>>
                            >
                            >Thank you for the clarification. I have made the correction.

                            Just to be clear. It wasn't an error, the way you had it.You can use
                            lang with almost anything. I just meant that if you intend it to be
                            good for the whole document, HTML is a more logical place for it

                            Lotta.
                          • Ray Shapp
                            Hi Lotta, Understood. Thank you. Ray Shapp
                            Message 13 of 14 , Dec 8, 2009
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                              Hi Lotta,

                              <<I just meant that if you intend it to be good for the whole document, HTML
                              is a more logical place for it>>

                              Understood.

                              Thank you.

                              Ray Shapp
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